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user3010322
6:02 PM
I wonder if you can have Async properties in C#.
 
@ThePhD it can just return Task<X>
 
If you want a wiki account then you have to ping me in the chat this is not optional don't just send the form
Loungers and following instructions
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus Plinkiy Plingity pling?
 
@CatPlusPlus thank you
 
@ThePhD Pling what
 
user3010322
6:04 PM
@CatPlusPlus To, uh, get a wiki account. Unless this is just for new people, not old ones?
 
Send the form, ping me in the chat
 
Why would I want a wiki account?
 
Cool Special:ActiveUsers doesn't even work
I hate MediaWiki
 
welp it's 22:08 time to go home
 
do you guys prefer C or C++-style file I/O
 
6:09 PM
Python
 
Python or C#, perhaps
 
Ell
c++ over c
 
<< for IO is awful
 
Ell
but c++ is a whole mixing bowl of concerns
 
hmmm
 
6:17 PM
@nightcracker The type safety and extensibility of iostreams trumps any concerns over syntax (which I'll admit is well short of ideal). The real ugliness of iostreams is the inconsistency of some flags being persistent and others not (and no apparent logic to which flags work which way).
 
do I need to support adding imports to random modules/scopes or just global?
 
@Puppy I would say only global.
 
Ell
$1000 headphones? I didn't know audiophiles were that stupid :P youtube.com/watch?v=8khvLYW_fnM
 
Now you know
 
Guys.
I forgot something.
 
6:24 PM
:frogsiren:
This is the end of the world as we know it
 
user3010322
@JerryCoffin Is there another syntax that you'd prefer, if it were equally extensible and type-safe?
 
Also I still haven't fixed my ZSH bindings
 
@Ell people pay way more than that for fucking WATCHES all the time
 
@ThePhD Get the formatting out of I/O layer
 
Ell
@nightcracker At least the watches are made of precious metals
And the price is part of the statement
 
6:26 PM
Modelling initial prompts in a MUD as a special room y/n
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus I'd like to do that a lot too.
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus y
 
@CatPlusPlus What.
 
@Ell what statement?
 
@Ell Why can't that be true for headphones?
 
6:27 PM
But maybe the mob object should process commands idk
That makes more sense
 
SHIT
FUCK
DAMMIT
CUNT\
 
Important thing eh?
 
No.
Fuck.
Dropped my electronics components box.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Little problemette?
 
Now there's a sea of resistors and stuff on the floor and just FYI don't step on that shit. It fucking hurts.
 
6:29 PM
Computers make your life miserable even in rawest states
 
You'll pick the mall up eventually, (except the one with the sharpest, longest pins, which you will tread on).
 
I'm blaming my boss.
 
I have this fetish
I LOVE stepping on lego blocks
 
Put a clean bag into the vacuum cleaner and hope it's strong enough to not break on high velocity impacts with the pins :v
 
@ThePhD I don't mind the << and >>. What bothers me is the replacing something like %-2.2x with `std::left << std::setw(2) << std::setprecision(2) << std::setfill('0') << std::hex << x << std::setfill(' ');.
 
6:30 PM
j/k
 
I sat on an 8086 once, (DIL, 40 pins up). It FUCKING HURT A LOT.
 
It was his idea to try out this homemade Serbian alcoholic thing.
 
:lol:
@MartinJames And you've been kind of slow ever since?
 
user3010322
@JerryCoffin Maybe something like std::format("%-2.2x") << x ?
 
@JerryCoffin Yes- the first is unreadable gunk and the second is somewhat verbose.
 
6:31 PM
@MartinJames Sounds expensive.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hmm. It could be I guess. It's just people reviewing them describe it having superior sound quality and only for real audio producer pros
 
@CatPlusPlus I was certainly no good at sprints, but I could do far jumps.
 
I just bent a couple pins on a shift register.
 
Ell
Whereas all watches tell the time pretty well
 
std::format("{:2.2}", x)
- whatever
 
6:32 PM
@CatPlusPlus Needs positioning.
 
@JerryCoffin I'm working on a C++11 library function to replace that with whatever << op::fmt("{:<02.2x}", x) << whatever.
 
Well, guess it could be optional, but I'd rather not.
 
@Puppy The first also has the advantage that it's pretty easy to change formats because it's all expressed in a string.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not that much - none of the pins bent over much, (luckily, else it would have required surgical extraction and the doctors would have been pissing themselves for a week).
 
The idea of 'formatted read' must die and then IOstreams will be slightly better
 
6:34 PM
@nightcracker Is it basically stateless then? That's the other thing that's really ugly to deal with.
 
@JerryCoffin I think stateful formatting is total cancer
no offense
 
@JerryCoffin It's true that you can interpret the first at runtime if you want.
 
if you need one particular type of formatting a lot of times you make a wrapper function for it
 
In case of i18n you don't have a choice and parsing at compile-time is useless
 
Ell
I don't think formatted read is that much of a terrible idea
 
6:35 PM
@nightcracker None taken, I assure you--rather the contrary, I'm happy to hear it.
 
Ell
actualy
I take that back
 
Neither parsing nor formatting belong inside I/O
 
concur.
 
@JerryCoffin eehm, I don't get it
 
user3010322
Formatted read is the bane of I/O, especially in C++'s interface because it's the default mode.
 
user3010322
6:36 PM
Which leads to all kinds of surprises because you're using the default but it takes on hidden quirks based on system flags and shit.
 
user3010322
If it was more opt-in, you'd see that shit coming.
 
It's another wierd day - I'm agreeing with other Loungers again.
 
Sorry bjarne, but what were you smoking when you looked at scanf and say "that's great, let's make it the default"?
 
But proper clear encoding support? No who needs that
 
Fuck scanf.
 
6:37 PM
@CatPlusPlus we have locales, who doesn't love locales?
 
Xeo
I don't quite get why it's so unpreferrable to read directly into a data-type, instead of going through a string?
 
everyone.
 
@nightcracker :((
 
@nightcracker You mean among the 10 people who know they exist?
4
 
@CatPlusPlus ..and those 10 are trying to forget.
 
6:38 PM
with alcohol for assistance.
 
"Locales - write once, don't even try to debug it."
 
codecvt, not even once
 
user3010322
Haha
 
user3010322
codecvt
 
user3010322
The roundtrips you have to make through that interface
 
user3010322
6:39 PM
Christ.
 
I still have no idea what vt stands for
 
user3010322
Should call it codecrt
 
I had forgot about beer until just.
Now I think I should change my locale.
 
is anyone ever in the mumble?
 
Sometimes
 
6:40 PM
Nope
 
@nightcracker i had evidence of this happening sporadically
 
well I'm alone
so that's a no
 
@CatPlusPlus but... how?! how does it fixup LD_LIBRARY_PATH/ldconfig.d etc. for the particular dependent apps?
 
@sehe It doesn't, it handles it at build time
 
this flag
lol
 
Ell
6:41 PM
I think source/filter/sink is the best way
 
@nightcracker Stateful formatting is ugly to deal with, so I'm happy to hear that what you're working on is stateless.
 
@nightcracker ?! anecdotal¹²³
@nightcracker i missed it
 
@JerryCoffin oh my bad
 
user3010322
What I would like is Stateful when I want it, stateless when I don't.
 
@CatPlusPlus hmmm. Ah, so it can only handle "predefined" slots - so "n" blessed packaged versions to cater for "m" (m>=n) dependent packages?
 
user3010322
6:43 PM
E.g. if they made a stream_settings object where I set all my crap,
 
I admit, it's an improvement.
 
@JerryCoffin I read "Is it basically stateless then? That's the other thing that's really ugly to deal with." as "I find stateless things really ugly to deal with"
 
user3010322
and then I applied that on a per-write/read basis,
 
Slots are defined by slotted packages
 
user3010322
and then there was another class that took a settings and a stream and just held the two together for as long as I wanted,
 
6:43 PM
I guess I never got the nack of slots - though they might not have been fully developed by ~2004
 
user3010322
I could have my cake and eat it too.
 
A slotted Boost would have slots for every major version
 
Makes sense
 
@nightcracker Sorry, poorly expressed--I meant state was ugly to deal with.
 
@JerryCoffin I agree fully
 
6:44 PM
Dependent packages would be coerced to pick the right version during configure stage
And that's about it
 
@CatPlusPlus and the rest is -Wl,rpath based? (so that they keep on working at runtime)
 
@sehe what are sluts?
 
If you have versioned .sos then they'll be linked to the right thing and rpathing isn't really necessary (unless it's some really bad library, but at least Boost doesn't have to be)
Packages are built and installed on the target system, so the paths don't change between the stages
 
This Q needs the coup de grace:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/25574265/code-in-c-for-taking-up-the-first-alphabet-from-every-word-like-a-t-machine-shou
 
(Or built on an identical system)
 
6:47 PM
@PolymorphicPotato many many times over on my dual socket AMD k6 board! I was so ahead of the times. And I couldn't hear a jet plane flying overhead. O, how times have changed!
 
@MartinJames how dare you
just look at him:
 
@nightcracker look around
 
@MartinJames done
 
@nightcracker I'm pretty sure even the people who designed locales never loved them. Locale support in C got hacked in at the last minute when they had the ANSI C standard mostly done, and then had the bright idea that it could be an ISO standard, but the Japanese (I remember it as Japanese, anyway) said they'd vote against it unless it had some sort of locale support, so they hurriedly put together what they thought might solve a problem they didn't understand.
 
6:47 PM
@nightcracker you can guess all you want :) Yesterday I was at Blijdorp Zoomeravond. And I went by bicycle
 
@sehe :) I could not be happy while it was still open.
 
@JerryCoffin It's always the Japanese
 
@nightcracker don't let LRIO see that. I bet he will be dead jealous
 
@sehe fuck blijdorp, ik wordt er nooit blij van :(
 
Met dt
Pffft
Jij verdient geen blij dorp
 
6:50 PM
mooi, ik wil het ook niet
 
PEEPS PEEPS
Mechanical keyboard is the bee's knees.
It's actually less loud than my previous "conventional" keyboard. Because that made me always "bottom out" as they say.
So you end up "banging away" instead of just lightly tipping away and enjoying the text appearing quietly on the screen.
That was almost a deception, as I had been worried sick about spending €150+ on a keyboard that I would dislike due to the noise levels
 
@sehe 150?
fucking casual
 
user3010322
Sorry, but some of us are poor. :P
 
Dunno. I don't bottom out.
 
If you say so.
 
I'm waiting for my custom 60% keyboard with custom microcontroller to arrive :D
 
user3010322
60%?
 
Ell
I need to learn to drink shots quickly
 
Xeo
With my current keyboard, the resistance doesn't let you do anything but "bottom-out"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Me neither, as it turns out. That's a surprise and a relief (I know I like to exercise quite some punch when playing the piano. It's a deformation from years of choir accompaniment)
 
Xeo
6:53 PM
needs a full keypress to register
 
Ell
@Xeo I've had that problem before. Never with keyboards though ;)
 
Xeo
Well, maybe not quite
but it's close
 
@ThePhD this is a 60% layout: cdn.overclock.net/5/51/…
 
@Xeo Mechanical? What type?
@nightcracker usually referred to as tenkeyless
 
@nightcracker A brick keyboard. A brickboard
 
user3010322
6:54 PM
@nightcracker So, it's a laptop keyboard that they bill you top dollar for?
 
user3010322
Seems legit.
 
@sehe no
 
Also ew missing keys
 
Like you can afford losing keys on a standard keyboard
 
6:55 PM
Oh you mean it's even smaller. Well, I'm not sure I'd buy that. Tenkeyless: ok, but "mini" (lacking F1-12 e.g.) - no way
 
F1-F12 is simply holding caps lock + 1234567890-=
 
Looks like a brick, useful as a brick
 
or at least the big key that once was caps lock
 
@nightcracker Looks like a normal small-format KB.
 
caps lock+hjkl = arrow keys
 
6:56 PM
YAY MORE MODIFIER SHORTCUTS
 
Xeo
@sehe It's a Logitech G15, dunno specifics
 
I always wanted less keys so I have to press modifiers more often
 
FUCK OFF MOTH!
 
@nightcracker precisely, no way. Good luck doing Ctrl-Alt-Shift-F5
 
user3010322
Uh.
 
6:57 PM
That's a BIG moth. I gotta get it out of here.
 
It must be Emacs' users dream keyboard
 
user3010322
Is there a way to throw if something is null before I use it in the base arguments of a constructor?
 
No distraction from the wonderful, wonderful modifier shortcuts
 
user3010322
(C#)
 
@sehe I don't recall ever having to use ctrl+alt+shift+f5
 
Ell
6:57 PM
@MartinJames I can't stand moths
 
@ThePhD Whatever(T x) : base(Shit.CheckNull(x))
 
@Ell The little ones are not so bad, but this massive one keeps flitting in front of my display:(
 
@Xeo rubberdome (i.e. your run-of-the-mill 15$ keyboard)
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus Oh. I can make a general ClassExtensions and do that. Sounds like a plan. :D
 
Xeo
@sehe 'cept the G15 wasn't that cheap :D
 
6:59 PM
@nightcracker well, that's just a sample that I use. But all debuggers I know of map F-keys
 
Xeo
Not that I paid for it
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus base(x.EnsureNotNull())
 
user3010322
Or maybe just x.Ensure() ?
 
Just x.E()
 
@Xeo I know. So, it's a 15$ with bells whistles :/
 
user3010322
6:59 PM
Heh.
 
user3010322
x.NullCheck it is.
 
Object extensions are meh
 
Xeo
@sehe The whistles are nice sometimes
 
@ThePhD Whatever(T x) : base(() => { Assert(x != null); return x; }()).
 
user3010322
It'll be an extension on T with a class constraint
 
user3010322
7:00 PM
@PolymorphicPotato Who wants to type that whole thing out 20 times? D:
 
Or Whatever(T x) : base((Assert(x != null); x)) in C# 6.
 
@MartinJames I just went upstairs for the second time. I was determined to kill the either the mosquito or the boy. Luckily for the boy, I spotted the insect this time
 
Not sure if parentheses needed.
 
@ThePhD Same thing really
Anyway
 
@ThePhD Uh, other approaches also have to be typed out 20 times if not put into a function.
 
user3010322
7:01 PM
@CatPlusPlus But I want to also return, like Polymorphic's Lambda does.
 
Xeo
Okay, I really need to eat something.
Time to order.
 
Eat penis.
 
preferably don't
 
@Xeo Something unpizza for a change?
 
Xeo
noodles
 
7:03 PM
Oh Chinese. Now I'm hungry again too.
 
Xeo
not chinese
don't have a good asia restaurant close to me :<
 
> good asia
 
Xeo
Hm, friend of mine is ordering mead.
 
@Xeo I don't have anything close to me. If I want chinese takeout, I have to drive & so that means I have to eat before drinking:(
I could bribe Anne to go get it, but it gets kinda expensive.
 
user3010322
public Meow(Kitty kitty)
            : base(kitty.ThrowNull().MeowProvider)
 
user3010322
7:07 PM
I like it. :D
 
you suck
 
Call that ThrowIfNull.
ThrowNull implies it does and only does throw null;.
 
user3010322
Hokay.
 
uh, so this 4th game jam thing...is the start time decided yet?
 
no.
 
7:24 PM
Wow Defiance saved all the cheap CGI for finale it seems
 
user3010322
....
 
user3010322
So.
 
user3010322
AppBar exists in WIndows 8.1
 
user3010322
But it's not there on Windows 8.1 Phone
 
user3010322
... But they ship you a sample that builds the entire AppBar for you in Windows Phone 8.1, and they encourage you to use it in Windows Phone 8.1...
 
7:27 PM
Hm, is the whole #include <...> vs #include "..." covered by the standard?
 
user3010322
.... GEE I WONDER WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUT IN THE CORE LIBRARY. <_>
 
> Represents the container control that holds app UI components for commanding and experiences.
"commanding and experiences" wut
 
user3010322
Maybe I'll just use the CommandBar for Windows Phone 8.1 instead
 
user3010322
Can't be too different in look and programming, right?
 
but then you can't have experiences! :(
 
Xeo
7:28 PM
@EtiennedeMartel kinda, I think. not much
 
@EtiennedeMartel IB
With "" -> <> fallback if "" doesn't do anything special
 
user3010322
@melak47 Apparently so.
 
user3010322
The Command Bar is just a watered down shitty version of AppBar
 
user3010322
Meant to be used when you don't want TextBlocks, Images, or "need more complex content".
 
what are you doing anyway, building apps :E
 
user3010322
7:32 PM
> Windows 8.1: CommandBar and AppBarButton controls are available only in Windows 8.1 and Windows Phone 8.1. For Windows 8, use AppBar and Button.
 
user3010322
So they only made the fucking distiction in the latest version.
 
user3010322
It didn't occur to them that a Universal app should probably do its best to NOT separate things and keep things as Universal as possible.
 
user3010322
<_>
 
Private members can be seen by everyone. It's like wearing transparent swimming trousers.
 
user3010322
@StackedCrooked PIMPL is the boxers.
 
7:33 PM
@StackedCrooked but at least they're impenetrable!
 
PIMPL is transparent swimming trousers over a non-transparent one :)
 
user3010322
@melak47 I'm trying to subject myself to the greatest amount of pain possible.
 
@melak47 Unless when forced!
 
@ThePhD looks like you're succeeding! :D
 
I wish #define private public worked irl.
 
Ell
7:34 PM
I have just under an hour to get pissed
suggestions?
 
user3010322
If the naughty C comes over and casts you out to sea, your white boxers will also become see-through too.
 
@Ell start drinking?
 
C would be a lower life form like the worm.
@Ell anal absorption
 
Ell
@melak47 That's a start :p
@StackedCrooked I don't have the apparatus :(
 
Xeo
@Ell I will never understand why people will purposely get extremely drunk
 
Ell
7:36 PM
A tube, Vaseline and a funnel namely
@Xeo I do it because I'm not comfortable dancing around people, but I'm going out clubbing tonight for a friends birthday
 
Xeo
Then just... don't dance?
 
Ell
Going to club and not dancing is equally awkward imho
 
IIRC there was Darwin award for somebody who overdosed like that.
 
Ell
I don't want to get extremely drunk anyway, "pissed" was hyperbole :)
 
> When the rest of us have had enough, we either stop drinking or pass out. When Michael had had enough (and subsequently passed out) the alcohol remaining in his rectal cavity continued to be absorbed. The next morning, Michael was dead.
> According to toxicology reports, his blood alcohol level was 0.47%.
 
Ell
7:38 PM
@StackedCrooked you know that doesn't sound as high as it is
 
He had "inserted" 3L of sherry (18-20% alc).
He was truly a man.
RIP
 
Ell
3L? jeeesus :P
 
user3010322
Rot in peace, I suppose.
 
ROT13 in peace.
 
Xeo
... bloody hell, I think I have to murder somebody
 
Ell
7:49 PM
@Xeo why?
 
Xeo
Why, why whyyyyy does every site say they have "macaroni" noodles, and I get delived penne :<
this has to be a conspiracy
 
bin laden
 
Literally Hitler
 
Ell
penne is the straight one isn't it?
 
@Ell hehehehe
 
7:49 PM
Yes.
 
:giggles:
 
So much cheap CGI
 
Can't decide where to apply
Fuck this I'll become a baker
baguette
 
Xeo
become a peking duck
 
user3010322
> <!--The StacklPanel doesn't resize nicely if the window gets narrow, so this way can be problamatic if there are too many pages.-->
 
7:56 PM
Blogue
 
user3010322
So glad you realized this, Windows Team.
 
user3010322
While you're at it, would you mind telling me why you removed every fucking useful panel from the WPF Library while you were writing your shit?
 
@ThePhD I didn't know thecoshman worked for the Windows Team
 
user3010322
@dolan Comments and documentation for samples and projects. :3c
 
user3010322
QA is high.
 

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