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12:06 AM
night
 
user3010322
Nighty night.
 
12:19 AM
@JohannesSchaub-litb in case you are lazy, the URL in the screenshot is vps2.etotheipiplusone.com:30176/redmine/emscripten-qt-examples/… :)
 
The more I use it, the more I like boost. It's love/hate. But it's saving my life many times over
 
Kate?
It is impressive though. Is this pure JavaScript rendering?
 
Well, as completely pointless as it may be, I know have my own mail server... of course I do not have enough faith in myself to rely on it.
any way... night all
 
G'night.
 
night
 
user3010322
12:24 AM
@StackedCrooked It's taking a million years to load. ._.
 
user3010322
Currently at the four minute mark. ~___~
 
Well, it's not that exciting.
 
user3010322
If lauching a full-blown C++ application to teh web takes this log, I don't think that'll be my mode of transport..
 
user3010322
LOL the download bar just appeared, looks like i'ts at 10%
 
user3010322
This is worse than just downloading it directly. Bump that nonsense.
 
12:27 AM
In today's news: Belgium considers buying 40 new fighter jets.
 
what would Belgium want fighter jets for?
 
For shootin stuff.
 
be more specific about "stuff"
 
I dunno.
 
@ThePhD What browser are you using?
 
12:28 AM
no me neither
 
user3010322
@jalf Firefox.
 
Took 10 seconds or so for the download bar to show here, and then maybe another 10 before it was fully loaded
 
It's the minister of defense that is pleading for this. The other parties are not excited about the idea.
 
@ThePhD Huh, on a 486 or something?
 
user3010322
@jalf Lucky you, I was running into the 5 minute mark.
 
user3010322
12:29 AM
@jalf No, x64 machine. But my internet connectivity is not the greatest thing in teh world. Still, downloads can get up to 1 MBps, usually average 500 KB, so.
 
@jalf Same here.
 
user3010322
So not sure why it's taking this long. <_>
 
user3010322
Not even downloading anything else.
 
user3010322
No messengers except SO running either. <_>
 
You're not running Firefox 1.5 or something, are you? :p
 
user3010322
No, I'm on like Firefox 20, or whatever absurd version number they're at.
 
k
 
> The F-16s are nearly 50 years old, we have to decide on a successor and we must do it now," said De Crem, that his proposal announced today at the Military School in Brussel.
Wow, 50 year old F16s.
 
I dunno then. Your firefox is just broken I guess :p
 
user3010322
q_q
 
12:31 AM
@StackedCrooked Personally, I feel kind of good about a world in which a country can use the same fighter jets for half a century before seeing a need to replace them
I guess that's why I'm not a senior government official or high ranking military officer
 
@jalf Yeah, we always shoot first :)
But yeah, it's remarkable.
I wonder if this period of piece will turn out the be just a brief moment in the world history.
 
@StackedCrooked Well, I was more going for the "apparently, we haven't had a desperate need to stay on the cutting edge of military technology for several decades now" angle ;)
 
@StackedCrooked Nope.
 
@StackedCrooked Eventually, any particular period will become just a brief moment in the world history :p
 
user3010322
Lol, Firefox 26 just told me to update and install.
 
user3010322
12:36 AM
Welp, maybe this'll make it load faster!
 
Ah, I'm on 25
so I don't think that's the problem
 
Take a look at the JavaScript… sheer volume is the problem. It locked up my browser entirely for a few minutes while parsing it, still on the "loading" progress bar after 10+ minutes.
 
@Potatoswatter except that for some of us, it didn't
 
@jalf Probably CPU cache, or some other level of memory hierarchy is overflowing on our machines. I'm running a 6 year old laptop.
 
someone give this guy a darwin award
 
12:45 AM
why were you watching that in the first place?
 
guise, xml or json?
 
neither
 
what else?
 
your question was vague
 
For definitions of levels (grid, items to spawn, initial position, etc) what format is best (for C++)?
 
12:49 AM
Notice from local council "Your garbage collection date is now Thursday". Didn't know thay had any Java.
 
@Jefffrey Tiled uses XML for that
 
Oh man, I love the new Twitter interface
 
Click link A. Click back button. Click link B. Can't go back to A anymore :(
The bane of all software which has the go-back/undo feature.
 
user3010322
@StackedCrooked Vim trees.
 
Ctrl-H in Chrome is a gift form the heavens.
 
1:03 AM
@Jefffrey I would code a function for it in a script, using maybe Lua or Python or somesuch.
 
@StackedCrooked *peace
 
Oh God.
I'm degrading.
 
@DeadMG isn't it an overkill?
 
well, only you can tell me that.
but I don't think so.
 
I'll look into it
 
1:08 AM
@Jefffrey Webserver with REST API :)
 
lol
 
Grid, items, positions, etc.. that's purely data right? (No logic?)
 
yes
 
Interesting question.
Maybe a relational database?
 
wat dafuq are you serious?
 
1:10 AM
wat
 
I knew it was a risky thing to say.
 
Go SQLite!
 
What is the common solution? XML? Binary file formats?
Hard coded?
 
bin fmts. for me
 
@StackedCrooked Most of the time, binary format at runtime.
 
1:11 AM
depends on what the use case is
 
Usually with some human readable format at design time, and a tool to convert between the two.
 
afaik most games load from a text format so that the less-competent designers can modify them
 
At work it's XML -> binary.
 
I'd like to be able to write the data by hands easily
 
either directly or intermediary
 
1:11 AM
@DeadMG They don't.
The games don't load from a text format. The tools do.
 
@EtiennedeMartel some sort of serialization?
 
@DeadMG the more competent ones probably prefer plain text as well.
 
@Jefffrey No. Serialization is persistance. That's just converting things to something that's easier to load.
For performance reasons, ideally you just want to memory map something and cast it to a pointer to a struct.
 
binary formats seems very inflexible though. very much tied to the internal code structures. I could be wrong though.
 
depends on how you use it. To my delight, boost serialization perfectly handles serializing from a std::map<K,V> into a boost::vector<pair<K,V>>, a boost::interprocess::flat_map<K,V> etc.
 
1:14 AM
@StackedCrooked There's nothing magic about text except compatibility with text editors. The structure of a format is not determined by its numeric encoding.
 
^
 
if you say so :)
 
That's the point with Boost Serialization: the /logic/ of the serialization is expressed in code. It just happens to have text/xml/binary archives depending on the audience/your mood
 
I was assuming the binary structures are directly serialized from the C++ class hierarchies.
Which would mean that refactoring of the code would also change the data format.
 
define "directly". If it's in shared memory, or memory mapped, yeah, POD data would make sense. But then you get all kinds of weirdness like boost::interprocess::offset_ptr so you can actually have smart pointers inside your shared memory realm
 
1:17 AM
I guess I'm thinking on a too simple level.
 
Otherwise if your realm gets mapped to a different base address (in a different process/next run) you'd get wrong pointers
 
@StackedCrooked That's essentially the same as assuming a text format isn't based on XML or such a structured metaformat.
 
I wouldn't store an address book by serializing a std::map to a binary blob.
 
@StackedCrooked I think you're conflating levels - this is what always explains my confusions
 
But games are different I guess.
 
1:18 AM
@StackedCrooked What would you do?
 
Problem is, people tend to get obsessed with efficiency when designing a binary format and impulsively leave out extensibility.
 
@sehe Maybe sync it with google API.
Bad example I guess.
 
lol
 
I would probably use plain text.
 
(Meanwhile serializing all fractions to double-precision FP format because they're still lazy with math… lol)
 
1:19 AM
One line per contact.
Or perhaps xml.
Nah, I don't like that.
Plain text probably.
If the amount of data gets too big then I would switch to relational db.
 
How is a database related to serializing?
 
Come on.
the output of serialization is data.
so the container of that data is a database.
But I don't know how games use resources. I guess it's more than just storing high scores.
 
@sehe What would Jesus do?
 
I dunno. Never asked
 
Jesus would change it into wine.
And forgive prostitutes.
 
1:26 AM
@StackedCrooked Soooo. There's a relation. Doesn't quite make it the same. Send your incremental update over the wire? Still need that serialization format. The database doesn't actually help much there
 
Why does emscripten output so much boilerplate? That QT demo is full of idioms like STACKTOP=STACKTOP+3>>2<<2. Is it really that the JS interpreter handles such longhand better than a function call or eval metaprogramming?
(It's still loading for me by the way.)
 
@Potatoswatter I believe it's an architecture choice that they know requires the custom array extensions in v8 (? I think). I also believe there's another C++->JS compiler project that does take another approach. That might just be what you were expecting?
 
@StackedCrooked If you forgive a prostitute well enough, she might just let you in for free. (Is that the miracle in this situation?)
 
Can't remember the friggin' project name now
 
@StackedCrooked Any data is a resource.
Sometimes even code is a resource.
 
1:28 AM
@Potatoswatter Such kindness.
 
(i.e. scripts)
 
@Potatoswatter Because that's what code generators are good at.
:)
It's hard to write a generator that outputs elegant code.
 
@sehe I'm not talking about the arithmetic they're doing, but the way it's encoded in such a way as to bloat the executable. That expression, and many others, could be factored into a function. If the inliner doesn't work that way, then they could generate the text of the function by metaprogramming.
 
@Potatoswatter well. you'd have to ask 'them'. i'm sure they run all kinds of benchmarks and profiling. I've been subscribed to their blog for about ~1.5-2years now
 
@StackedCrooked It's easy to compress anything in postprocessing though… I suspect that the decompressed code would then eat into the JS VM RAM allocation. Anyway this seems needlessly inefficient.
 
1:33 AM
You should tell em.
 
@sehe Should look into it… it's a very interesting subject.
 
And an impressive project
 
Does the frontend have an extern "JavaScript" specifier?
 
It would nice to be able to control by desktop remotely like that.
 
Yeah, my current project is supposed to evolve into a web-based IDE.
 
1:41 AM
@Potatoswatter something equivalent, but nothing at the language level. I think you can call js through specific API and certainly you can access c++ classes from js
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus @Xeo Buying Starbound~
 
@EtiennedeMartel sounds dangerous, but makes sense
 
1:57 AM
Actually, it's exactly what I'm currently doing. I'm merging ~48 tables of ~2Gb each. I had used in-mem tables with boost serialization until now, but the merged table (deduped) would become larger than my system's RAM (32Gb). So.... Boost Interprocess it is. And now I merge into vector<...> (flat_map and flat_set didn't perform well).
The most annoying downside of memory-mapped files turns out to be that it's hard to resize them. So I just created a 128Gb sparse memory mapped file and hope it'll be enough. (I had just created a 32Tb sparse file to see whether it would work. No cinch!)
 
So I finally found out how I lost rep overnight - seems a decent answer of mine was deleted. I found that you can select "show removed posts" at the bottom of your rep page and it will show it. So I reposted the question (slightly clearer version) and an answer since I'm guessing it will come up again
 
night lounge
 
2:16 AM
yup
 
user3010322
@sehe Sounds tough. :c
 
I like how my process is using ~52Gb of RAM on my 32Gb box :/
 
user3010322
o.0
 
user3010322
That's, erm.
 
user3010322
Interesting.
 
user3010322
2:18 AM
Hey, @sehe, if you had a file API, would you want something like memory_mapped to be a separate class?
 
@ThePhD It's kinda fun. I like when it really does matter how you approach things. I'm now still using
 
user3010322
Or something you'd pass to a FileStream or the like as a parameter, e.g. "try to memory map this"
 
        for (auto const& ddt : ddts)
        {
            auto middle = end(db);
            const static multiway_comparer cmp;
            boost::set_difference(ddt | map_keys, db, back_inserter(db), cmp);
            boost::inplace_merge(db, middle, cmp);
        }
That's (a) in place (b) standard algorithms. However, I'm pretty sure that sequential reading directly into the memory-mapped datastructure, with hinted insertion might be a lot faster. Of course, this would require me to write the algorithm.
I'm lazy
@ThePhD There's really not much overlap. Memory mapped files are inherently not stream-like. They're random access, like RAM: it's directly mapped into your process space, remember
 
user3010322
@sehe I'm not going to lie: even with the code sample, much of it is going over my head.
 
user3010322
@sehe Ooh. I see.
 
user3010322
2:21 AM
Well, I'm still working on my IO library. u.u
 
user3010322
Trying to make something that has a really good design, since we've already gotten the performance bits out of the way.
 
@ThePhD Think of merging very very large std::sets (which is basically what I'm doing)
 
user3010322
@sehe You can't do a one-by-one lookup, and then use the lookup as a hint key to emplace_back (thinking in terms of std:: containers and their functions)?
 
user3010322
It might speed things up a bit?
 
@ThePhD usually, range-insertions are a lot quicker (especially since I'm actually using sorted vectors now, and the element type is POD). However, doing the thing sequentially could enable me to do things entirely streaming (loading just the input data takes ~5-7minutes). I might be checking the performance comparison
 
2:24 AM
@sehe Lazy is good. Be lazy :)
 
Always am. Well, almost always.
The contradiction being that I'm working. And it's 3:25am
Mmm.
 
And you write the longest SO answers in the history of ... SO
 
user3010322
Lol.
 
Sadly not true :/
 
user3010322
I"m going to call my IO library Bus.
 
2:26 AM
Hope you don't get hit by your library then
 
user3010322
@sehe It would be if you included ALL of the source code you use in your answers, probably.
 
user3010322
@sehe Exceptions will throw You classes. :D
 
Ugh... cover letters >.< why must you exist
 
user3010322
@Borgleader Where are you applying?
 
user3010322
Because I want to apply where you are.
 
2:27 AM
@ThePhD There's a point. I usually link to several versions/approaches, and then include one of them as fully working sample (protect against bitrot)
 
Eidos and Ubisoft
Its in the same city as Ludia
 
@Borgleader Because they're all that is going to be read! They're the most important thing. I think
 
user3010322
@Borgleader Maybe I should apply to.
 
user3010322
We can get in together. <3
 
I know 5 people who got hired by Ubisoft in the last... 4-5 months
 
user3010322
2:29 AM
Throw me a link! Where are you applying at?
 
user3010322
Also, I remember Warzone 2100
 
user3010322
Fucking loved that game to death.
 
I'll probably just be sending my stuff to people that are at each respective companies
 
yeah. well. This job is currently at 41/87 progress. It'll take a while but looks stable, still at 53.6Gb memory. I'm pretty confident that it will complete, so let me head to bed :)
 
user3010322
Alrighty.
 
2:33 AM
@sehe 'night
 
Cheers
 
user3010322
Night. Hope you wake up to a completed job and a clean error report. :D
 
Oh, all I fear is that it will still be running. I think it might get progressively slow.
17 mins ago, by sehe
That's (a) in place (b) standard algorithms. However, I'm pretty sure that sequential reading directly into the memory-mapped datastructure, with hinted insertion might be a lot faster. Of course, this would require me to write the algorithm.
Perhaps I should not be quite that lazy
 
@sehe To bed with you!
 
ugh
why do most color schemes make comments almost impossible to read?
they're often the most useful information available on your screen
(assuming you're reading properly written code)
 
2:45 AM
Properly written code doesn't need comments ;)
 
@Borgleader that's bullshit
 
No seriously, properly written code at least 90% of it doesn't need comments
 
Properly written code is clear in how it does what it should do, but gives no clue on the why
you could have a move constructor containing like references.clear();
 
@nightcracker That's more true to numerical code than "normal" code.
 
it could use a comment // clear references - now owned by the other object
or this for example (from my own code)
// request OpenGL version 3.2
SDL_GL_SetAttribute(SDL_GL_CONTEXT_MAJOR_VERSION, 3);
SDL_GL_SetAttribute(SDL_GL_CONTEXT_MINOR_VERSION, 2);
 
2:54 AM
void requestOpenGLVersion(int majorRevision, int minorRevision) {
    SDL_GL_SetAttribute(SDL_GL_CONTEXT_MAJOR_VERSION, majorRevision);
    SDL_GL_SetAttribute(SDL_GL_CONTEXT_MINOR_VERSION, minorRevision);
}
see, no comment required ;)
 
congratulations you've created a function for 2 lines of code
which is only ever called in one place
 
Yeah so?
 
this means that if I ever have to debug this shit I first have to find where the function is defined, whether there aren't any overloads/linking mismatches going on, etc
 
Right-click -> go to definition
 
right-click -> I don't use MSVC
(often)
 
2:58 AM
I'm sure that option is available elsewhere
 
if you don't use an IDE that has a project build thing going on, it doesn't
no way to find out what the corresponding definition is
 
in an ideal case though, if its used in one place like you claim, it should be defined close to where its used
that way its easy to find
 
CTags allows you to go to definition lol
 
@Rapptz thanks I'll try that
that feeling of danger when you've accidently started dragging an important folder in Windows
release the mouse on the wrong place and you've got yourself a nice situation
@Rapptz thanks that's actually pretty sweet
 
yup
My plugin only has 186 downloads :(
 
3:07 AM
@Rapptz have you tried getting it to work with standard headers?
@Rapptz what's your plugin
 
@nightcracker I tried with Boost once but it ended up being like ~400 MB worth of CTags so it's not worth it.
@nightcracker nah, that one has >1k
I meant this one
 
nice gif screencasts
@Rapptz would you be interested in trying my console application for windows?
 
@nightcracker sure
@ScottW hi
 
I'm sure you'll love it
 
user3010322
@ScottW Hiya
 
3:10 AM
I've been busy myself. :P
 
@nightcracker Oh. You wrote that?
I used to use it :)
 
well "wrote"
I made it yes
but it's mostly an autohotkey script + a particular configuration for console2
 
I used it for a long time before I switched to ConEmu.
I remember I got it from this room, just not who.
 
it was me ;)
did you use it with the hotkey though?
that's the entire crux of it
 
3:15 AM
Which hotkeys?
It's been a while.
 
ok
:P
unzip it somewhere
then run qcon.exe
(NOT install.bat unless you want to go fix your startup routine to remove it :P)
 
@nightcracker And then nightcracker will tell you your password
 
@GlennTeitelbaum sshhh
 
it's not downloading
hmm
 
try downloading from there
 
3:27 AM
download managers suck
 
how hard is it to download one file lol
 
nah it's just my download manager was stuck on 'Connecting' so I had to reset it
 
-1
Q: Where to ask questions about intercourse after pregnancy?

I Like to CodeI know someone who is having trouble with sex after pregnancy. I thought this question is related to parenting.stackexchange.com but I was wondering if there is another site that is better suited to these types of questions?

 
lol
 
I think downvoting that is not fair
 
3:32 AM
I wouldn't have.
 
It's a legitimate question about a legitimate subject
 
Wasn't me who downvoted.
 
Some people might not find the subject appropriate for stackexchange - fine, but we don't have to act like a bunch of schoolkids "omg he said sex LOL".
 
@nightcracker There was an A51 site for sexuality that went beta.
But it died after a few weeks.
Not enough activity.
 
shame
sounds like SE could provide a nice platform to share information on it
though I guess the original questions die out very rapidly
 
@Mysticial With A51 mostly having a bunch of coders... seems normal.
 
Speaking of burn, I just went to a shop to buy cat5 cable. The tender asked me if I want it to have jacks crimped. I answered no. Then I dumbly asked him if he could test the cable. Burn me!!!
 
3:54 AM
^ C++ Guruish edit by Community <>.
 
yikes
ss.rdbuf()?
 
@Rapptz actually... that's not a bad idea....
 
It's a valid point.
 
though probably overkill for most answers
I wouldn't do that for most answers
 
@MooingDuck But if you make the original answer, that should be the better thing to do. Like using empty() instead of size() in containers.
 

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