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5:00 PM
And anything that gives you a bit of trouble can be remedied by reducing stuff like fat shadow settings.
 
My PR from December 2014 finally got merged. 10/10 reflexes by the maintainer
 
the pull request was still mergeable?
 
From which repo?
 
Virtually nothing changed
Actually, it got merged via another PR, but I guess that still counts
 
5:03 PM
@набиячлевэлиь Whatever works.~
 
Pro tip: Always use the "hardware" cursor. Damn clumsy games.
 
What is the "hardware" cursor?
Not the one rendered over by the game?
 
Yes, not the one that the game itself implements in a half-assed manner, which is deeply interconnected with the framerate and poorly replicated acceleration curves.
 
Can't you just pass a BMP as the cursor, and update it as necessary with Window messages?
 
You can do a lot of stuff, customize it to a degree, but the heavy customization is really a bad idea because nobody has ever done it justice. It just makes your game feel subpar and lacking in optimization. Which is not an impression you want to leave on a paying customer who shelled out $60 and has a GTX 980 or equiv.
Also, animating/easing camera rotations too slowly will feel the same as wonky framerate. Assassin's Creed is the usual suspect in this category. GTA V does it really well on PC. Feels tight, yet has a polished feel.
 
5:08 PM
Does anyone know where they proposed the change from integral_constant<bool,T> to bool_constant<T> for the true_type and false_type typedefs in c++1z?
it just seems a little weird to me
 
Ugh. Not this cda bullshit.
Now I need software just to RIP CDs properly.
 
@ElimGarak You mean there's actual lyrics and not just impure barbarish gibberish?
 
Can't just tear some files off a damn thing.
 
I thought all people living in the Uncivilized Lands just said "bar bar bar" to each other all the time.
 
@EtiennedeMartel no, heathens go "foo bar foo bar"
 
5:11 PM
@jaggedSpire If that were true, then they would be "foobaric", not "barbaric".
 
... Damnit Jerry, you made me chuckle in the middle of the music library. .-.
 
I don't understand the Volkswagen emission cheating. If they are able to reduce the emission during test usage then why can't they reduce it for normal usage?
 
@StackedCrooked They could--but if they did, it would also reduce performance.
 
@StackedCrooked The vehicle runs at suboptimal settings, which doesn't show as they're not measuring the performance of the vehicle during an emissions test.
Which is probably going to change in the future, thanks VW/Obama.
 
When Unit Testing fails the Auto Industry.
 
5:15 PM
@JerryCoffin haha!
 
@EtiennedeMartel The title of the song is "Orange (fruit)". And it goes like... Uhm... Oy, girl with the apple blush, they say an orange gave birth to you... And then a context switch to the girl responding: "No, an orange didn't give birth to me, my mother gave birth to me... On a mountain".
 
@JerryCoffin Performance meaning maximum speed, acceleration speed, ..?
 
@ThePhD The BMP is a bit big for a cursor, being as it's like 16 million characters or someshit like that
 
@ElimGarak How... pedestrian.
 
@ThePhD In this case, at least according to the allegations from the US EPA, it sounds like they worked perfectly well. Their software was doing exactly what they wanted; it just happens that what they wanted was illegal.
 
5:17 PM
All cars emit more at maximum speed. Why don't they try to use that as an excuse.
 
@Puppy I meant a Windows Bitmap, gooshh.
 
@StackedCrooked Pretty much all of the above. They would also have to top up the emission control system with various chemicals to keep it running.
 
@StackedCrooked My immediate guess is that it could probably affect both, but probably has more effect on acceleration than top speed (or at least that's what people would be likely to notice).
 
@StackedCrooked The lab tests include maximum speed.
 
So the software reduced acceleration speed if it suspected it was under emission test.
 
5:18 PM
I am just curious how they justified this to the employees that implemented the lie. Or was it the employees who did it because they couldn't deliver on what was expected of them?
 
Money & job?
 
Feels like a thing that would happen top-down.
 
"Yeah, uhm, listen... I need you guys to help us commit fraud."
 
@StackedCrooked Well, reduced (for example) the amount of fuel injected, which would (of course) reduce emissions.
 
And not bottom-up.
 
5:19 PM
@Elim clearly an inter-team job
 
Then again, don't you remember Toyota's spaghetti code?
 
So from the top
 
I wouldn't be surprised if the engineers had no fucking idea.
At least, the grunts anyway.
 
@ElimGarak Probably, the software had a legitimate original purpose, like internal testing or someshit like that.
 
And they implemented this cheat without plausible deniability? What a stupid thing to do.
 
5:20 PM
although the part where it detects if it's in an emissions test I find hard to believe how you would conceal that from the implementers
 
Volkswagen exec: ~ -> leavemealone
 
@Puppy "Just leave the detection code in.... no, no it'll never turn on in production, we promise... now, uh. What were the switches again? So that we, uh. You know. Won't turn it on."
 
Oh we're talking about the car emission thing. For a sec I thought we were talking about some stupid SO question asking how to hack or spam.
 
personally
I think they should be fined the maximum $18b in the US and then more in the other countries where they did the same.
 
@ElimGarak I'd guess they didn't--by the time it got to the engineers, it was a specification of how the tests are conducted, with (quite possibly) some justification: "if the engine runs in the following RPM range with load less than X for more than N seconds, assume the driver is going down a hill, and even though they're holding down the accelerator, inject less fuel, modify timing, whatever, to minimize emissions."
 
5:23 PM
> The low emissions mode almost cuts mileage by 30% – which is why many carmakers used this trick. In recent tests in europe, every single tested car from every carmaker used this trick.
 
@JerryCoffin However, that would imply an honest mistake?
 
^ ^ reddit comment, possibly wrong
 
"possibly"
 
just trying to not look stupid
 
I question the wording of articles, it is ludicrous for a vehicle to be able to tell apart whether it is in an emissions test or being used on the road. Exposing that information to the vehicle would pollute the emissions test by default.
 
5:26 PM
you suck
 
@ElimGarak On most of the engineer's part, probably--but there was undoubtedly at least some small team (or at least one person) who translated the test conditions into something more justifiable.
 
@ScottW yep it does
 
Maybe the software team was Chinese and only the technical instructions were translated leaving the rationale in English.
 
@ElimGarak It can't tell directly--but the point here is that somebody apparently translated standard test conditions into a routine to detect the test (at least with high probability, if not perfect accuracy).
 
@jaggedSpire There’s nothing to change as it’s all aliases.
 
5:32 PM
Yes, exactly, that's the part that baffles me. If the test conditions are transparent to the manufacturers and modern vehicles are heavily computerized, the test ought not to allow black boxes. And I have a feeling that this particular $18 billion mistake will change that in the future. Opening the code to the testing authority.
 
@ElimGarak The software probably has many more "modes". Teams would need to implement each mode without being told when they would be activated.
 
It's like being in a programming competition where there is an available expected/target solution, and you provide a blackbox which just drops the solution without actually solving the problem that is being tested.
 
@ElimGarak I've had shitty grades throughout my life largely for that reason.
 
Video card manufacturers also cheat in a similar way.
To increase FPS during benchmarks.
And there's no law that makes this illegal afaik.
 
5:37 PM
@Mysticial wow imageshack sucks
 
@StackedCrooked Click through to the link on the Chinese site.
That picture still works.
 
@Mysticial wow, that much have sucked for the laborors
imaging scrubbing corners all day long
 
pretty sure they use the machines to cut the corners
 
oh right, I forgot we have machines
 
@StackedCrooked It doesn't suck if they were cutting corners.
 
5:43 PM
HOW TO SUCK LESS
 
By cutting corners.
More at eleven.
 
Yakk is being funny again
@Columbo Column reads the same as Colum to my ear. Bo is a Japanese character, ぼ. It actually took me a second to see the difference between Colombo and Columbo, and then my brain went to one more step to Columnbo, which led to Columnぼ, which amused me. That is all. — Yakk 6 mins ago
 
Ell
@StackedCrooked I feel like a law isn't necessary
people need to boycott more :(
 
@ScottW Haha, star me then, not my message :D
 
5:46 PM
Seriously, I'm surprised that there is no wikihow tutorial about sucking less.
 
@Mysticial When I was in fifth grade, my teacher told me to write something (can't remember what) 50 times. I wrote one sentence: "I will [whatever] fifty times." My teacher was (of course) pissed and was going to punish me for it. Then my dad (who'd have been a great programmer, if he hadn't been born several decades too soon) called the school and ripped into them for deciding to punish me for doing exactly what they'd asked.
 
Ahahah :D
 
@ElimGarak more importantly, why is telkitty not on that list?
 
@JerryCoffin Ahaha, that's epic.
 
Well, she is the to-be newest honorary member. :D
 
5:48 PM
the mother of all trolls
 
chmod sinokitty
 
the bane of the lounge
 
I love how the wikiHow homepage always looks so random.
 
The last 83 seconds of the first track on Alive 2007 are so good.
 
> How to Start Learning C Programming in Turbo C++ IDE
 
5:54 PM
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva That's pretty bad.
I've tested out the functions with like 50 nested structures without triggering SO.
That's as deep as I went though.
 
SO is highly platform dependent.
not sure if the standard requires a minimum
 
@StackedCrooked Oh yeah.
 
Allocating objects on the stack is just as bad as using std::gets.
 
wot
 
@LucDanton which is what confuses me. Why are they listed as being defined differently in the wiki?
 
5:57 PM
Just kidding.
 
to_json is a recursive function.
 
@ScottW yep.
 
Thing is allocating on the stack is essentially using a bounded buffer without boundary checks.
Isn't that supposed to be evil?
 
@jaggedSpire Because the standard is using different wording even though it amounts to the same thing.
 
@Rapptz Overloading ftw.
 
6:01 PM
ye
 
Does to_json support tuples?
 
nop
 
What would tuple support look like?
 
Python dumps tuples into arrays
but I don't like that
(mainly because namedtuple dumps into arrays too which is silly)
 
@ThePhD object to_json(std::tuple<T...>) {...}
 
6:03 PM
I meant, what would it do, not what would the function signature be.
 
and recursively apply to_json to each member of the tuple
 
@Morwenn nicekek
 
@jaggedSpire The magic of aliases.
 
And then you serialize arbitrarily deeply nested tuples..
 
I wanna work on inkdoc.
I think I'm gonna nix .. inkfunction:: x though
cause sanity and what not
problem with tuple support is std::get is a bitch
 
6:05 PM
What's the problem with std::get?
It's one of the simplest functions in the std.
 
I'd have to do indices wankery to loop over the tuple
 
That requires a little bit of beginner-level meta programming.
 
and my experience with recursive functions + indices wankery + nested tuples is that everything becomes very very very slow
 
Could be.
In David Abraham's book I read it helps to "unroll" the template instantiation.
 
Is there any way to do this with std::regex and related?
 
6:09 PM
For example by writing explicit instantiations by hand for tuples up to a certain element count.
But you are right. Stuff gets slow.
Cool, but slow.
Slow, but cool.
Your pick :P
@ScottW so hows your work day going? did you fall asleep?
 
Increase FPSs of FPSs
 
rip
 
Never thought about the fact that Frame Per Second has the same acronym as First Person Shooter.
 
@набиячлевэлиь no
 
@Rapptz Really?
 
6:13 PM
yep
 
'indices wankery' is a too technical term for me. Is there a more layman description that I'd understand?
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ That is an extremely odd thing to not notice. You might want to talk to your optimetrician for new specs.
 
@Rapptz I wonder if the std:: implementors will find a way to make std::apply really fast.
 
6:16 PM
@Rapptz How do you want to loop over the tuple? What do you want to do with each type?
 
As far as like, instantiation time goes.
 
speed isn't an issue with like 1D tuples
unless you do a runtime retrieval of the index
it's when you add recursion and nested tuples to the mix
 
Aren't compilers becoming gradually better at handling those?
 
20 bux says VC++ would choke.
 
tuples should have been a language feature
 
6:18 PM
It's already giving me errors that my big tuples are run over the mangled name length.
 
@Rapptz Reflection group is working on that.
 
this chat's obsession with telkitty is p. weird
 
scala> :t List(List(1), Vector(1)) http://t.co/BwGpE1NEWB
 
@ThePhD I mean actual compilers.
 
@Morwenn Ouch, right in the abdomen.
@Rapptz I think its grown from a collective understanding that she's either at best harmless (annoying at times) or at worst vicious (to select individuals).
Those she's been vicious to feel pretty strongly about it, and for others even if they misjudge based on their own (or telkitty's) misunderstanding, it's pretty much downhill from there.
 
6:22 PM
@Rapptz annoyance rather than obession
 
meh iunno
I've been in so many chat rooms over so many years
 
@Rapptz Would you have any suggestion on how to do that in C++ (in any way)?
 
and telkitty is pretty harmless lol
 
if she was any worse she'd get banned
 
@набиячлевэлиь Parse it yourself. It's pretty easy (without RE)
 
6:24 PM
@Rapptz 's what I thought, too. Thanks
 
FWIW the reason why I think it's not easy to do with regex is because matching braces with regex and looking ahead for braces is bound to be a bad time that's more complicated than just doing it yourself.
 
Hey, I could use multiple inheritance to solve a problem.
 
Well, then consider using it.
 
Not sure how it plays with CTRP though.
 
I've been using multiple inheritance (with CRTP) for great fun.
 
6:26 PM
struct foo: crtp1<foo>, ctrp2<foo> looks like I'll have problems.
 
@Morwenn Whatever you do, don't listen to @ThePhD.
 
@Morwenn You won't.
@StackedCrooked Hey!
 
Dude, you invented cowboy_cast.
 
@Morwenn Thinkin' you'll end up like this?
 
Such lies.
I deny these allegations.
 
6:27 PM
@AndyProwl Ah, sorry, I didn't have my computer up during the keynote ;d
 
The code is already horribly template-heavy, a little bit of multi-CRTP can't do more harm.
 
@Morwenn Famous last words
 
@AndyProwl I'm in 403 atm
 
@Morwenn Been there, done that, code is still compiling.
 
Sometimes I don't know whether what I wrote is actually legal or whether the compiler randomly accepts it.
 
6:30 PM
That's how programming works.
 
@Morwenn Throw it at a language lawyer
 
Ask Luc Danton. He will gladly destroy you.
 
@набиячлевэлиь Mr. kbok and Cicada told me that the code looked clean at least.
 
Lounge<this code isn't that bad, right?>
 
Well then you're probably fine.
Because even our lowest standards are inhumane.
 
6:31 PM
Lounge<it compiles so it's right>
 
> It does not compile properly, but at least it's clean.
 
As long as it sufficiently compiles.
@Morwenn Empty files are clean and accepted by some compilers.
 
As long as they end with an empty line.
 
But that's kinda unclean.
 
6:34 PM
@StackedCrooked Reminds me of the shortest C program printing its own source
 
Empty line rule is gone.
 
:o
My life is over.
 
What is the empty line rule?
 
A file must end with an empty line or else UB say goodbye to the contents of your HDD
 
Files used to have to end with a newline character
 
6:35 PM
Ah.
 
Not since a long time ago de facto, and not since C++11 de jure
 
So I can stop doing that. Yet another productivity enhancement.
 
I guess it's something I'll keep out of habit.
 
I'll probably feel bad about not doing it for a while.
I used to feel bad about closing two template brackets without a space in between them.
But now I feel fine about it.
 
Just set your editor to enforce an empty line on end of file -> productivity enhancement + old-standard-compliant
 
6:38 PM
I'm back :V
 
Heh. Yeah, I configure Qt Creator to do that.
@Grimbode Who the hell are you? :P
 
ahahahah. (FNG)
 
:V I joined today
I said "Hi" and everyone thought I had a c++ question which I didn't.
haha
I'm just a javascript dude in a c++ ocean. I met my creators today. :V :V :V
 
JS ALEEEEERT
puts on hazmat suit
 
@Grimbode JavaScript, I am your fa....oops, wrong movie!
 
6:44 PM
Emoji 'problem' solved, it's so easy!
 
Lots of JS savages in the Lounge lately.
 
@Grimbode Hi.
 
@ElimGarak I don't know if that's amazing or just a complete waste of time. :V
 
Does anyone know I can get the car id from the xml file. pls urgent.
 
@StackedCrooked Hi :V
 
6:46 PM
@StackedCrooked jQuery, which does all, knows all and cures all, of course.
 
#AskTrump do you hate Mexicans because most of us have that natural tan glow and you can't achieve that without looking like an orange?
owch
 
@thecoshman It even includes MAN IN BUSINESS SUIT LEVITATING /cc @R.MartinhoFernandes
 
@StackedCrooked It's never been a problem to me. I more or less started learning C++ by myself while C++11 was being finalized, so I quickly got used to it :p
 
@JerryCoffin good point. jQuery is useful in reading XML like as if it was a JSON
 
@набиячлевэлиь he knows
 
6:48 PM
#AskTrump Where will your concentration camps be?
 
@набиячлевэлиь :O that's what I should map my 'calc' key to
 
twitter had fun with this #AskTrump hashtag
 
May 6 at 13:50, by R. Martinho Fernandes
The levitating dude in a suit was added for interoperability, btw.
 
@TonyTheLion Trump 2016 will be World War III for sure.
 
@TonyTheLion ETOOCONSTRUCTIVE
 
6:49 PM
lol
 
@sehe Really?
Oh, wow. For Webdings.
Topkek.
 
@набиячлевэлиь hardly convincing. It's only a ~1% deterioration. In the grand scheme of that is not even a blip
 
Have any of you played around with Dart?
 
I tried but never managed to consistenly hit the triple twenty.
 
Darts are my favourite implementation of monte-carlo Pi approximation.
Also explains my average scores
 
6:51 PM
slow claps
 
@StackedCrooked Mine was more elaborate. Which excuses the slowness
 
:V much troll
 
> >tfw every second message you send contains the string ":V"
 
:V yeah and?
 
what does :V mean?
It looks like a talking face.
 
6:55 PM
it's a Vim shortcut for Vendetta
 
#AskTrump Is there any documented proof that you are from this planet?
ok that was the last one
 
@TonyTheLion :V
 
Ell
fuck me I have to go out again tonight :v
 
@Ell With whom?
 
Ell
6:59 PM
me flatmates
 
I'm tempted to write a letter to the editor to see if I can get "colon V considered harmful" published--only it's not so much harmful as just annoying enough to get somebody kicked if he doesn't at least slow down a bit with it...
 
@Ell you don't have to do anything
 

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