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8:00 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes context sensitive proll
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It doesn't, but I don't need to.
 
also we had this discussio before
 
if that makes any sense
 
I don't think it's sensible
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh yeah, that was so matter-of-fact I didn’t think to bring that up. Ends the whole debate really.
 
8:00 PM
5 mins ago, by Jefffrey
@Puppy Is that based on personal experience or something that you think inherently makes functional programming terrible for "entire systems"?
@BartekBanachewicz I was trying to go deeper. ^
 
you won't go deeper
 
damn
my swift topic change didn't work
 
tailor it
 
@Puppy It's just one of several possible notations. Of course it is the one that in your view taints the whole thing beyond salvation.
 
@Jefffrey acknowledging haskell might be important knowledge is the same as admitting to not knowing something. Puppy is too full of himself to say that openly
 
8:01 PM
since you guys are so heated
you should redirect your heat to closing this question: stackoverflow.com/q/26980809/1381108
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It is the one that removes a choice that should be mine.
 
he has issues with his own self-respect and so is very afraid to even hint at any sign of his own weakness, probably because of his sickness and how he felt helpless in that period
but then again, I'm not a psychologist vOv
 
user1804599
Scala can tell type names and value names apart without problems.
 
Can we stop talking about the casing and start talking about what puppy meant by saying that functional languages were not suitable for building entire systems?
 
I don't think we're supposed to guess that, are we?
 
8:03 PM
I'm starting to believe that answer will never come.
 
Yes, that incredibly important choice that separates the wheat from the chaff.
 
@Jefffrey Neither will he be able to produce any reasonable arguments because he has, with all due respect, no idea about utilizing FP in "building entire systems"
 
user1804599
You can say class A; val A = 1 and using A will never be ambiguous.
 
@rightføld wat do today C# vs Haskell
 
Also you can have functions that starts with an upper case letter.
 
user1804599
8:05 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Depends on what you want to make.
 
user1804599
Haskell is better at A, B and C, while C# is better at X, Y and Z.
 
@rightføld a project tailored for each of those, respectively.
 
@Puppy Actually, isn't that exactly what makes typename necessary in C++?
 
In data X = X String, X is a function of type :: String -> X
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Let me choose one using Clojure.
 
8:05 PM
@rightføld that would be great
 
Hello does anyone here know the best way to keep 2 folders on two separate Cento/Os machines in sync? I'm looking for the Linux version of DFS
 
@TheSnooker dropbox?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Seems like a similar problem. But typename is a much superior solution.
 
user1804599
  <annelies> ,(rand-nth [:c# :haskell])
<clojurebot> :c#
 
user1804599
8:06 PM
@BartekBanachewicz There you go!
 
@rightføld there we go. I don't know C# though. How do I start.
 
wot
 
@Puppy How came it is so superior?
 
@BartekBanachewicz no that wouldn't work. We are trying to setup a load balanced machine but need to keep the 2 machines folder structure the same.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes One, it only applies when the ambiguity actually appears, instead of everywhere.
 
user1804599
8:07 PM
public static class Program {
    public static void Main() {
        Console.WriteLine("Hello, Bartender!");
    }
}
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz There you start.
 
(Also, I'll remind you how you admitted you never use it; I deal with that shit in my sleep)
 
@Puppy Will you ever answer me on that "the functional paradigm is not good for building entire systems" thingy? So that I can stop asking.
 
two, it does not involve restricting the programmers choice.
@Jefffrey I am thinking about it.
 
Ok
 
8:07 PM
teacup.jpeg
2
 
:(
damn it guys
 
@rightføld I'd like a GUI. I've created an empty WTF project
oh wait it's WPF
 
user1804599
What is WPF.
 
user1804599
How many GUI frameworks does Microsoft have for Windows?
 
Windows Presentation Foundation
 
8:08 PM
@Puppy It doesn't. And as a result of giving you all those powerful choices, it makes both writing and reading code quite the painful business.
 
@rightføld WPF is the newest and shiniest one
 
user1804599
10? 20?
 
at least for desktop.
 
inb4 reading C++ is not painful
inb4 yes it is
 
user1804599
I wrote C++ code today.
 
8:09 PM
inb4 at least i can make my own choices
 
user1804599
I am now at this part:
 
is today the opposite day and @Jefffrey is me
 
user1804599
case Opcode::Send: {
    ++instructionPointer();
    auto channel = pop();
    auto value = pop();
    return;
}
 
this discussion is so boring
 
user1804599
I have to do something with channel and value but I suck at multithreading.
 
8:10 PM
@Jefffrey Not so much if it doesn't have typename and template and other shit in it. That does make the pain balloon a lot.
 
it's clear like the sky in a sunny day of summer that neither of you will change your mind and that you have different preferences and priorities
 
7 mins ago, by Bartek Banachewicz
@Jefffrey Neither will he be able to produce any reasonable arguments because he has, with all due respect, no idea about utilizing FP in "building entire systems"
 
no you didn't inb4 me
that was regarding some other unborn discussion
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, personally, I simply designed a system where you don't need to tell types and variables apart, so I'm hardly arguing that typename is the perfect solution.
 
user1804599
Learn Scala instead of C# and use *ugh* Swing *ugh*.
 
8:12 PM
they can produce reasonable arguments but it will also involve their preferences, which makes it subjective
 
Oh, so now it's "it's not Wide". At least that is better than "I can't use PascalCase".
 
@rightføld no
@R.MartinhoFernandes is it?
 
that is absolutely not what I just said.
 
if you're just gonna cry like a little girl because not everybody likes Haskell, that's fine by me
 
8:12 PM
I feel him closing into himself
 
I got games to play
 
@Puppy You seemed to be arguing it was much superior.
 
@Puppy If you described typename as ‘much superior’, what epithets will you use for that system?
 
8:12 PM
haha
 
come on guys, I'm waiting for an answer here
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz :'(
 
don't make him angry
pls
 
user1804599
Puppy get angry pl0x.
 
8:13 PM
hi, sorry off topic but can somebody please confirm to me real quick that when simulating depth of field using distributed ray tracing, angle of view and focal length are actually not related and can be chosen independently? its driving me nuts :]
 
@Jefffrey we have to force him out of his shell or he'll stay socially incompatible forever
just like me
 
user1804599
When you hold a Unix shell to your ear, do you hear the C?
 
it's not like you are "socially compatible", but you are working on it at least
11 mins ago, by Jefffrey
I'm starting to believe that answer will never come.
 
@rightføld C# fits my needs perfectly in this project
 
user1804599
Then use C#!
 
8:14 PM
@PhilipSalzmann wat
 
@Jefffrey that's the point. I'm only doing that because people told me they won't tolerate me if keep behaving like I do.
 
that doesn't sound like a c++ question
 
user1804599
> off topic
 
maybe you should head to gamedev.se
 
8:15 PM
to their chatroom
 
@PhilipSalzmann frankly I've no idea
 
yeah sorry it looked like the fullest room and i'm programming it in c++ so yeah :P
 
@PhilipSalzmann What's angle of view? You mean fov?
 
user1804599
Holy fucking shit.
 
oh wait we have a C# room here
 
8:16 PM
yes angle of view is the "correct term" for fov
 
@rightføld wat
 
user1804599
I have no idea how to implement this.
 
Xeo
@PhilipSalzmann "looked like the fullest room" is actually a very bad reason to play party-crasher.
just FYI
 
user1804599
Basically I want to have some box that can contain at most one value.
 
Xeo
?
 
user1804599
8:17 PM
And you must be able to register a callback for when that value arrives.
 
@Xeo ok ok i was just hoping for someone to say "yes!" and i could be done with it
 
use a monad
 
user1804599
However, when the value is already there the callback must be invoked immediately.
 
user1804599
And when the callback is invoked the box must be cleared.
 
Xeo
@rightføld Sounds rather simple so far.
what language?
 
user1804599
8:18 PM
And thread-safe.
 
user1804599
C++.
 
user1804599
inb4 these two criteria make it incredibly difficult.
 
Xeo
lol
 
lol
 
8:18 PM
You're doing it in C++, you're bound to accomplish exactly nothing
 
Xeo
So, should the box be able to hold any type or something?
 
user1804599
@TonyTheLion I'm rightfold. That applies without C++ too.
 
user1804599
@Xeo Just one specific non-POD type. (Styx::GCPtr<>)
 
@rightføld lol
 
wait
 
8:19 PM
...
 
Xeo
@rightføld Now that's just simple.
 
what's so hard about implementing this thread safe?
 
nothing
noobfold strikes again
 
Xeo
8:20 PM
Get a boost::optional, grab yourself a mutex, and off you go.
that's the simplest version
 
user1804599
Hmm.
 
user1804599
Of course lol.
 
well he'd have to bake in the callback mechanism somehow
 
@PhilipSalzmann From the little I know about optics, I'd say they can be chosen independently.
 
user1804599
Well wait.
 
8:21 PM
if u get mad at ppl for changing their name to be like their kintype please stop
 
user1804599
Oh no don't wait. Thanks.
 
I don't understand what would be the mutex for.
 
user1804599
Well actually it has to store a set of callbacks and pick a random one but that's not very different.
 
I'm really striving to understand the use of a mutex in this case.
 
user1804599
8:23 PM
Let's implement that first.
 
You have a box which contains some value privately and some callback. And when the value is set chooses a random callback an executes it.
 
3
Q: Backed by a Benjamin, What am I?

Digital ChrisBacked by a Benjamin, Used as an insult: I just can't win. You might be surprised to find rocks in me, Just as shocked as when you find me in a tree. I can get high when I get wild, But making you nod is more my style. I am dark and I am light; cold tomorrow but hot tonight.

 
What's the concurrent problem.
 
Xeo
@Rapptz Yes, grab a std::function vOv
@Jefffrey value set by one thread, callback by another or something
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well they are coupled in physical lenses, thats whats confusing me. But I'll take the conversation elsewhere. Thanks anyway!
 
8:25 PM
@Xeo AFAIU the callback has nothing to do with the value.
 
Yeah but that's a physical limitation AFAIK.
 
So I still don't see the problem.
 
Xeo
@Jefffrey It has - it's called when the value exists
 
I think you can build lenses with any combination of the two.
 
Right.
 
Xeo
8:26 PM
you get a race if you don't synchronise that stuff
 
It's just that some combinations don't produce very interesting results.
 
But then this box is always instantiated in a single thread, so the two operations happen within a single thread.
 
Or "too interesting" results from a different POV.
 
and they basically happen in a single block too
inside the member function that allows to set this property in the box
 
user1804599
8:27 PM
aarrgghrgh
 
Xeo
@Jefffrey do they?
box.set_value(blub);
box.set_function(bla);
 
@Jefffrey where are you getting that from?
 
Xeo
now split that between two threads
 
user1804599
More fun: when setting it has to wait until the box is empty. It shouldn't block the thread, though. I yet have to figure out the API.
 
Xeo
also, that actually sounds like some kind of reversed promise/future thing
 
user1804599
8:28 PM
It's a synchronised channel.
 
@Xeo But that should not be of concern of the Box class
 
user1804599
Receive and send block and the maximum capacity is 1.
 
user1804599
But I don't want to block OS threads.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ok thank you!
 
Xeo
@rightføld so you need a queue for the input?
 
user1804599
8:30 PM
Ah, I know.
 
user1804599
send can take a callback that will return the value that has to be put in the box.
 
@rightføld Wait but not block? lol.
 
user1804599
And that callback can then schedule the fiber as well (but that's outside the scope of Channel).
 
Hah, fibers.
have a tattoo of Celestia on my back because I honestly believe if I praise hard enough She'll come for me when I die http://t.co/Ycj2sHotXj
 
8:32 PM
@mlp_txt Fuck, did he do that himself? I can't believe he paid money for something so shittily drawn
lol
 
user1804599
I'm going crazy.
 
ooh neat
mad world is playing
 
user1804599
inb4 deadlock
 
user1804599
Does moving from boost::optional<T> clear it?
 
8:46 PM
> they’re death threats in the same way that saying ‘go f— yourself’ is a rape threat.
I like that ^
 
why do people make such terrible color schemes for command lines?
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
Now send.
 
@VáclavZeman Oh boi
 
@Jefffrey What? :)
@corvid Probably because your terminal is not set to 256 or RGB colour capability?
@corvid At least with Emacs, the colours looks significantly different if the terminal does not claim good colour palette support.
 
8:51 PM
@VáclavZeman finally
 
Agh. Laptop keys still not functional.
It's been 20 days.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Finally what?
 
@VáclavZeman what is your point, exactly? A deeply conservative website run by right wing nut and climate change deniers say that feminists are evil
 
Dudes, talk in full sentences that I can understand.
 
how is that news?
 
8:52 PM
FEMINISTS ARE EVIL
LOUNGE SAYS FEMINISTS ARE EVIL
 
and you swallow it up because it confirms your sexist-as-fuck views. How is that news?
 
feminism argument
 
lol
 
lol
 
recipe: in a lounge, mix jalf and vaclav
 
8:53 PM
lol
 
obvious troll
 
@VáclavZeman Hey, I've got a link too. Here's what actually happened on social media: storify.com/cantfakethefunk/…
 
@VáclavZeman that won't change a thing
 
careful, the reaction is violent
 
being a feminist is convenient for some females
 
8:54 PM
@jalf hey, you called that women "nut", apologize, quick!
 
The only people to talk about "bullying" or "mobs" are people with a quite clear agenda to make feminism look bad. It doesn't seem to be what actually happened
 
wat
 
@Jefffrey "twat", ftfy
 
thanks
 
I just want space boats.
 
8:55 PM
It's clearly unbiased as fuck
 
np
@jalf wow I like those guys
or should I say "xirs"?
 
I don't give a fuck about who they are.
Their points are good.
 
They also have a grudge against obamacare, because god forbid people can afford health care
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes :)
 
@Jefffrey Their points being what, exactly?
 
8:56 PM
And I've seen this shitstorm with my own eyes.
So I know it's true.
 
@Jefffrey Have you? Can you show me?
 
Register to Twitter.
 
@Jefffrey didn't meet jalf in person
 
user1804599
Ugh, shit.
 
user1804599
I don't want a capacity of 1.
 
8:57 PM
@jalf I am on your side of the issue but you seem to be building an ad hominem argument.
 
user1804599
I want a capacity of 0.
 
that explains things
 
user1804599
Which is much easier to implement anyway.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes by pointing out the bias of that website, you mean?
 
@jalf Also if the shitstorm didn't happen, then why did the guy apologised?
 
8:57 PM
Not of the article. Yes.
 
@jalf Oh please--there's as yet pretty close to zero evidence that Obamacare has reduced health care costs for anybody (and quite a bit that's it's increased health care costs for most).
 
Or are you claiming that video is fake?
 
@Jefffrey are you saying that people only ever apologize when forced to by a raging mob?
 
FWIW I haven't read it.
 
have you seen the video?
 
8:58 PM
Is it inconceivable that he'd just apologize because he was able to understand why his shirt sent the wrong message, a message that he didn't actually want to send?
 
@Jefff have you considered that he realised his mistake, whatever that was?
 
@Jefffrey yes?
 
this shirt was also a gift from a female friend
 
lol
 
@jalf: I just agree with the article, not the whole site. Cheers.
 
8:59 PM
@Bartek women are not exempt.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't see how that's relevant
 
no seriously just having this discussion is retarded IMHO
 
@VáclavZeman I know you do
 
Yes, he seems like the kind of guy that goes on nation television to "make sure everybody knows he realized his mistake".
 
But I still haven't seen any shitstorms. Only MRA nutcases claiming that the criticism was a shitstorm and that he was bullied and harassed by a mob
 
8:59 PM
"objectification". fuck me, overreacting to bullshit like that is the whole cause for hate against feminism
 
Hint: public apologizes are almost always forced
 
He was on national television making the mistake.
 

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