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user1357851
3:00 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes some monks/nuns can be quite happy ... so are some diabled people ... or poor people
 
user142019
lol
 
there's a specific platform, SE Linux, which they told me to look at
 
Xeo
@LucDanton I think we didn't come to a clear solution on when to substitute or something
And about nested substitutes etc
 
@EtiennedeMartel A lot of people (including me) thinks Maslov's pyramid is bullshit
 
Xeo
Eval<std::vector<std::add_pointer<_>>, int>
 
3:00 PM
Ya that rings a bell.
 
-1 not a joke.
Sadly.
 
Poll: Anyone here playing Ingress?
 
user1357851
I think Sigmund Freud is full of shit, start with everyone wants a penis. Because I sure don't
 
never heard of it
 
@Telkitty What, you don't want to be able to pee anywhere?
 
3:02 PM
ah yes
 
@Xeo I think one of my biggest concern is that if there ever are types T such that they're useful as either T or Invoke<T> then there is some lost functionality. But it's hard to come up with such types so I'm going to give it a try.
 
two new things I wish to propose based on what I've seen here
 
user1357851
Quite happy with a woman's body, that's why woman's body is on womens' magazines and mens. That & 80+ percent of the clothes/shoe shops are for women
 
first has got to be variant, and the second is going to be a format-string-style thing which is not backwards compat. with printf.
 
Now that's a beer!
 
3:03 PM
@DeadMG yeah, I definitely see the problem
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz Two coworkers of mine do
 
@Xeo Since I am a part of Android community again, I am assembling friends to play :)
 
@jalf The main example solution is to allocate T somewhere else, and put the asm thunk in a special page, and then after you've written the thunk in, mark it read-only and executable.
 
@TonyTheLion That's doesn't look that efficient.
 
user1357851
@ScottW then I remember we are bunch of geeks so we are all weird :'(
 
Xeo
3:04 PM
@DeadMG "foo % bar %"_fmt % std::tie(a, b);? :D
 
might be worth considering heavily sandboxed environments such as iOS too. I'm pretty sure you have no way to have writable executable memory there (given that they ban JIT's etc)
 
so you don't need simultaneously writable and executable
but you do need to be able to switch from one to the other.
 
@DeadMG and I guess that's where the problem lies. How do you ensure that this can't be abused?
 
Xeo
So, Puppy... any hope that you can present N3617 tomorrow?
 
@Xeo It hasn't even been scheduled. I don't know.
 
3:06 PM
@jalf How do JITs do it?
 
Xeo
Ah, too bad
 
If the process has the privileges to mark arbitrary pages as executable, what's to stop evil people from just... marking arbitrary pages as executable
 
@EtiennedeMartel heh, true. But its fancy and large.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think it's where they all get together and maim people
 
@jalf Apparently, the OS simply bans that combination.
 
3:07 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm not sure (worth looking into), but I suspect they get a lot of help from the fact that the languages are typically "safe" (as in, no UB and no writing outside allocated memory)
@DeadMG Oh, you mean writable+executable? But allowing me to change the executable bit of memory seems even worse
because if I can do that, then I can make anything executable
 
right, but you can't change existing executable memory
which I think is the concern raised
 
@DeadMG but why would I need to, if I can create new executable memory?
just overwrite some function pointer somewhere so it points into my executable memory rather than the existing executable memory
 
I don't know, I'm just going from what the other guy who works at Google and spoke to the security experts told me.
 
aha
anyway, a very interesting proposal
was it one of yours?
 
and he basically said "It's only the combination of writable and executable which is bad".
yeah
N3572-N3575 were mine
 
3:11 PM
@DeadMG Simultaneous?
 
@DeadMG that doesn't sound right
 
@DeadMG but again, if I can mark pages as executable, then I can do that with any writable page, and I have the "bad" combination
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah.
@jalf It's my understanding that the OS will throw an error if you do that. You have to mark the page as non-writable first.
 
This is a cool view.
 
@TonyTheLion JESUS
 
3:12 PM
touch myfile;
chmod +w myfile;
echo "rm -rf /*" > myfile;
chmod -w myfile;
chmod +x myfile;
# oh shi-
 
@EtiennedeMartel hahaha
 
@DeadMG so? I can easily mark pages as read-only without any special privileges
 
yeah
 
So I can write evil malicious code to a writable page, make it read-only, and then make it executable. Bam, instant evil malicious code
 
ohhhh
 
3:13 PM
@jalf Like noodles.
 
~evil code~
 
yeap, but if you are trying to exploit existing code via bad input, say.
 
But evil and malicious.
 
@TonyTheLion (Pronounce it with a heavy Spanish accent for even more lulz)
 
then you can't write to the executable pages
 
3:13 PM
@EtiennedeMartel lol
 
(And yes, I know they speak Portuguese in Brazil)
 
here we go again
 
it's not about protecting from intentionally malicious code, it's about stopping malicious code from getting the opportunity to execute in the first place.
 
@TonyTheLion are those.. people?
 
3:14 PM
From my completely unprofessional and probably flawed perspective it seems you've basically lost once you give the process privileges to mark anything executable which wasn't already marked as such
 
@TonyTheLion perhaps lights
that or a fuckoff crack
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I don't know...
 
user1357851
All cool view with heaps of giant buildings, albeit impressive, reminds me of ant hills
 
user1357851
people are ants
 
3:16 PM
@Telkitty speak for yourself
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh you.
 
user1357851
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I live in a house with big piece of land attach to it :p
 
@TonyTheLion There's one a little like that in Kansas (i.e., no view), but he's in the middle of a pond, up to about his knees and looking up. Always looks to me like he's looking up and saying: "But Daaaaad, you said I'd be able to walk on water! Why am I sinking?"
 
user1357851
I like my pet neighbourhood wild birdies >_<
 
@Telkitty And poisonous snakes.
 
3:18 PM
Tuesday I met the first foreigner that said Brazilian Portuguese sounded harder to understand than European Portuguese.
 
user1357851
@EtiennedeMartel that too, but they are quite shy
 
SELinux is the thing the Google guy referred to
 
user142019
lol
 
3:20 PM
@JerryCoffin hahah
 
Ell
all I know is selinux is on my live usb
 
@JerryCoffin "I'm sorry, son, but you've caught Peter Syndrome."
 
I love a cock up in the afternoon
 
user1357851
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I am touched, you spend your birthday here with us.
 
nothing better then having to sort shit out
the joys of legacy code
 
3:22 PM
@Telkitty well, I'm at work
 
:O
@Borgleader HEY
 
user1357851
I know ... still <3 from the lounge
 
To animate Deus Ex, HR, did they use MotionBuilder ?
... Oh shit, that's right,
my birthday passed.
I can drink now. :O
 
@thecoshman I first read "I love cock in the afternoon"
 
@ThePhD You so young.
 
3:24 PM
I'm not compelled to go get a drink, though. ._.
@EtiennedeMartel Aren't yoooou young?
 
@ThePhD 23.
 
user1357851
@ThePhD happy belated birthday 2 u too :)
 
Younger than me
woah
 
3:25 PM
Happy belated birthday to every single person in this room
 
:)
My bday is in just over 2 months
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Happy Birthday, Tomalak. May it be <3
3
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Discriminating against us married people again, I see!
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Happy birthday to our favorite hater! [c++] [c++11] [coliru] [no-helpdesk]
 
user1357851
@JerryCoffin majority rules
 
3:28 PM
@DeadMG I'm wondering what JITs do to get around these restrictions
 
@JerryCoffin oh a pun
 
@TonyTheLion Mine is in less than two weeks! Haha! I win1
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You do win. Winner.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You will drink.
 
@EtiennedeMartel That I'm taking the Monday after off work is all I'm saying.
 
3:30 PM
Damn English. I can't phrase an affirmation like a question.
Actually, wait, I can.
But it'll sound weird.
Or maybe not.
Eh, fuck it.
 
It only works well if it is somewhat of an incredulous repetition of what your interlocutor said.
 
Wow, that sounds actually canadian
 
@ScottW I'm not Canadian.
 
@ThePhD hahahaha
@JerryCoffin Of course - you're not allowed birthdays. Certainly not happy ones...
 
3:35 PM
@TonyTheLion your have a filthy mind
 
@thecoshman I know that, why do you state what I already know? :P
 
@jalf Apparently, there is some hole somewhere.
 
(Fun fact: Molson Canadian is a terrible beer)
(Fun fact 2: anything Molson makes is terrible)
(Fun fact 3: and so does Coors)
 
@EtiennedeMartel Is that the national anthem in the background
 
@kbok No idea, I have no sound right now.
 
3:38 PM
 
But it wouldn't surprise me.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Does that mean I don't get older any more? I'm fine with no more birthdays, if it means I don't have to put up with being old any more.
 
@Telkitty D'aww, thanks. <3
@EtiennedeMartel n'est pas? <3
 
@TonyTheLion "Shit, I am incapable! I shall abide by the spirit of this instruction and remove myself from the carriageway immediately."
@JerryCoffin You're not really that old, you know.
 
Alright, I got Maya and MotionBuilder
 
3:39 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit That actually sounds reasonable.
 
Have you tried running it? (I'm really not sure what you think is illegal- the fact that you pass the same argument twice to a function?) — David Robinson 2 mins ago
lol
@LightnessRacesinOrbit hehe
 
@EtiennedeMartel Yeah
 
Oh by the way, those are the French National Anthem's lyrics (translated)
Under our flags, shall victory
Hurry to thy manly accents,
That thy expiring enemies,
See thy triumph and our glory!

To arms, citizens,
Form your battalions,
Let us march, let us march!
So that an impure blood
Will water our furrows!
^ lol
 
As written by a drunk.
 
@kbok Yeah, La Marseillaise is not for pussies.
 
3:42 PM
It's not about peace or collaboration, you see
 
It's about sacrifice, IIRC.
 
Lol.
France is hardcore.
 
That's from France.
 
FTFM.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I sure feel like I am sometimes. Especially right now -- I ache everywhere (got some bad food on Sunday, and now I'm pretty dehydrated).
 
3:43 PM
In Canada, we have the incredibly boring O Canada.
(Which was actually originally written in French and then translated when the Anglophones realized they really needed an anthem).
 
-3
A: Is this short program legal C++?

tadmanWhy wouldn't it be? You can always try running it: http://codepad.org/TJ3kYenb

gets upvotes :(
 
@EtiennedeMartel Wow, Canada is full of Pussies. =[
 
in fact, the oneboxing summarises the debacle fairly well, I'd say
 
@ThePhD lol
 
@EtiennedeMartel O Caprica, let us persevere...
 
3:43 PM
dat fail
 
@JerryCoffin That's related to your career, not your age. :)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I wondered about that. Thanks for confirming.
 
@ThePhD Actually, most of Canada is basically empty of people (of either sex).
 
@TonyTheLion np
 
3:45 PM
I disagree with its closing reasons
It already has 4 votes :S
 
And now 5.
 
LOL
 
@EtiennedeMartel Boring indeed
 
I accidentally downvoted Konrad.
 
@ThePhD Justice.
 
3:46 PM
I hope he didn't get angry. x3 I switched it back though.
 
Well I'll vote to reopen.
 
lol, asking for upvote explanations.
 
Upvoter, you suck. This is incredibly wrong. — DeadMG 39 secs ago
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Ping
 
Oh, the answerer is from Toronto. Well, that explains it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Today is opposite day.
 
Xeo
3:50 PM
> -5 User was removed
 
@EtiennedeMartel He's a rails guy
 
@EtiennedeMartel Oh, btw, what are stereotypes of people from Alberta?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes They're rednecks.
 
That's it?
Boring.
 
Or rather, northern southern Americans.
They like guns and shit.
 
3:52 PM
Gaah, I hate the tag. I bust my ass for an answer and I never see a single upvote. Meanwhile other users post bullshit or bad code and get the credit because OP has no understanding of programming.
 
@KonradRudolph Isn't that true for any tag?
I'm sure Tomalak has some crunchy examples like that from the PHP tag.
 
@EtiennedeMartel No, I see a pretty high reward/effort ratio in other tags, especially
 
@KonradRudolph You need a critical mass of good programmers for the vote system to work
 
@kbok Exactly
 
Otherwise it's as good as political rubreddits
(= worthless)
 
3:54 PM
@kbok Rubreddit?
Something that rubs Reddit?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Yeah. I guess.
 
@KonradRudolph I don't really want to discuss it. You invented the term "alias" as it applies to references and pointers in C++, despite the fact that it doesn't, and despite the fact that references are not pointers. Stealing all my upvotes with a near-identical answer, at that! Psshaw.
 
I'll leave the typo here because it's funny
 
user142019
Ugh assembly is ugly.
 
@kbok Not necessarily good, but at least semi-competent.
 
3:56 PM
Zoidberg sounds like a genius.
 
@KonradRudolph It depends on the and the asker question. =[
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Sorry but you act the idiot. You don’t want to discuss, then accuse me of dishonesty. This is a sleazy attitude and doesn’t exactly endear you.
 
@KonradRudolph What the fuck? Piss off.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Exactly, this.
 
"Dishonesty"
I already told you that the standard does not define "alias" in the way that you claim. I invited you to prove me wrong. You did not.
 
user142019
3:58 PM
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit What you accuse me of is dishonesty
 
The fact that I have no intention of getting into a debate with you over it, and that I currently find you to be a jerk, is not "sleazy".
 
What else would you call it?
 
@KonradRudolph Right, okay then.
*re-plonk*
 
user142019
@R.MartinhoFernandes lolwot
 
3:58 PM
No time for this bullshit today
 
8
A: Where does the standard talk about aliasing?

KennyTMAliasing is mainly discussed in §3.10[basic.lval]/10: If a program attempts to access the stored value of an object through a glvalue of other than one of the following types the behavior is undefined:52 the dynamic type of the object, a cv-qualified version of the dynamic type of...

 
Back to regular lounge business please!
 
@Lightness Even more so when you now accuse me of stealing your answer, which is just ridiculous – I gave a completely different reason
 

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