« first day (1771 days earlier)      last day (3183 days later) » 

12:00 AM
yup
 
Nice, someone's alive. I've been looking for a more dynamic programming community these past few days. Didn't expect to find it here.
 
is b = ++a UB?
 
Why would that be UB?
 
@Rapptz It depends on the scheduler, you ain't running an RTOS
 
@RadAway because a can get assigned to b before or after it is incremented
if a == 5 then b == 5 or b == 6
 
12:04 AM
If the ++ is in front, it is first incremented, then assigned.
 
@Rapptz That's terrible. Today's OS should give you sub-100 microsecond precision.
 
something tells me rapptz ain't 100% precise there
 
sorta
the 42 55 is true
minute not really
might as well though
WebSockets are fun.
 
@RadAway yes but = isn't a sequence point.
 
Indeed, they are. Full duplex communication is always fun.
 
12:06 AM
okay, to make it more clearer: is b = a++ UB?
 
No.
Wait, why am I the only one commenting on this. And took a bathroom break before responding? Is this the new guy trolling?
 
@RadAway Read up on sequence-before and sequence-after points fool
 
Sequence points are gone.
Well, terminology has changed in C++11 spec.
> This answer is for the older versions of the C++ standard. The C++11 and C++14 versions of the standard do not formally contain 'sequence points'; operations are 'sequenced before' or 'unsequenced' or 'indeterminately sequenced' instead.
 
@StackedCrooked thanks for the heads up
 
No problem, fool.
 
12:12 AM
 
Besides, a lot of things would randomly implode if that were the case. Anywho, what's up with them stars on the side. Words of wisedom?
wisdom, dafuq
 
is rightfold UB?
 
I would 'askell on SO.
 
@Rapptz Too bad FF sucks at em.
 
iunno how they suck at it
you mean debugging them?
cause I'm doing it in code
 
12:21 AM
@RadAway If you say something interesting/funny/stupid, you get starred.
 
Larynx, I'm curious, why did you think the pre-post increment followed by assignment of two different variables would be UB? In no case is it contentious, there is no ambiguity, it is rather easy to settle on what happens first in such a situation, unlike with something like b = b++.
Given that I've been declared a fool in my first 10 minutes here, I predict a glorious future of me adorning the wall of stars.
 
@Rapptz Won't let me view the data stream through its network thing.
Chrome does though.
But FF <3
 
oh yeah you're referring to the debugging
I thought that was lame too.
 
Firefox has some nice tools.
 
But I just echo through the python code
 
12:23 AM
Crafting requests and sending them is great.
 
@RadAway Don't worry, it was only Don who said that, not someone like me, who's a member of the super-very-high council.
 
Wellp, Nvidia still hasn't implemented support for Metal on OS X El Capitan, and we're already on Beta 7.
 
EL CAPITAN
 
@Rapptz I've never done Python before. Is it easy to do this?
 
I am not exactly sure whether they will at all... AMD has taken over the integrated GPU duties and Nvidia has been focusing a lot on working on the DX12 drivers.
 
user2628526
12:25 AM
@RadAway That's sequenced....so failier
 
@Nooble There are a lot of websocket libraries.
 
Indeed it is.
 
I'm using ws4py atm but it's kinda mediocre but I'll put up with it.
 
@RadAway OSX :P
 
user2628526
@RadAway Then it isn't UB
 
12:25 AM
The ones for Python 3.3+ are better.
 
Who said it is?
I am speaking of first-sight confusion, not making a statement.
 
user2628526
@RadAway " there is no ambiguity, it is rather easy to settle on what happens first in such a situation, unlike with something like b = b++."
 
user2628526
"unlike"
 
Well, that would be confusing to someone at first sight, which is why I am asking Don why he thought it was an issue. I can see him being confused by the latter, but not the former.
Anyways, doesn't matter. =)
 
user2628526
moving on nao
 
12:28 AM
Also, with the C99 spec, I think the latter was UB (and perhaps still is, I don't really deal with the North Korea language).
So, how's everyone doin' today? :P
 
@RadAway Feeling screwed by OpenGL.
Thanks C.
 
Forget OpenGL, wait for Vulkan
Or you know, use DirectX 12.
 
@RadAway Why on earth.
 
Because it is amazing.
 
I don't want to be screwed by Microsoft either.
Anything that is proprietary, at least in my mind, sucks.
And Vulkan is still a C API.
 
12:31 AM
Yup, but it introduces a lot more control to the developer, all of the responsibilites and power is now in your hands. Bindless model, no hazard tracking, concurrency unleashed... All the good stuff.
Just like DirectX 12. I think AMD also lend a hand after all their work with Mantle, which was pretty much killed by DirectX 12.
And OpenGL's "open nature" is greatly exaggarated.
 
@RadAway Yeah I know. Still no drivers though.
@RadAway Not really.
 
Really.
 
How so?
 
The only great thing about OpenGL is being cross platform. Aka for it's the only way to do graphics in mobile platforms.
 
Yup. And it's design is so 1990s.
its*
 
12:33 AM
Up arrow to edit.
And that's something DX12 doesn't have.
 
yay i flashed a rom on my android device
 
Windows is the only true gaming platform.
Anyone who tells you anything else is dreaming.
 
~~true platform~~
 
man lollipop is already annoying me
I didnt know you could make flat icons even worse
 
The best way to utilize any platform is to use its APIs. Windows, DirectX. Apple, now Metal. Linux, Vulkan. Only the fellows designing the system can utilize it to the brink, and let you utilize it to the brink.
 
12:35 AM
TBH I see Steam OS as the biggest threat to Windows on gaming now.
 
my data indicator icon is a fucking triangle
 
gamedev alert
 
@RadAway This won't be the case for long, also mobile.
 
DirectX12 is hitting mobile.
Metal is already mobile.
 
If you're using Vulkan there's no reason to not use it wherever it's supported
 
12:36 AM
^
 
Yup, if you're using it.
 
As is pretty much the case with OpenGL.
 
given that powervr has already implemented both vulkan and metal im hoping that apple will add vulkan to iOS when the time comes
 
If you're not using it then you're doing it wrong which is not surprising in gamedev world at all
 
OpenGL is dead.
 
12:36 AM
Yeah no
 
GL and GLES are pretty much the same API now, too.
@RadAway Nope.
 
It will drag on for a while, but AMD hasn't touched it for a while.
 
Who cares
 
Nvidia has been a pretty fan of it for a while, but it's going away.
 
WebGL isn't going anywhere
 
12:38 AM
WebAssembly~
 
Anything interesting using WebGL? Genuine question?
 
Who caaaaaares
 
I do?
 
What do you think people who need 3d that aren't writing games use? Do you think people use DirectX for scientific visualization and stuff? lol
 
It's a stupid irrelevant question
 
12:38 AM
OpenCL, CUDA.
 
opengl isnt going anywhere
 
Not right now, no.
 
The technology is not going anywhere regardless of whether you think that there's enough ~~interesting~~ things to make it WORTHY
Not in the next 20 years either
 
I thought OpenCL and CUDA were for doing computing on the GPU, not for drawing
 
Also lol CUDA
Good replacement
 
12:41 AM
OpenGL and OpenCL are used intertwined, it was pretty much the only way to emulate DirectX 11 functionality on OS X as they are still stuck on OpenGL 4.1
and OpenCL 2.0
So you could do some compute on OpenCL and pass the results back, but nothing serious.
 
THERE ARE SO MANY STUPID ICONS ON THIS THING I DONT UNDERSTAND
what the fuck is the circle for
god damn
 
@Prismatic wut
 
lollipop icons
I think its... battery?
 
wattttttttt
 
what was wrong with the old battery icon? it looked like a fucking battery
 
12:42 AM
Wat
 
now its a stupid donut thing
I hate this planet
 
What's wrong with toruses
 
Gotta justify paying designers for full-time
 
@RadAway Irrelevant.
 
Irrelevant that the second major IHV is ignoring it?
 
12:43 AM
What do you mean by AMD is ignoring OpenGL exactly?
that they haven't contributed any extensions recently or something
 
It took them a year to bring to OpenGL 4.3 support
I switched to Nvidia shortly after
GTX 980 all the way, for now.
 
@RadAway There's no significant demand, I think.
 
@RadAway Absolutely horrible for compute.
And also horrible for Vulkan IIRC.
 
lol no
Vulkan isn't even a thing yet.
 
What are you talking about, the GPU rocks. Under DirectX 12 it flies.
 
12:45 AM
@MarkGarcia I remember something being posted here about 70% performance gains with AMD.
 
Ignore the Ars technica article, Dan Baker and the squad messed something up with the engine, the whole article was skewed.
 
@RadAway ehhh, DX12 mostly helps your CPU by reducing driver overhead...
 
@RadAway How is this going to make OpenGL disappear?
 
Not really, no. It does a lot more. It removes hazard tracking, resource renaming is in your hands, opts for the bindless model and all in all removes the terrible concurrency issues of DirectX 12. Scales really well to multiple cores and let's the GPU do its thing.
I've been working with it for a year now.
I was and still am in the Early Access program, Microsoft's initative.
 
@Nooble Because Vulkan almost== Mantle
 
12:48 AM
AMD has basically given Mantle to be the basis of lessons learned for Vulkan
 
@MarkGarcia itll be a thing by years end
 
It would be nice if there was thorough vulkan support, and then opengl could just be implemented directly on top
And you could just download OpenGL versions with a dll and itd all be magic
though I'm guessing vulkan itself will have revisions then and its the same problem
 
Vulkan and OpenGL, as well as DirectX 12 and DirectX n < 12 will persist together. But Vulkan and DirectX 12 will dominate. Along with Apple doing its own thing with Metal. DirectX 12 isn't meant to replace 11, even though most think it is.
The jump from 11 to 12 is only for the advanced developers, the amount of work has drastically increased.
 
Mark my words: no one's gonna use metal.
 
Same is probably true for the would be Vulkan and OpenGL
I am using Metal right now
 
12:50 AM
@RadAway Other developers will just use Unity which will do DX12 for them ;)
 
Everyone's gonna use DX12 or Vulkan anyway: middleware.
 
Man, people who don't write their own tech are not game developers for me. Meh.
 
laffo
 
Snob =/
 
I'll never understand people's inclination to create more work for themselves
 
12:51 AM
I don't think Vulkan is going to make OpenGL disappear.
 
When you can do so much more with more work, it's preferable. If you're able to do the work.
 
apple kind of shot vulkan in the face with metal. I don't see why they'd roll out their own variant even though they likely had extensive knowledge of the state of vulkan when they decided to work on metal
 
Nowadays, everyone's a game developer.
 
Gamedev remains to be terrible
 
Jim Sterling will be busy.
Nowadays, everyone's a geek, a nerd, a programmer... In the back when times, I got my ass beat for just looking like one.
 
12:54 AM
Freaking everyone wearing huge glasses.
 
And Linux gaming is slowly becoming a thing.
Which is nice.
 
Is it? I only know of Steam OS trying to make it a thing.
 
time to install google apps! pls work
 
Yes.
 
And judging by Steam hardware surveys, Linux is barely a thing.
 
12:55 AM
Well there are 1000 linux games on steam.
Go back a few years and it was a lot less IIRC
 
I'm shocked that Steam survey would have low representation of Linux users
shocked
 
@Ell no worries.
 
But Linux is a gaming platform, man.
GTA V, now on Ubuntu.
 
No gift was to be expected, I think.
 
Maybe if gamedevs stopped being so terrible at writing code, and realised that being cross-platform is not that hard
 
12:56 AM
Cat, you seem a smart feline, can you recall any AAA developer using OpenGL these days? I remember only John Carmack, he's in the VR camp now.
 
Here's how much I care about AAA
 
What do you play?
 
@RadAway dont get him started
plz
 
Genuine curiosity.
 
Is RadAway a new person?
 
12:57 AM
Not garbage
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think so
 
Yes, Google pointed me to you. God help you.
 
@RadAway We should be saying that.
 
Meh, not gonna bother. I'm busy.
Stay safe, folks.
 
Fly safe!
 
12:58 AM
night
 
Good night.
 
why does i = ++i still invoke UB...i am so confused
surely since = is RTL then ++i gets invoked first, so it's really i = i + 1
@unordered_meow
 
@RadAway you were close to the rep limit for talking here
so i gave you an upboat
 
1:20 AM
@Borgleader Uhh.
I'm close too!
Relatively.
 
hello, fellow meatbags
 
@jaggedSpire Hi.
 
@Nooble how fares the koala crime empire today?
 
@jaggedSpire Very well. We've trapped several kangaroos.
 
@chmod711telkitty Oh my. The victim's friend was the rapist's son.
Can you imagine.
"I fucked your mom lol".
 
what's worse - & your mom is jailed for it
 
Can't help but think that 15 year old was also responsible for this.
I mean, come on. He's capable of rational thought.
 
not by legal standard
 
Hard to say, she spent a few weeks courting him...
 
1:41 AM
I am sure the sex was consensual in the normal sense, but in legal terms it is not because he was a minor.
 
struct Test
{
    union { std::string str_; };
};
^ TIL this is valid
 
@StackedCrooked Why would it not be valid?
 
Because std::string is not a trivial type.
The union is basically like uninitialized std::aligned_storage for a certain type.
 
user406009
So @Nooble, you haven't told us too much about your future policies for your Nooble2016 for room owner campaign.
What's your stance on foregin room policy? What should be done about the JavaScript immigrants such as rlemon? What have you decided to do about the star economy? Some people think the top %1 control too many of the stars.
 
@StackedCrooked Ohhh right
 
1:47 AM
> Back up your device's apps, app data, settings and Wi-Fi passwords using your Google Account
seems like a good idea
 
> main.cpp:5:8: note: 'Test::~Test()' is implicitly deleted because the default definition would be ill-formed:
struct Test
 
Ah. Crap.
Found it here.
In Folly's Optional<T> implementation.
 
wtf is Folly
 
@Lalaland Let me type up a brief summary, give me a few minutes.
 
user406009
1:52 AM
Their futures are quite good.
 
user406009
10/10 would use again.
 
did you use it?
 
@StackedCrooked What are the advantages to using it?
since it seems to be partially broken :P
 
@Lalaland Should I buy FB stocks then?
 
@Borgleader It's like a bag full of interesting ideas. Cherry picking and stealing is in order.
@MarkGarcia You should definitely .get them.
 
1:54 AM
@Borgleader use a fucking dictionary
 
user406009
@MarkGarcia Only if you like to play the lottery.
 
user406009
Facebook actually does top notch open source work.
 
user406009
React, folly, Flow, Thrift, etc.
 
Wow, so many new peoples.
 
2:07 AM
google play doesn't let you search for free apps
I swear it had this functionality before
 
never did
I remember complaining about this like 2 years ago
 
@RadAway Wait til the Euros come.
 
I am a Euro. Hah.
 
you can on play.google.com though
 
Google trying to sell shit to people.
 
2:13 AM
I thought that the new lollipop had a dark theme
this is so... white
 
You got a problem with whites?
 
I dont have that option :/
 
The white version looks better, tbh.
Visual Studio dark style is the way you do dark.
 
@Prismatic Are you a South East Asian?
 
But that may be because the light version + LED displays burns my eyes.
 
2:16 AM
@MarkGarcia I'm one of those kinds of asians :p
 
Said that for the flags.
 
I wouldn't mind a white background when ambient colors are bright
 
As expected, Apple broke all the Metal sample code on El Capitan.
Except the latest one that is for both OS X 10.11 and iOS friendly. Hardcore deprecation.
Also, shit code practices find their way into those samples. Wow.
In other news, I AM KILLING IT IN ROCKET LEAGUE.
Apple made some hardcore iMacs back in the day.
 
is that a hackintosh?
 
Yup. Had to rework a few kexts to get it to deal with multiple displays.
But all in all, it's running fine. No Metal support with the Nvidia drivers, tho.
 
2:27 AM
I used to use a mac pro at work that had like 16gb of ram iirc back in 2008
 
Do they have mac laptops with 32gb+ of ram?
 
Yeah, nowadays 32 GB is the norm, use that on my standard desktop. This machine is from 2011, so
I faked the SMBIOS with that in mind.
 
But as a laptop
 
@RadAway thats pretty neat. I've been getting kind of fed up with KDE
is it buggy at all
 
2:28 AM
It's working perfectly, the only issue is the boot up noise because the audio kext cranks the gain back up and then upon init restores it to nominal levels.
Well, that and no Metal support. But Metal works if you have an iPhone 5s+ device, did some tests, it's fun. Very Vulkan/Mantle/DX12-ish.
 
@RadAway Dude.
You have 19 rep and you can still talk.
Coooool.
 
Ah, must be some caching system in place, the various parts of SO update at different frequencies.
Googled it, the flair thingy is updated every 24-36 hours.
I don't think I'll be boosting the rep on SO too far, the questions seem really stupid. Impressed some of you guys had the steel to go through all that and get up to 10k+
Must've been different in the early days, I guess.
 
@Nooble he has 31
 
@Prismatic Not on SO chat on my end.
 
well your end is behind the times, koala
 
2:34 AM
Server and client side caching, takes a bit of time to update.
Necessary on such a huge network, either that or massive server costs to maintain the load.
 
asking good questions gets you rep too
i've amassed pretty much all my rep by being a huge help vampire
 
My first upvote was on the question from a guy who managed to mistake - for =.
 
@Lalaland Fixed the typos. Nooble's 2016 Campaign Speech.
 
Just wanted to get the rep to chat here.
Tried to get involved with multiple IRC communities, pretty much dead. But this seems to be quite alive.
 
It's more alive at around 1700 UTC.
 
2:38 AM
Ah, good. I have social anxiety, this is perfect pretty much.
 
@RadAway Stop having it :P
 
Doesn't work like that. :P
 
social anxiety happens online too?
 
To some, since I limit my outside contact with people, online is the only place it can manifest itself.
But being behind a nickname helps.
 
Evening
@RadAway Stop writing PHP or MySQL
 
2:42 AM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Good evening.
 
I find that it helps with anxiety
 
^
 
I hate PHP. :/
And am not a big fan of MySQL either. :Đ
 
This is Jefffrey, our fellow psychiatrist.
 
whatup @ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ
how goes the plan to erase you identity
 
2:43 AM
Too lazy even for that
 
@RadAway Weird D.
 
@Nooble Weird Smiley.
One eyed smiley
.P
 
i am now running lollipop
 
Just installed iOS 9 Beta 3
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ ,)
 
2:45 AM
@Prismatic Is that a disease?
 
Some improvement with Metal, cut down on the time between frames.
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ yes
 
This still manages to entertain me.
 
@RadAway you writing some kinda game or sth
 
Just watched Kung Fury, didn't find it amusing at all.
 
2:46 AM
 
Rendering tech, mostly, realtime diffuse + glossy global illumination is my field of interest mostly.
 
USA USA USA
 
Wondering if I can get limited diffuse GI on the iPhone 6
and by extension the 6s in a month or two.
 
@ʞɔᴉN :(
 
is it bad that I started searching "nooble" when I was trying to launch mumble?
 
2:48 AM
Mumble?
Some kind of VoIP software?
TeamSpeak?
 
yeah we have a mumble server
 
Anyone using it?
At this hour, I mean.
 
not right now haha
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ It had a couple of moments I thought were funny
 
I love how every OS I use manages to identify two identical displays as different models.
 
2:51 AM
but it got very tryhard very quickly
 
Anybody has one of these?
Thinking about getting one.
Worried that the DPI shift between HD and UHD displays of same dimensions might fuck with my eyes, will have to replace all three. Still cheaper than the 32" one.
 
damn, that's a nice monitor
I have two 24 inch ultrasharps but they're the U2415 model so 1920x1200
 
Yeah, Dell makes awesome displays. Elegant, too. But most important, can be tilted into portrait mode.
 
right?
 
The Surface Pro 3 display spoiled me quite a bit. Especially with the crisp text rendering, hard to go back to a lower DPI display.
 
2:59 AM
IPS and ability to rotate 90 degrees were my only requirements when I was searching for monitors; was surprisingly hard to find
 

« first day (1771 days earlier)      last day (3183 days later) »