« first day (3880 days earlier)      last day (1067 days later) » 
00:00 - 22:0022:00 - 00:00

12:40 AM
Wow.... @Crell, @Tiffany, and I go to a picnic and y'all just clam the hell up.
 
1:03 AM
you guys are the drivers of the room, clearly
I am guilty of being English on a non-rainy day, and am thus currently hammered
 
I'm working on providing a dubious change as a bugfix
 
...whilst being English on a non-rainy day. bold move.
 
I was drinking more or less all day
 
happy to help if you want a sesh review or some pair-drinking
 
 
4 hours later…
4:44 AM
o/
 
4:55 AM
o/
 
5:05 AM
o/
 
5:39 AM
Hello folks. Is there a service where I can preview the php-doc XML rendered?
 
6:32 AM
there's a kind of preview on edit.php.net, but it's not very good and doesn't work for all changes
 
6:43 AM
Oh. Thanks. Looks like I'll send the PR as is, as I had a bizarre experience with edit.php.net in the past
 
 
4 hours later…
10:28 AM
@JoeWatkins For some definition of 's
(I don't think the preview has worked in the last N years)
 
10:46 AM
Hasn't worked since I started working on the docs... circa 2017
 
@Girgias Is there no way of previewing changes at the moment?
 
@CraigFrancis You can build the docs manually
However, I've never really seen the need in previewing the change
 
ok, so not exactly easy for someone new to try edits out
 
@NikiC about 10 years ago, it could do one or two kinds of pages, but they weren't useful (function ref pages) ...
but yeah, it's typical phooling ...
 
Tbf I still have no idea how PHD actually works
And migrating to pandoc seems impossible sadly
 
11:13 AM
@Girgias it's a real rabbit hole, it's like a rabbit hole with rabbit holes inside of it ... also, those rabbit holes may contain rabbit holes ...
 
Yeah, I tried too, the reason why Pandoc doesn't work is that it doesn't expand System XML entities >_>
But maybe a mix between pandoc and a new trimmed down custom tool might do the trick...
 
docbook is very suitable, so long as it's very far away from me ... I'd like it to be more user friendly ... people have suggested switching to another magical system, but it makes no different what spells we cast to turn things into documentation really, and these spells do work ... ish ...
 
Oh I don't mean changing docbook
I mean changing how we render the HTML docs
 
nods
 
just a single page preview without having to re-do the entire thing would be a godsend.
 
11:19 AM
I once started to write a thing for phd to show off pthreads, I never finished it ... but it's a lot of work to do in one thread no matter what you are doing it with .... and it wouldn't have to use pthreads, a bodge like parallel test runner would also improve things a lot ...
 
cmb
@MarkR that won't necessarily work, since there needs to be an index of what is there, so auto-linking to other funcs etc. works
 
for me it's books at a time, pages aren't so useful ...
 
cmb
I think we should set up a GH action to render the docs (manually triggered).
xhtml format
 
@cmb I'll wait here while you do it ...
 
cmb
you may need to wait for long time :)
 
11:21 AM
it's alright, I got nothing on ...
 
@cmb I've only written like... 2 pages of docs in my time, so my sample size is tiny, but caring about it linking to other functions / pages accounted for... maybe 5% of what I cared about. The other 95% was checking how the page looked, reading / re-reading the text, making sure the tables presented the info clearly. How successful I was at that is for someone else to decide, but only at the very end did I care about links to other articles.
 
cmb
PhD supports a --partial (or something like that) arg to which you can pass an arbitrary xml:id to only render this; should work for books, func etc.
 
Does the whole manual.xml have to be pre-compiled to allow that to work?
 
wow, I wish I'd known that when I was writing a book every other month ...
 
cmb
@MarkR yes
 
11:29 AM
I mostly give up on extensions now, I'm just going to focus effort on php itself, if someone comes up with a really good idea I'll implement it ... but people just complain when you package things as an extension, and I don't get enough support to warrant spending time on them ... it's either work on complicated extensions nobody cares about or is willing to install, or go back to being useful ... so I do the latter ...
unless someone pays me a million dollars a month ...
 
I'm still waiting on you to add a $25 tier if you're willing / able.
 
so phd is using sqlite, and has problems with things being passed by reference, this looks like fun.
 
@MarkR Building the manual doesn't take long when you don't have any XML error
 
@Girgias When I was running on a native linux FS in WSL it took about 45 - 60ish seconds for a manual rebuild and render. Using a windows mount with its IO performance, I could go off and make a cup of tea in the mean time.
 
@MarkR done
 
11:35 AM
@MarkR It takes me 5s
Not the rendering bit, just the configure
 
@JoeWatkins ty
@Girgias The first time I ran it took 20ish seconds, the second time took around 5. Caching?
 
maybe
 
nobody knows
that's actually a fact, the people that wrote the code are silent or dead ...
 
I'm planning on having a look at configure.php soonish, to try to refactor it and bringing it up to PHP 7/8 standard
 
When half your infrastructure depends on an black box :P
 
11:42 AM
Because there are some hacks and options which are only relevant prior to PHP 5.3
2 black boxes*
But yeah, I'm currently sorting through all the stuff in doc-base to see what is relevant still
 
2 black boxes and one box of an indescribable color and shape, possibly from another dimension
@NikiC my approach to the factory feature must have some flaw in it, do you know what it is and are saving it for later ? because I'd like to know what it is, I see it's there but can't identify it ... if you don't know what it is, can you just think real carefully about what it's doing for five minutes, and then tell me what it is ... if there's really no flaw and it should be fine, can you also tell me that and I'll stick at it ...
 
    if ($ac["SEGFAULT_SPEED"] == "yes" && version_compare(PHP_VERSION, "5.3.7-dev", "lt")) {
        $b = basename($mxml);
        echo "\n\nPHP will segfault now :) - Don't worry though, the $b has been saved :D\n";
    }
 
yeah it is ancient
 
If cobol is anything to go by, PHP is probably going to be in use for another 100+ years. We should really start fundraising to create a secretive sect of monks with knowledge of internals, and have them cryogenically frozen or something.
 
12:06 PM
o/
 
\o
 
12:40 PM
SIGSEGV (Address boundary error) in zend_mm_alloc_small ・ Reproducible crash ・ #81091
 
12:52 PM
@NikiC I've narrowed it down to something to do with constructor promotion ...
<?php
class Foo {
    public function __construct(public int $day = 1) {}
}

$foo = new Foo(...);

$foo();
?>
==1697631==The signal is caused by a READ memory access.
==1697631==Hint: this fault was caused by a dereference of a high value address (see register values below).  Dissassemble the provided pc to learn which register was used.
    #0 0x555a3fcbfb49 in zend_gc_delref /opt/src/php-src/Zend/zend_types.h:1191
    #1 0x555a3fcc1a97 in zend_assign_to_variable /opt/src/php-src/Zend/zend_execute.h:144
    #2 0x555a3fcc6a8c in zend_std_write_property /opt/src/php-src/Zend/zend_object_handlers.c:741
    #3 0x555a3fbde04c in ZEND_ASSIGN_OBJ_SPEC_UNUSED_CONST_OP_DATA_CV_HANDLER /opt/src/php-src/Zend
no ctor promotion, no error
and I see it ... sorry for noise
if I bought you a t-shirt that said "I am a rubber duck for krakjoe", would you wear it !? hehe
rubber ducks are good, but I often find when I'm trying to ask you a question I lead myself to the answer, I dunno why ...
 
1:21 PM
@JoeWatkins At least you found the issue, and it is somewhat reasonable not like: chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/11?m=52224446#52224446
 
 
1 hour later…
cmb
2:25 PM
@Girgias, wiki.php.net/rfc/implicit-float-int-deprecate is still "under discussion" (should be accepted).
 
Ah indeed
Let me fix that
 
cmb
ta
 
2:50 PM
Anyone able to clean out the spam we just got on GH? github.com/php/php-src/pull/5820#issuecomment-851537698 Currently not on my php.net GH handle :>
 
@Kalle Done
Someone want to write a diplomatic response to bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=81023&edit=1?
 
@NikiC Kiitos
Is closing it as not a bug diplomatic enough?
 
@NikiC should we add the optional parameter to get_defined_function() on the chopping board? As this is now useless as disabled functions cannot show up anymore if I understand correctly
 
no such response is possible
 
@Girgias Isn't it already?
Throwing deprecation I mean
 
2:56 PM
Oh it is indeed
Just need to update the docs then, I made a memo to myself but didn't check the impl
 
@NikiC okay.
 
cmb
wouldn't that be a nice addition to safe_mode ;)
 
"Both is big improvement for security"
 
@cmb didn't I remove safe_mode back in 5.4? :D
 
@Kalle We can bring it back just for this feature
 
2:59 PM
and the notorious sql.safe_mode!
which I think only interbase had some references too
 
cmb
what, safe_mode has been removed?!
 
@cmb I think it's been deprecated as long as I've been working with PHP (5.3) and removed soon after
 
@bwoebi Interesting argument :)
@Girgias I see the monster has finally been merged...
 
yeah
Thanks for the reviews
 
@bwoebi wiki.php.net/rfc/removal-of-deprecated-features it also killed Rasmus' favorite -- y2k_compliance
 
3:04 PM
PHP 8.1 will be a scarily deprecation-heavy release
 
Next up pure intersection types
Well we did delay a bunch from 8.0 sooo
 
But I guess the most time consuming deprecation is the internal method return type stuff.
 
@Kalle now I'm in possession of one more useless bit of knowledge :-D (i.e. what y2k_compliance does)
 
Perhaps the best feature PHP had yet to offer the world at its prime
 
cmb
@bwoebi I know. My comment was rather satirical. :)
 
@cmb @bwoebi interestingly enough, the example in the manual for ini_restore() uses y2k_compliance as an example :')
 
may be missing rebase I suppose
 
@cmb should I got ahead and merge the mysqlnd plugin extension removal from the docs? (c.f. github.com/php/doc-en/pull/612)
 
cmb
@Girgias yes please (AFAIK only maintained mysqlnd plugin is mysqlnd_azure and that doesn't have any docs)
 
great less stuff to maintain :D
 
cmb
3:24 PM
@Kalle I shall replaced that with get_magic_quotes :p
 
3:47 PM
> there is one shared MySQL server for all webs.
That's got to be a fast machine it's running on.
 
@JoeWatkins Didn't I fix those already?
 
@NikiC yeah my bad, I rebased and it went away ... though I thought CI pulled in the most recent commit and that was started after those fixes, but it went away anyway, sorry for noise
 
 
1 hour later…
4:57 PM
@JoeWatkins Mornin'. It looks like you've been busy. Is the PR in a state where I can do the planned RFC tests?
 
@Crell probably no need to add tests now, I think I've got just about every thing covered ...
 
Even stuff from the RFC?
 
I think every behavioural aspect should be covered in at least one test
 
OK then! So what is the next step?
 
I guess read the tests and see if they allow you to clarify any things
then move onwards I suppose, I guess as a matter of courtesy you should restart the clock on discussion period whenever you start it again ... this is a different thing than previously discussed, and the document is large, and people may have grown tired with the last discussion ... agree ?
 
5:07 PM
I don't think it's radically different in practice, even if the description has changed. I would say at least a week of discussion before a vote.
 
there's not really any rush, another week makes no difference to us, but it might be the difference between someone having the time to vote or not, vote either way, doesn't matter ... it's a lot of information to read, and the second time we had the conversation in a month, it seems like a good idea to allow the normal discussion period ... it maybe also helps to reset the conversation and give people the idea we're not pushing too hard, we're starting again ...
 
For this RFC, no. But I'm trying to be mindful of the pipe follow up, even if it is a simple RFC.
I suppose I could bring that back up for discussion now; I was going to wait until it was in voting.
 
but hey, it's you conducting the discussion mostly, so whatever really ... it would be nice to force a reset so we don't have the same conversation, or pick up where we left off ...
 
5:32 PM
When the partials RFC finally goes to vote... upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/84/…
 
@Crell I'm about to be afk, so any quick questions as a result of the test reading ?
 
Let me get back to test reading; I've been multi-tasking.
 
@MarkR I'm ... not sure I would vote for it ...
because the simpler thing is on the table already ... and everybody can understand it ... and they don't spend time in this room ...
it's quite a hard sell at this point imo ... most people will have read nikitas less than positive opinion ... and they'll be swayed by that ...
 
We don't mention magic methods in the RFC at the moment. Should we?
 
it's right they should both be on the table, I don't care if neither get in ... I had my fun whatever ...
@Crell I think yes, but probably not much more than "you can do call magic, look:" ... but mention, yeah ...
 
5:42 PM
Roger roger.
Same for static vars in functions? I don't know if that's worth mentioning.
 
@Crell that's more a ze test, impl detail ... probably not, unless you can find similar reference to the handling of statics with regard to closures in existing documentation
I think probably not
 
I'll ignore then.
 
@JoeWatkins I think the effects of this RFC are going to be felt long term, perhaps not for it's immediate uses, but because it puts PHP on the path to being able to tidy up callables and put the 'callable' mess on the bonfire. I think the long term benefits of it combined with piping depend very much on if we can agree on a scalar objects API (or can somehow optimize away the needing to fetch everything for write)
 
we get to have the bonfire with the simpler solution too though ... it's obvious to everyone this isn't straight forward in the same way as typed properties wasn't (fun fact, I wrote the first impl of that too, very early, crap impl) ... and it's obvious that we knocked up the other thing in a few hours and there wasn't really anything to bikeshed or argue about ...
if I was them, and I couldn't read an impl and was bored with reading rfc's, and I was being informed by the opinion of the most vocal highly respected developer, I'd probably rather go for the simpler thing and start building the bonfire, than read another RFC and listen to another month of discussion ...
 
Tests that I don't see yet:

1. The "dynamic dependency injection" thing that Nicolas had been asking about.
2. Closure::fromCallable(foo(?)); // Not sure if this is really needed, but we had it previously.
@JoeWatkins Well, then we should try and get Nikita on board with this version. It's not radically different, but much more precisely defined.
 
5:57 PM
2 is not needed, and I don't remember what 1 is referring too ?
 
It's probably been rebased out by now... :-(
Basically, given an associative array of possible arguments, and a callable, give back a partial that has those arguments that have a value in the array prefilled.
$callable(..., ...$named_args_that_matched); - Looked kind of like that?
 
we have to disallow unpacking
 
We do?
 
yes, place holders are inherently positional, and we can't mix unpacking with positional arguments as an existing restriction
foo(any number of unpacked args, don't know what position this is)
 
What about unpacking named args.
 
6:05 PM
doesn't matter
 
That's... very unfortunate. It did work in the previous iteration.
 
that's because we were sprinkling ? and making it work, but it's logically inconsistent, it must be disallowed
foo(?, ...[]) -> overwrites previous argument
foo(...[], ...) -> position is lost, and you are not allowed to use positional arguments after unpack ...
 
Why does foo(?, ...[]) overwrite arguments?
 
if they are named arguments
 
6:20 PM
You can detect that and error, no? Same as foo(?, x: 1)
 
Well, that's very unfortunate. :-( That was a nice bit of functionality.
Can we detect that the array is named-only arguments and allow that?
 
Since foo(..., a: 1, b: 2) and foo(..., ...['a' => 1, 'b' => 2]); certainly feel the same to the user.
 
So is the problem unpacking named args, or positional args?
 
place holders are positional, and unpacking takes up an unknown number of positions, we can't say "here are the semantics, except when you use unpacking", or except anything ...
 
6:22 PM
The unpacking is after the positional arguments though.
@Crell foo(..., ...[]) definitely won't work.
 
but it doesn't matter if it overwrites named arguments, and that now raises an error ...
 
But foo(?, ...[]) seems like it should.
 
function foo(int $a, int $b, int $c) {
    var_dump(func_get_args());
}

$f = foo(..., a: 1, c: 3);

$f(2);
That's giving me an error, too.
I... sorta understand why, ish. (No named placeholders.) But it's unfortunate.
 
that's a bug
krakjoe@Fiji:/opt/src/php-src$ sapi/cli/php compile.php

Fatal error: Uncaught ArgumentCountError: foo(): Argument #2 ($b) not passed in /opt/src/php-src/compile.php:3
Stack trace:
#0 /opt/src/php-src/compile.php(9): foo(1, NULL, 3, NULL)
#1 /opt/src/php-src/compile.php(9): Closure->__invoke(2)
#2 {main}
  thrown in /opt/src/php-src/compile.php on line 3
 
6:28 PM
$f = foo(?, ...$array); // This does work.
As long as $array is only the trailing arguments.
 
no, wait
that is supposed to be an error ...
 
Which that?
 
function foo(int $a, int $b, int $c) {
    var_dump(func_get_args());
}

$f = foo(..., a: 1, c: 3);

$f(2);
that's supposed to error exactly like it did, overwrite named argument
the error is $f = foo(..., a: 1, c: 3);
on that line ... not the execution ...
 
So the guideline is "you can unpack named args iff they are all for trailing arguments and you didn't use ... to get there." Accurate?
 
no, I disallowed unpack
 
6:34 PM
$f = foo(?, ...$array); // This does work.
 
eb1a8871f3b095e0855aabf96aec5450c3d70077
disallowed
 
Calling fflush before stream_filter_remove results in corrupted stream ・ Bzip2 Related ・ #81092
 
You just blocked it? :-(
 
it doesn't make sense, we've defined these placeholders as positional, and unpack takes up an unknown number of positions, we've disallowed named param overwrite of placeholder, unpack may overwrite place holders ... I don't want to make exceptions ...
 
That feels like an arbitrary restriction if it did work 5 minutes ago.
 
6:39 PM
foo(?, ...$array) makes sense though.
 
The unpack lets you determine the args dynamically.
(Even if you know the names in advance.)
 
we are not trying to accomodate every single kind of call that php could possibly make
 
If there's a logical reason why a certain call style can't work, sure. But... this does work in a sensible way unless it's actively blocked. Please don't actively block it.
 
I've told you why, we have to keep the rules simple ... you're saying ?, ...$ar will work, but that depends on the contents of $ar, and if $ar should happen to overwrite ? and that raises an error, to some that's obvious and others that is surprising ...
 
@JoeWatkins wouldn't an overwrite error?
 
6:48 PM
it's more valuable to us to avoid that surprise altogether ...
@NikiC yes
 
If $arr is positional, yes, it would break. That's expected.
If $arr is all named, though, it feels like it ought to work.
 
function foo($a, $b, $c) {
    var_dump(func_get_args());
}

foo(?, ...["a" => "a", "b" => "b", "c" => "c"]);
that would error ... see surprise, best avoided ...
for the same reason as
function foo($a, $b, $c) {
    var_dump(func_get_args());
}

foo(?, a: "a");
that does error ...
 
7:07 PM
foo(..., a: "a");
I broke that and just fixed it, that's not an error ...
 
7:18 PM
@Derick yes, what time?
 
@JoeWatkins Found a segfault.
 
show me?
 
class Foo {
    public function __call($method, $args) {
        printf("%s::%s\n", __CLASS__, $method);
        var_dump($args);
    }
}

$foo = new Foo;

$bar = $foo->method(...);

print (string)(new ReflectionFunction($bar));

$bar(1, 2, 3);
I was checking to see what reflection would say about the partial. What it said was "Termsig=11". :-)
Added small section on magic methods to the RFC.
 
yeah, bug
 
erm. Anyone else getting what snells like a targeted hacking attempt from a guy called Jacob Pelzl?
 
7:29 PM
"However, argument unpacking when creating a partial is not supported. There are some cases where it would work fine, and others where it would result in a variety of error conditions such as variables being out of order, variables being used as positional placeholders and in the unpacked array, etc. Rather than have support for only some combinations, which would not be easily identifiable through static analysis, the implementation omits them entirely for consistency."

Adding that to the variadic section.
@NikiC As long as you're sorta here, have you decided yet what you're doing with the accessor RFC?
I'd still love to see at least the asymmetric visibility/implicit accessor parts in 8.1.
 
@Crell are you just trying to sound like you agree, or do you actually agree ?
 
@JoeWatkins A little from column A, a little from column B.
 
we tried wide open scope, I have wounds ... okay not actually wounded ... but I learned my lesson, we gotta keep it simple and easy to understand, narrowing scope is a legitimate way to do that if it doesn't narrow so far that the majority use cases aren't handled, everything remains easy to understand
 
I grant that it does leave open the potential for removing that limitation later, so I'm picking my battles because even with that limitation it is still a hugely important feature that I want to pass.
 
you know that argument handling hasn't really changed, all of these things that we've pinned on have been done with compromise, and pa is the latest set of compromises ... in an ideal world, we'd go back to the drawing board and write all code gen and prologue and all related things in mind of the things we are doing today, and that's a legitimate project for PHP 10 or whatever, and then we lift some of the limits of pa and other things too ...
 
7:44 PM
Are you trying to convince me to not be sad about it? :-)
 
harder to imagine because jit now, but it's maybe a thing we do, pa is not the only thing with limitations, we can only have anything with compromise, and when we try to accommodate absolutely everything, it's not workable, I mean I can write code that will make it work, but everybody hated it the results ...
 
I already added that to the variadic section. Unless you think it's misleading or inaccurate, let's just move on. As I said, not a hill I'm dying on, especially when we're this close.
 
not sure why it's under variadics ?
 
Not sure where else to put it. :-)
 
I'd put a simple one line rule at the top with "rules of", then a little section somewhere underneath, if you feel it's necessary ... or maybe it's time to have a future scope ?
 
7:49 PM
Is that the only future-scope bit? Or should we put named placeholders there as well as "things we rejected as too damned complicated for now."?
 
yeah it might be good to talk about that ... it's the sort of thing I imagine we can solve elegantly in some far off future version, where the handling of arguments (or calls, or both) is rewritten or at least in some way more accomodating than it is today ...
 
I'll add a section.
 
8:01 PM
Added. See "Excluded functionality" at the bottom.
 
8:13 PM
lgtm
 
8:29 PM
Anything else then before I post to the list?
@LeviMorrison?
 
this call trampoline thing ...
it's a bit messy, we can't reflect anything useful about it, because there's nothing useful to say
 
Should that also get excluded, then? I don't know when it would even be useful, honestly...
 
I can write code that will make it work, but what does it mean to apply to a non-existent function anyway
I mean if you drop off the reflection dump from that example, it will work, but it leaves the engine in an unknown statte (will fail assertions on a debug build) if you don't immediately execute (or eventually at least) that trampoline ...
I can make it properly work so that it doesn't fail, but I'm not sure what I'm making work, we can't build a prototype, there is no argument names, no definition ... it's confusing to think about ...
you may not totally get what this means ...
but here
you can see there's no arg info and it's lying about the prototype (no required args, no args)
I dunno what to do with that
@Crell they don't look like reasonable targets for application, because they don't really exist
 
8:46 PM
This sounds like we just don't bother trying to support it to me.
 
yeah whatever I do is not going to make any sense really, if we make up argument names it has all kinds of implications, it we omit them we cannot build a prototype and so cannot handle further application, this just doesn't make sense
 
Kill it with fire. I'll update the RFC.
RFC updated.
@MateKocsis Were you going to try and get clone-with into this cycle?
 
patch updated
 
9:05 PM
anyone got a link to being able to do php run-tests.php in parallel?
 
-j$(nproc)
(that's all, pass -j directly to script, or set in TEST_PHP_ARGS when using make test)
 
ta
====================================================================
========= WELCOME TO THE FUTURE: run-tests PARALLEL EDITION =========
Futuristic.
 
it's pretty futuristic
> time make test TESTS=Zend TEST_PHP_ARGS=-j16
real	0m6,097s
user	0m2,364s
sys	0m0,905s
I remember waiting large chunks of time for tests to run in the past ...
 
yeah...
 
Just how many cores do you have...
 
9:09 PM
16
 
/me sighs at his 4 core laptop.
 
I'm real bad with generators. Can someone tell me how to type hint a generator function returning instances of DateTime?
 
iterable
 
but then how will my ide know that it's DateTime?
 
Currently the language doesn't do that.
 
9:10 PM
oh
 
It is very sad.
 
should I use Generator instead of iterable?
 
cmb
Future? github.com/php/pftt2 runs tests in parallel for many years!
 
@Dharman Kind of a wash either way, IMO.
@JoeWatkins @LeviMorrison Waiting on the green light to take it back to the list.
 
function () : Generator<DateTime> {}
 
9:14 PM
Don't tease the poor guy.
 
@Crell I think ready, that's not to say I won't keep reading and working, although I'm pretty happy the way it is ...
 
Ok, then I don't put any return type and instead use docblock @return \DateTime[]
 
> Download binary from 131.107.220.66/PFTT-Results/PFTT/current and run it.
sounds legit.
 
You can use iterable as the return type, but otherwise yes, docblock is the answer.
 
@Danack this was my favourite bit
> When a PHP (or Apache) process crashes, PFTT will try running it a second time to confirm that that specific test really caused a crash before reporting the test as CRASH.
 
9:16 PM
Hm. The list seems... slow today.
As in, I know of at least 3 emails to it that haven't come through yet. One of which is several hours old.
Does the mail server have Memorial Day off?
 
possible
 
cmb
Well, I have to admit that PFTT2 has some minor issues. It is much slower than run-tests.php -j1, it always passes EXPECTF tests, fails randomly on mbstring tests (and some others), has a hard coded list of ~1000 XFAILS – but other than that it's mostly great! ;)
 
@Crell I think it's something to propose after @NikiC's accessors RFC (or any simpler variant of it), isn't it? Realistically, 8.2 seems to be a safer target for clone with.
 
Convenient timing. I was just about to mention that maybe someone should update the mailing list with regards to the status of "Short functions, take 2".
 
@MateKocsis As with a lot of RFC these days, it seems like a valuable stand-alone made more valuable in concert with other RFCs. I don't think it has to wait.
@Danack I literally just opened the vote for it, but the server is being slow.
Basically every RFC I'm working on or tracking this year is related to some other RFC. :-) It's all about synergy!
 
9:24 PM
@Crell The issues with it's implementation that I seem to recall were addressed?
 
straight to prison for 100 years for using marketing speak @Crell
 
2 hours ago, by Danack
erm. Anyone else getting what snells like a targeted hacking attempt from a guy called Jacob Pelzl?
something might be fucky with a mass phishing attempt.
 
doesn't show up in my email life
 
@Danack I think so. It's still 100% parser implemented, but the logic is now a lot cleaner. It first unifies both function and method body definitions, then tosses one extra line into that definition to make it work. Quite elegant.
I have not gotten such an email.
 
it isn't under voting on rfc index
 
9:26 PM
Also, does anyone know where I can submit an image that really smells like it might be an invalid image that hopes to abuse bugs in image processing libraries to hack a machine?
 
I knew there was a step I was missing...
 
and it says version 1
 
Which, short functions? It's still v1, as far as design goes.
Same for auto-capture closures.
 
9:46 PM
@Crell it's still the same implementation
 
Well, I'll post partials back to the list as soon as the list appears to be working again. So... whenever that is.
Did the implementation really change that meaningfully? It was just a bit of cleanup in the parser. It still results in the same AST as before.
 
I'm reading PFA RFC and I see example like $points = array_map(new Point(?, ?), $data);
 
(I legit have NFI what the guidelines are for version within an RFC vs a new RFC v2.)
 
How does it work?
 
did you read what nikita said about it ?
 
9:47 PM
It's clearly not the same as $points = array_map(fn ($a, $b) => new Point($a, $b), $data);
 
It's been a month, so probably and I've forgotten.
 
it will capture too much, it's not suitable
 
Wait, which RFC are you talking about? There's 2 separate ones here.
 
two PFA RFC?
 
auto capturing multi statement closures
 
9:49 PM
@Crell I'd like to first ask @NikiC 's opinion here if he sees any issue with adding support for "clone with" with a future compatible way with any readonly property implementation.
 
Short functions is mine, and is just some lexer tricks. Auto-capture multi-line closures are @NunoMaduro's. There's probably more optimization to be done there but he hasn't had bandwidth to do so yet.
@MateKocsis I pinged him earlier about accessors, but he's not responded. I think he's tired of me asking him about his own RFCs. :-)
@Dharman Actually, it is effectively the same.
 
Then how does one work and the other doesn't?
 
not sure why it's in voting if it's there's no implementation ready, I don't think it should be used like this even if it is voted in ...
 
@Dharman Both should work and do the same thing?
(There's about 4 different conversations happening at the same time right now, FYI. :-) )
 
but how do you unpack an array like this?
$data = [
[1, 2],
[4, 6],
[3, 9],
[7, 4],
];
Then each map attempt will complain about one argument missing
Too few arguments to function {closure}(), 1 passed and exactly 2 expected
 
9:52 PM
thinking_face.gif - You are correct. The example is bad.
 
his first point about opt in for by-ref capture could be sorted later on ... but the second point, this:
> For much the same reason, capture analysis for arrow functions is very
primitive. It basically finds all variables that are used inside the
closure body and tries to import them, silently failing if they are not
available in the outer scope. For multi-line closures, this would commonly
end up importing too many variables. For example:

fn() {
$tmp = foo();
bar($tmp);
return $tmp;
}

Here, there is no need to import $tmp from the outer scope, but a naive
implementation (which I assume you're using) will still try to capture it.
that's much harder to ignore, and I don't think it's enough to mention in the RFC ... to me this needs to be solved before it's viable ...
 
@JoeWatkins I defer to @NunoMaduro on that front. He wrote it, I'm just the secretary.
 
00:00 - 22:0022:00 - 00:00

« first day (3880 days earlier)      last day (1067 days later) »