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4:00 PM
its so fugly with that stupid local ret variable...
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes char const *, but const std::string &?
 
Xeo
@TonyTheLion return str.empty() ? 0 : std::stoi(str); ?
 
user142019
 
Thanks :)
 
user142019
4:03 PM
No need to copy the string either.
 
;d
 
user142019
Just take it by const ref.
 
Hello.
 
@Zoidberg for some reason I thought it would be moved, but no temporary
 
user142019
4:04 PM
let time_split = map (\s -> if null s then 0 else read s) split
 
Ell
Hi guys
 
user142019
Hi Ell
 
user142019
time_split = split.map { |s| s == '' ? 0 : Integer(s) } Ruby is awesome.
 
Ell
trudat
 
user142019
I love Array#grep.
 
4:07 PM
 
Ell
@Zoidberg what about split.map{|s| s.to_i}?
 
user142019
@Ell how about split.map &:to_i?
 
Ell
even better
 
I found sbi :O
so suave
 
user142019
irb(main):001:0> split = %w(1 2 3 4 5)
=> ["1", "2", "3", "4", "5"]
irb(main):002:0> split.map &:to_i
=> [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]
 
user142019
4:08 PM
\o/
 
Ell
wait. does that work?
ah yes
I forgot what & does
 
user142019
Unary & on a symbol converts it to a Proc that calls the method denoted by the symbol on the passed object.
 
Ell
right coolio
so beautiful <3
 
user142019
It's from Ruby on Rails but got into the standard library.
 
> We knew you had precious when you walked in...
 
Ell
4:09 PM
@Zoidberg &?
 
user142019
Yes.
 
user142019
Unary & calls to_proc on the object, and Ruby on Rails initially added to_proc to symbols.
 
user142019
class Symbol
    def to_proc
        Proc.new { |obj, *args| obj.send self, *args }
    end
end
 
user142019
Haha that answer.
 
user142019
4:18 PM
Dammit Ruby. Why is there no Range#sample.
 
Ell
because ranges can be infinite? o.O
 
user142019
Oh right lol.
 
Ell
(0..(1.0/0)).each{puts "weeee"}
 
user142019
I prefer (0..Float::INFINITY).
 
Ell
or that :3
 
4:24 PM
@Zoidberg What does it yield? epsilon() increments?
 
user142019
@sehe 1 increments.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Cowboy Cast is awesome. :D
 
user142019
irb(main):001:0> (1..5.0).to_a
=> [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]
 
user142019
Ruby is great for code golf.
 
"memory interference" - that's a first time term. I suspect you may have a background in electrical engineering? — sehe 4 secs ago
@Zoidberg boring
 
user142019
4:26 PM
Hey @sehe, you know Perl right?
 
user142019
while(<>){print join(' ',reverse split)."\n";} # Perl
$<.each{|l|puts l.split.reverse.join' '}      # Ruby
 
user142019
Can the Perl version be written more shortly?
 
@Zoidberg I do
@Zoidberg it'll have to wait till after dinner. I'd guess it can be shorter, yes (use the (<>) array direcltly, with map?)
 
user142019
Oh Perl has map. :v
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes what() is const
 
4:41 PM
@Zoidberg Btw. what do you use Ruby for?
 
@sehe I thought you would have posted it here as well.
 
user142019
@DomagojPandža nothing atm.
 
I mean ever. Maybe some RoR web dev? In the future?
 
user142019
Blewrg RoR.
 
user142019
I sometimes use Sinatra for web apps.
 
user142019
4:42 PM
Or I use Ruby if I need some quick script for something.
 
user142019
Because fuck shell script.
 
D'you like Sinatra (framework) ?
 
user142019
Sinatra is awesome.
 
My fluffy coffee is awesome.
 
user142019
gem 'sinatra'
gem 'sequel'
gem 'haml'
gem 'pbkdf2'
 
user142019
4:45 PM
This is my usual Gemfile for web apps.
 
O'Reilly made a book on that. I didn't see that coming...
 
@DomagojPandža Fluffy coffee. How many weeks has it been standing?
 
Ell
@DomagojPandža I used it for RPG Maker VX :D
also I wrote a pokedex data collector
 
@DomagojPandža moulded coffee?
 
Ell
and a maths homework completer :3
also it's useful for testing out sockets imho, fire up a quick interactive console and listen to packets etc.
 
4:46 PM
@TonyTheLion Oh, I have this special technique where I mess up half the kitchen by dropping hot milk from a height into the cup. Side-effect: fluffy coffee.
 
@Zoidberg, what server do you use it on?
 
@DomagojPandža If I ever visit your place, please remind me to ask for black.
 
user142019
@Jueecy.new I have never deployed anything so I use Shotgun for development. I think it uses WEBrick.
 
@Drise I'm baffled as to the relevence of myself to that situation.
Also I've been avoiding chat because I got caught "on social networks" too much at work
 
5:00 PM
Hm.
 
damn
my brother is a worthless fuck
 
Should I have each thread trying to pull from 1 queue?
 
Ell
@DeadMG why?
 
more like, "Why not?"
 
Or should I have a single separate thread who's job it is do dish out work to the other queues?
 
Xeo
5:02 PM
@DeadMG Oooh, I can relate to that - having a worthless brother, that is.
 
at least yours, as far as I understand, is pretty young
 
@DeadMG I trust he's a programmer, then. :Đ
 
Xeo
@DeadMG 15, now
 
Ok, "no c++14 tag", I'll remember that.
 
@StackedCrooked <script>alert('pwnt');</script>, classy.
 
5:05 PM
C++14 is still a world away. A galaxy away from the perspective of MSVC.
 
Haha xD
I generally don't think in terms of MSVC.
Apart when I want to do some C99.
 
@ThePhD Get it working with one queue first, (whatever it is, presumably threadpool-thingy).
 
It seems that interviewing the Boston bomber has yielded a preliminary reasoning behind the attack - he claims it's because of Iraq and Afganistan -- a radical jihadist.
 
It will work, 'cos it's a common pattern. You can then benchmark it, and try out any enhancements.
 
@TonyTheLion also std::back_inserter<std::vector<int>>(time_split) to std::back_inserter(time_split)
 
5:10 PM
@DomagojPandža OK, fair enough. Needle or Gitmo for life it is. Fine.
 
Ell
I always forget c++ switch syntax :(
 
@MartinJames US citizen no Gitmo
 
Ell
@DomagojPandža c++14 is only a bugfix release, right?
 
@DeadMG Punch him in the throat.
 
I've been increasingly considering it
 
5:11 PM
@MartinJames Although federal weapon of mass destruction charge carries chance of death penalty
 
@Ell Perhaps you should read this, then.
 
@StackedCrooked Well, I'm sure @R.MartinhoFernandes would love to see that.
 
Ell
@EtiennedeMartel oh wow filesystem and network :3
 
@EtiennedeMartel Yet another cringe in his cringeful day.
 
5:12 PM
@Ell Aye, them polymorphic lambdas, std::optional and such, totally bugfixing.
 
@Ell What? No. It brings new stuff, but in smaller doses now. Some shitty stuff like dynamic arrays (resurrecting C99 VLAs), incorporation of the boost filesystem ver. 3 and such. And, oh yeah, optimal<T> <3
 
I don't get the hate against dynarray.
 
@EtiennedeMartel It's a worthless piece of shit. How can you not hate it?
2
 
I think the main problem with DLAs is that they are incompatible with 80% of the type-system.
* VLAs
 
@DeadMG Why is that?
 
5:14 PM
std::dynarray seems to be more consistent.
 
the entire justification for the class is "Hypothetical compiler magic", but we won't even tell you if the magic is done or not so you have no idea if using the class is justified and we have no idea if any vendor will even try to implement this magic and you get fucked on moves if it is done.
at least with VLA-lite, you actually know what the behaviour is.
 
Ell
Don't we already have vector? :3
 
@Ell stack allocation -> better locality/compactness -> faster -> speed does matter for C++
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk That's nothing like VLAs.
 
Xeo
5:19 PM
@DeadMG Doesn't VLA-lite also not guarantee if stack or heap allocation is done?
 
@DeadMG It is stack allocated array, which size is set on runtime. How is it nothing like VLA?
 
Xeo
@EvgenyPanasyuk The shitty pitfalls of VLAs are out
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk The size of the stack allocated array is set as a template parameter. It's not runtime set at all.
 
@DeadMG How is your proposal on thunks going?
 
@DeadMG it allocates arrays of different size from stack
 
5:20 PM
@EvgenyPanasyuk No, you just mapped it to some pre-set compile-time values. It's not actually run-time at all.
 
@DeadMG check output
 
@EtiennedeMartel Not that well. Turns out I don't remember anything about assembly.
@EvgenyPanasyuk I did. It doesn't change anything.
 
VLA-like arrays have been extensions in compilers for years anyway. I don't think GCC or Clang will have so much work to do in order to implement them the standard way.
 
I don't know what the fuck you are smoking, but let me give you a hint: run-time stack-allocated arrays require a special syntax, your program does not demonstrate that syntax, therefore it cannot be.
the only remote approximation is to construct a linked list of chunks from non-tail-recursion.
 
@DeadMG does it allocate arrays of different sizes from stack based on runtime value?
 
5:22 PM
@EvgenyPanasyuk No, not really.
 
I was hoping for a cross-platform alloca.
Turns out it's just shit disguised as C++ code.
 
@DeadMG why?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Arguably, char arr[N]; and auto arr = alloca(N); are pretty equivalent.
@EvgenyPanasyuk Because, on an implementation where int is of arbitrary precision and the stack is of infinite size, you cannot allocate an arbitrarily large array from that stack.
 
@DeadMG With the key difference that with alloca, N can be a non constant expression.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Same is true for VLA lite.
 
5:24 PM
@DeadMG Indeed.
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk and the same limitation occurs in reality when you try to make a variable-length array for any value that you did not happen to remember to hard-code at compiletime.
 
@DeadMG good luck with your "the stack is of infinite size"
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk Real implementations are closer to that than "Only up to four elements".
try implementing your mapping for every possible value of N that will consume my 8MB stack.
come back when you're done and I'll just set my linker to 16MB.
 
@DeadMG that is demo of core idea, it is easy to extend it to bigger sizes
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk With what? A copy and paste?
Or preprocessor stuff?
 
5:26 PM
@EtiennedeMartel read the comment ideone.com/HsrQqc - // mpl::for_each / array / index pack / recursive bsearch / etc variación
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk And your core idea has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with VLAs.
@EvgenyPanasyuk None of those will scale to 8 million elements.
 
@DeadMG ok, ok - just forget it, ok?
 
not to mention the absurd code sizes you're going to get.
 
Ell
Is the stack a c++ idea or does the processor have the idea of a stack?
 
@Ell Hardware has featured a stack directly in assembly since the 1980s, or even earlier.
 
5:27 PM
@EtiennedeMartel BOOST_PP_REPEAT for just quick example..
 
@Ell Pretty sure that most processors today have hardware stacks.
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk Somehow, I'm not impressed.
 
Xeo
hm
 
so yes
creating thunk is hard
but I am going to take a very lazy approach, I think, since the implementation is to demonstrate security, not performance.
 
Ell
I forgot what a thunk was
 
5:41 PM
ah, are you making any progress on working out the security issues with thunking?
 
@Ell Most hardware has supported a stack since the late '50s or so, though there are a few exceptions (and used to be more). Nearly the only current machines that lack native support for a stack are IBM's z-series mainframes, but (for only one other example) the original Cray-1 didn't have a stack either.
 
@jalf As far as I'm aware, the ones raised by the Google guy don't exist, I just have to show that
 
@JerryCoffin Have you ever had a chance to tinker with "natively stack-less" machines?
 
6:00 PM
Jolie glissade du Dow Jones suite au tweet d'@AP annonçant deux explosions à la maison blanche. Dingue. http://t.co/4P5BDPkD9b
So, to translate: AP's Twitter account was hacked, and someone posted fake news about Obama being injured by an explosion at the White House.
The above is the impact on the Dow Jones.
 
@EtiennedeMartel +1 :D
 
Oh shit. The shutdown button on my box has gone dark red and has a shield on it. This is my punishment for refusing the Adobe update yesterday :(
Has Patch Tuesday moved? Used to be second Tues in month.
I guess this is 'Miserable Mardi'. Wot they gonna stuff this time?
 
I need to document myself about Oracle 11g stored procedures
Needless to say, it does not makes me happy
 
Hi guys
I'm back in CMake testing problem land
 
Ell
woo
 
6:13 PM
anyone care for an interactive help session? I'll even move the conversation outta here :)
 
Haha, CMake is always a problem.
 
well, it was nice until I needed my test to compile and run.
 
@kbok Hmm, yeah, sorry. I didn't test because I didn't have GCC 4.6 at hand, and newer versions use noexcept instead of throw() (something you guys might want to think about, btw).
 
I even got tests to only compile, not link. Speed up with about factor 2.
 
@rubenvb kbok seems to want one on Oracle stored procedures - maybe you can help him out?
 
6:14 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Are noexcept/throw() part of the signature? Because both worked, so I left throw() since I thought you had a good reason to put it there.
 
@MartinJames lol what makes you think I know about Oracle? Why would I even want to know about Oracle crap?
 
Xeo
throw() is deprecated(?), noexcept is the new throw()
Or was it throw(args) that was deprecated?
 
@kbok throw() is actually tricky when it comes to function signatures.
 
@kbok I get an error (might be a warning turned into error, though) if it does not match.
 
@Xeo I thing the overall throw() has been deprecated.
 
6:16 PM
@StackedCrooked Change the page encoding to windows-1252 instead of UTF-8.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh wait, I actually changed it to noexcept. Perfect.
 
user142019
 
user142019
Dat cheese.
 
well guess what.
I already fixed it.
I rule.
 
@Morwenn Is that more of a yes or more of a no?
 
6:18 PM
I used CMake to actually do something mightily useful.
 
AFAIR it doesn't
 
@DomagojPandža Yes -- long ago and far away, I wrote a fair amount of code for a Control Data mainframe that didn't really support a stack. Then again, most code for it was in FORTRAN, so we wouldn't really have had much way to use a stack even if it had had one.
 
@StackedCrooked haha, the page advertises itself as UTF-8, but it is actually Windows-1252 (or latin-1, one never knows). Stupid web developers.
 
Because the signature is only what is used for overload resolution
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hey it works. Are you like the unicode whisperer or something :D
 
6:18 PM
@kbok There is a code guru you should read about that.
 
@JerryCoffin I'm fairly sure that FORTRAN had 'CALL'.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh, that's a logical explanation.
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked If there's a unicode replacement character (that weird '?'), UTF-8 is the wrong encoding choice.
 
@Zoidberg I hate you.
 
user142019
6:19 PM
Ok.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Oh - you hungry too, eh?
 
@DeadMG good luck with it. Satisfying security people tends to be an uphill struggle :)
 
@MartinJames It did have call, but didn't support recursion, so what we'd think of as stack frames were statically allocated.
 
@StackedCrooked With that symptom the problem was actually quite obvious.
 
6:20 PM
@MartinJames No, but it looks really good.
 
@JerryCoffin Oh right. Quite a long time since I did any FORTRAN - about 37 years.
 
> a) Exception specifications don’t participate in a function’s type.
> b) Except when they do.
 
Ell
has anyone here done any work with payment processing?
 
@MartinJames If I'm not mistaken, later versions of FORTRAN did add a save (or something like that) for local variables, so you could do recursion -- but by then I'd moved on to other things (Pascal, mostly).
 
@JerryCoffin Oh - ALGOL, then Pascal for me.
 
6:23 PM
fortran is teh uglies
 
@kbok Well, you see the problem now. If possible, just drop them.
 
@rubenvb Yeah - crusty old memories, (all bad).
 
@jalf The guy from Google implied that as long as I didn't have memory that was simultaneously writable and executable, it should be fine.
 
@Morwenn Can't drop them when overriding :S
 
@rubenvb The rest of Fortran gets a bad reputation based on the small minority (only 90% or so) that's really bad.
 
6:25 PM
there's a guy at my Uni learning Fortran because there's old code (physics) written in that.
 
@Morwenn Overriding what() so we have to leave them in
 
I bet it's the bad kind.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Too bad. I'm glad I never had to handle legacy production code in C++ yet xD
 
It's not legacy.
It's std::exception.
 
It's std::exception
 
6:25 PM
Ow, fuck then.
 
@rubenvb Someone has to do it, (like COBOL:).
 
Since noexcept is stronger than throw() then it's OK
 
Old code should regularly be rewritten to conform to modern standards. I bet it would decrease bug count and not make that much difference on actual total coding time, if this was done from the beginning.
 
Ell
@rubenvb one of my brothers friend learned FORTRAN to aid his physics and philosophy degree :3
 
@Ell I got into Python instead. Numpy is pretty cool.
 
6:27 PM
@rubenvb Well, good luck on finding staff willing to do it, and managers willing to pay for it.
 
Ell
I don't do any kind of mathsy/physicsy stuff really
 
@kbok Ah, didn't know that. That's cool.
 
@rubenvb Yeah, you don't have to write any algorithm. They already exists xD
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Wait, I don't have proof for that, it's only a supposition
 
6:28 PM
hi all
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz hi :)
 
The rule on exception specifications is that while overriding, you should not provide a less-strict specification
 
@BartekBanachewicz hello
 
@Morwenn that's the general idea of using a computer yes :)
 
So my premise is that noexcept is more strict than throw() wrt overriding
 
6:29 PM
@Ell I wonder how fortran will help him with philosophy
 
@rubenvb But numpy and scipy are especially good at it.
 
I came up to function not being ok again. Makes you wonder, huh.
 
@Morwenn afaict, they mostly try to provide as much as Matlab does.
 
@rubenvb True. But in a much less specific programming language.
 
Ell
@melak47 I wonder how physics and philosophy go together :P
 
6:32 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes what() is qualified noexcept in the C++11 standard. Since they don't want to break compatibility with old classes, bet it is compatible with throw().
* old code
Urgh, forgot we could edit...
 
@Morwenn Exactly the reason why I switched :) Everyone here uses Matlab. Did you know the whole GUI freezes when you run a command?
@Ell there is a lot of overlap when you get to the core interpretation questions.
 
@Morwenn You get at least a warning.
I compile with -Werror.
 
Ell
@rubenvb obviously enough for a degree :P
 
@rubenvb I did not know. I used Scilab and NumPy/SciPy/matplotlib, but never did I use Matlab.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, that's tricky.
 
Rumor: the next XBOX must always be connected to the Internet for you to continue eating a pizza you ordered on it
 
6:36 PM
Am I correct in assuming most people rent servers rather than buy them?
 
@kbok Too bad it's a parody account.
 
@EtiennedeMartel You don't say.
 
are the swap functions scattered across std:: actually still useful with move semantics?
Let me rephrase: can we do without, without losing clarity in user code?
 
@Zoidberg Where is the crab image?
@Zoidberg this is confusing
 
At Sony, we know that hardcore gamers want challenging experiences. That was our design philosophy behind the current PlayStation Store
^ hahaha
 
6:38 PM
@kbok did you force push or something?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I would never do such a thing. Why?
 
Because the commit you merged has noexcept.
And does not match the one in my repo.
 
vOv
 
What did you do then?
 
Okay, right, I forced push.
 
6:39 PM
lol
 
If you guys ever come to Montreal, you have to try that place.
 
I actually reverted the commit, then pulled the commit from your repo, fixed it, pushed it, then collapsed all the stuff into one commit and force pushed
 
Oh oh, VS2012 license at work.
 
Free VS2012 student license.
Never bothered to actually download it though.
 
6:45 PM
Rumor: Dark Souls II will have no actual gameplay and will just be this static image: http://t.co/CSZDSyZhim
 
Me too. Dreamspark. Downloaded, installed, experienced MSVC failure.
Now I can rant about how it sucks, people can ask me: have you ever used it? and I can say: yes, it really sucks.
 
you just hate it cause it's purple
 
@DeadMG once you have a new draft, it might be a good idea to check with him (or other security people) before the next meeting though? So it doesn't get pushed another 4 months if there are other issues or if you misunderstood him :)
 
@jalf Yeah, I'm going to email it to him.
 
> Anyway, here is the simplified PrintTwice, utilizing templates:
void PrintTwice(TYPE data)
{
    cout<<"Twice: " << data * 2 << endl;
}
Congrats, you are not confusing at all
 
6:47 PM
so helpful
 
how does kiss::pointer::owning look instead of kiss::owning_ptr?
 
I would not kiss a pointer
 
lol
 
@rubenvb verbose and silly
:)
 
@EtiennedeMartel Arrghhh! HUNGRY. MORE LOUNGERS POSTING FOOD.
 
6:48 PM
@jalf I agree, I'm still undecided on subnamespaces or not.
They seem awfully longwinded.
 
unless it's typedefed to kiss::owning_ptr, at least
@rubenvb yeah, I don't think they should be exposed to the user at least.
 
template<class T>
double GetAverage(T tArray[], int nElements)
 
then I just wont have them.
 
tArray :(
 
6:49 PM
Also, should probably only be used in cases where you actually need the grouping. Seems pointless to have a namespace just for smart pointers
 
well, it could be a library module
 
> void operator *= (int);
 
Make stuff small and decentralized
 
WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS GUY FFS
 
@kbok wat
 
6:50 PM
note I am unable to write a copy constuctor without looking at the [c++-faq] entry.
 
@kbok Well, what do you expect from an idiot's guide? :)
@rubenvb The Rule Of Three one?
 
Who does produce such a code?
 
@FredOverflow Spot-on :)
 
@FredOverflow just a random copy constructor that the C++ standard says a default deleter needs to have. I'm guessing an empty one'll do though :)
 
the idiot's guide- as in, the guide written by the idiot
 
6:53 PM
yep, he stated that explicitly
 
@rubenvb I meant "Which FAQ entry?"
 
@rubenvb you don't need separate namespaces for that though
 
@jalf true enough. Too much boost::like::namespaces are just crazy.
@FredOverflow I suppose. I only remember one.
 
detail::_detail::_this_should_be_hidden::_secret_class_
 
deepest I go now is kiss::implementation.
I'm gonna say using anything from there is stupid and you should be bitch-slapped if you do.
 
6:57 PM
> std::unexpected_handler get_unexpected(); (since C++11)(deprecated)
wut
 
xD
 
Even if flying cars did exist, could normal citizens learn to pilot them?
 
lol
 
@Crowz They would pilot themselves.
 
6:59 PM
Is there somewhere an exhaustive list of C++ deprecated features?
I mean besides Java.
 
@Rapptz get_unexpected was missing, but unexpected was only used for throw() which is deprecated. So it is not needed, but if you have code that still deals with deprecated stuff, you might like having it.
 
@Morwenn I don't get it.
 

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