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3:00 PM
@KendallFrey bow.com
 
@CharlieBrown Oh wow. Thanks, Charlie. Not now but next semester when I am in school I won't have MSDN so raincheck?
 
that's my link generated automated
 
@DarkHorse No, where are your github pages?
 
@CharlieBrown are you on google plus?
 
@ton.yeung WIC? really?
 
@walkingTarget Here is the link to the conference: southeastwomenincomputing.org/#welcome
 
@DarkHorse No, doesn't it give you a github.io page?
 
@ton.yeung Oh. I thought you were talking about the FNS program
 
@ton.yeung Basically we are a minority in the field obviously, so the organization is set up to get women interested and surround them with people who have the same struggles as they do.
 
3:03 PM
@kush i cant access it from work
 
@KendallFrey page build failed reprot show out eventually
 
@ton.yeung yo, I don't even remember what you guys said or did to drive Ellie away :(
 
@JLott I'd start by contacting the conference hosts and sponsors, see if they'd help you out
 
Lol the advancement as in getting more females into the field
 
3:04 PM
@ton.yeung it helps to keep goals fuzzy
@JLott or to help those who are already here?
 
@JLott I just want to point this out because it is hilarious. Look at the body of the iPhone 5C and compare it to a Nokia Lumia 620.
 
@KendallFrey actually I didn't
 
@Greg now that song is stuck in my head :(
 
It is a male dominant field and not only that, it seems to have a "nerdy" way about it which causes a lot of women to not choose that direction.
 
Well, why the f not?
 
3:05 PM
@Greg I will have to check it out.
 
@kush What song?
 
@ton.yeung no man, easy monies is in business
 
@JLott Hey, they've got scholarships too
 
@Greg Look at the body I work out
 
I think its partly a role model thing too right? There are not many female role models in the tech industry, so young girls dont grow up with that.
 
3:06 PM
@KendallFrey my internet connect is so poor, I will try it later, thanks very much
 
@Greg annoying and I know it
 
good night
 
@Greg Apple wins spec wise :P
 
@ton.yeung I don't know about where you went to college but it seemed like the business students never had to study
 
3:07 PM
I don't think the men in the tech industry are actively keeping women out (or at the very least any more than any other male dominated-industry)
 
Well, the phone came out as a budget phone in early 2012.
 
@CharlieBrown Exactly, it is nice to have a mentor who you can talk with about everything
 
If I was better at programming I would be a mentor for you. We are similar-
@ton.yeung To @JLott she spoke about mentors.
 
Haha I have a couple of female mentors thanks to the organization
 
@JLott what do mentors do?
 
3:09 PM
I've got a slew of people I ask questions to @ton.yeung @CharlieBrown @drch @RoelvanUden @TravisJ @ReedCopsey
 
Hi everyone!
 
@ton.yeung that could be a part of it
 
@kush Give you direction in life. Help you when you struggle. Give you support.
@ton.yeung That too
 
@JLott technical questions or soft questions?
 
@kush Both :)
 
3:11 PM
I don't believe their is a technical reason keeping women out... its just that most women are not interested. BUT, they could be if they had some great women to follow in the footsteps of
 
@CharlieBrown Exactly
 
@ton.yeung stahp!
 
HAMMAHTIME!
 
You all have to remember I am not normal either... Some of the things you all have said in here would have sent a lot of ladies running.
 
I could use a mentor...
 
3:12 PM
@ton.yeung You all would say it regardless lol
 
and the comments in this room are far more mild than the javascript room (when a woman stumbles in there)
 
@walkingTarget yes, we need mentors for guys as well
 
When there are enough women in this room, im sure some will turn the tables
 
You all have also never experienced someone automatically assuming you lack technical knowledge because you are a female. It is really frustrating.
 
It's inevitable anyway, more software engineers will be required in the future. And computers are the great equalizer imo. Who cares who is on the other end of the keyboard as long as the code is stellar.
 
3:14 PM
@ton.yeung What do you mean?
@ton.yeung That ones is also annoying
 
@ton.yeung what's wrong with being a high school student?
 
@ton.yeung works the same way with SO rank somedays
 
@ton.yeung They just want a damn job
 
@ton.yeung eight here :)
 
A lot of my girls lack confidence which makes things difficult for them
 
3:16 PM
wow I am old
 
@ton.yeung The girls in my group are still in school.
 
@JLott I don't think it is just girls. Programmers in general don't push back that much.
 
@ton.yeung Nice. There isn't much of that around here
 
there was a 12yo girl who taught a session to other kids at the conference i just went to. the applause for her lasted almost 10 minutes
 
3:17 PM
@ton.yeung eight years since high school graduation o.O
 
@ton.yeung Lol. We just don't do that much around here though haha
We also do other things though, we go to the middle schools and high schools and tell them about computer science. Give them a little insight into the field.
 
thats epic, i would donate to that
 
We do a workshop using Alice for 8th grade girls
@ton.yeung Yep. It is an intro to OOP
 
I hope one day i have a daughter that follows in my footsteps and basically takes over the world
 
@CharlieBrown Aww :)
 
3:20 PM
They teach Scratch to kids around here
 
See we have an issue around here... our schools do not have computer classes.
 
blasphemy (sp?)
 
Hey guys, so here is an issue I have... my application talks to wcf services. if I rebuild before I debug, it works but if I fail to rebuild before I debug, I get the faulted stateWCF error. How can I prevent that?
5
A: I keep getting WCF service is in faulted state on the client side. How should I catch WCF exceptions, without breaking my WCF service?

TimUnhandled exceptions will fault the communication channel. As others have pointed out, a faulted channel must be aborted by calling Abort() - it can't be closed and it can't be used again. To address the other part of your question, the "best way to catch the exceptions, log the exception on se...

 
@ton.yeung And it isn't like we don't allow men.. I get that a lot... "What about a Men in Computing...?" We have several guys that come to our meetings and help out at events. Our meetings aren't us sitting around talking about boys, we cover career building, grad school, robotics, anything that any other comp sci org would.
 
3:25 PM
@JLott But you still have pillow fights, right?
 
@walkingTarget Those are private.. I am not allowed to discuss that.
 
@ton.yeung I know... I was just talking directly to you lol
 
@JLott yeah but we are in the same class so it is ok :)
 
@kush We are not in the same class...
 
3:34 PM
@JLott huh?
 
@ton.yeung Yeah they won't go to the conference, but we are all good friends so meetings are ok
@kush You said we are in the same class lol
 
@JLott not as in sixth grade, I meant as in we are in the same classification
 
@kush Ahhhhhhh ok lol. And this is still classified info
 
@JLott :P
 
@kush Security clearance is required, and it's not easy to obtain
 
3:38 PM
@ton.yeung Awesome :) We have a company meeting on Friday... Ugh.
 
@walkingTarget war were declared!
 
@ton.yeung Because I do not know what they entail lol
 
The feels... Futurama :')
 
What do you need a security clearance for?
 
@kush are you Kushal Hada?
 
3:47 PM
@KendallFrey are you IRS?
 
I've got a Top Secret Military Clearance. Does that count?
 
@kush No.
 
We demand bouncing, followed by rolling, followed by rolling of the third type.
 
@KendallFrey yes I am :)
 
You look a lot like my coworker.
 
3:48 PM
@walkingTarget easy to obtain, just expensive. or join the military then its automatic!
 
@KendallFrey my photo is on stack overflow as well!
oh, the fish one
@KendallFrey tell your coworker I said hi
 
Can't see your face on that one.
 
@KendallFrey I have a Nexus 4 phone now so I can take photos that are better than potato quality
 
Funny thing is, that's a high quality camera in there.
 
@CharlieBrown Yeah, I was working on SIPR Communication. So I was forced to get it.
 
3:52 PM
@KendallFrey yeah, I was surprised that Google could tell what camera it was
 
@ton.yeung Funny. Boss just came in to talk about this company meeting
 
@JLott What'd he say?
 
@ton.yeung What'd he say?
 
He said it is usually just for full time people but since we have talked about me continuing with the company, he wanted me to go
 
So I'm looking at some sample code with examples for creating database fields of different types. It says //all the types of fields:. I happen to be using a datatype that's not in that list.
 
3:54 PM
@JLott That is promising and quite good.
 
@ton.yeung thanks for relaying the info, ton :)
 
Lol and yeah @Greg, money talks though :P
 
if i win the lottery this week i'll hire you
 
@JLott just remember loose coupling :)
@CharlieBrown what's the job? can I apply?
 
3:55 PM
you win the lottery, you can just sit on your couch and tell me what to type for you
 
@JLott Yeah, I'm poor here I feel ya.
 
@dirt EXACTLY
 
@dirt haha I could be like Dragon
Naturally Speaking
 
Socratesdragon
 
funniest thing I hear from EVERY company in EVERY industry: "We prefer untrained people, b/c experienced professionals always need to be retrained." Isn't odd that they all say that?
 
3:58 PM
@CharlieBrown Especially when people they'd like to train can't make it through Human Resource filters.
 
training is for the googleinept
 
its just comical, when you think about it, it makes absolutely no sense at all
 
@CharlieBrown I have never said that or heard someone say that sincerely
 
it just tells you that everyone does it their own way, so it makes no difference
 
they dont want old dogs with old tricks they want dogs that will do things exactly how they want
 
3:59 PM
Yeah, that is true. Google is how I taught myself alot of things.
 
I have been at this company for almost 2 years. They want to keep me probably so they don't have to train anyone else.
 
@JLott Ask for a raise.
 
BUT, I will probably ask for more than they want to give me.
They gave me a $2 raise this year
@ton.yeung I will be getting a big raise when I graduate lol
 
$2 is to make you shut up
 
@CharlieBrown If they are doing things right, they should not have to do mass training. I have come to learn that when a company is frantically hiring mid-project it means they are not able to contain turnover.
 
4:01 PM
@ton.yeung Yeah. Freaking. Right.
 
@JLott you dont get what you dont ask for
 
@JLott per hour, right?
 
That would almost be way too excessive.
And yes @kush
They start their programmers at $18 an hour
 
@JLott When do you graduate?
 
@kush May 2014
 
4:02 PM
@JLott Yeah, I have the same issue.
 
18/hr? ouch
 
@JLott you'll have much more leverage then :)
 
I think I am worth 70K lol, but I know what this area can afford.
 
@CharlieBrown hey, I've worked for less >:(
 
@CharlieBrown That is a hilarious lecture dude...
 
4:03 PM
@ton.yeung That is what I want
 
fresh out of college, still is around 40k + benefits
and honestly, if it gets much higher, it hurts all of us
thats why I said fresh
 
@ton.yeung I know but they will only pay you as little as they think they can get away with
 
but I think even 50k starts pushing a boundary
 
if they think she will quit and move to another company, they'll pay her more
 
I am also the only one here who knows about their GIS stuff which is being included in their software this year.
They had me formally trained on it
I still don't know why they did that lol. "We want GIS capabilities in our software! Have the intern do it!"
 
4:06 PM
@JLott Nothing wrong with communicating expectations but I would not try to frame it as an ultimatum. It is not 70k or bust.
just my two cents
 
@kush I was going to ask for way less than 70 lol
You all are making me rethink this
 
@JLott "I would love to continue working here, however, ..."
 
everytime i meet a developer and they are like, 'yeah i started programming back on <old ass crusty machine> around the year <1950 or something>`, I puke a little in my mouth
 
That is the thing @dirt I do actually have a lot of other options so I will fight a bit, but I also don't want to rub anyone the wrong way.
 
@JLott I have hired many interns, my advice is take the normal out of college pay and add to it the number of years of exp you have worked for them.
 
4:08 PM
@JLott yes, thinking is good. try not to get distracted from school though.
 
@CharlieBrown Best quote: "For some reason people think owning a penis means they understand computers. If you believe this your likely a terrible programmer and a terrible person too. If you'd like to take me up in argument about this later, I'll fucking have you."
 
lets say 18/hr is the normal start, plus 2 years = 25/hr
 
@CharlieBrown That is my strategy.
I was going to ask for 24
 
@JLott emphasize on what you bring to the table not what you want
 
And a week of vacation time
 
4:09 PM
@ton.yeung Is who hot?
 
@JLott yeah see, there is always wiggle room :)
 
i think 24 is a great rate, if you start with a high rate, you force yourself into outreaching inflation when it comes to yearly raises
 
@kush They know what I bring to the table lol. They want me to stay.
 
@ton.yeung It is some dude who gives a lecture that @CharlieBrown linked.
 
My boss wants me to go on management track I believe.
 
4:10 PM
@JLott it still does not hurt to communicate it. It shows you have their interest in mind. :o)
 
"If you meet someone with a high Stackoverflow reputation, they are probably a great copywriter" -programmingisterrible.com
4
 
He is a funny guy.
 
@kush Yeah I agree, I actually want to deal with clients directly which is a plus to them as well.
 
@CharlieBrown That is a great remark!
 
@JLott run away from mgmt. run far and fast. never look back.
 
4:12 PM
MGMT is a great band, I will never run from them
 
@dirt haha
 
@dirt Disagree, engineers need competent managers
 
Thats fine, show me an engineer that wants to be a manager given the choice
 
Keyword is competent, incompetent makes you hate your life and job. Notice there isn't a sarcastic font, cause it is true!
 
Uh I believe @TravisJ has a sarcasm font
 
4:14 PM
I have the font, I didn't use sarcasm because I have incompetent management.
 
@ton.yeung hun pai or something
 
Dude, I know... Wtf?
 
@ton.yeung That only works if engineers and managers have equal power. If not, you'll end up forced to implement some very bad ideas.
 
poh kai!
 
I know that as well.
 
4:16 PM
@JLott now the trick (which I still have to master) is to not appear confrontational
@ton.yeung politics, man
 
@kush Yeah, people tend to take it as arrogant or your challenging them.
 
Not to be sexist.. but this is a nice thing about being a female.. I am less threatening to clients
 
@ton.yeung And I am sociable lol
@ton.yeung Lol introducing computer scientists
@ton.yeung Yes lol
Me too...
Actually the majority are fine, but some of them... oh god...
 
Have a star.
 
4:26 PM
it looks like a drowning in the star list, so it works either way
 
@ton.yeung That looks an awful lot like kirby
 
just finished the website for our reception, responsive can be a pain in the butt
 
@ton.yeung Lol. YES.
 
works for me
 
 
4:33 PM
the jquery is only processing the children of the root, not the root itself
brb
 
@kush IIRC, if you delay, then reboot, you can skip that nonsense
reason #52 why I left my last employer: McAfee policies
 
"If the job ask you brain teasers, you should leave and save your sanity."
 
4:51 PM
Morning!
 
@Greg that one i def agree with
 
This dude is hilarious!
@CharlieBrown I just want to learn, learn correct.
 
@ton.yeung could you just do it with css?
 
He doesn't like Jeff Atwood at all.
 
@Greg He doesn't like SO either.
 
4:56 PM
who is this?
 
His response was hilarious.
 
He said there's nothing preventing people from asking X-Y questions.
 
X-Y Questions?
 
Can't watch, at work :(
 
4:57 PM
Today, questions have to meet a high standard to be answered.
 
its hard to argue against what SO has done for the community as a whole, however
 
There may be a few X-Y questions
 
I'd agree with that. Most basic knowledge can be answered in a couple seconds with a google search, so in order to get people involded the questions should be more difficult, yes?
'grammer failing today'
 
prior to SO, how easy was it to 'answer with a google search'?
 
Depends on the question. I still use a couple different sites, and many times SO doesn't have what I need
 
4:58 PM
@not-rightfold I would recommend that you wear underwear made of 2 mm stainless sheet-metal until you learn to control the women. Transition can be rough.
 
blogs have helped a lot too
 
@ginkner More like, they only get answers if they exact a perfect question. It doesn't have to be difficult, but it can't be unclear.
 

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