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7:00 PM
Speaking of good languages - I'd say it's hard to write buggy code in Haskell.
 
!!s/buggy//
 
@AwalGarg Speaking of good languages - I'd say it's hard to write code in Haskell. (source)
 
@JanDvorak Yeah, because no one would run it
 
so many large custom built applications in it, with such a small dev team here, would take years to move off of it for little gain
 
!!xkcd haskell
 
7:01 PM
 
@KevinB until they figure out hiring a CFM contractor will cost them huge $$$
 
@MadaraUchiha this be why I have tried pretty much all WMs except xmonad
 
That's true actually. You write math definitions in Haskell and the compiler turns them into machine code
 
it's an easy to learn language, so we can just pick up any dev that's willing to learn
 
So basically we should all just learn machine code
 
7:01 PM
@MadaraUchiha an-cient
@SterlingArcher still better than PHP
 
yes
 
in react router
`replace({ pathname: '/login', state:
 
The only good thing that came from me learning ColdFusion was the 16 upvotes I got from answering a Stack Question
 
Was that really a good thing?
 
Dom
7:03 PM
@SterlingArcher was that an upvote from everyone in the CF community? :P
 
1.9k followers, 10.6k questions
MHM >:(
 
!!urban mhm
 
@JanDvorak mhm Word used in IM convorsations to make the 'sound' of nodding or accepting.
 
I don't get the difference between mhm and hmm
!!urban hmm
 
@AwalGarg hmm Something somebody says when they are thinking about what you have just said. They have an opinion.. but dont want to tell you what it is.
 
7:05 PM
well..
 
mhm means yes or i understand
 
hmm...
 
mhmm
 
hmm means I'm thinking
 
!!urban well
 
7:06 PM
@JanDvorak [Wells](http://wells.urbanup.com/586257) Any drink prepared with liquor deemed by a particular bar as "wells". All bars have different brands of "wells liquor". Usually this is their cheapest liquor and is used in most drinks unless a specific brand of liquor is "called" (requested).
See [\[call\]](http://urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=call).
 
Dom
@Caprica fail... :P
 
and there is also "hm" which I have seen used as a firm version of "hmm"
 
mhm can also use tone to appropriate sarcasm or an "exaggerated agreement"
So if you inflect mhm to be like MMMMHMMM it could mean "ok fuck you"
 
actually the number of m's is inversely proportional to the firmness intended
 
in react router, what is state doing ?
`replace({
pathname: '/login',
state: { nextPathname: nextState.location.pathname }
})
`
 
7:07 PM
Or "Sure, whatever you say, dumbass"
 
!!urban ahem
 
@JanDvorak [ahem](http://ahem.urbanup.com/1464529) The sound made when a person clears his/her throat, often interjected when speaking or writing to indicate that the next word or phrase is used ironically or euphemistically, (esp. with regard to sexual euphemisms).

Sometimes used to replace a sexually explicit word or phrase altogether.

When used on its own or at the end of a sentence, indicates that the entire previous sentence has been intended (snip)
 
Dom
looks like @KendallFrey would be a better bot
 
@AwalGarg to me that means the same as huh as in "that's weird"
 
@vzhen Please don't post unformatted code - hit Ctrl+K before sending, use up-arrow to edit messages, and see the faq.
 
7:08 PM
in react router, what is state doing ?
replace({
pathname: '/login',
state: { nextPathname: nextState.location.pathname }
})
 
!!urban hmhm
 
@rlemon [hmhm](http://hmhm.urbanup.com/7736985) 1. Yes.
2. No.
3. I'm not listening to you.
4. I am listening, but too bored to answer you correctly.
 
Dom
@KendallFrey that one always gets me
 
oh god, I sneezed and knocked over my goldfish again
 
7:10 PM
@CapricaSix aka indian head bobble
 
!!afk disaster
 
@SterlingArcher why was your goldfish standing up in the first place?
 
Also, how?
 
Dom
That's a mighty sneeze
 
!!urban disaster
 
7:11 PM
@JanDvorak Disaster Miley Cyrus.
 
Dom
Big bad wolf style
 
lol
rekt
 
lmao
 
i didn't have heard of Miley Cyrus lately
no news = good news
 
Fishtank faceplant. What an excellent name for a rock band
 
7:14 PM
I have updated my portfolio
 
1. Goldfish bags are upright 2. My hand hit it
 
cc @KendallFrey @rlemon
 
Opinions?
 
3. 3/4 my goldfish are gone :(
 
7:15 PM
@MattewDeveloper Yea, focus on actually doing stuff.
 
how can 3/4 of a goldfish disappear
 
goldfish are too dumb to know they're alive anyways
 
I'm... talking about crackers...
 
@Trasiva What you means?
 
oh
you mean the crackers
noob
 
7:16 PM
for now I've put a few elements
 
@Trasiva can confirm
geese === daemon
 
@MattewDeveloper Actually start writing some different code pens and learning instead of just building one that claims your proficiencies.
 
@Trasiva There's a very very serious omission
it's colour you fucking mong
 
@SterlingArcher THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN GOOD TO KNOW BEFORE I SENT YOU THE CARD
 
7:17 PM
> The leaderboards for Send Me to Heaven show some players have managed to get their phones as high as 40 meters (131 feet). Svarovsky did a little investigating to learn how that impressive score was achieved and discovered some players are using slingshots.
 
@rlemon Oh I know dude. Granddad decided one year we were having goose for Thanksgiving, bought two clipped geese to feed and fatten up. One day I was visiting and went to feed them, and the male wouldn't stop attacking me despite the fact I was trying to bring them food. After about four attempts to feed them I went inside and grabbed the shotgun and put the bastard down.
 
even that won't work
he's still in the shadows
watching
 
@KendallFrey I didn't make the comic, and it's color in freedom language.
 
waiting
 
@Trasiva It's obviously not written in freedom language
 
7:19 PM
The colors of freedom are red, blue and white. As in Czech Republic, not as in USA.
 
@rlemon Best was when I gave my sister a horn for her bike for her birthday the one year. I'd tested a bunch of them and found one that pissed off the geese that lived along the lake across the street from us. I laughed when they started chasing her.
 
@KendallFrey wat
 
Dom
@Trasiva Did someone else get them a sex change?
 
When developing is it normal to get stuck on a problem for hours/days?
 
7:21 PM
yes
 
si
 
taking a break can help
 
they're being nice. no it isn't. you just suck.
:P
 
@Mr_Tree Yea, but that's why sometimes you walk away from it and come back to it a couple hours later when you can come at it from a new perspective.
 
Im a bit confused right now, how do I get the index of the clicked class relative to the entire document again?
 
7:21 PM
I understand when working on personal projects that you can get stuck, but lets say you are working in a company
 
if you're feeling workoholic, break = switch to a different project
 
Dom
@Mr_Tree Especially yes at the start of learning, should get quicker
 
and they boss sees that you havent made any progress on a problem - will he ask why
 
That's why you have three
 
?
 
7:22 PM
That's why you have three. One to be compiling in the background, one to think about and one to be coding.
 
Dom
@Mr_Tree If you said you were an expert than of course lol
 
I ask because i am just about to finish college and love development but i spend most of time trying to figure stuff out
 
@Mr_Tree I get your problem
 
And i am wondering how it works in the real world
 
Maybe its related to your capability to think in an abstract way?
improve your logical thinking, abstraction skills
 
7:23 PM
I can usually figure things out - it can take time though
Yes i will have to!
 
Ya then improve those skills
 
Thank you
 
I know because I had the same issues and it improved like hell
 
what are we discussing?
 
jquery
 
Dom
7:24 PM
Mordor
 
Sometimes I ask here. It helps me to figure out the problem in an unrelated way.
 
Good idea
Be prepared to see me often
peppering every chat room with questions
 
joking of course
 
Dom
Also, Stack Overflow is pretty good for asking good questions
 
7:25 PM
@Mr_Tree I think the solution is to challenge yourself constantly. I do it even in my freetime. Then you really improve the speed of problem solving
 
It may attack at any time!
 
@MadaraUchiha sure, they had a beer today btw
 
I will use these suggestions
thank you
 
@KendallFrey We must dill with it immediately.
 
mordor :l
 
7:27 PM
Guys, is it possible to get the index of a clicked element in relation to the document? For example I have this:
<div>
<div class="hello">One</div>
</div>

<div>
<div class="hello">One</div>
</div>
 
:|
 
Dom
"There's been a Mordor!"
 
@Asperger index?
 
and when clicking on the second hello class I want to get an index of 1
 
One does not simply ... wait, that's the original version.
 
7:28 PM
> Error C4996 'std::_Copy_impl': Function call with parameters that may be unsafe - this call relies on the caller to check that the passed values are correct..
 
who are full stack folks here?
 
I can get the index using [].slice.call and indexOf but that doesnt quite work
Me
 
@Asperger You could set a passive attribute there.
 
And it's from an internal library that is used by library that my project is using.
 
@Asperger arrayOfElements.indexOf(myElement)
 
7:28 PM
@Trasive, never heared of that term
 
Dom
@GandalftheWhite According to my course I am, but I sure don't feel like one
 
okay
how do you guys approach the UI part?
 
js/CSS
 
APPROACH-
 
JS/CSHTML/SCSS
 
Dom
7:29 PM
Design?
 
@GandalftheWhite most of us
 
@ndugger You could change <div class="hello">One</div> to <div divIndex=index class="hello">One</div>.
 
@GandalftheWhite can you be more specific? I use css3 and html for gui
 
for backend i use java / php
 
7:30 PM
@Trasiva data-div-index tyvm
 
and for front end user interaction js
 
@Asperger poor / bad
 
@JanDvorak what?
 
Java is verbose and PHP just sucks.
 
ah, dat jsp pages
 
Dom
7:31 PM
@GandalftheWhite what are you asking? It's the broadest question I've seen in months
 
@ssube Oh yea, you're right. I shouldn't even be at work today. Between the migraine I got over an hour ago and the 101 fever, I'm probaly not too qualified today.
 
that's sooo old
 
@JanDvorak php is pretty much standard
 
@JanDvorak have you used Java 8 with Guice?
 
Unless you want to go with node which is really overkill and performance sucks compared to php for certain things
 
7:31 PM
The two combined cut out a ton of the verbosity (not enough, but a bunch).
 
!!convert 101 f to c
 
@JanDvorak Unit f not recognized. Did you mean:
* length: ft, mi, in, yd, ls, ly, rd, pc, AU
* speed: fps, kt, kn
* time: yr, hr, wk
* counting: nt, bp
* luminous_power: lm
* mass: lb, kg, Da, dr, st, tn, ct, oz
* force: lbf
* volume: pt, tb, cu, qt, bu
* resolution: px
* charge: Ah
* prefix_only: dz, gr
* logarithmic: dB
* solid_angle: sr
* energy: th, Wh
* luminosity: cd
* power: hp
* pressure: Pa
* viscosity: St
* radiation: Sv, Ci, Bq, Gy
* frequency: Hz
* magnetism: Oe, Wb, Mx
 
@Asperger lol, not even close.
@Asperger Node is faster than PHP in almost every situation (although Java and C# are faster than both).
 
@ssube that php is not standard?
 
PHP (and Perl and Python) are notoriously slow.
For whatever reason, languages that start with P have a tendency to be really slow.
 
7:33 PM
R too
 
@Asperger PHP is popular for small applications, especially open-source ones. You won't find a ton of companies using it, especially not large ones.
 
in C#, 11 mins ago, by wadry
@Amy its fact that jquery is used on over half the worlds web pages
 
Many will have some part of their website done in PHP, often by contractors, but it's not too popular.
The heavy lifting is typically Java or C#.
 
Dom
@ssube eckscooooz me? Python rocks
 
@ssube You sometimes surprise me
 
7:34 PM
@ssube Pascal is pretty fast
 
@ssube what about CMS'?
 
@Zirak with or without butt stuff?
 
Those aren't really small apps
 
@SterlingArcher most of em are small OSS apps
 
But they inherit a large scale framework
 
7:34 PM
all the "big" PHP stuff is (wordpress, phpbb, CMSes, etc)
 
Drupal is huge
 
most of Drupal.se is spam
 
well wordpress is changing to node
 
my website runs off of Drupal. Too lazy to move it to something better like Ghost
 
@SterlingArcher in complexity? not really
 
7:35 PM
@JanDvorak hey hey hey.
 
my GFs site I made recently runs off of Ghost though. Love it so far
 
in popularity, it's... medium
 
For fucks sake... every satellite I add increases rendering time by 50 seconds :(
 
lol
 
Things is for everything else node is just overkill. If you dont need to change something every so often like facebook and co then php is really great
 
7:36 PM
@SterlingArcher at least it's linear
 
@ssube ~15% of websites run it, last time I was told
that's pretty popular
 
@Asperger no
 
@Asperger FB changes things all the time and hardly uses PHP (they certainly don't use what you think of as PHP)
 
@Codeman I haven't gotten to the constellation orbits yet :( those will be near exponential
 
@FlorianMargaine drupal?
 
7:36 PM
@ssube yeah
 
Dom
@Asperger In my understanding, node is very versatile, can go big or small
 
Facebook needs node and they profit a lot since the changes taking place are insane
 
300 seconds rendering and counting
 
@FlorianMargaine huh. That's more than I would expect, but makes sense, considering you can throw a couple small pages in and add your custom thingy.
 
but for simple things php is better in my opinion
 
7:37 PM
in my experience, Node is good for servicing tons and tons of requests. It's shit at doing long running tasks as a web server
 
@Asperger that makes no sense
 
there arent many hosters that support node yet
 
node + nginx
 
@Codeman node is good for I/O bound tasks
 
don't make node do what it shouldn't
no problems
 
7:38 PM
@ssube but not in a web server context
 
@Codeman indeed. THe more requests the more I would go for node.
 
unless I'm mistaken
 
@Asperger what? If you're talking about HostGator just get out now lol
 
Give me a minutes guys
 
if you need to do anything CPU-bound, JS is a questionable choice, but you can always fork processes
 
7:38 PM
thanks for response
 
@Codeman web servers are IO bound
 
Anybody who knows anything about hosting knows to not use a host that won't let you run anything you want
 
exactly
 
node falls down when you try to do number crunching in the same thread
 
or a shared host even
 
7:38 PM
also, since I've worked for ~4 years on drupal-related stuff, I can tell you that it's quite popular.
 
so if you have long running DB calls or heavy number crunching, things go south quickly
 
@SterlingArcher I think my swiss hoster Hostar doesnt support it. Got to see
 
@ssube C++ CGI?
 
@Codeman DB calls are async, though
 
I wonder if there's an easy way to do interop between Node and Rust. That would be the dream
 
7:39 PM
@Asperger don't use them, then. I bet you don't get root access either
Use DigitalOcean or AWS
 
@JanDvorak cluster
 
@SterlingArcher or Azure ;)
 
Or that
 
@Codeman if you want to pay extra for a crap interface
 
(plug plug plug)
 
7:39 PM
you're shameless
you whore
 
@ssube I don't use Azure's interface much. I just script stuff out with the API
 
GCE > Azure >>> AWS
 
do you guys know about cloudwatt?
 
I live life on the edge. My DO server only has root login :D
 
They're all shit, but so is hosting yourself
 
7:40 PM
what is GCE?
 
google cloud engine
 
I am using it atm
 
@SterlingArcher ah yes, the ability to run a DoS against the other sites is important
 
they're all insanely expensive
 
Mongo Redis and Nide
node*
We have free credits from Google's end
 
7:40 PM
@KendallFrey damn straight
 
so it isn't problematic as of now
 
@SterlingArcher like me
 
they basically run openstack on their datacenters
 
How about Google App Engine?
 
@FlorianMargaine they're pretty expensive
 
7:41 PM
You're the guy that gay guys look at and figure out later and they're like "Damn.. straight.. :("
 
Google app Engine isn't what one might except for Node.js environment
 
@ssube they're for customers that want a french cloud
 
Ok so for now my backend knowledge is Java and PHP
 
I haven't tested it for the 4 primary languages that they are supporting
 
is node another trend that passed?
 
7:42 PM
which is pretty important for more and more European companies :)
 
or you think its there to stay for a while?
 
Node is very much in use as of now
 
@JanDvorak GAE is ok. You have to write your app for GAE, though. I prefer to rent a VPS and write a "normal" app.
 
and the way I see it - we'll be hearing a lot of it in near future
 
@Asperger node is getting bigger and will be around for a while.
 
7:42 PM
It matters for me, who actually maintains it?
 
@Asperger you might wanna google these things... you'd know that Node was the highest growth language last year, and many huge companies use it
 
@JanDvorak 38.3C
 
@ssube you used GAE for which language, if I may ask
 
I dont want to use something maintained by some guy other than w3
ok I will google
 
@GandalftheWhite Java and I tried their Python thing
 
7:43 PM
Okay sire
 
@Asperger w3 doesn't maintain any software
 
it isn't that great for node.js
I am no expert anyway so I am just giving a simple opinion
 
700 seconds rendering -_-
 
@GandalftheWhite maybe, I haven't tried that.
 
and with node.js we barely need to write differently
 
7:44 PM
The idea of writing your app for a particular platform is gross.
 
write our code differently*
Agreed sire
and I wont be using it if I was forced to do something like that
 
I just cant figure how to test node on my localhost like i did with XAMMP
 
Inb4 a big no
 
@Asperger it's pretty much the same
 
?? node server.js
install node, write server script, run script
super cake
Like... 3 lines of code
 
7:45 PM
Ok I thought its really complex to get the wheels running
 
I sterling
when I wrote that php is done and dusted I meant
 
@Asperger it takes the same amount of time as PHP, sometimes less
 
can we expect a decline in it's existent market
hi* Sterling
FML
 
Ok so Node > Ajax+PHP
 
7:46 PM
@Asperger what the hell kinda tutorials are you reading? O.o
 
@Asperger AJAX isn't part of the picture yet.
 
Do you know what ajax is?
 
no no, I know
 
Hi sterling
 
You use AJAX with any client/API setup, regardless of languages.
 
7:47 PM
54 secs ago, by Sterling Archer
Hi
 
yes i know what ajax is xD
 
I wrote a statement a few hours ago - php is done and dusted
 
@Asperger tell us what ajax is
 
what I actually meant is can we expect a decline in its existing market
 
Im just saying that the combination AJAX+PHP is worse than using node
 
7:48 PM
Doubt it. PHP is well maintained and a shit ton of the web uses it
 
You replied to that statement saying - as far as I know php is one of the most famous server side scripting language
 
so from now on I will build my chat software with node
 
I hope the trend fades
php isn't that awesome
 
@Asperger React/Redux, Express, Node, Redis, and some sockets make great chat.
 
PHP is horrible indeed
 
7:49 PM
@GandalftheWhite yes, but slowly. The companies using it are either using a framework, like Drupal, or have built up their own ecosystem, like Facebook.
 
Coming from the guy who can't run a node script, I think that statement is highly uncited
 
There certainly won't be a lot of new work happening in PHP.
 
Maybe that is sarcastic
 
So react is actually super easy to learn. Am I missing something?
 
Sarcasm doesn't translate well over text
 
7:49 PM
they released new php version but I agree php language is horrible
 
Agreed there
 
@corvid nope. It does one (and two half) things and does them well.
 
php 7 right?
 
Dom
The best languages are open-sourced imo
 
Yes
 
7:50 PM
@Dom most languages are.
 
scaling php based web app isn't easy IMO
 
C# isn't
 
compared to node.js + subsidiaries
 
@JanDvorak is so
 
@Asperger why is PHP a horrible language
 
7:50 PM
My favorite language is C# and Java
 
unless you count mono
 
Java is probably the most-closed of the big languages
 
I have heard many good things about Scala
 
There is OpenJDK
 
C# has a partially OSS runtime, but the standard is openly licensed.
 
7:51 PM
if I stay in tech sector for couple of more years
 
and the bytecode is well documented
 
@SterlingArcher it is the syntax and paternalism that bothers me.
 
I will love to learn that for sure
 
Java is sort of the opposite, plus parts of the runtime are restricted.
 
how much will you guys give JAVA language out of 10
 
7:51 PM
First reason isn't a reason, and what do you mean by paternalism?
 
@JanDvorak the Java spec is more closely guarded than any of the others, though.
 
keeping all the frameworks and all in mind
 
9 out of 10
 
I don't like Lisps syntax, doesn't make it a bad language
 
Even C# has very liberal terms around the spec, so MS can't sue over it.
Java has no such thing and Oracle does (is) suing people for using it.
 
Dom
7:52 PM
@ssube atleast .NET is open-sourced
Or atleast ASP.NET is
 
C and C++ are all open, since they're just a spec. PHP is who cares. JS is all open, spec and runtime.
 
two runtimes even
 
rare Java folks!
 
@GandalftheWhite Scala is ok, but the libraries for it are mediocre.
 
Dom
I don't know Java, but apparently it's quite similar to C# (many transferable skills)
 
7:54 PM
They rely heavily on operating overloading and small object creation, which causes a lot of overhead and heap thrashing in the JVM.
 
I have used C# for a while - in college
 
If you write Scala well, it can be super efficient.
 
I was to a fortune teller once. She was surprisingly accurate. She was a rare medium well done.
 
Okay @ssube - That means it is a tricky language and one must write things properly
 
Scala works great with Spark
 
7:55 PM
@Dom C# is Java with 20 years of experience and forethought. C# was created to resolve most of the problems.
I'm pretty ok working with Java, but I'd use C# if it ran on any servers.
 
Dom
so Java v2?
 
1090 second render time. Fuck. This is gonna take forever to make changes to...
 
@ssube hindsight is 20/20
 
@Dom v20, more like.
 

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