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12:01 PM
@Jefery nice
 
that perturbed you :)
 
@sehe Nice :)
 
yeah, nice
 
@sehe cool
 
@sehe On the other hand, your probably deserve it :p
 
12:05 PM
Many deserved things go without saying
So it's nice anyways he took the trouble. Spirit devs also did that once on the mailing list.
 
It does help
 
@Puppy ITT your mother's a Java game
 
:)
 
@Morwenn ☺☻
 
12:14 PM
Silicon Valley professionals take LSD to boost productivity & benefits of LSD ... whoever wrote those articles were probably drug dealers ...
 
2015-11-28| 10 000 000 times with optimized took: 497 ms
2015-11-28| 10 000 000 times with regex     took: 3548 ms
was hoping for more
 
@набиячлэвэлиь woah man, that's a bit uncalled for.
 
@thecoshman Why?
 
@набиячлэвэлиь just a little too insulting
 
12:19 PM
@thecoshman lol
 
user1804599
My fan makes an annoying noise.
 
@sehe \o/
 
@Elyse That's the price of public adoration
 
@Elyse try to clean it with the vacuum cleaner
 
user1804599
It's the fan that was built into the case.
 
12:22 PM
@Elyse It just wants to be like you!
 
laptop?
 
user1804599
Time to implement the consumption of roots emitted by root providers.
 
@Elyse remove it
 
user1804599
The noise goes away after about one minute after booting.
 
@StackedCrooked You may now find the latest Linux build of Wide available at s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/wide-build-artifacts/builds/latest/…
 
12:23 PM
the bearings in computer fans are usually cheap/poor quality
 
@Elyse oh I used to have one a bit like that
hmm... do I want to get a ps4 controller for playing emu games with...
It's a nice controller, both the feel and the connectivity... but ·€42 :\
 
@JohanLarsson Yes, they are, and it really pisses me off that I have to continually buy new fans.
 
One of the articles said LSD causes less brain damage than alcohol, it's hard to believe. Because humans have used alcohol for 5000+ years. Plenty of intelligent people have drunk alcohol for years. LSD was invented less than 100 years ago, long term effect was pretty much unknown in comparison to alcohol
 
@MartinJames how much do you tend to pay per fan?
 
@MartinJames especially the small fans on mb and graphics card
@thecoshman more the effort than the cost imo
 
12:27 PM
@thecoshman Not much for the fan, but it's all the aggro of ordering one, waiting in for it to be delivered, taking my box apart, fiddling with the plastite screws and all that crap.
 
keramiska glidlager would be nice
 
Also, the fan connector is ALWAYS underneath drives and/or stiff cabling.
 
no translation
 
@ElimGarak not just yet, though - right?
 
@MartinJames try getting ones more than 99p
Yeah, let's get that PS4 controller!
 
12:29 PM
@thecoshman There are fans that cost more?
 
@MartinJames buy £20 with leds, the leds make them work better
 
user1804599
Does the C++ standard library provide atomic operations on non-atomic values?
 
@thecoshman lol
 
user1804599
 
@Elyse that sounds stupid
 
user1804599
12:32 PM
Why?
 
@Elyse int x; reinterpret_cast<std::atomic<int>&>(x).store(1); :p
 
If you want atomic, use an atomic
 
user1804599
@melak47 UB
 
user1804599
@thecoshman I can't.
 
@melak47 Preload :(
 
user1804599
12:33 PM
I want atomic only sometimes.
 
@Elyse o.O
 
user1804599
What's so weird about this?
 
user1804599
Sometimes I just don't need atomic operations.
 
like, when
 
user1804599
12:35 PM
Almost always.
 
user1804599
But anyway, back to the point, there seems to be no such facility in the standard library.
 
struct maybe_atomic { bool atomic = false; union { int x = 0; atomic<int> y; }; };, and switch which one you use? :/
 
user1804599
Overhead of a Boolean.
 
user1804599
The Boolean is not needed.
 
user1804599
Just template<typename T> maybe_atomic { T x; atomic<T> a; };
 
12:37 PM
the value of maybe atomic updates is limited.
 
then don't use the boolean if you know when you need to use what and you know that it was atomic previously
 
I'm pretty sure that mixing atomic and non-atomic updates is going to be super bad.
 
user1804599
It's up to the API consumer to make sure they use the correct (atomic or nonatomic) functions.
 
@Elyse now you have an overhead of T
 
user1804599
It's not bad.
 
12:39 PM
but a bool is?
 
user1804599
It is entirely reasonable that programs running on a VM will want some operations to be atomic and some not.
 
user1804599
As such the VM should provide both ways to modify memory.
 
yes, but it's a bad idea to use the same variable in both cases ;p
make the user make atomic objects of a distinct type and provide atomic ops only on them
 
Ven
just how can hotmail suck so badly? I do not understand how you can fuck something up so badly
 
user1804599
12:41 PM
@Puppy The VM doesn't know about types.
 
Ven
@Elyse just use .at, c'mon
 
user1804599
@Ven Where?
 
user1804599
fields is a flexible array. There is no .at.
 
Ven
@Elyse instead of the asserts
 
@Elyse That sounds more than a tad risky.
 
user1804599
12:42 PM
@Ven Doesn't matter. It's two words.
 
@Puppy no risk, no fun! :p
 
user1804599
All types are fully erased by the compiler.
 
user1804599
The VM doesn't know about them. Making the VM know about them complicates everything without zero benefit.
 
Ven
@Elyse gist.github.com/rightfold/ce56626fece3e50e315b#file-gc-cpp-L188 map#erase invalidates the iterator, methinks
 
template<class T>
union MaybeAtomic {
    T x;
    std::atomic<T> ax;
};
 
user1804599
12:44 PM
All the VM knows about is how many pointers to objects an object contains, and how many bytes of non-object-pointer data it contains.
 
there's little point in using a VM if it doesn't guarantee safety.
 
user1804599
@Ven It doesn't. That's why I used std::map instead of std::unordered_map. It does in C++14, but library implementations still suck.
 
otherwise the proposed compiler may as well just target LLVM IR.
 
probably violates all kind of standard stuff
but should work with simple types on most compilers
 
Ven
@Elyse stackoverflow.com/questions/6438086/iterator-invalidation-rules says it does, that's where I got it from
 
12:45 PM
@orlp well, if you kept a bool telling you which one you were using...you could at least do an atomic load before switching to non-atomic use or something. not sure if that helps at all. :D
 
Ven
@Elyse okay, another answers says you're right. I'm going to downvote this one
 
> 'x86_64' is not a recognized processor for this target (ignoring processor)
fucksake I thought I fixed that
 
oh lol
those are the Polish cities. The "Proc" column is a percentage of people happy to live where they live
 
Ell
1:00 PM
I need fish&chips agaib
 
Why can't I have an array of auto :(
 
@набиячлэвэлиь what do you mean?
what would you initialize it with?
 
@BartekBanachewicz auto asdf[] = {your, mother};
 
@набиячлэвэлиь make_array(your, mother)
 
^
@набиячлэвэлиь also wtf why are you using C arrays
dude
 
1:04 PM
Because I don't have constructor template argument deduction yet
 
user1804599
Jungles in Minecraft are really nice.
 
@набиячлэвэлиь what
what do you mean "you don't have that"
 
@набиячлэвэлиь Wait for concepts.
 
@BartekBanachewicz it's supposed to come in C++17 I think :D
template<typename T, typename... Args> T make_anything(Args&&... args) { return T{std::forward<Args>(args)...}; } you can do make anything!
 
@BartekBanachewicz That's C++17, duh
 
1:05 PM
@набиячлэвэлиь it's a function
 
std::vector<auto> vec = { 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 };
 
@Morwenn that also. kinda weird :D
 
@melak47 dunno why it would be weird
 
The number of language changes crammed into the Concepts TS is rather high.
 
main = print ([1,2,3] :: Num a => [a])
@melak47 this is weird
you don't have to worry about C++ getting to that level for the next 15 years or so
 
1:08 PM
@melak47 I ain't got no <experimental/array>, doe
 
now what happens if you have a template<class T> class thing { template<class U> thing(U) {} }; and you do thing<auto> = {1}; - failure to deduce T I guess?
 
@melak47 I suppose so.
It's not the part of concepts I care about the most anyway :p
 
@melak47 until you get Hindley-Milner inference, yeah.
 
@BartekBanachewicz and what's that gonna do?
 
@melak47 @Nooble's mom
 
1:16 PM
I am so distressed that I had to called in the police & fire brigade for cutting a gas pipe this afternoon, I am polishing a bottle of French rosé :'(
 
uh oh
all my Wide tests pass.
 
time to release it.
big launch party when?
 
@melak47 Yeah, before he tries the Narrow tests.
 
@Morwenn could you not
 
no, it's super suspicious
I'm pretty sure that most of them pass, but certainly not all of them.
and on Windows, they all fail.
so I think I've just broken the test runner.
 
1:26 PM
@Puppy are you using VW's test framework on linux?
 
what's that?
 
@Borgleader What do you mean?
 
shows failing tests as passing
 
#vwcares #dieselgate Adopting a VW-inspired testing framework. All my tests will pass! https://github.com/auchenberg/volkswagen
:P
 
oh
no I am not
lols
forgot to put MinGW in the right place to use libstdc++ for running Windows tests
ah
now my PC is lagging to shit so I know the tests are running
 
1:37 PM
@JohanLarsson I have a test runner that reports compiler errors as successful test cases :v
 
not to feel better about MSVC, though. To test static_asserts :)
 
R#10 and nunit 3 was a bugfarm, think it was nunit's fault
 
R#9 was unusably slow
 
depends on settings
they released some slow updates, think it was 9.1
 
1:42 PM
as long as R# is enabled, it's super slow, and their Typescript support is just bad
 
hi all
 
hmm
run test individually, segfault
run tests as a group, all pass
I think I am using waitpid wrong ;p
 
@Puppy there are settings to tweak for R#
but it does not make vs faster
 
it's not VS, it's R#.
if you disable R#, VS is still bad and slow but nowhere near as bad and slow
fuck, I failed to pick up my package.
I am a bad and a stupid.
 
2:01 PM
Time for a sauna
 
huh.. is that John de Lancie? yup yup it is
 
TIL Japanese refer to Daft Punk as Daft Punk-san.
 
@Borgleader is what John de Lancie?
 
@melak47 The voice actor in SC2
hes doing one of the important characters :)
/cc @ElimGarak
 
2:04 PM
:D
 
Yeah, Q has been expanding his portfolio to voice acting :P
 
I realized really late he did one of the voice in Assassin's Creed
 
Have any of you tried cling
the c++ interpreter
 
I toyed with it long time ago.
 
I get tired of setting up a project every time I want to mess with something simple
 
2:08 PM
Well, there's coliru :)
 
true
 
Gawd, I want to smack the turian councilor across his stupid face
 
I actually have a script on my mac that generates a new project with random name for messing.
 
That's a good idea... I should set up something similar
I have a scratch dir for random scraps of code
 
I have a script that generates mac & cheese
 
Ell
2:13 PM
@StackedCrooked I need to set that up
Something that sets up a quick project in a temp directory
 
Y'all lazy
 
@AndyProwl nice :)
 
this might be a silly question
but how to do I run a .maxhelp file?
 
suspicion confirmed
 
what extension is this?
 
2:17 PM
Never heard of it before
 
mentions -> run the "kin.skel.maxhelp"
 
might be a 3ds max help file
@Ell for single-source stuff I just have an alias for gcc and clang with some standard flags
 
@melak47 How do you suspect I run it?
 
@AbhishekBhatia open 3ds max, drag it into it, or explore the help menu
if your version of 3ds it too new, there might not even be a non-web help anymore, though.
 
Ell
I want to attempt to learn about graphics drivers
 
2:24 PM
@Ell oh no :D
 
Ell
:D
Cool infpgraphic
 
$369 for a 1080p screen?
 
@Ell I don't trust AMD's info on this (in spite of the fact that I am an AMD person)
 
help I think I borked coliru
 
what did you do!!
people depend on coliru!
 
2:30 PM
haha @Stacked that's what you get for your suggestion
 
oh wait its good
 
cppreference.com does!
 
gave me a scare tho
I think I'll stick to local stuff I can kill
what happens if I infinite loop something? Does coliru auto kill the job eventually
 
yes, there's a timeout
 
I'd expect that
 
2:33 PM
I think 5 seconds last time I heard.
 
user1804599
Back to implementing safe points.
 
user1804599
I think I know how to do it.
 
ugh, Elementary S4E0E just rebecca.blackfriday'd me :(
 
@melak47 20 seconds
can be extended to 60 seconds if you know the secret
 
that long? no wonder it sometimes takes ages til a snippet runs :p
 
2:36 PM
only sehe uses it
 
There's a party goin' on here, a celebration to last throughout the years.
@melak47 Yeah :D
But it wasn't Friday :D
 
user1804599
I think I'll do it like this: I have one shared mutex. On resumption, a mutator acquires a shared lock on it. A safe point then releases that shared lock and acquires it again immediately after. On collection, the GC acquires a unique lock on the mutex.
 
user1804599
That should work.
 
Man... why are lambdas so much slower than virtual functions :/
 
wat
 
2:40 PM
@Prismatic you what
 
why is bread slower than pizza
 
give us the codes please
 
just tell your lambdas to move their ass
 
lambda was the wrong word
I should have said std function
 
@milleniumbug Because it wheats too much
 
2:40 PM
oh, ok
 
user1804599
void fiber::resume() {
    std::shared_lock<decltype(gc->stop_the_world_mutex)> stop_the_world_lock(gc->stop_the_world_mutex);
    auto safe_point = [&] {
        stop_the_world_lock.unlock();
        stop_the_world_lock.lock();
    };
    // interpret bytecode
}
 
@Prismatic well there you go :v
 
@CatPlusPlus :\
 
@Elyse I'd write an acquire_shared(Lockable) function so you can just write auto lock = acquire_shared(gc->stop_the_world_mutex)
 
@Elyse Is the stop_the_world_mutex the lock that'll cause those gc hiccups in every managed language
 
user1804599
2:42 PM
Yes.
 
@CatPlusPlus lol
 
user1804599
Fun-fact: a GIL would be just like this, except shared_lock would be unique_lock. :D
 
@melak47 Nearly twice as much as I paid for mine =/
 
@Borgleader well it says average. still, seems expensive
 
2:43 PM
so slow ... too slow
 
user1804599
> [When] safepoint is required, JVM unmaps page with that address provoking page fault on application thread (which is handled by JVM’s handler). This way, HotSpot maintains its JITed code CPU pipeline friendly, yet ensures correct memory semantic (page unmap is forcing memory barrier to processing cores).
 
user1804599
dat hack
 
@Prismatic std::function may need to perform dynamic allocation when you construct it
I expect the time to call the function in both cases to be comparable
just try to remove construction from the test and you should see similar results
 
user406009
@AndyProwl I think the compiler might also be able to "devirtualize" a virtual method call in certain cases.
 
user1804599
dat hack is awesome
 
2:46 PM
@Lalaland yeah, that too
 
@melak47 creation is still timed there though, isn't it?
hm, doesn't actually seem to change much
better though
 
@AndyProwl true enough
 
but yeah, I also suspect the compiler is devirtualizing there
 
 
2:49 PM
I gotta admit I don't quite get the point of the virtual there...
I mean the thing is not even used in a polymorphic manner, so why would there be a virtual function call even without de-virtualization :/
 
In my actual application I'd have several classes that would inherit from BufferUpdateInheritMePls, and then it would be called through its base pointer
 
hm, coliru stopped working for me
 
too many loungers pressing compile & link & run :D
 
Its pausing for me every once in awhile like that too
 
@Prismatic you did it!
 
2:51 PM
its why I freaked out earlier
@melak47 >_>;
 
this should get rid of devirtualization
 
ReaderWriterLockSlim
 
maybe
 
@AndyProwl yep
 
2:54 PM
@AndyProwl neat
    BufferUpdateInheritMePls* b = new BufferUpdateSPtr(bar);
    auto v = b->GetData();
    delete b;
^ also gives me similar results
 
yeah
 
user1804599
I just used const_cast to cast away volatility.
 
> oh no, it's retarded
:P
 
user1804599
Every programmer should have done this in their lives at least once.
 
@Elyse isnt doing that like straight up criminal
 
2:59 PM
@JohanLarsson in my experience in most cases I'd use a reader/writer lock atomics would do a better job. Also most people misuse reader writer locks
 

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