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4:00 PM
It's this thing called... what's it called again? Sunner? Slumber? Strummer? Ah, summer!
 
damn earth
learn to rotate at an angle which suits me
also, I failed to specify exception specifications for like, 99999 things in my libraries
 
OMG im loving this new theme for mozilla ;D
 
Heh, someone emailed me a job offer due to SO.
 
@CatPlusPlus Some Valeria something?
 
Yeah.
 
4:05 PM
I got one too.
 
I didn't :(
 
We shall look down upon people who didn't and adopt smugface.
 
@DeadMG You suxors.
@CatPlusPlus (What's the smiley for smugface?)
 
:smug:
 
4:07 PM
TF2 time.
 
@DeadMG Honestly, I don't think you missed much.
 
SA has the best smilies.
 
@CatPlusPlus Was it 420 EUR per day?
 
@sehe $60/hour ~= 380€ per day.
 
@StackedCrooked you mean before or after tax?
 
sbi
4:11 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes What happened to your algorithmic module, robot? $60*8hrs=$480/day.
 
He did currency conversion mid-way.
 
@sbi Hm €?
 
sbi
@CatPlusPlus Oh, yeah. €380. Sorry, I filed to spot that.
 
What happened to your sight?
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes That has been bad since I was about 8 years old.
 
4:12 PM
You failed to type "failed".
I had to write that.
 
sbi
throw exasperation()
 
Failception.
 
I must say I don't like post scriptum in an email.
It looks so silly.
 
Any of you ever use ncurses?
(I'm not going to ask for help. Don't worry.)
 
Curse that thing.
 
4:17 PM
Lol.
I've used PDCurses some.
 
What don't you like about it?
 
It's crappy C API built around global state.
And really, curses CLI interfaces tend to suck.
Hell, any interactive CLI tends to suck.
 
I was just about to say, you really can just cut the "curses" from that sentence
 
Well, it's the terminal. There's no real way to avoid global state.
 
Says you. What if I want to have an application displaying n embedded consoles?
 
4:23 PM
You avoid global state by not having global state.
But even if you disregard that, it's still a crappy C API.
 
@DeadMG because... inflatable swimming pool
 
(Also it has global state not related to the state of terminal.)
@sehe WACKY WAVING INFLATABLE ARM FLAILING TUBE MEN.
 
@CatPlusPlus Really? Like what?
 
(the only global we have is global warning warming)
 
Some window stuff operates on a global state, AFAIR.
 
4:26 PM
I ask because I'm writing an alternative provider for some of its basic functionality, and I need to know what it does wrong.
 
It uses terminal and is in C.
 
Screw iterators. I'm going range-based.
goes back and changes tons of code
Now that we have "match-anything-references" in templates, Boost.Range might actually be edible.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes i love boost range
 
Having to take ranges by reference has always irked me.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes do std::screw_iterators have any implicit conversions with move iterators, const iterators and or reverse rietberger iterators?
@RMartinhoFernandes well, not all ranges need to be by ref? std::iterator_range doesn't necessarily need to be passed by ref? Are you talking about adaptors (like sliced etc.)?
 
4:35 PM
constexpr int strlen_ (char const * const p) {return *p ? 1 + strlen_ (p+1) : 0;}

--------------------

3 int main () { const int len = strlen_ ("hello worldd"); return len; } /* compile time */
3 int main () { return strlen_ ("hello worldd"); } /* runtime */

---------------------------
Any reason for this? g++4.7
 
@sehe But how do you write template functions that work on ranges?
@refp Why do you say the first one is at compile time?
Oh, constexpr. Don't mind me.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes because I disassembled the executable, that's why.. compiled with g++ -Wall -pedantic -std=c++11 -g
 
Yeah, sorry about that.
Sounds like a bug.
It's not mandated, but it's certainly desirable and feasible.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes agreed
 
I don't suppose you can make main() constexpr, can you?
 
4:40 PM
@Maxpm nope
 
ah. by rvalue ref :)
(which is by ref)
 
@sehe btw, do you know of any vim plugins similar to emacs table mode?
 
cut the craps
 
@refp you have optimizations turned off, that's why.
 
4:56 PM
@rubenvb I have optimizations turned off when compiling them both..
 
Is C++ AMP supported on operating systems before Windows 8?
 
@IDWMaster Yes. Like the PPL, it is part of the CRT.
 
@DeadMG Thanks.
 
if you have the necessary hardware, and Vista or later for VS2012, then you are supported
 
damn it, I'm tired off switching between the terminal and this chat.. anyone who got any good thoughts on how to create a secure ircd binding this chat to the IRC protocol?
 
4:58 PM
@IDWMaster Windows 7?
 
the problem is with passing authentication keys back and furth.. (mostly "back" to the ircd itself)
 
sbi
Nope.
 
@sbi as I thought.
 
@rubenvb No, I meant Windows 8.
 
without support for "private messages" there are a few methods of making it kinda secure, though..
since all rooms are publicly available you just need the IRCd to pass the information to all peers connected, then you could have an option of specifying an external host to do the actual posting of messages.. (ie. the ircd is really a distributor who just sends posted messages to everyone, when a user want's to send a message to the ircd it acts as a relay and sends the message itself to another host (which users find secure enough to trust, such as their own computer or similar)
if you get what I'm saying.. my head is filled with fuzzynezz, can't really express myself at this time
ircd -> messages -> IRC client
IRC Client -> message -> ircd -> [trusted host] -> stackoverflow chat "api"
 
5:04 PM
@IDWMaster Is C++ AMP supported on operating systems before Windows 8? - Windows 7 (for example).
 
that way you could only need one ircd to be ran, but a small relay script/application to "redirect" messages back to SO itself
 
@refp and how would replies work?
just a bunch of numbers and a semicolon?
 
Sounds to me like the benefits don't outweigh the costs.
 
IRC is stupid.
 
you know
my library spec is probably so defective, it's not even funny
 
5:10 PM
@rubenvb nhaa, the IRCd will keep track on the numbers and "translate" them to the correct username/stripping them off before sending it to the client
 
@DeadMG that's why you should release alpha versions, break compatibility, release beta version, break more compatibility, then do a rc breaking compatibility and end up with something no one uses because it's incompatible with all the code they wrote testing your library.
 
lol
 
though preferrably there would be an option saying wether all messages should be prefixed with a identification number, that way you could still see which message a reply was actually meant for
 
Or are you really going to fix all those things before writing the library itself?
 
no, I'm going to write a bunch of sample implementation.
 
5:11 PM
@DeadMG I'd say with great confidence that it's far from comprehensive.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes the benefits of being able to use a IRC client is always greater than the "cost" of implementing it
 
then some sample uses
 
IRC proto is crappy and IRC clients are crappy.
 
and simply look up the behaviour of every little thing and check if it's defined
 
@refp Right, that's why you can't even figure out how to do it.
 
5:12 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes There's quite a lot of stuff where I just didn't define it. The C++ Standard probably defines "files" or something like that.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes the only thing I cannot figure out is how to make it as secure as using the web application by itself
 
It'll be silly without a custom client, anyway.
I'm too lazy to type message IDs.
 
plus, I did things like universally forget about exception handling across the board
 
@CatPlusPlus you don't need to type them out, at all
 
How do you reply to an older message in your super-automatic system?
 
5:14 PM
@CatPlusPlus the IRCd could translate usernames into either @username or the last post provided by the user specified
 
Rewriting entire chat with a better web interface is more feasible than doing IRC frontend to this one.
 
@CatPlusPlus You're holding it wrong.
 
@CatPlusPlus by writing the number, but how often do you do that? I know I don't.
 
@refp So, how could I write this message?
 
@CatPlusPlus I don't want a freaking web interface, that's why I'm thinking of doing this in the first place.. I want a IRC-proxy
 
5:14 PM
Rather often.
 
@refp You just did.
 
Well, I don't want an IRC-proxy.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yeah, just because I'm getting used to this freakin' interface
 
And I doubt anyone here does.
Well, except you.
There was one attempt at writing IRC bridge, but it died, because this interface is better than crappy IRC clients.
 
@DeadMG How is the CV writing going?
 
5:15 PM
check out the threads at meta.stackoverflow
 
@ManofOneWay epic fail
 
IRC is not a silver bullet.
 
@DeadMG :( why?
 
In fact, it's outdated and it shows.
 
@CatPlusPlus depends on what kind of person you are, terminal fanboys (such as myself) prefer IRC over.. anything
 
5:16 PM
because I don't really have much to write there :P
 
I don't really care about terminal fanboys.
 
@refp Nobody else is silly enough to join you in that.
 
@refp X fanboys prefer X over anything.
 
I don't like the tendency to webify everything, but it works here.
 
It's not a good thing.
 
5:17 PM
@DeadMG I'm trollin' (a bit, though I still stand my ground.. if I could chat with people in here through IRC I would)
 
IRC doesn't have editing. QED.
2
 
@CatPlusPlus my irssi has editing, or well.. it supports it when people write a message containing of only a regular expression after their own message (in a short period of time)
 
And yes, you can extend it, but then you're writing your own client, but then why use shitty IRC proto, but then lol not IRC anymore.
 
anyhow, editing can also be sorted by not sending a new message but a NOTICE of the changes (or the new message itself)
 
Still needs custom client to present it.
Really, terminal client for this chat would be fineee, but not IRC. Bleh.
 
5:19 PM
well I guess we can agree upon not agreeing, I would prefer a IRCd connected to this chat than using the web interface any day
the only issue with creating a terminal client would be that it still requires me to switch between irssi and this new awesome client
I guess creating an irssi plugin could be the simple approach to solving the issue, instead of creating a entire new client
s,could,would,
 
Also lol writing regexes to edit messages.
 
@CatPlusPlus the IRC way to do it
 
@CatPlusPlus s/re/p/?
 
Never seen anyone bother with something like that.
It's just corrected*.
 
@CatPlusPlus The client can guess!
 
5:23 PM
@CatPlusPlus on IRC?
 
If a message has the form x*, find the closest word in the previous message, and replace it!
 
it's quite a common method to show that you meant to write something else..
especially when dealing with bots (such as geordi in ##c++ eelis.net/geordi), though it has it's own "maybe not so standard" way of changing messages directed to him/her
 
I know, I know, IRC users are used to crappy everything.
This chat is pure gold.
 
I've been using IRC for about 10 years now, call me old fashion but I'll probably use it for many years to come
 
About 5 for me. I don't want to go back.
 
5:26 PM
@CatPlusPlus we are a different breed.
damn it.. I need to get dwm up and running. everytime I look at old screenshots I weep inside because of the way my workspace behaves right now
damn it.. I need to get dwm up and running. everytime I look at old screenshots I weep inside because of the way my workspace behaves right now
 
dwm is the Windows default window manager.
 
or it's suckless dynamic window manager.. depending on who you are talking to
maybe I should make it tonights task to get dwm running on my macbook pro, I miss the old days
 
2
A: How efficient is the assignment operator in c++

myrkos1 is the simplest and fastest, assuming of course there isn't some wacky overloaded operators. 2 just isn't required, and the extra branching will just decrease performance, if anything. 3 is basically both 2 and 1, and thus is way too over-complicated. Also, an interesting fact is that on man...

 
@refp Where in Sweden are you located?
 
Is that last paragraph true?
Sounds like complete bullshit to me.
 
5:32 PM
here goes me building Cyanogenmod ICS
 
@refp Obviously the problem is you're not running Xmonad.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I think @Mysticial could answer that.
 
@CatPlusPlus obviously the problem is that you are not running dwm.
@ManofOneWay Stockholm.
 
@EtiennedeMartel He's probably asleep right now.
 
Why would I run dwm when there's Xmonad.
 
5:33 PM
Wait, maybe not.
Where he is from, actually?
 
He's Californian.
 
@CatPlusPlus why would I read what you are writing when I could just cat /dev/urandom?
 
Should be around 9:30 there.
 
@refp Uppsala here
 
5:33 PM
For some reason I thought he was from the east.
 
I know better.
 
@ManofOneWay cool
 
So no one has the faintest clue?
 
Nope.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes if it's faster to write than read memory? not really, no
 
5:34 PM
I doubt it, though.
 
You're both right. I'm Californian, but I live in the midwest right now.
 
I'm not sure about the precedence
 
@Mysticial So... answer?
:)
@ManofOneWay What precedence?
 
hmmm
 
In a = a != b ? b : a;
 
5:36 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes Yeah, that's bullshit...
 
@ManofOneWay Assignment is very low.
 
difficult to specify exception specs for objects which can have new functions which might throw arbitrarily added at run-time
 
@ManofOneWay Only comma has lower precendence.
 
so it's basically a = (a != b) ? b : a;
 
Yeah.
IOW, it works.
@Mysticial Ok, thanks.
 
sbi
5:37 PM
So we got used to all the hominids being intelligent enough to cheat each other and we also happily accepted dolphins being intelligent enough to do this. Only a tiny bit miffed, but still in relatively good spirit, we got used to the idea that ravens are cheating smartasses as well. But now coleoids (octopuses and sepia) — a subclass of the cephalopods dating back to the carbon, and thus ~20 times as old as us hominids! — are found to be very clever little cheaters, too.
So much for us being the crown of evolution.
 
Ah missed the last part Also, an interesting fact is that on many systems (including x86), reading from memory is slower than writing to it. Thus, checking the value before assignment is way unnecessary.
of course that's bullshit
 
They're two different thing anyways. You can't really say which is faster or slower. Especially with out-of-order execution.
 
anyone who can get inside their RAM-slot and measure the time?
 
sbi
@refp Only our insect is small enough to fit into a RAM slot.
 
I feel as if a very inappropriate joke is coming up, which is why I'll resort to having a smoke on the roof instead..
 
5:41 PM
@ManofOneWay Micro even if it is true, surely?
 
Writing to memory should limit the possibilities of out of order execution since you have to be cautious when to write?
 
you know
 
"reading from memory is slower than writing to it." - That is complete FUD. What if you had two threads sharing the same cacheline? Would reading from it be slower than writing to it? — Mysticial 18 secs ago
 
It's not entirely false
It depends on how the RAM module is implemented, though
On the CPU level it should make no difference
 
sbi
Can we please have "Silly Benchmark!!!" (complete with at least three exclamations marks!) as a close reason?! — sbi 22 secs ago
 
5:51 PM
Another thing is that it's impossible to measure how long a write takes without eventually reading from it.
 
My android story is going to be cut short.
 
@sbi We got guns. They don't.
 
@rubenvb What went wrong?
 
There are these things called "streaming writes" that if immediately read from, will take 200+ cycles to read because it skips the cache.
 
@Cicada I can't get the necessary ICS stuff from the dev who's building it already.
 
sbi
5:52 PM
@EtiennedeMartel So far.
 
His source repos are missing stuffs
or I am not finding the references to the missing stuffs
 
Silly PHP flag.
 
What a bunch of prudes.
 
Obviously the first is fastest: it's only 6 keystrokes, and I don't even need to reach for the "shift" key. — Mike Seymour 6 mins ago
 
Funny thing is, I once built the kernel before. For linux itself, cause I needed a builtin module as a loadable module. Android fucks everything up.
I feel like spewing cusses in here for about 5 minutes straight.
 
5:59 PM
wow, 5 upvotes already on that comment. lol
 

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