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TTT
11:00 AM
Gotta go, bye
 
Does anyone know if it's possible to look up what DNS Google is using? I have recently changed DNS (and server) - approx 15 hours ago - and I am getting a problem with the new site, which I believe is google accessing the OLD server, rather than the new one
 
@MarcGravell +1
 
Yes, very easy. Look for googlebot in the access logs of the old and new servers.
 
It's actually a google checkout integration. The error I'm getting back seems to be an IIS error (old server = IIS, new server = apache)
 
11:03 AM
Either way, if it requires Google to resolve your DNS, that means they're making a request to you? Which means you can check your access logs to see which server that request hit, right?
 
Was just hoping there might be something that I could see what IP google thinks the domain is
True
Thanks Dan
 
Easier than finding a random Google employee and asking him to ping your domain ;)
 
@BlairMcMillan 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 are google's dns servers
 
@DanGrossman random probably wouldn't do it; to be sure you'd probably need to get somebody on the same network as the crawler
 
hmm, 7am, i should go to sleep
 
11:05 AM
@stagas I am aware of them. Do you happen to know if that's also what the google servers (specifically the checkout ones) use?
 
@Marc Gravell You could find one of those datacenters-in-a-tractor-trailer they use and break in!
There are no people on the same network as Google's search infrastructure, since it lives in people-less trailers :/
They are Borg
 
@DanGrossman You were spot on with checking the server logs. It's sending the request to the old server
I've asked a question on SO search for magento checkout. If you post something like that as your answer I'll +1 you
 
Just in case there are any hardware experts here: (Sorry for crossposting, but su.chat is very quiet)
0
Q: Steps to debugging a problem with high DPC

BenjolI've got a Dual core processor, and one of the two is constantly at 100%. Looking in ProcessExplorer shows me that it's Deferred Procedure Calls. Reading around the net seems to give me tons of different answers. Is it possible to set out a couple of steps to trying to narrow down what the proble...

(Make that troubleshooting)
 
Wow, that question posting feature is sweet. This is a pretty darn advanced chat system.
 
11:17 AM
And I seem to be not reputable enough to use all that stuff
Which seems to be my failure of not marketing my answers and questions good enough
 
It's attractive, I'll admit, but variable-width fonts and no op wars make me pine for IRC.
 
Heh, I read the FAQ Dan. I was just aiming for humor.
 
user235273
hey!
 
@sinni800: I think you can post a question like that by putting a link to it on a single line, no reputability required
 
11:25 AM
@Andomar, thanks, I've added a comment ;)
 
@sinni800: See the chat FAQ on what kinds of links can be oneboxed. As Andomar says, no minimum rep requirement (other than the chat system's).
 
@ConspicuousCompiler me and @balpha could fight to the death for your amusement, if that would help?
 
@MarcGravell I'll say it again: MOD RAGE!!!
 
UPDATE Users SET Rep=19, IsModerator=0 WHERE UserId=23354
 
@balpha why 19?
 
11:29 AM
DELETE FROM Users WHERE UserId = 115866 -- damn, he already removed my access; too slow...
@SilentGhost you need 20 to chat
 
Speaking of which
@BoltClock myrep += 10000; yourrep -= 10000; // when you can't win, cheat
 
@MarcGravell so, it's an equivalent of kick-ban, then I guess
 
fine; rage-quit! I'm pulling down IIS with me!
 
Heh, this reminds me of Uplink :-)
 
Is there a way to be in multiple rooms in one browser page?
 
11:37 AM
@Andomar, thanks for that, I'll post back comments depending on how it goes this evening... I think I'll try booting from a recovery cd first, just to see if it could be a HW problem.
 
@Andomar Yes. Just enter more rooms and you'll see it.
 
@Benjol: Keep an eye on the question, perhaps someone else will provide a better answer :)
@balpha: But the left side of the page is always for one room?
 
sure -- how would you imagine to have several rooms displayed in one chat view?
 
@balpha I wouldn't say one chat window. Maybe a tabbed view? But then you'd have tabs inside tabs. Why not just use a new window....I don't know...
 
@Adomar The side bar on the right shows recent messages from other rooms anyway, and the task bar changes to show the number of new messages in a room when its not the active window.
 
11:42 AM
show messages from other forums in a different color perhaps
 
heh
well maybe having more than one room per tab
because then you can see activity easier
although really, i'm a curmudgeon and i'd rather use irc
 
I dislike IRC.
 
So long as no one hates ZMODEM.
 
I don't know, I have tried it on a number of occasions, I just can't get on with it.
 
11:46 AM
@KyleSevenoaks You're in the wrong channels then
 
@BlairMcMillan Yeah, most likely. A friend of mine from NY introduced me to it, and her friends and I was like,.. "Uuhhh.. what?"
 
IRC's primary value, a bit like Usenet, can be a great utility for finding a group of people with knowledge on a very specific area and learn about particular subjects interactively.
 
so feel free to set up a room and start coaching people in the ways of The Force.
 
need an ego filter on this...
 
@dogbane, heh? Why?
 
11:54 AM
@ConspicuousCompiler I shall have to find these channels. Although I've been hooked on SO and it's increasingly incredible amounts of knowledge on virtually any Programming language. It has helped me understand tons of things in a very short time.
 
@dogbane no need; you get notifications of replies etc; or see your profile; or your global inbox thingy
 
@MarcGravel yes you're right. Thanks!
 
@KyleSevenoaks SO is a great learning resource
but so is IRC indeed
 
@Tony I am hooked on it :D
 
me too
:)
anybody got tips on deadlines?
and meeting them when it seems rather unreal?
 
11:58 AM
@Tony, get off SO and chat for a start :)
 
@Tony text them and say you'll be five minutes late
 
> I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by.
-- Douglas Adams
 
@Benjol I originally came on to get some help solving an issue im having
 
@YiJiang +1
@Tony I just say "You want a whole new newspaper, for when?"
 
hehe
 
12:01 PM
> Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll ask the people on chat.stackoverflow.com"; Now they have two problems
 
true
 
161
Q: How much does it cost to develop an iPhone application?

user27815How much can a developer charge for an iPhone app like Twitterrific? I want to know this because I need such an application with the same functionality for a new community website. I can do Ruby but have no experience with Objective-C. So it would be interesting for me if I should start reading ...

 
cuz chat is addictive
 
12:48 PM
@YiJiang: The original quote was about regular expression, wasn't it?
 
@FirasAssaad Yes it was :)
 
@FirasAssaad don't frickin' talk to me about frickin' regex. Would you believe it was regex that broke chat there?
 
I love hasty workarounds, 90% of my code is composed of those
@MarcGravell: Haha, sorry!
 
Actually, I had a less hasty one, but @MarcGravell beat me with hastyness :)
 
Wez
ah SO is back online
 
12:50 PM
@balpha - by all means, if you have a proper fix, go for it.
 
in Chat feedback, 4 mins ago, by Marc Gravell
We bought a new hamster. Sorry, the pet shop was a while away.
 
My approach is "rip it out, then dissect when the app is back up" ;p
I probably wouldn't make a good surgeon.
 
What kind of bug is it?
 
@FirasAssaad We're talking about it in the Feedback room

Chat feedback

Problems with chat? Let us know...
 
I wonder if robot surgeons will have to fix regex bugs in the future
 
1:10 PM
@Andomar Thank you for your heads up a while ago ;) got it in my inbox!
Only four people look active in here :(
 
Hey @sinni800
 
Hey @FirasAssaad
 
People were talking and then they had some server problems
 
Ohh, I seem to have missed that just now
 
Was this chat thing just released today?
 
1:19 PM
No
 
Cool thanks.
I'm so impressed by it
It's like a reinvention of chat
 
@debu wannabe
 
hi
 
Wannabe whut?
 
1:21 PM
chat feature is soo cool and soo useless
 
It's really made convenient, messages are really there
 
sorry for trouble
 
It can be useful to discuss certain questions that are not suited to q&a format
 
messages dont just disappear from the server after they've been sent. ALSO EDITING IS AWESOME
 
Chat is totally useful
 
1:22 PM
@debu: wannabe = wants to be, it can't replace irc cause irc is distributed and free for all
 
@Firas kind of what?
 
Some things aren't big enough issues to warrant opening a question on SO
 
@stagas IRC is not distributed, jabber is. IRC is just a set of closed (servers) okay, server bunches. But it allows anybody to make their own rules
 
@stagas: sure it won't replace IRC. But it'd be nice if some of the features could be taken across to a like, second-gen IRC or something
 
i interviewed one guy for internship (.net) and asked to solve this problem blogs.msdn.com/b/ericlippert/archive/2010/09/09/…
 
1:24 PM
@debu people already tried to enhance irc
 
he was unable to do it, now i am thinking was not it too much for intern or not
your opinions?
 
Hmm... by the way, anybody know something?
1
Q: Using FFMpeg to determine video-type, converting afterwards?

sinni800Hello, I'm trying to determine the real type of a file programmatically. It seems I have to use for example FFMPeg for that. I want to determine if an uploaded file is in fact a MP4 or FLV (for flash videos) [or WebM (for HTML5)]. I know the -i operator in FFMPeg but I don't know what to check...

 
@Andrey: how long did you give him to do it? Doesn't seem like it should be that hard for an intern
 
@debu i gave about 40 minutes
but he didn't make any progress. He doesn't know how to traverse trees
well i solved this puzzle in 10 minutes, and it was completely trivial to me
 
Oh maybe I'd be able to do it :)
 
1:26 PM
@Andrey: Hmm. Hard to say
 
I think so
A little recursion
 
I guess give him something else, test a bit more of his knowledge in other areas
 
By the way... What IS an intern?
 
@debu i need to test his smartness, not knowledge
@sinni800 intern is larva of developer
 
Apprentice?
 
1:28 PM
yes
 
@sinni800 @debu it's like a huge shoutbox. I'm not sure about people will adopt this kind of communication. would work better if it was a widget in the main SO site, for quick questions and answers on things that aren't worth it as a regular SO question
 
@stagas I often have those small questions which could be answered in a second... When I find out the answer myself after long searching I often think to myself: "Duh."
@Andrey I am an apprentice as a computer specialist in programming
This is what Germany calls it
 
@stagas: I agree. All in all I just think it's a great addition to SO. I'll definitely use it for smaller questions. Maybe even for bigger ones, who knows.
 
@sinni800 yes that is the same. do you have any experience in development?
 
I'm in the apprenticeship for a year now
I had experience before going there already
 
1:31 PM
@stagas It's also good to alert people of still unanswered questions in a certain topic (through the topic's room)
 
@sinni800 i heard that in Germany they like to teach too much for even simple jobs
 
I prefer IRC. I can see the reasoning behind this chat though. Mostly in terms of website integration and more modern features.
 
@Andrey could be true. But it also makes for very good educated people coming out of their apprenticeship
 
@sinni800 I use irc for that, freenode has channels on most popular frameworks/languages
 
@stagas Freenode? I'll definitely have to look into that...
 
1:32 PM
@sinni800 because in Russia you can become middle developer after having 3m apprenticeship and 9m of work experience. everything is faster here.
 
@Andrey in Germany everything has to have a foundation... We have a plan on how the apprenticeship has to run in the company
@Andrey We have work mixed with school. 2 weeks of work vs 1 week of school.
 
@sinni800 it is good for companies and bad for developers. in Russia no one will invest year into you. faster feedback is needed
 
@sinni800 it's irc.freenode.net
 
@stagas I know!
 
@sinni800 yes, i am mixing school (university) with work for 4th year
 
1:35 PM
@Andrey So people don't come out of their apprenticeships with many skills?
 
@sinni800 i think 3 months is enough to become developer if you have good theoretical knowledge from school
 
@Andrey we have really smart people in school. Three are making a project management system together
masterprogs.de ahh blast. You can't go in there without having an account
 
@sinni800 percentage of smart people in our school is getting too low. well, that means that i will always have work :)
@sinni800 and without knowing Deutch
 
@Andrey You could still see the fancy bars and run-managements
 
@sinni800 i know only Wie geht's? and Woher kommst du?
 
1:37 PM
They import from SVN and things like that
@Andrey I personally currently develop upon aspbooru.tk
 
My co-worker's code: return ((realValue() > 0) ? false : true);
 
@FirasAssaad this is classic WTF
 
@FirasAssaad Short IFs make me sad
 
I'm not sure if it's worse than a full if in this case
 
@sinni800 my ex-PM was fan of nested a ? b : c that is not cool also
 
1:39 PM
at least it's not return ((realValue() > 0 == true) ? false : true);
 
@FirasAssaad at least it is not return true ? false : true;
 
@Andrey For a second there I thought you meant Prime Minister when you said PM
 
I saw something like that... return value ? true : false
where value is a number that is 1 or 0
 
@YiJiang almost :)
 
@Andrey oh wow.
 
1:41 PM
@FirasAssaad if value is 1/0 this trick will work in C / C++ only
 
@Andrey: Yes, it's C++
it probably works in perl
 
@FirasAssaad sorry, i hate perl :)
 
In fact you can pretty much just bang your head on the keyboard and the code will work in perl
 
@FirasAssaad that's the reason. perl is write-only lang
 
Well, it's useful for small command line scripts I guess. I prefer Python or Ruby for that.
Well, I told my co-worker about his return statement. He said "Who cares? It does the same thing and is more readable"
 
1:46 PM
hello
i am back
 
Welcome back @Tony
 
@FirasAssaad there is a piece of truth in his words. sometimes readability matters more
 
has anyone else had problems with the chat
 
I answered your question in the C++ channel
 
@Andrey -- re tree traversal, I'm an intern and I did it in ten minutes
 
1:46 PM
@Tony:

Chat feedback

Problems with chat? Let us know...
 
@Tony - We had a glitch with the server; we're working on it
 
@katrielalex good!
@katrielalex we can employ you :)
 
Ok @MarcGravell
 
@Andrey: I wouldn't say it's more readable in this case. Either way, I don't think it's a big deal. Just funny.
 
@Andrey - win, I need a new internship next summer :p
@Andrey although elementtree does the work anyway
 
1:48 PM
@Andrey I've been known to do them: trying to get my C# to look like F# pattern matching ;)
 
@katrielalex what is new internship?
@katrielalex is not one enought?
 
do we have a room on algorithms and data structures??
 
@Andrey I had one last summer and another coming up this winter. It's fun :p
 
return !!realValue()
 
1:54 PM
@katrielalex i like real stuff. i never was intern, i started as jr developer
 
@Andrey well I'm still a student so don't want to take up a real job yet
 
@katrielalex well i am student too :) taking master degeree
 
2:20 PM
test
 
@CiscoIPPhone IT WORKED!
 
Great :D
 
@Andrey While I agree about that, I don't see how that statement is more readable than the shorter version...
 
2:39 PM
I'd say return realValue() >= 0. return realValue() would work but it's less readable because he's not interested in the value itself.
That wouldn't work at all... I was looking at @CiscoIPPhone's answer :/
 
Anyone keep a TOP-100 of Exact duplicate questions?
smth. like "what is the !! operator in Ruby?"
I'm reading only tags in which i'm interested - it would be interesting, to know, which questions are "the most popular" for all SO.
 
The "ain't no" operator.
 
3:12 PM
@FirasAssaad ??
 
anyone here+
?
 
?? operator? ..)
 
@Tony We're here, just lurking in the background, waiting to pwn the first n00b to float through these digital gates...
 
hehe
:) thats funny :) n00b = pwn'd :)
 
@YiJiang: Now don't be such a PK... the xp from noobs isn't worth it
 
3:18 PM
@FirasAssaad wtf is PK?
 
player killer
 
hehe
 
Term frequently used in PVP games, mmos etc
 
lol not much of gamer myself, so I wouldnt have known
maybe we should have a room for n00b pwnage
if youù
if youre a n00b join this room, lol :)
 
3:20 PM
There would be nothing to do in this room then, @Tony
 
true
 
4:01 PM
Hello
 
@spoulson hello
 
Seems dead at the moment
 
@spoulson Kinda is.
 
@spoulson A couple hours ago Marc piped half the SO population into this room with a shiny banner on the SO homepage
@AidenBell is still a bit angry with the mess they caused
 
@YiJiang What mess?
(I mean, did you make a joke or did it seriously cause a mess? :) )
(So hard to tell without intonations... :-/ )
 
4:05 PM
@YiJiang 1000 messages later, heh.
 
Well, not really, but the room basically broke down into pointless noise
 
@YiJiang as far as I recall it was mostly because of people wanting to find girl programmers.
 
Which you may interpret as mess or not
@AviadBenDov :P dating.stackexchange.com
 
So, this is going to be a bunch of bearded dudes, looking for a perfect match of another bearded dude, who will hopefully share his language and OS preferences? :)
2
 
@YiJiang Heh. That could be a good idea. First question there could be "Is it possible to female partners in the SO chatroom?"
Sigh. I hate reverse engineering code.... It's more of a psychological thing to get into the mind of the person who wrote it (with questions like "Why they hell did he check that if statement" or "this loop is unneccessa... damn, it is.")
I wish people who made open source code would be at least honorable enough to explain why they made the decisions they did!
:P
 
4:14 PM
@YiJiang Wow
@YiJiang Is that why the chat was down this morning?
 
Any msbuild gurus on the line?
 
@spoulson No, separate issue, was partially my fault actually :P
 
@YiJiang I don't see the irony. :P
But it is funny. :)
 
@AviadBenDov I was paraphrasing an old adage about regex
 
and this quote caused a regex to eat up our CPUs
if that isn't ironic...
 
4:21 PM
The original quote, by Jamie Zawinski, goes like this:
> Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll use regular expressions." Now they have two problems.
 
0
Q: Cross-site tag sets are live: feedback?

Jeff AtwoodOn http://stackexchange.com -- assuming you are logged in via global auth -- we now support cross-site "tag sets". That is, you can set up a stream of tagged questions on a single site, or across multiple sites. Like so: You can also browse other people's tag sets, so feel free to set up tag ...

 
I see :D
 
@YiJiang Uh oh. Keep it up and you're gonna get canned! :)
 
@YiJiang trying to bring down the system, we see how it is.
 
161
Q: How much does it cost to develop an iPhone application?

user27815How much can a developer charge for an iPhone app like Twitterrific? I want to know this because I need such an application with the same functionality for a new community website. I can do Ruby but have no experience with Objective-C. So it would be interesting for me if I should start reading ...

 
4:29 PM
It cost my the price of an iPad and a mac mini.
my? me*
 
is that the question with the most downvoted answers on SO
 
I don't know, check the query site
 
4:46 PM
@JeffAtwood Is it also possible to somehow tag whole sites? Would be useful for beta sites that don't have too much traffic yet.
 
Is there a way to find out what files have been added to source control since the last build in TFS?
programmatically.
(of course).
 
@YiJiang - Im not angry
It was nice to see more people in here
 
@sepp2k that isn't really the use case for this feature, I don't think .. but feel free to ask for that on the meta Q
 
@AidenBell You're not? Good. Goes over to pick up the giant <table> tag
 
Run @AidenBell, before he snaps!
 
4:59 PM
@TimStone - He doesn't scare me!
I can take his table bashing with aplomb.
 
I know, I just figured that getting hit in the head was bad for productivity, and you seem strapped enough as it is. :P
 
I thought about closing this question from the title alone. And then I read it. Fascinating stuff: stackoverflow.com/questions/3974077/…
 
@AidenBell The SO comment tables are rather heavy. There's quite a bit of nesting too, adding to the overall weight, which makes it the perfect weapon for pragmatism-as-an-excuse'ers like you
@GeorgeStocker Meow
 
Wait a sec, this site takes Stack Overflow questions and localizes them? nl.efreedom.com/Question/1-837141/…
 
@YiJiang - Pragmatism isn't an excuse, It just ranks higher than other stuff!
 
5:05 PM
Am I crazy?
I dont' know what that actually says, but it appears to be a localized Stack Overflow question.
 
@AidenBell It's an excuse when you start using <b> tags instead of proper CSS rules
 
@YiJiang - rolls eyes
 
@AidenBell Or when you use <table> s when using a list in its place makes no difference and actually saves the number of bytes needed to be sent over the internet
What was that again, pragmatism? Practicality? What are you trying to save here then?
 
@AidenBell Stop changing the subject when I'm talking to you! Picks up <table> and bashes Aiden
    -------------
   /   REST IN   \
  /     PEACE     \
 /                 \
 |    AidenBell    |
 |   killed by a   |
 |giant <table> tag|
 |    *  *  *      |
 /\\_/(\/(/\)\//\//|
 
5:15 PM
@YiJiang - Attemping to kill me results in ban hammer.
Unless you commit to my A51 proposal ;)
 
5:35 PM
@YiJiang lol
 
 
1 hour later…
6:56 PM
SO just went over 4M questions
 
34 people and nobody's said a word in an hour, impossible!
 
@JasonWatts Cool :)
 
@JasonWatts - No it didn't
The ID in the URL doesn't equal the number of actual questions
 
@DanGrossman - ;)
 
7:04 PM
Learn something new everyday
 
Really, Visa? To redeem my worthless reward "points", I need to set a new 16 character lowercase uppercase special character and digits password, and create three security questions?
WTF is wrong with security these days, adding more punctuation to my password does not make it safer
 
@DanGrossman - I know DaNGr0ssMan1 isn't safe
 
7:29 PM
17 million Americans with college degrees perform jobs that do not require the skill level of a degree. For example, there are 5057 janitors in the U.S. with Ph.D.'s. chronicle.com/blogs/innovations/…
 
5k Janitors with Ph.D.s ... in what? Janitoring?
Theoretical Floor Cleaning?
 
Mathematical Modeling of Cleaning Dynamics?
Interesting read however
 
The first FourSquare checkin from space earns the NASA Explorer Badge techcrunch.com/2010/10/22/foursquare-space-astronaut
 
8:05 PM
haha
that is funny
who's around?
 
watching TV on hulu
 
hehe
lol
 
8:35 PM
eloh
 
hole?
oot sdrawkcab gnipyt evol I
 
@DanGrossman is that a language?
 
.esrever ni ,hsilgnE s'tI
 
I guess not
 
ukjdsfkjdsfhkjsdfhkfsdhkfdsjfds
Yay! im chatting too
 
8:43 PM
Try holding your computer up to a mirror
geeze, programmers that can't read right to left... how do you do bit arithmetic?!
 
Actually, what you did is typical of most programmers
Take something simple and make it complicated
 
@LasseVKarlsen - lold
Reminds me of Django
 
little endian
 
8:46 PM
lol
lol
sometimes I get lost between bits and bytes
and then end up here on chat of SO
 
between bits and bytes are nybbles
In computing, a nibble (often nybble or even nyble to simulate the spelling of byte) is a four-bit aggregation, or half an octet. As a nibble contains 4 bits, there are sixteen (24) possible values, so a nibble corresponds to a single hexadecimal digit (thus, it is often referred to as a "hex digit" or "hexit"). One early recorded use of the term "nybble" was in 1977 within the consumer-banking technology group at Citibank that created a pre-ISO 8583 standard for transactional messages, between cash machines and Citibank's data centers, in which a nybble was the basic informational unit...
 
or in C++ land
lost in Xpath and XML traverals
 
but does anyone actually use nibbles?
 
Thx for the Nibble
i dont use nibbles
 
9:14 PM
currently? no, back in the day of 16 bits computers? ya
 

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