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9:00 PM
GDI is Window's graphics layer or something...
 
sbi
2 hours ago, by sbi
@Xeo I just don't want the room to go quiet because you lured everyone to The Site That Must Not Be Linked.
 
At some point in Windows history, GDI objects resided in both userspace and kernelspace (or so I'm led to believe)
So if one application chewed up all the GDI handles every other application would suffer
 
Tropers are people too.
 
Handles are stupid.
 
Windows is stupid
 
9:02 PM
Your mother is stupid.
 
sbi
> The Windows SDK no longer ships with a complete command-line build environment. The Windows SDK now requires a compiler and build environment to be installed separately. — The Windows SDK for Win8 will not include a compiler toolchain at all. That's a first.
 
wat
 
sbi
If true, this is the kind of developer hostile thing that, if I still worked at MS, would inspire me to quit. http://buff.ly/KeeLIF
 
@sbi I'm confused as to what the "build environment" entails.
 
@sbi what the actual point
 
@sbi are the windows headers compilable by any other compiler?
 
This is wrong on so many levels
 
Apple charge to allow people to develop on Mac OS X now... Xcode is $5 or something
 
sbi
@dreamlax VS Pro is a probably hundred times that much.
 
@sbi: I think you'd probably get a bit more bang for your buck though
 
9:07 PM
@dreamlax Xcode is free.
 
@sbi Express?
 
It was $5 about half a year ago due to legal issues, but they fixed it.
 
sbi
@DeadMG Can only target Azure, Phone, and Metro now. No desktop apps anymore.
 
what the fuckles
 
@sbi say what now?
 
9:08 PM
@RadekdaknokSlupik oh, I stopped developing on Mac OS X about half a year ago
 
actually no more like a year ago
 
sbi
@MooingDuck Just follow the link from the tweet I posted above.
 
@sbi so basically they discourage people to invent new cool apps and make them sad?
How stupid.
 
9:09 PM
They can't be serious
 
@StackedCrooked I have something similar.
 
$1199.00 for individual license?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Narcolepsia?
 
@StackedCrooked I saw the word "template" in that code and I hit ⌘W immediately.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik template
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes In fact, I put a function with the very same name into our project'#s toolbox. It's C#, though. :-/
 
I'm not sure if MS still do this, but if you were a startup company you could register for a BizSpark MSDN subscription and get 10 keys for almost any Microsoft product, OS, Office, Dev, etc.
The stipulation was that your company must not make more than $1,000,000 in revenue per year
 
Microsoft is too money-oriented.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Man you always manage to freak me out with this explosion of funny new features :)
@RMartinhoFernandes But that's because I'm currently still unfamiliar with usage of && outside of move constructor and std::forward and stuff..
 
Oh yeah right I was writing an app.
 
9:12 PM
Oh, it's still a real thing: microsoft.com/bizspark/About/Default.aspx
 
I can get all those for free without a subscription.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik Including the technical incidents and a concierge?
 
Do people really still put numerals after written numbers?
 
AFAIK, you can't download people yet.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I don't need those.
 
9:14 PM
Oh well. Let that w8 thing fail already. I can't wait for w9. I guess.
 
I would do it incorrectly just to mess with people

Three (2) technical support incidents
Five (1) E-learning collection
 
Xeo
@Xeo: I am overloading the bitwise operators for a set of scoped enumeration types. — James McNellis 6 mins ago
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik You said you could get them for free, not that you'd use them.
 
Xeo
@RMartinhoFernandes, time to take out your operators :P
 
@ScottW Sjaak with internet. :P
 
9:15 PM
wonder if I can point MSVC10 use the MSVC11 compiler and still debug.
 
Or wait was it @sehe who was on het Gertrudis?
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik You write some ridiculously good c++ :-)
 
@ScarletAmaranth libcupcake? It's a piece of shit.
Only the documentation is semi-decent.
@ScottW leuk.
 
@EtiennedeMartel I fully agree- Supreme Commander was the best.
 
9:17 PM
DTrace y u use all RAM.
Safari too, I guess.
Oh only 119 MB.
Xcude is winner with 213 MB.
Oh wait the kernel is the absolute winner.
The kernel uses 400.8 MB of RAM. -_-
 
@sbi that can't be right! They say MSVC11 Express won't compile/run #include <iostream> int main() {std::cout << "Hello World";} ?!?!?
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik That was meant for Rmarthinho :P
 
@ScottW about:memory
 
@RMartinhoFernandes You write some ridiculously good c++!! :)
 
@MooingDuck that's because there needs to be a newline after >.
@ScarletAmaranth oh :P
 
sbi
9:20 PM
@MooingDuck That's what i understood. Or maybe it compiles it, but creates a Metro app from it. I really dunno.
 
It may have been an implementation-specific header
To support ISO treams
 
@ScarletAmaranth Thanks.
 
@sbi I'm irked, but as long as simple console IO keeps working, I'll make most stuff with metro, it's not that big a deal for me.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik SORRY!! :P
 
@sbi This is baffling. I just don't even
 
sbi
9:22 PM
@MooingDuck But the article specifically said that "Hello, world!" no longer works.
@Cicada You don't even? You odd?
 
@sbi right, I find that very hard to believe. I hope like mad that he's wrong about that point, and it was speculation/misunderstanding.
 
@sbi Yes, I'm odd indeed. Also that link will probably ruin my night :(
 
sbi
@MooingDuck I don't think so. I had read that before on twitter today, just not as specific as this one.
 
Anyone else think Rapoo is an incredibly poor brand name?
 
sbi
@Cicada Oh, this young folks is crazy. When I was young we let our nights be ruined by humans, rather than compilers.
 
9:24 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes I was expecting that
 
sbi
@ScottW :)
 
DAmn, looks like I need to reseed my PRNG. Everyone is predicting my moves.
 
@dreamlax Indeed, sounds like rape-wooo!
 
sbi
@ScottW It is for some. I seem to be immune. But there's a reason he keeps posting these.
 
@sbi I feel betrayed
 
9:27 PM
I'm using a Rapoo mouse, it's a pretty good mouse, very ergonomic/comfortable and responsive... but when someone says "oh what kind of mouse is that?" I have to come up with some exotic-sounding pronunciation to avoid me saying "rape poo"
 
@ScottW Depends on your domain of work, I guess
 
sbi
@Cicada Oh, this young folks is crazy. When I was young we were betrayed by humans, rather than compilers.
 
sbi
@TonyTheLion Oh, the kitten is back.
 
@ScottW So am I functionnally
Probably syntactically too
 
9:28 PM
lol, kitten
 
sbi
@Cicada Not orthographically, though.
 
Says the moth
 
Does semantic equality imply functional equality btw?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Just how on Earth did you achieve such legendary C++ skill :D ?
 
9:29 PM
Legendary? Woah, let's not get carried away.
 
@Cicada I would say so. Semantics define functionality.
 
@sbi One does not simply, call me a kitten...
 
sbi
@TonyTheLion Oh, I was calling you a kitten sophisticatedly, not simply.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes but you are pretty damn good at C++ :)
@sbi oh, I see, I failed to see that sophistication
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Well, it's real good :)
 
9:32 PM
@ScarletAmaranth Really, what do you expect me to answer that?
Reading and practicing.
There is no secret.
 
that's no cat
 
@RMartinhoFernandes It was more of a rhetorical question as to praise your c++ skillz :)
 
+1 sir
 
@ScarletAmaranth Well, thanks. Don't make me blush.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I though i write decent c++, now im back at: "Oh god i can't write c++".
 
9:34 PM
One does not simply ask rhetorical questions to a robot
 
@TonyTheLion Oh gawd, now I'll have to resist the urge to memify that one too... :S
 
lol
@RMartinhoFernandes hahah :P
 
@RMartinhoFernandes why?
 
cuz he lovez all the memes
 
@MooingDuck Because I can't be predictable!
 
9:35 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes ...
 
you're so random
> We invented our own Voldetrope
WTF?
 
sbi
2 hours ago, by sbi
@Xeo I just don't want the room to go quiet because you lured everyone to The Site That Must Not Be Linked.
 
Yeah. Can't find it.
The Site That Shall Not Be Named. or something
Right.
 
sbi
@Cicada :)
 
it's harmless :P
 
sbi
9:39 PM
Jun 24 '11 at 0:06, by Tony The Tiger
TVTrope links are dangerous
 
Can you bin the "1 message moved to bin" message?
 
bin all the things
@sbi yea, only when you click on them :)
 
sbi
Mar 31 at 14:58, by Tony The Lion
cause you almost trapped me on TVTropes.org
 
which I've done many times.,.
lol
yes I know, what I've done
woah, I think you've made your point!
OFFS
std::exit();
BYE
 
I don't actually get the point of that website
 
sbi
9:44 PM
@Tony, you can come back, I'll stop now.
I only left one in here.
Nope, you can't undo history here.
 
this sums it all up
:P
and kittens :)
 
@ScottW Binning isn't actually a feature.
 
it's just moving a message to a room called "bin"
I don't know how to move stuff to the bin
 
sbi
@TonyTheLion You need to be admin in both rooms in order to move messages from one to the other.
 
9:52 PM
@sbi Actually, you need ownership privileges in the source, and talk privileges in the destination.
 
ah right, I don't think I have admin rights in the bin
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes Oh, I didn't know that.
 
but then again, who wants to administrate a bin?
 
The bin is probably the room with the most owners.
 
oh I am a bin owner
woot :) I own a bin :P
lol
 
sbi
9:54 PM
@ScottW WTF?! That thing just wanted to plant a cookie in my browser!
 
Going to bread
Good night
 
bread???
 
sbi
@TonyTheLion It's a speech impediment. Something with her moth, prolly.
 
wut???
 
sbi
9:55 PM
Well, I've been procrastinating enough here, too. I should get up...and go to bed now.
 
good night
 
This whole project would be so much easier with extern templates :/
 
I'm not going to sleep.
It's boring and a waste of time.
 
sbi
Here's two more voices about VS11, before I go to bed:
The $500 program: #include <iostream> int main() { std::cout << "Hello World!" << std::endl; }
Please vote and retweet for Microsoft to re-add building non-metro development support in Visual Studio 2011 Express http://goo.gl/g7E95
 
Ell
Hi guys
 
10:01 PM
It surprises me that my CPU is only 45℃.
Hi Ell
 
Ell
I feel like 45^o atm! It's roasting!
Hey :)
Its a whopping 18 degrees c here, and everyone is dieing of heat exhaustion
 
@johnathon here, says Apple's documentation:
@Ell my room is 28℃ 3:
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik very simmilar to windows. But it does not show the way the events are trasmitted
 
@johnathon "Mach Port"
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik sockets
 
10:04 PM
Where does the diagram say "sockets"?
 
"Mach Port"
 
That's not a socket.
That's a Mach port.
 
Right, a socket.
 
Ell
28!? How are you alive!?
 
Mach ports ain't sockets. :P
They don't use sockets.
They don't have anything to do with sockets.
 
10:07 PM
"To do this, Mach introduced the concept of a port, representing each endpoint of a two-way IPC."
"A Unix domain socket or IPC socket (inter-process communication socket) is a data communications endpoint for exchanging data between processes executing within the same host operating system."
 
Ell
:L
 
Say again?
 
Ell
Do IPC sockets have a reputation for being slow and having lots of overhrad?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes neither of those statements say that Mach ports are (implemented using) IPC sockets.
 
I don't care what fancy name you give them. It's the same concept.
 
Ell
10:09 PM
We don't need to know how they are implemented
 
I know, but it wasn't about the concept but about the implementation. :P
 
Ell
You know what I don't even know why I'm taking sides L
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik reddit is <-- that way
 
10:12 PM
--that will evaluate to that -1
 
I don't understand that sentence.
 
GitHub is suggesting drunken-octo-nemesis as the name for my new repo.
 
xD
I thought you used BitBucket.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik My apologies, I thought your unicode exercise was intended for amusement.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik Doesn't have something like GitHub pages.
 
10:15 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes I see.
I use that for documentation.
 
does the standard library contain a neat trick to turn a iterator into a generator?
 
?
What's a generator?
 
@MooingDuck * ?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes generator |ˈjenəˌrātər| noun a thing that generates something
 
@RMartinhoFernandes like a RNG kind of generator
A lambda could do it, but MSVC10 doesn't support lambdas.
 
10:16 PM
@MooingDuck what have those got to do with iterators?
 
auto foo = { 1, 2, 3 }; auto gen = make_generator(foo.begin()); std::cout << gen() << gen() << gen(); would print 123?
 
@MooingDuck surely your not asking for int f(){ rand() }
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yes
 
[it] mutable { return *it++; } :)
 
10:17 PM
@CaptainGiraffe no, I'm trying to type erase an iterator using std::function
@RMartinhoFernandes .... yes. Stupid MSVC10....
 
@MooingDuck I wish I could star caps of a dialogue =)
 
Scumbag Apple. Recommends to disable DWARF for release builds, enables it in Xcode's project templates.
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik scumbag vi, leaves a lot of ":w" in my document.
 
@MooingDuck Ooops, actually, that example of mine would produce an unspecified output out of these six: 123, 132, 213, 231, 312, 321.
 
Now all this stuff relates to the Knuth works on seminumericals. In the modern editions he leaves out the discussion of double precision numbers. What was different between floats and doubles in the early days?
 
10:22 PM
Why is it so hard in C++ to write a large complex function that takes different string iterators? Do I really have to put the whole function in a header?
 
posted on May 24, 2012

My last two notes discussed a subtle language-design issue that simplifies programmers' lives in ways that they often don't suspect. This theme seems useful, so I'll continue it.

 
that's got nothing to do with complexity, and all to do with the shitty template implementation
if you have Clang, you can use a modules-alike, I believe
 
What? Modules?
 
@DeadMG Still under way.
I think.
 
man, it's like dangling a bone in front of a puppy, modules in front of C++ programmers
4
 
10:26 PM
Yeah, C++ is hard too.
 
@DeadMG I've never even heard of an .so until now.
 
That's unrelated as hell.
 
@CaptainGiraffe That has nothing to do with modules.
 
@DeadMG Maybe it's just me, but I prefer silly.
 
I want to make an app but I have no ideas of what kind of app. :P
@CaptainGiraffe Are you using Bing Translate?
 
10:30 PM
@DeadMG lol
 
@RadekdaknokSlupik Yes, of course. I'm using all bran too for regular bowel movements.(Brand names held back for legal reasons)
 
How ironic.
 
why do iterators have a pointer typedef? Seems completely useless
 
For allocator-aware containers.
 
10:33 PM
@MooingDuck Try compiling a parallel_for_each with a std::set on MSVC10 and then come say that.
namely, because pointer might not actually be T*. It might be, necessarily, const T*.
as demonstrated in, conveniently, the Standard's own containrs
 
@LucDanton what would an allocator-aware container do with the pointer type of an unknown iterator?
 
and if some muppet in the MSVC team had paid notice, then their code would work
 
I wondered that too
 
instead of just assuming that iterator::value_type* would be fine
 
I see use for the allocator to have a pointer typedef. I see use for the iterator to have a value_type typedef. But I can't think of a reason for an iterator to have a pointer typedef.
 
10:35 PM
Yeah, should be iterator_traits<iterator>::value_type* :P
 
@MooingDuck No -- an allocator-aware container will have a pointer member that delegates to the underlying container. When generic code is passed an iterator (e.g. from begin() or end() from such a container), it may need to have access to that alias.
 
@DeadMG why should an algorithm use the pointer type at all? Isn't that what we gave it an iterator in the first place for?
 
@DeadMG Me rereading Bjarnes original 98 text I find him making this point very clear about the std containers.
 
You need access to the same information from the iterator as you would have from the container.
@MooingDuck What if you use the expression &*it?
 
@MooingDuck Because it's concurrent, and you do all crazy shit to make that shit work
 
10:37 PM
what containers are allocator aware?
 
@LucDanton you shouldn't. The only reason to do that is to deliberately work around the allocator system.
 
@TonyTheLion std::vector?
 
@TonyTheLion all of the containers in std::
 
@MooingDuck I suppose &*it will have type decltype(it)::pointer.
 
@MooingDuck Who are you to say? And what do you base your second argument on?
 
10:40 PM
All this confusion comes from me writing an input iterator, and I haven't the foggiest what the pointer type should be, since operator* returns a completely different type than the underlying data.
 
It's the type of &*it, silly.
(For some definition of 'is'.)
 
pastebin.com/86w20nQ9 is the offending code from PPL
they use it to chunk up items for each worker thread to do
 
More specifically, you should provide the pointer synonym so that generic code can enable template<typename Iterator> typename Iterator::pointer foo(Iterator it) { return &*it; }.
 
Oh God it's 30º in my room and only 21 outside.
 
It doesn't have to be exactly the type of &*it, but it has to be something convertible from it.
 
10:42 PM
of course, arguably, such a thing from an input iterator doesn't make an awful lot of sense
 
(Maybe there are more requirements on that pointer synonym in the Standard though.)
 
you should check to see if pointer is actually required of input iterators
 
@DeadMG the typedefs are all required for all iterators AFAIK
 
@DeadMG +1
 
Better, you should use Boost for boost::iterator_facade. (The CRTP one, not sure if that's correct.)
 
10:45 PM
hmmm
trying to implement dependency tracking
is not teh easies
 
@LucDanton yes another dependency for a simple * seems like a not that good of an idea.
 
fuckles, why did I eat that food?
it's time for sleep, not eat
that was dumb
 
lol, I did the same mistake.
 
@CaptainGiraffe It's not another when you're already using Boost. And there's more to iterators than just *, and what are your criteria for something being 'simple' anyway?
 
@LucDanton Moo is asking for an input iterator. so * and maybe ++([int])
 
10:49 PM
I also think it's wierd that it's legal to skip input/output iterators. I feel like it should be required to dereference once (and only once), per increment.
 
You're wrong to think that writing an iterator is made less simple (whatever that means to you) by using Boost.Iterator. Writing an iterator has some inherent underlying complexity, and some of that underlying complexity can be delegated to Boost.Iterator.
 
@LucDanton You might well be correct. I'm going for less code is less buggy code.
 
Ya. Things like refactoring and DRY are all about avoiding that the complexity spread out everywhere in your code but instead stays well put in some well-defined pain points, too.
 
@LucDanton I prefer to call them crying stations, but yes.
 
lol those crappy answers people post.
0
Q: C++ Putting text from a text file into an array as individual characters

forthewinwinI want to put some text from a text file into an array, but have the text in the array as individual characters. How would I do that? Currently I have #include <iostream> #include <fstream> #include <string> #include <cmath> #include <vector> #include <sstre...

 

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