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7:00 PM
Why not add a library to deal with that then
 
@RonaldMunodawafa inb4 ICU
ICU is a library
 
Okay
Let me check it out
 
@thecoshman what
 
If IBM uses it then it is good enough for my needs
 
cmon pizza hurry up already
I find this to be a very calming and fitting track to play while working youtube.com/watch?v=7gQivCRYNL8
 
7:05 PM
@RonaldMunodawafa Cool! So you're also switching to EBCDIC?
 
holy crap I inserted a CD in my drive
 
Didn't IBM abandon that years ago?
 
and I started an autorun for a game
and then an installshield wizard
it feels so inappropriate now
 
I think it is lazy of programmers to use InstallShield
 
7:08 PM
why?
 
@RonaldMunodawafa Nope. They still use it, and AFAIK, they don't even have any plan for when they might get rid of it either.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit s/pp/p/ (factorio)
 
> Ubisoft recommends Assassin's Creed: Unity players delete all game contacts pcgamer.com/…
bahahaha
want your game to stop crashing in the menu?
delete all your friends
gg ubisoft
 
@JerryCoffin I will look into it
Why do I feel like I will never know C++ in its entirity including the entire standard library and STL
 
@RonaldMunodawafa IIRC also Bjarne said that
that's encouraging
 
7:12 PM
@thecoshman ic
 
;-(
That is not encouraging
That freaks me out
 
@RonaldMunodawafa "the entire standard library and STL" ??!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
 
@RonaldMunodawafa no
 
7:13 PM
I guessed so
I suppose I am going to sit down with all of Stroustrups books and papers from CFront onwards
And then study the G++ source
I want to stop writing C in C++
 
I wouldn't study the GCC source if you want to learn good C++
And if you want to stop writing C in C++ then reading about CFront isn't going to help you much
 
I want to know the evolution of the language
How we moved from C to the atomic memory model
 
4275
Q: The Definitive C++ Book Guide and List

grepsedawkThis question attempts to collect the few pearls among the dozens of bad C++ books that are published every year. Unlike many other programming languages, which are often picked up on the go from tutorials found on the Internet, few are able to quickly pick up C++ without studying a well-written...

You probably want Accelerated C++ to learn it
given your background
To learn the evolution of the language er I dunno wikipedia? :D
 
How about Design and Evolution by Bjarne Stroustrup?
On Monday I will buy all his books
I will use them as the canonical source
 
If you have that much money to throw away just donate it to me
 
7:19 PM
Someone posted youtube.com/watch?v=7gQivCRYNL8 and it is mesmerising
It is not my money
 
you need some Kalafina on the go
@RonaldMunodawafa still
 
@RonaldMunodawafa not as trance-ish but youtube.com/watch?v=IYCZcTcpxaA
 
How about "Let Us C++"
Someone recommended it to me
 
Xeo
Kalafina's great
 
@RonaldMunodawafa what about no
 
@RonaldMunodawafa (the book list has every book approved by The Lounge, and if it isn't on it, it's either not approved, or none of us had read it)
 
It looks like it has very good ratings
Okay
 
why the matlab examples?
 
Ratings on Amazon are very important
 
user1804599
awwweeesomme
 
7:22 PM
Also lol out of 3
 
"Author uses unconventional language to attract the attention of the reader and help you understand."
 
?
 
I think original authors do a great job
 
7:23 PM
BLIPPITY BLOPPY BOOP
HARK THE INTEGRAL FLOW OF X AS ITS FIVENESS RUNS INTO YOUR FUNCTORAL MASS
might be nice poetry but it doesn't teach you programming nor how to converse with others about programming
besides the author, that is
also not to be racist or anything but... "unconventional language"
> Yashavant P. Kanetkar
probably not deliberate
 
I am now suspicious of this Yashavant Kanetkar and authors only popular in India
 
damn straight
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Ye Olde Hello Mundi ?
 
Is India known to produce code on par with Russia?
2
 
a few weeks ago I encountered a guy with three PhDs and numerous published C++ books, who taught at a higher education establishment..... who could not tell the difference between precedence and evaluation order and was getting an SO question very wrong accordingly. he was an Indian professor.
 
7:26 PM
How did he end up a professor
 
he ended up an Indian professor
 
user1804599
lol
 
wb to me rightfold
 
@RonaldMunodawafa They're competing fiercely, if you know what I mean.
 
Let me see if I can fetch this facebook post by this one author
 
7:27 PM
permission granted
 
There probably is an Indian equivalent of Vlad somewhere.
2
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit my MSc professor wrote a matrix with a small 't' on the top right of it. He was writing quickly and we could barely distinguish the letters so someone asked "what is that on the top of the matrix?" and he answered: "T.. the T letter. Stands for 'time'". We were kinda baffled since we all thought a T would be for 'transposed' but.. whatever..
the day after the professor wrote the same slide on the whiteboard and said "and the matrix of TEMPERATURE T..". We therefore realized he was Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V the slides from another professor with no idea of basic math or what he was talking about.
 
I can't find it
Perhaps it was taken down
 
> Considered to be one of the best-selling programming books ever written
WOW
> A CD-ROM with demos, code, compiler, executables, and MATLAB examples has been added to the book
WOT
> Today s C programmer (still the language of choice in science, engineering, game programming and for handheld devices) has to master the complexities of the language and contend with its usage in environments like Windows, Linux, and for the Internet. Let Us C, Eighth Edition covers these three aspects of C programming...
ERM
 
7:31 PM
@milleniumbug Given the number of people in India, there are probably a number of them.
 
> Let Us C, Eighth Edition
 
all of the reviews talk about C, too
 
Oh hey we're talking about Vlad.
 
C is not as complex as people want to make it seem
It is not complicated either
 
It's slightly less complex than C++
 
7:32 PM
@RonaldMunodawafa It's not complex, it's simply dumb
 
Like Scheme, it is so simple you could teach teach someone C in a day
 
lol no
 
Perhaps simplistic
 
@RonaldMunodawafa You can teach the syntax in a day, yes.
 
Maybe
 
7:33 PM
They will figure out the rest for themselves
 
C declarators are shit
 
@RonaldMunodawafa Sort of in some says, but in other ways completely different. The Russian code I've seen is very "hackerish", so to speak. The Indian code I've seen has been almost slavish in having perfect formatting, careful commenting, etc. The problem was that they clearly hadn't quite gotten around to understanding the problem before writing the code.
 
Also writing correct C is incredibly hard
 
Joel Spolsky remarked in one of his articles that Russian code makes you wonder how they did what they did
 
7:35 PM
I could say that about the US code that I've seen
and the UK code
every country has shite programmers
so Joel is a racist
 
Especially the UK.
 
He is a good guy
 
then again, USAians are typically very unkind about Russian skills
 
His articles are good
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Could well be mere ignorance rather than racism.
 
7:37 PM
some
 
> >=> […] the Kleisli fish
 
@JerryCoffin lol
 
"perfect formatting, careful commenting" (transcript)
woah
find me some of that Indian code
in these parts Indian code is recognisable primarily for having neither of those things
though I have managed to train my Indian colleagues to be about 40% good at it
 
My only encounter with Indian code was when I was in Durban and worked with a couple of guys who had come from India and I assigned them to write a few procedures. I couldn't understand a damn thing and their code never compiled
I learnt with Indians for the whole of last year
 
I communicate with programmers from India at my job too, there are some studios there
it's like fucking oDesk over and over again
 
7:41 PM
I was probably the only non-Indian
 
really the only part of the email thing that I do not like
their skill is oDesk worthy too
I'm being asked questions that I would not expect another programmer to ask me
 
@ScottW spicy hot or attractive hot?
ok
 
Up to this day I wonder why my paper was not marked because I used int main(int argc, char** agrv) as my prototype
My Dad transferred me because of that
 
honestly i'm very proud of teaching my guys why abstraction matters and why clearly delineated responsibility is important in components
 
7:44 PM
is Ronald someone we know?
 
She wanted void main()
 
some of them are in their 40s with decades of soft dev experience
 
perhaps another user'...
wait nvm
 
yeah I got it
 
7:45 PM
And we used to use a DOS simulator
 
Xeo
So, I got tonight and tomorrow until early afternoon to do stuff - suggest things to do!
 
i don't think you did but that's ok
 
@Xeo Factorio
 
@Mysticial I didn't find it very funny. I'd been assured (for about three months) by the "project manager" that they'd produced lots of code, and eventually that they were pretty much done, but there were just one or two bugs... We had a hard deadline, and I ended up re-implementing the whole thing from the ground up in about two weeks (of around 100 hours apiece).
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit actually I didn't
 
who's Ronald?
 
Ronald is Ronald
my point is that he has been here talking to us for a few hours so yes we "know him"
u elitist
 
Xeo
@AlexM. Ronald McDonald.
 
Xeo
@CatPlusPlus I saw that coming.
 
7:46 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit no, aclarke was talking about changing his name today
so I thought he was aclarke
but google's cache seems to disagree with me
 
@AlexM. ic
well, it could be
 
Apparently the reason why used a DOS simulator and Turbo C was because we had to understand the language and reason about why we wrote what we wrote
 
i'm not an ELITIST so I didn't check
@RonaldMunodawafa well that makes no sense at all
 
> elitist
 
We spent a month discussing loops
 
7:47 PM
lol
my pizza's here fuck yes
 
I had been taught PASCAL and C by my Dad so I was confused to what the hell they were talking about
 
@Xeo make a boat
 
Ell
what is the bottleneck in building usually?
 
I asked my "professor" why we had to use books from India and she told me that I was being racist and inconsiderate of how everyone else found it easier to relate to Indian authors
 
@Ell compiling and linking
 
Ell
7:50 PM
@StackedCrooked :3
I asked for that
is the bottleneck usually IO or CPU?
 
I got one for tomorrow too
it was a 1+1 offer
 
@StackedCrooked :)
@Ell CPU at a guess?
 
Is that Debonaires?
 
@AlexM. the one on the left actually looks like pizza, wow
 
@AlexM. Nice. Goats' cheese, presumably
 
7:52 PM
@milleniumbug the one on the right is quattro formaggi, the supreme form of pizza
you pizza nub
 
But remember to count your calories
 
I got the one on the left so that I don't explode due to extreme pleasure caused by the QF
I can't handle two
 
Xeo
@AlexM. You eat too much pizza, guy.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol I did not check
 
@AlexM. well you're still in Romania right
let's face it the whole pizza is just reformed goat
 
7:53 PM
@Xeo one per week
this one was an exception because it was 2 for the price of 1
 
Xeo
@AlexM. sure doesn't seem like it!
 
I'm not lying, I promise
:P
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ground goat shaped like a pizza lol
 
I know this is old but youtube.com/watch?v=5I2JsOAByek I feel good writing with this playing
 
@AlexM. yep
om nom nom
 
@AlexM. just remember to have your raw fruit and veges
 
7:56 PM
@AlexM. hey, what are you gonna do tomorrow? Microwave it?
 
Green smoothies are good for that
 
@milleniumbug microwave it, add tons of ketchup, that's about it /cc @Jefffrey
 
Ketchup has a lot of calories
 

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