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11:03 PM
Whoa, that's a beefy computer even now! Anybody else have 96GB RAM?
 
That was 6 years ago. I have 48 GB in my laptop now.
 
<- still using 8GB
 
@Puppy Your stuff is already in a box waiting for you to pick up tomorrow... :)
 
lol
 
11:06 PM
Fun site there
 
I've got 32GB in my desktop
 
My first "serious" machine was a dual-socket Core 2 box with 64GB. That was back in 2009. Expensive as hell and has very slow memory. But totally worth it since getting my code to scale on that thing meant it would scale on almost all machines for the next 5 years.
 
tonight I am sad :(
 
Only now am I'm starting to see problems with those original algorithms - albeit at 40+ cores with NUMA.
 
11:08 PM
 
@orlp liek if u cri evrytim
 
@Mysticial At 40+ cores, top kek
 
@Mysticial That's a sign of good progress, being able to look back and see how far you've come :) And wow, I've never seen that much computer outside of a case
 
That's why I'm interested in the Knights Landing boxes. They have 256+ vcores, and a NUMA cache. New generation, new set of algorithms.
 
I see two CPUs and a bunch of hard drives, but where's the RAM?
 
11:09 PM
@Puppy Very close the heatsinks.
 
oh wow
that's 96GB?
I expected like 16 DIMMs or something
 
I'm not sure that's the same box as the one from 6 years ago.
That one might be 8 x 16 GB = 128GB.
 
I can only see four DIMMs
4 32GB DIMMs?
 
@Puppy There's 2 on each side of each socket. So 8 total. But the heatsinks are huge. So it's hard to see the ones that are not at the bottom.
 
oh I just can't see the other half
ok
 
11:11 PM
4 in between the heatsinks, but you can't see it because of that fan.
 
ah yeah I found a tiny hint of one
what's the star for?
 
nwp
@Puppy penis?
 
I'm trying to insert a penis, but it's just not working.
6
 
You need to insert new ones every 5 years or so
 
anyway it's my bedtime
you go insert penises into yourself if you please
 
11:20 PM
@Aaron3468 I didn't realize it at the time, but the fact that I had 8 cores on VERY slow memory turned out to be a blessing in disguise in the long run.
 
How so?
 
@Mysticial All the memory problems popped up more?
 
That machine had one of the worst CPU-speed to memory-speed ratios. It made me completely design everything to be memory-oriented in a way that assumed all memory access was bad.
Memory got a lot faster with Nehalem, but fast forward a few more generations, the problem is coming back. I read about it all the time from people's who stuff stopped scaling after a few cores. And yet my shit had no problems going 32+.
 
So it prepared you for nowadays
 
yeah
The situation now with 40+ core machines is worse than it was back in 2009. The jump to NUMA-aware programming will be as difficult as the jump from single-core to multi-core.
 
11:23 PM
Nice! SSDs are definitely helping, but they don't have the memory density now to solve the problem
 
The disk I/O thing is a different problem which used to be solvable by throwing infinite hardware at the problem. (as you can see in those pictures)
 
> Now a system can starve several processors at the same time[!] - great quote from the wikipedia article about multi-core computers.
 
That doesn't quite work as well nowadays.
 
11:36 PM
It must be a bit odd to think that y-cruncher has a life of its own now in the record-setting community
 
@Mysticial Just curious, how do you "diagnose" being memory bound?
 
Quick question, do values in an enum in C++ have an integer value assigned to them based on their index?
I noticed a pattern when looking at some source code for a networking library called RakNet, which didn't list it's packet ID's
Yet every ID correlated with their index in the enum
 
The first one starts at 0 (and it increases by 1) yes
 
@Borgleader Intuition combined with scalability.
Basically, I run 1 thread and see how long it takes.
Then I increase the thread count and watch the run-times.
I use Task Manager to make sure they are actually using CPU.
 
@Mysticial They are use. It is known.
 
11:45 PM
enum Suits { HEARTS, DIAMONDS, CLUBS, SPADES } HEARTS is 0, DIAMONDS is 1, CLUBS is 2, and SPADES is 3
 
@Darkrifts not necessarily
 
in that example, yes
 
no
only if you do this
enum Suits { HEARTS = 0, DIAMONDS, CLUBS, SPADES };
 
Since there are no locks anything short of perfect speedup was automatically caused by something to do with memory.
Back then there was no turbo boost or HT. So it was a lot simpler.
 
The default is that the first one starts at 0
So yes, it is in that example
 
11:46 PM
@Darkrifts on your compiler maybe
 
Xeo
@orlp Isn't that dictated by the standard?
ISTR something about that
 
^
0 indexing is the norm in c++ (And the C style languages in general)
 
I remember that something about it was undefined
 
Nope
 
Xeo
> If the first enumerator has no initializer, the value of the corresponding constant is zero.
[dcl.enum]
 
11:48 PM
So, I was right
 
I misremembered
 
Xeo
first enumerator not being forced 0 (without initialiser) would make a whole lot of code rely on certain compiler behaviour
 
there was something similar though... see if I can remember
 
sounds like something the c++ standard would be able to do
 
@Borgleader Oh and also, absolutely nothing would scale on that box. It literally took an infinite loop to not be memory bound.
 
11:50 PM
@orlp it's easier to enumerate things that the standard says are defined, by a long shot
so I'm not really surprised you remember something about something being undefined
 
You can accidentally put in 1 wrong digit and get undefined behavior in c++ :P
Pretty fun times
Much harder to accidentally destroy the runtime in c# (or on purpose ;()
 
@Borgleader Thanks :) (Sorry it took so long to respond, I'm gonna make a tool which prints out all the ID's now)
 
My attempt at causing undefined behavior in C#
 
If you want to almost reliably crash your application just dereference a null pointer
 
I want to only sometimes crash :P
 
11:57 PM
@Darkrifts You suck at crashing programs.
 
@Darkrifts Then randomly dereference a null pointer
 
lol
Should move it to C++ for that
:P
"38406017 \  | 37985765 \  | 37985764 \ Ḁ" - Undef window in my app
 

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