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5:00 AM
The Chinese are the ones selling dirt cheap panels to everyone.
 
user3010322
Well, silliness aside, I'm sure the price will go down, and then we just need to figure out how to make it useful and build it into the world's infrastructure.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Black hole Jupiter and then use mirrors for increased Hawking radiation! Of course if we can black hole anything it wouldn’t have to be Jupiter but I still want my night light.
^ this can’t fail
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes One local news report said that some parts of those cheap panels are just tinted plastic.
 
@MarkGarcia Why am I not surprised?
 
user3010322
I should probably be more involved in this discussion of solar stuff since I am actually planning on making a self-recharging bracelet using solar panels. <_>
 
5:01 AM
Oh right I remember
 
@MarkGarcia Assuming that's not bullshit, if tinted plastic can produce energy, who cares?
 
2 years I made a solar powered fountain and it only cost me $35.
then again it's just a fountain lol
it was either $35 or $45, I just remembered it was less than $50 and ended in 5.
 
o.O thats actually kinda cool
 
user3010322
That is cool.
 
user3010322
Share plans with me plx?
 
5:03 AM
I have pictures of it
lemme find it
 
user3010322
Pictures are nice.
 
@LucDanton It would have to not be Jupiter. Jupiter is too important in the grand scheme of things.
 
It’s not like I’m saying we take away the matter :v
 
user3010322
What is Jupiter good for?
 
@ThePhD Hosting a bunch of possible habitable planetoids.
 
5:05 AM
Jupiter's magnetic field would be the size of the Sun in Earth's sky if visible. This is at four times farther than the Sun is.
 
user3010322
So... what does that do for us? D:
 
That massive ball of hydrogen helps keep a lot of shit in place, and keep a lot of shit away from the inner solar system.
It's fucking huge.
 
> That massive ball of hydrogen
lel
@Rapptz neat
 
5:08 AM
@Borgleader Ah. Nice.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I’m just suggesting we compress it a little and tap energy from things further falling into it (e.g. Saturn). It’s not going away — as you can see I’m being perfectly reasonable here.
 
@LucDanton I'd rather just drop a teleporter emitter on it, and plug a receiver in a fusion plant.
 
Your plan is flawed: how much energy is required to sustain this alleged teleportation?
 
As much as you need to launch Saturn into a black hole.
Or less, if the plan was to teleport Saturn into a black hole.
 
user3010322
@Rapptz Shiny.
 
5:11 AM
@Rapptz Hmm. I see an opportunity for infinite energy generation.
 
user3010322
Water Wheel with a solar-powered fountain? :P
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes See, that’s for latter. You start with black holing a bit of Jupiter, then as this black kernel grows in density (random walks leading to the horizon etc.) Hawking radiation increases (actually I don’t know that for a fact :( ).
 
Was to help demonstrate renewable energy for the local high school's AP Environmental Science class.
 
user3010322
Blah.
 
user3010322
I'm going to just write old, plain, regular shading equations. ._.
 
5:13 AM
@Borgleader WTF is "a loop setting"?
@LucDanton Wait, you mean to make a black hole out of Jupiter?
 
Now that I think about it, the plan really is to seed Jupiter, but you have to wait that there’s enough collapse (if that’s the term) before reaping the fruit of the labor. Obviously we need to start early and do the same to Saturn while it’s still underway — plan a whole system harvest, so to speak.
13 mins ago, by Luc Danton
@R.MartinhoFernandes Black hole Jupiter and then use mirrors for increased Hawking radiation! Of course if we can black hole anything it wouldn’t have to be Jupiter but I still want my night light.
13 mins ago, by Luc Danton
^ this can’t fail
 
The world Sun is not enough.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes If runs out of space it loops back to the beginning and overwrite the old data?
 
@Borgleader Wouldn't that destroy any filesystem?
 
wouldn't this guy feel how light it is?
 
5:16 AM
Nuts for ballast!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Joking aside the energy perspective of that ‘plan’ is tickling my mind. Those random walks into a black hole sound very much like Maxwell’s demon…
 
Second law.
The usual bitch.
 
But the mirrors!
 
@Rapptz It had nuts to give it the right weight
 
5:18 AM
That means black hole evaporation is cray-cray. I should have realised that from the start of course but orders of magnitudes are hard.
I’ll file my plan under ‘how to keep lukewarm during heat death’.
 
What are good keywords to add to my TCG outside of Haste?
For some reason I have like a mental block or something
 
Would be a bit imba with this battle system
 
user3010322
Flying is a piece of shit.
 
user3010322
And I hope all winged creatures die.
 
5:22 AM
lol
 
lol
 
user3010322
I am not bitter at MtG 2014. :|
 
@Rapptz I think it’s a customisation point that can play along the flavour of the setting, so I’d pick abstract terms and fit something thematically appropriate later. Assuming here there’s going to be a canonical theme though.
 
Oh I was just using Haste as an example of a Keyword that does something
e.g. bypass summoning sickness
 
I wasn’t going to assume useless keywords.
 
5:24 AM
I'm not actually going to name it Haste
Oh I thought you were referring to the name.
 
It's just a specific pattern you can find again. The idea is rather simple: first you set everything on the drive to 0, which means all bits should be 0. Then you only modify the very first 3 bytes. If all other bytes stay 0, they're indeed there. If other bytes change as well, the drive is defective (didn't write or read properly). If other bytes are the same, the drive is in "looping" mode, meaning, if you write over the end (which is closer to the start than expected), it will start writing at the beginning again. — Mario Aug 14 '13 at 8:25
 
(Does anyone here even know what I mean?)
 
user3010322
Dizzy.
 
Does this make sense to you?
 
5:26 AM
My point being that if the theme is wizards (e.g. creatures are various kinds of spellcasters) then you can have ‘ethereal’ or ‘intangible’ for something that can’t be blocked.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yikes
 
Doesn’t work as well in a gangster setting though! But you could pick ‘runner’ then! Exclamation point!!
 
I named my keywords "properties" :v
I don't know if keywords are patented by WotC
i.e. it's not in this one: google.com/patents/US5662332
 
If they would be anything, that would be trademarked. Which I would not expect them to be (well I suppose there are several trademarks containing ‘Planeswalker’).
 
user3010322
Fuck BRDFs.
 
user3010322
5:31 AM
Nobody needs that shit.
 
@LucDanton Oh no. I meant the concept of a keyword existing in a trading card game.
 
@LucDanton "Tap" is trademarked though.
 
They already patented changing state of a card by turning it 90 degrees (e.g. "tapping"), using card sleeves to denote a change of state, and other nonsense
 
The only recourse I know around patents is black room design. I don’t know what help a thesaurus is.
 
I see a lot of games using workarounds like "exhaust" and stuff.
 
5:35 AM
@Rapptz Mechanisms, yeah. Words though, no.
 
Mechanisms is more of an issue than words :(
 
We still turn those cards 90 degrees when we "exhaust" them.
It just doesn't come described that way in the rulebook.
 
Yugioh turns a card 90 degrees to denote change in defence <-> attack
 
user3010322
You should say convention for the card game is wearing lipstick and kissing the back of the card everytime it'sbeen exhausted.
 
user3010322
Nobody will actually do it, and they'll just end up turning the card sideways. :v
 
5:39 AM
Sounds like something out of Unglued.
Would totally do it.
 
lol
I can see a lot of people doing it too
 
A friend of mine did the hokey-pokey quite often.
Going to sleep now. Later.
 
user3010322
Lol.
 
Night
 
user3010322
Night.
 
5:56 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes That cant be a real card
 
It's part of Unglued which is a joke set
 
Holy shit those cards are hilarious
 
@Rapptz Um should I watch this?
 
Hell yeah.
 
@LucDanton Clean room design isn't even intended to get around patents, only copyrights. For a patent it doesn't matter whether you copied from the patented item or not. You don't even have to realize the patent exists to infringe on it.
 
5:59 AM
The ending is great
 
@JerryCoffin Good thing bringing that up. I’m not sure what I had in mind.
I suppose there doesn’t need to be a technique for not infringing on a patent. Treading around one to achieve the same results without the same method or device would be, well, invention.
 
@LucDanton Most likely copyrights. You can get around a copyright by showing you didn't copy/derive from the original.
@LucDanton ...or just using what was known prior to the patent.
 
@JerryCoffin I understand that. But for instance I recall there’s an historical example where a patent on some crucial device for steam engines (held by Watt?) lead to varying inventions that achieved the same thing, but differently enough they could lead to new patents.
@Rapptz If anything, I’m fascinated by some of the accents.
@Rapptz You lied to me :|
 
You didn't think the ending was funny?
I laughed :(
 
Eh, no stupid questions in a classroom kind of deal.
 
6:09 AM
@LucDanton Oh yeah, that's certainly frequent as well.
 
@LucDanton Yeah I know. I just thought it was funny at first, then a bit sad because I remembered these people can vote now.
 
@Rapptz Are you talking about the guy's comment on where african americans evolved from?
 
Yeah
 
I died inside when I heard it =/
 
Why do you say African American?
 
6:11 AM
@Rapptz I have to give it to you that sometimes there is laughter even when it shouldn’t be funny :Þ
 
@Rapptz Isnt that what he said?
 
I honestly don't like that term, it has always bugged me.
@Borgleader Yeah. He did. For some reason I thought he said "Black" and "White" and you were correcting it.
 
7:06 AM
does this look right? Seems too fast to believe.
 
I would test it locally but I'm on Windows and high:resolution:clock is a fraud =/
 
it's even crazier on my local machine
Construct mutex elapsed: 20ns each
Construct unique_lock elapsed: 9ns each
Acquire unique_lock elapsed: 18ns each
Release unique_lock elapsed: 20ns each
so mutex REALLY flies when there is no contention
linux btw, in case you were wondering
I disassembled it, it's really calling pthread_mutex_lock etc
 
7:45 AM
why is this piece of shit macbook kept on insisting me putting everything on the internet
 
@sudorm-rfTelkitty Because the iCloud is the best thing since sliced bread
oh my... i think i just puked a little typing that
 
artificial stupidity
that's why everyone have their own brains
because we are not designed to share everything
now stop trying to steal/facilitating other people stealing your users info
 
This looked like a job for template template parameters. And yet again, a type parameter ended up being more convenient.
 
@sudorm-rfTelkitty the NSA has infiltrated Apple! :O
 
it's 24 instructions to acquire a mutex when it isn't held
 
7:57 AM
sharing everything is for idiots ... sharing is caring, yes, helping others or making them happy is good. but sharing everything without thinking is just retarded
now stop treating everyone as retards
 
@doug65536 IRC, it's roughly the same on a Windows critical section, (a mutex class restricted to inter-thread locking).
 
9:07 AM
@sudorm-rfTelkitty OK, that took some time. 'Accident-prone area' :)
 
9:41 AM
This seems to be the perfect book to put under my Christmas tree. Or, since I don't really celebrate Christmas, any other tree for that matter :)
 
morning motherfuckers
 
morning fuckwit
 
Bad question of the day:
0
Q: ERROR LIKE "THE DESIGNER ENCOUNTERED AN ERROR WHILE LOADING THE TABLE DEFINITION". CAN ANYONE HELP ME?

INJAS M T P"THE DESIGNER ENCOUNTERED AN ERROR WHILE LOADING THE TABLE DEFINITION" ERROR IN VISUAL STUDIO 2013. CAN ANYONE HELP ME?. BUT SOMETIMES I CAN CREATE DATABASE AND ITS TABLE. AFTER CREATING ONE TABLE AND ITS DEFINITION I CANNOT CREATE ANOTHER DATABASE TABLE. I HAVE RESTARTED THE APPLICATION. BUT NO ...

 
that's terrible
for the morning, when I haven't even had my coffee yet
free downvotes
 
I am doing an online exam, but Javascript kept on stuffing up
 
9:56 AM
hi
anyone knows, if it's possible to generate a random number without a seed
with a computer
 
@VitaliusKuchalskis yes
 
@Mysticial OK, I give in already - I doubt that a worse question will come in today.
 
 
@VitaliusKuchalskis Pseudo random or true random?
 
9:59 AM
Then you need special hardware that detects radioactive decay or background noise from the Big Bang.
 
^^^^^ this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 
Plug in a random number generator board.
 
@FredOverflow That exists already. In Ivy Bridge processors.
But the NSA backdoored it though.
 
or you need @Mysticial to reveal to you the inner mysteries of today's CPUs
 
10:00 AM
I thought he was kidding, but he's not.
 
@Mysticial how?
 
@VitaliusKuchalskis How hard is it to type "ivy bridge nsa" into Google?
 
sorry and thank you! :)
 
That said, it doesn't mean that they backdoored it well enough that they can exploit it.
 
> The generator uses an on-processor entropy source
I wonder what kind of entropy source they use.
 
10:05 AM
shot noise.
 
I don't have guns.
 
They let a few circuits hang in the "don't care" region between 1 and zero.
Then they use a few transistor tricks to force it away from that region into either a 1 or a zero.
 
And that happens non-deterministically?
 
@FredOverflow correct
 
That is, it couldn't be predicted with physics simulation or whatever? Wow.
 
10:07 AM
So this gives you a somewhat random seed. Then you apply it through a few cryptographically secure algorithms to make it look more random.
@FredOverflow The neutral voltage region is the unstable equilibrium. If you perturb it up or down, it will snap all the way to 0 or 1.
 
I have no idea what "the unstable equilibrium" is, so I guess I'll just have to take your word for it :)
 
lol
> In Unix-like operating systems, /dev/random is a special file that serves as a random number generator or as a pseudorandom number generator. It allows access to environmental noise collected from device drivers and other sources.[citation needed]
this made me laugh a bit
 
Environmental noise? I have a very loud neighbor. Can she make my numbers more random?
 
No, but your mom can.
:)
 
@FredOverflow you may try to google :D
 
10:10 AM
@VitaliusKuchalskis Thanks for the hint ;)
 
anyway
thanks for the information
I feel enlightened
 
@VitaliusKuchalskis You're welcome.
 
It seems that keeping C++ out of the room name has also kept out the trolls.
3
 
@Mysticial that's kinda sad 'cuz I like to see C++ in its name
 
@Mysticial what trolls?
 
10:18 AM
also I still believe that normal people can come and ask normal things about C++
 
Ever since we renamed the room to not have C++ or C++ related tags this room feels more dead
Maybe it's a cognitive bias of some sort.
 
Well, we could put subtle hints in there that only intermediate programmers would understand. Let me give you an example:
room topic changed to Rule<Three>: I'm in your constructors, acquiring your resources [maken-not-newed] [raii] [sfinae]
 
Oh wow.
 
@Rapptz y
:D
 
If you make your app interrupt itself if the phone receives a phone call, Android says under permissions that the app requires "Phone Calls" permissions.
silly
 
10:33 AM
 
is anyone going to the aachen user group meeting in february?
 
No, but I'll be attending the Hamburg meeting.
 
were you in the first meeting there?
 
I have never been to a C++ meeting in my entire life.
 
Me too
 
user1804599
10:39 AM
> var x = [].reverse;
undefined
> x() == window;
true
 
user1804599
I wonder if it would be a dupe if I asked why this happens.
 
What language is this? JavaScript?
 
likely
 
user1804599
Yes.
 
user1804599
Actually, I know why this is happening.
 
user1804599
10:41 AM
[].reverse returns this.
 
I can't repro
 
user1804599
Although I am not 100% sure.
 
If you know the answer, why would you ask on SO? Rep whore!
 
> undefined == window
> false
> var x = [].reverse
> undefined
> x() == window
> TypeError: can't convert undefined to object
 
user1804599
10:44 AM
@FredOverflow I am not 100% sure of it.
 
user1804599
And in Node.js I get a different, unexpected result.
 
user1804599
 
10:58 AM
@Rapptz You mean "Me neither", right?
 
Yes
If you want to be more technically correct then it should be "I haven't either"
 
Ell
11:16 AM
or neither have I
 
room topic changed to Rule<Technically Correct>: Consuming too much DHMO can kill. [maken-not-newed] [raii] [sfinae]
room topic changed to Lounge<Technically Correct>: Consuming too much DHMO can kill. [maken-not-newed] [raii] [sfinae]
 
I like the relevance of the sfinae tag.
 
well, cycle shall soon complete and we'll be back to Brothel<C++>
 
Linux's manual pages suck.
Why is there none for say man pthread or man pthread_atfork?
 
@ThePhD Ye, getting light to work was really obnoxious for me as well. I actually did go trough the afore-linked paper a few times and "refreshed" some calculus to get it working ---almost---- properly.
 
11:22 AM
@wilx If you're using Debian they're under manpages-posix-dev package. Should probably get manpages-dev too.
 
"USE_LOTS_OF_FORCE" is actually a flag in the Win32 SDK. http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa370646(v=vs.85).aspx
2
^ lol
 
@sehe legit
 
@wilx dur. Try man pthreads...
Though pthread_atfork seems to be AWOL
@FredOverflow I did last novermber! For the first time ever. It was kinda fun, though I'm not convinced I'd do it again
 
@sehe man pthreads seems useless. It is just an overview or something.
 
@sehe What exactly happened?
 
11:31 AM
std::ostringstream key; is causing 23 million instructions to run on the CPU. Why? What the heck. I need to find a faster string concat.
@wilx Then what /did/ you expect to find at man pthread? A book?
 
try operator+? :P
 
@FredOverflow I went to MeetingC++ 2013.
 
@sehe I am expecting to get pthread_atfork() docs under man pthread_atfork.
 
lol maybe you people should find a better hobby than stalking people over the internet ~_~
 
> @kellabyte If you need most perf, avoid STL and use custom string operations.
lol
 
11:33 AM
@StackedCrooked somewhat on the money :) I reckon it's just not my thing. Don't get me wrong, the key notes alone were worth it. And I got to meet some heroes in real life (mostly, Eric Niebler) and some faces were added to screen names (kbok, je4d, some more).
But ultimately, talks are not the way for me to learn. And >50% of them were inherently pretty boring. Yes. It's good to rehash sometimes, but blogs make me do that too.
 
user3010322
@ScarletAmaranth Do I really have to whip out some calculus and other stuff just to compute this BRDF? =[
 
@Rapptz kinda true. Then again, the starting claim is ludicrous ("23Mio instructions"). I mean, maybe don't instantiate this often !?!?
 
yeah instantiation is probably the issue.
 
@wilx Like I said, granted. Dunno what happened there :/ Fiel the bug, I say. Or buy a better distro
 
@sehe How large was the attendance?
 
user1804599
11:36 AM
One polar bear.
 
@FredOverflow Not so sure. 200-300 range
@rightfold I was kinda surprised people would (a) find me (b) recognize me from my name tag.
 
user1804599
You look very typical.
 
user1804599
It is not difficult to find you.
 
And dat awkward moment when you find out you're talking to the author&maintainer of cplusplus.com :)
@rightfold I should drop the face-palm act
 
Did you tell him how much it sucks?
 
user1804599
11:39 AM
@sehe face-punch him.
 
user3010322
Quickly, assassinate him.
 
user3010322
It's your only chance.
 
He's obviously a nice guy.
@FredOverflow I did tell him I stopped visiting because cppreference is just much nicer for me.
 
user1804599
Do a talk about parsing in C++.
 
Ell
gosh that must be awkward
 
11:40 AM
@sehe for.. you? it's much nicer for everyone.
 
It wasn't. It was an alarming realization though. Happened on day 1 so I was on guard for the rest of the conference :)
 
s/reference/conference/?
 
@refp I said, this is what I told him.
@FredOverflow cough
Coders habits
 
user1804599
inference
 
Ell
differens
 
11:41 AM
We should have a talk about rvalue conferences.
 
@sehe exactly, and I'm questioning just that.
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow On an lvalue conference?
 
user3010322
@FredOverflow Only if you can get people to move into the space available.
 
@refp You can't question a fact.
@FredOverflow conference collapsing rules
 
user1804599
@sehe You are a fact and I can question you. Proof: how was your breakfast?
 
11:43 AM
@sehe I can question the reason for you acting a certain way in a given situation.
aaanyhow.. pointers, aren't they the most awesome thing evah!?
 
@refp indubitably. I wish you lots of luck doing so. I'm happy with my inclinations to be polite and open minded
 
user3010322
Why references can't do all the things pointers can makes me sad.
 
@refp Are you a C programmer?
 
Ell
men theyre so so
 
@ThePhD References were never designed to be pointer replacements.
 
11:44 AM
@sehe thank you sir, thank you.
 
user3010322
Like being reassignable.
 
Ell
value semantics is the real awesomeness
 
@FredOverflow nope, I are baboon.
 
@Borgleader just figurative speech I imagine ; )
 
user3010322
@FredOverflow Yeah, well... blah!
 
11:44 AM
@ThePhD They were consciously designed not to be reassignable, because Stroustrup found reassignable references very confusing.
 
user1804599
@Ell nah.
 
Ell
@thephd what would the point of references be if they were like pointers?
 
user3010322
@FredOverflow Well, Stroustrup is a horrible human being.
 
user1804599
@ThePhD No, you are.
 
user1804599
And you are a terrible programmer.
 
Ell
11:45 AM
I want the sparkling bjarne
 
user3010322
@rightfold Relatively speaking, he's horrible from my vantage point. :D
 
@Ell Would you like fries with that?
 
user1804599
Immutability is the best property of references.
 
What vantage point is that, the ivory tower?
@rightfold Also non-nullability.
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow that is a side-effect of not being able to dereference the null pointer, not a hard rule.
 
user3010322
11:45 AM
I really just want the non-nullability. The rest isn't very fantastic.
 
Ell
I'll have a herb sutter with a glass of sparkling bjarne please :)
 
@rightfold I don't care. It's awesome.
 
OK, installing the manpage-dev and manpage-posix-dev packages has fixed this.
 
user1804599
@Ell beware of singletons when the herb drank too much of itself, though.
 
user3010322
@FredOverflow Uh. I'm not so sure. :D
 
user1804599
11:47 AM
Also singletons in Scala are cool.
 
user3010322
Guys, there's a dev fest today.
 
user3010322
I think I'm going to work on that 2D C++ Platformer I was talking about in the lounge earlier.
 
user3010322
I wonder if it's still in the transcript.
 
@wilx Told ya.
 
Those pictures were giving me headaches.
 
11:51 AM
@Rapptz You did! :)
 
user3010322
I think that's the first time I've seen someone bin themself. o.0
 
user3010322
I didn't even know that was possible.
 
@Ell I thought it was the sparkling bjarne with herbs. Maken, not newed.
 
@ThePhD What can I say, I'm a perverted individual.
 
@rightfold what?
 
user3010322
11:52 AM
Kinky~
 
@ThePhD I did on more than one occasion.
 
user3010322
Oooh.
 
user3010322
Well, I must've missed it. :D
 
To get around the 2 minute limitation, or on request
 
yay, I'm not broke anymore
I'm only very very poor.
 
user3010322
11:56 AM
Dec 11 '13 at 12:25, by ThePhD
I'm going to create a video game where you play as C++14. You start out weak and with little memory, and you encounter people that help you. Various libraries that have been there: boost, ICU, etc. And then you also encounter people, who teach you many things. Herb Sutter, Alexei, R. Martinho Fernandes, Xeo. The ultimate enemy, in the end, would be a terrible monster only called "The Legacy", who you find out is the Phantom of your former self.
 
user3010322
Found it!
 
 
@rightfold not really :D
Although I'm with the reference love. I wish I had caller site indication but I get why I don't and it's a solid tradeoff.
 

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