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7:01 PM
oh...uhh neither do I....I was just joking. Ha...yeah
 
user6568562
This Band-Aid paradigm that people call stack is starting to get on my nerve
 
my models are figures... mostly anime figures xD
 
You don't have to hide your power level, tristan. Let me let you show me your pokemans.
 
tristan doesn't poke mans, does he?
 
user6568562
Please... They're called poképersons*
 
user559633
7:03 PM
@AndrasDeak i don't, but all love (without a victim) is beautiful
 
user6568562
Ah the joys of using an AZERTY "clavier"
 
yéyo @randomhopeful
 
user6568562
Hey @AndyK ! What up, my brother
 
@tristan oh I wasn't judging
 
user559633
didn't think you were :)
 
7:06 PM
I'm allrite. My little pug almost did not start due to the cold but except than that, I'm all good
 
everyone should be free to poke whomever they like, as long as both parties agree:)
 
your pug has a start button?
 
user6568562
Can there be a love without victims ? The answer is : no, lawl
 
What kind of pugs do they have in your area?
what year is it..what's happening
 
106,306,etc ...@idjaw
pug for peugeot
(if we are talking about the same thing)
 
user559633
7:07 PM
pugs are the result of man's hubris of playing god
 
user6568562
Hey ! Peugeot ! I used to own-hate that ! Mine was a 206
 
@AndyK I figured you were not talking about a real dog...but I had no idea "pug" was another name for Peugeot
 
@randomhopeful mine almost died on the M25 a few years ago... It was an interesting moment
I did not know Pug could also mean dog :)))
 
hehe
 
7:09 PM
ask @Programmer about it
 
actually, it was scary as hell
quick python question
 
user559633
 
I have this
 
@tristan he didn't choose the pug life
 
oh .... such a cutie ...
 
user559633
7:10 PM
 
user6568562
@AndyK Man I googled M25, that's one big ass highway. Let me guess, a problem with the injectors ?
 
almost @randomhopeful the engine had a huge leak and there was a weird smoke behind
had to change the whole engine...
 
I may or may not have a "pug life" shirt.
 
but manage to get back home safe, it was a monday with a typical brit weather ...
crazyness aside, this is my question
list(map(chr, range(97, 123)))
 
that gives you an alphabet of sorts, right?
 
7:15 PM
it gives me the list of the whole alphabet starting from a to z. Question is why it starts at 97
 
ascii codes?
check ord('a')
 
I tried with the following list(map(chr,range(0,5)))
you're the man Andras
 
I might be
 
excellent !!!!
what means the chr?
got it
Return a string of one character whose ASCII code is the integer i. For example, chr(97) returns the string 'a'. This is the inverse of ord(). The argument must be in the range [0..255], inclusive; ValueError will be raised if i is outside that range. See also unichr().
 
yup
 
7:17 PM
Python is still amazing ...
 
this is not even python:)
 
ok
Thanks for the help, but I got to run. Lady & kids to talk to. See ya! Thanks @AndrasDeak
 
way to crush his hopes and drops andras
 
no worries, take care
 
look now hes running away T>T
F
 
user6568562
7:21 PM
@AndyK Excessive oil consumption ! That's not Peugeot-like
 
Would it be well defined if I were trying to specify an audience and I said: "Product Owners et al."
 
user6568562
That's vague, if you ask me
 
Why relative seek function not allowed for text based io?
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak If I may ask you, how did you come across using Python ?
 
Hi @Rakesh_K. Welcome to the Python room. Please acquaint yourself with the room rules: sopython.com/chatroom. Can you please provide some more clarity around your question? What exactly are you trying to do, and what problems are you facing?
Andras didn't choose the Python. The Python chose Andras
 
7:26 PM
@randomhopeful sure you may:P Being a physicist, I've been using MATLAB for a long while. I got fed up with the bulkiness of MATLAB, and I like open source a lot. Both were very good reasons for me to switch to numpy
(to paraphrase idjaw)
 
It was fate
 
@idjaw Ohh, okay, So i was reading the Docs and came across this In text files (those opened without a b in the mode string), only seeks relative to the beginning of the file are allowed (the exception being seeking to the very file end with seek(0, 2)).
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak I see !! Thank you, dude [ :
 
no worries:)
 
I am getting the error as io.UnsupportedOperation: can't do nonzero end-relative seeks when text.seek(2,0)
 
7:30 PM
It says "end-relative". Does that change anything?
 
@Rakesh_K Are you dealing with a binary file? And you are getting that error?
 
no i am working on text file
 
I bet it has something to do with line ending conversion.
 
All i can do is seek(n) which will seek relative to the start of the file
 
oh, @randomhopeful, another reason I forgot about: MATLAB's plotting was pretty ugly (it's much better now). I first used latex/tikz/pgfplots to create publication-grade figures, but that was pretty cumbersome (even though the result is fabulous). I found out that matplotlib creates much prettier plots than the old graphics engine of matlab. Not as pretty as latex, but much less effort:)
 
7:37 PM
Lazy solution: load entire file into a single string and do whatever manipulations you need on that.
then a relative seek is as easy as current_idx += 2
 
if you are seeking from the beginning, then seek(1), seek(1, 0), does not make a difference. Unless I'm wrong?
Isn't it 0 by default?
 
yes 0 is default but when i am moving on the file and i want jump from that location not again from the begining
 
Open the file in binary mode, then.
 
hmm...so you are keeping track of where you are in the file? Are you doing this while the file is open?
or are you closing, then open it again to continue where you left off?
 
doh!
 
user6568562
7:46 PM
@AndrasDeak I see, even though I'm still in the early stages of Python usability
 
user6568562
I can't stress enough how much I love Python's indentation
 
user6568562
It's like a tenor-sporano poem
 
grumblecakes
Y U No show the comment???
 
@randomhopeful I've never been a huge fan of whitespace in syntax
@WayneWerner deleted?
 
7:48 PM
hmmm
 
Woah, the comment doesn't one box
 
weird
 
user6568562
#Pavarotti
If x:
    #Natalie Dessay
    *do stuff*
 
prepIn adjOther nWords, prnYou vUse adjHungarian nNotation prepFor adjDatabase nObjects? — dan04 Nov 4 at 18:30
There we go
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak Beside that, Python has the chic of making everything boil down to its essential
 
7:49 PM
so does assembly;)
 
Heh. Awesome:
47
A: Is adding the ‘tbl’ prefix to table names really a problem?

Brent OzarBrent here (the guy you're referring to in the question). The reason I tell you not to add tbl to the front of your table names is the same reason I'd say not to add child to the front of your child's name. You don't call them childJohn and childJane. Not only does it not add any value, they may...

 
@WayneWerner The post itself was amusing...that comment brings up more of the hilarity
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak I know, I know, my statements lack a lot of asterisks
 
Oh, BTW, I've decided to throw in my hat in the elections this year. (After a bit of discussion in another room).
 
Good times. Glad I never dealt with anyone insane enough to suggest a prefix of tbl_
 
7:51 PM
human_wayne - how are you?
@BhargavRao are the nominations officially open
 
Nope
10 mins
 
the worst I had to deal with was the debate on plural/singular
I prefer the latter
because select agents.name from agents is dumb
 
developers arguing about names
that should be a thing people watch
 
@BhargavRao break a leg:)
 
Thanks. I just hope not to end up in the negatives.
 
7:56 PM
@idjaw More entertaining than most "reality" TV shows out there ;)
 
I'm not that a good candidate, But I'm just curious.
 
@WayneWerner nice!
 
@WayneWerner It will air right after the Bachelor. Because you know...I uhhh don't watch that
 
@BhargavRao how so? You waste more than a reasonable amount of time moderating the site:P
 
@AndrasDeak I ain't famous. :/
 
7:57 PM
and you have lots of rep
yeah, maybe your meta presence is suboptimal
but there's really nothing you can lose:)
 
oh is meta presence a big thing too for mod nominations?
 
Way below optimal. But there were a few (winning) candidates without a huge meta presence.
 
well, voting and campaigns are on meta...
 
@idjaw Yep.
 
people who don't ever show their face on meta are much less likely to actually cast a vote in elections
 
7:58 PM
that makes sense
 
@PM2Ring I decided to add an answer to the weird numpy question. I did chop off a value from the example to make it rectangular, and I'm pretty sure using map() is not nice in numpy. Then again, the whole question is very not numpy-friendly.
if there's a more elegant solution, I can't find it
@BhargavRao nomination period began 1 minute ago \o/
 
Yeah, I'll add my nomination in a few secs.
 
new badge, wow [unimpressed cat gif]
 
Wow, My draft was 60 characters long.
 
8:07 PM
@wim Suspensions like that are a manual moderator job.
 
I'm just reading it:)
you might want to be more specific, we have only one Martijn but Jon might be ambiguous
well, maybe one elected Jon mod...
 
cbg
 
> I do not feel ashamed to accept my fault. Failure is the stepping stone to success.
I think that should be "faults"
 
8:10 PM
and there's a ", But" in "Why not me?"
 
Edited, Thanks.
 
re-cbg
 
@AnttiHaapala caviarg
 
and thanks to everyone for reminding me of my aging :D
 
hehe:D
 
8:11 PM
@BhargavRao Psh. You should've ran with the idea that you had only one fault ;)
 
@AnttiHaapala If that helps, I thought you were a bit older. This just probably means that I'm old.
 
Lol, Yeah.
 
@Bhargav with 40/40 and those stats, I don't think your chances are all that bad:)
 
@AndrasDeak my soul is older than my body
 
@BhargavRao: good luck!
 
8:12 PM
aren't Finns born at age 50?
 
@MartijnPieters Thanks. (And sorry for taking your name, I had to :) ... )
 
@BhargavRao Note that I didn't actually win the 2014 Winter Bash :-P There was a tie for 1st place, and that tie was broken by picking the user with the most hats on one site. By that measure I was second ;-)
 
@MartijnPieters Ouch. I was 1st. :/
 
@BhargavRao I completely missed that by the way
 
@BhargavRao all the better!
 
8:17 PM
O Lord. I received 6 notifications at once. The first time in my life. :D
 
It's 9th that the election results are announced, right?
I bet @tristan can't wait to find out the results, he'll be like a kid on Christmas.
 
this one shows a tie with 39 hats:P
it's Quill I remembered as winner
@Ffisegydd no, there's one week for nominations, and then comes the voting:P
 
@BhargavRao good luck xD
 
@BhargavRao and good luck from me
 
@MooingRawr thanks.
The site is still up
 
8:25 PM
the site is, the leaderboard errors out for me
 
@BhargavRao the leaderboard is b0rken.
 
@AndrasDeak Yep, Typing answers.
 
good, good;)
 
@MartijnPieters Ah, Did not see that. Checking now.
 
8:35 PM
web.archive has a cached leaderboard from march, I'm checking out network-wide vs SO leaderboards
 
user6568562
@Martijn Hey, man. My stalking issues are* well documented in this chat. I think I read in one* of your interviews that you worked at Zope. And I also think that I listened to Guido talking about his time working at Zope. Am I correct in thinking that you worked in the same company ?
 
@Bhargav is unique #1 on SO:)
36 hats, second alecxe with 35
network-wide cached page is january 1st, not final version
no wait, there's a newer version of that
 
@randomhopeful Yes, Guido and I worked at the same company. At the same time even!
 
yup, network-wide tie between Quill, David and Bhargav with 39 hats:)
 
user6568562
@MartijnPieters Nice !! idjaw's fate is one cool phenomenon. It must have been cool to work on something way before it was cool. If you have resources to point me towards, I would be gladder than I already am [ :
 
8:43 PM
@randomhopeful what kind of resources?
 
wow mod els.
 
user6568562
@MartijnPieters I've got all the Python primer I need :D I was thinking more along the lines of Python's history told by early Pythoneers. But any resource would be greatly appreciated
 
@BhargavRao you have my vote :D
 
@AnttiHaapala Thanks.
 
@randomhopeful there's Guido's History of Python blog, perhaps.
 
user559633
8:46 PM
@Ffisegydd Disappointed, no matter what I receive?
 
Why don't the nomination comments link properly? It's a bit odd to scroll down everytime.
 
The part where he joins Zope is here.
 
@BhargavRao they also don't auto-load, nor can be voted on
 
@BhargavRao that's been broken since the dawn of time.
 
@MartijnPieters so...tradition!
 
8:47 PM
@AndrasDeak exactly!
 
That's kinda bad.
 
They are neutered comments, to make sure they can't be voted on. Unfortunately, that also means they don't link properly.
 
user6568562
@MartijnPieters Nice ! Thank you [ :
 
wim
@MartijnPieters Did you suspend that guy? Why was he suspended? Only the second time I've seen someone active in the python tag get a suspension :)
 
@wim Who are we talking about?
Ah, Padraic.
 
wim
8:55 PM
yeah
 
No, that wasn't me. I can't discuss the reasons either, sorry.
 
wim
curiosity killed the badger
 
are you allowed to answer whether it was automated or mod-decided?
 
@idjaw I already did that.
49 mins ago, by Martijn Pieters
@wim Suspensions like that are a manual moderator job.
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak Did you link this blog post sometime before ?
 
8:57 PM
@MartijnPieters thanks. Sorry...on mobile...
 
user6568562
I could swear I already read it after you posted it
 
@randomhopeful I might have, I'm not sure
 
@randomhopeful That post is linked from several answers on SO, for sure.
 
user6568562
@MartijnPieters @AndrasDeak I'm pretty sure it was, and that my first encounter was Andras sharing it and that I am too dumb to check who is the blog owner
 
user6568562
It's just that I appreciate but will never understand this make-a-great-thing-and-share-it-for-free culture. God knows productivity is f*cking hard to achieve
 
9:00 PM
@randomhopeful you mean that Guido guy?
ah, OK, I see what you mean:)
 
Gah, I wrote up a big reply to the guy on this issue, but now I'm thinking I don't even want to keep the conversation going: github.com/pallets/markupsafe/issues/45 "SQLAlchemy is anti async/await and wheel so I don't think it's a good idea to follow their approach."
 
user6568562
I do mean that Guido guy :D First time I came across that blog post I thought, man, this guy* knows Python !
 
SQLAlchemy is against neither of those things, and they have nothing to do with the issue of where to package speedups.
 
he does;)
although his history stories need some citations...
oh, that reminds me of a post you'll love if you haven't seen yet
 
"you should put the speedups in another package" is not a solution to "we need to figure out the workflow for building a suite of wheels"
 
9:03 PM
@randomhopeful if you haven't seen it yet, take a peek at this answer, then on the top comments:D
 
user559633
@davidism What is he talking about with markupsafe? Does it have some binary portion that makes it harder to bundle?
 
Yeah, the escape functions have C speedups, but the build still uses the Python version if it can't compile them, so there's no errors.
 
user559633
Oh. So he's asserting that there should be an optional flag to force build the binary/c-ext?
 
I've been trying to work out how to build a comprehensive set of wheels the last few days. It's very poorly documented.
No, he's saying they should be in a separate package. Which doesn't answer the question of how to build them in the first place.
 
user559633
Oh. Wow, yeah, cv-pls off-topic
 
9:08 PM
Putting them in a separate package also means they won't be installed for anyone, instead of just anyone without a compiler, which is not idea for a mostly invisible utility library.
 
user559633
yeah. or default to trying to get it anyway and then sniffing out if they're available
 
Once I figure out the workflow it won't matter anyway, that's the whole point of wheels.
 
user559633
i thought it was just a speedup, not a replacement for compiling non-python
 
Platform wheels precompile extensions for specific platforms.
It's why you can install numpy so quickly now, for example.
 
user559633
ah, cool, where wheel maintainer needs to provide a number of pre-compiled objects, otherwise, back to compiling locally
 
9:14 PM
Exactly, the maintainer does the build instead of the installer.
 
So, now I'm getting an error when importing tkinter. Tried linking to tcl86t.dll and tk86t.dll but still did not work. Its like it doesn't even find tkinter. Am I missing something?
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak This is amazing ! It feels good to know better about the helpful things you're downloading
 
Did you read the comments? Those are the real gems:D
 
user559633
@davidism have a sec to proofread a response? (will PM you)
 
@tristan sure
 
9:24 PM
Hi everybody,
I’m newbie in python and Theano
I installed Theano on ubuntu, How can open theano deep learning sample and run it.
 
wow...I got a badge for visiting the nomination page? haha ok
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak I did !! Although I still need some time to wrap my mind around the technical details, I digged the consistence of Adler's answers
 
Basically I can't import any of the compiled built-in modules like tkinter and multiprocessing. Any ideas on why this is happening?
 
user6568562
The headache of discovering new paths to understand the unknowns is the best kind of suffer !
 
9:30 PM
thanks:)
Very familiar faces as candidates, so far
 
Rhubarb, Time to sleep. :(
 
rhubarb
 
user6568562
@BhargavRao You've put a lot of thought to your answers. It's a bit sad that everything has to be politicized, nowadays, but I sincerely do hope you get elected. Especially for you programming know-how
 
user6568562
And rbrb [ :
 
wim
Does anyone else find this kind of thing oxymoronic? stackoverflow.com/q/40474537/674039
 
9:39 PM
@randomhopeful Thanks. :)
 
wim
annotated duck typing ... hmmm
It's like, I want the worst of both worlds!
 
sorry I was distracted by the word duck..... What a fantastic word.... duck.... it's a noun, a verb and an adjective..... and it also rhythm with a certain, well flexible bad word...
 
@wim I had a great question the other day, someone was wanting to call a child method from the Parent class
if we want to talk about the worst of things
 
@MooingRawr what the duck do you mean?
 
wim
f*ck typing: pretending that PEP484 was never accepted and the typing module doesn't exist.
 
9:45 PM
I've ignored it. No intention of using it
 
yall all quacks
 
why all this whining
type hints rule.
though, I must confess I'd really like some static typing...
 
wim
Antti for real or trolling ?
 
@wim for real :D
 
user6568562
You know what the ancient Chinese proverb says @idjaw
 
9:52 PM
@idjaw is there Python 2?
 
user6568562
f*ck Python 2
 
hehhe
 
wim
Why do you like them? Was python your first language?
 
Antti you should run as mod and just have one simple responsibility: cleanse py2 from SO
 
9:53 PM
Welp it's freedom time again, Rhubarb all till tomorrow \o
 
you have 7 minutes left according to my clock
get back to work
6 now
 
wim
I would be happy for them to stay in mypy , no need to bring it into the language proper
 
@wim mypy was to become a language proper.
 
user6568562
@wim I'm most certainly not getting type hints, but what's some extra detail to do wrong ?
 
9:56 PM
but anyway there are already some interesting things that can be done with them...
 
Language question again: does "dangerous goods administrator" make sense in a logistics context for somebody who does the freight forwarding of dangerous goods?
 
Yeah, that sounds fine.
 
my concern is for "administrator"
 
I would assume they managed people who did the forwarding.
 
user6568562
Well, dangerous goods exist and you can administrate about anything, dangerous goods included
 
9:57 PM
If that's not the case, maybe shipper or processor?
 
Administrator of Dangerous Goods?
but, yours still sounds perfectly fine
 
I mean a dispatcher, who sends drivers on their routes
 
Yeah, administrator works fine then.
 
wonderful, thank you both:)
 
Or even Administrator of Shipping of Dangerous Goods.
 
user6568562
9:58 PM
@AndrasDeak I found a job ad for Agency contact information Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration
 
Depending on how specific you want to get.
 
@idjaw you got me, but I tend to go wash my cup and what not before leaving xD btu this is good bye for now
 
:P later
 
user6568562
Hazardous materials being == dangerous goods, I can safely suggest that it can be used
 
Also, "Administrator of Dangerous Goods" is my new dream job. It sounds like something out of a comic book.
 
9:59 PM
@randomhopeful yeah, but "hazmat administration" might be an office, that doesn't mean that the dispatchers there can be called administrators:)
at least that was my rationale
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak Hmm, I see your point. Depending on the dickishness of the recruiter you can add a zest of "grandeur" to your words. If you're planning on including details to that position, I think you can use that phrasing
 
user6568562
i.e describing what Administrating dangerous goods consists of
 
I love Skeptics. This question is well worth reading. skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/35801/…
 
I'm fairly certain that the sister-in-law who needs this will be applying to a Hungarian company, for Hungarian people
 
wim
I'm trying to find a link , some people indented javascript code so that it looked like python. It had all these semicolons and braces down the right hand side. It might have been a tweet or a screenshot. Help?
 
10:02 PM
@wim yup, recent thing
 
user6568562
@wim I came across that post and I found it rather well thought of
 
Oct 22 at 12:49, by Wayne Werner
Use whatever brace style you prefer. But not this. Don't do this. Seek help instead of this. https://t.co/1EYb7BLHkb
 
Yeah, that was Java, not Script
 
potato, potatoscript
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak You beat me to it :D But I did use your "I see a Python programmer" quote to find it :D
 
10:06 PM
yay, first triangle in opengl rendered
now I just need to figure out what the hell happens there
 
@randomhopeful good call:)
 
@ŁukaszRogalski what libraries are you using?
 
@davidism #include <GLFW/glfw3.h>
#include <OpenGL/gl3.h>
 
Oh, I thought you were talking about Python.
 
wim
@AndrasDeak thats the one. thx
 
10:08 PM
You can see how I could have made that mistake. :-/
 
nah, breaks from Python are needed sometimes
makes you appreciate more how easy is to do things in Python
 
my imagination is vivid enough to not need that:P
 
What I want is an explanation of how to pass an OpenGL surface to Cairo for drawing 2D. In Python.
I don't want to draw a bunch of sprites just to have 2d textures to move around, I got so used to making objects draw little circles in Game Maker.
But Cairo's drawing is so much nicer than calculating verticies for OpenGL.
 
so why woukd you need opengl for 2d?
 
Performance, shaders.
 
10:15 PM
@davidism what are you doing in OpenGL?
 
Is "co-department" a thing? As in another department in the same company?
 
Nothing, yet. I used to make little games in Game Maker, wanted to get back into it a while ago but also wanted to learn OpenGL.
 
user559633
10:30 PM
Cats have incredible internal clocks. Feeding time: 630pm. One just walked in the room holding a banner protesting the use of DST.
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak I don't think so : / Co- implies very close cooperation, I would guess
 
funny/useless thing I noticed on the nomination page. The "comment score" tag is still there, just oddly hidden. I would expect the entire tag to just not be part of the page.
 
@randomhopeful yeah, thanks, I've been Canadianned in another room in the mean time:)
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak :D
 
user559633
@idjaw i see it as empty of score as well. i imagine this is just so they don't have to make another template
 
10:34 PM
@tristan yeah..that makes sense. It's such a temporary thing. No need to perfect it.
 
10:51 PM
Prepping to work on projects on a plane shows you how hard it is to get good offline documentation :/
 
user559633
@KevinMGranger kapeli.com/dash
 
user559633
or full page -> print to pdf
 
I've just been opening a ton of tabs and ctrl+s-ing. I used to know the correct combination of the arcane 27 necessary wget flags, but I've since forgotten
Or letting it shape which part or which project to work on
 
user6568562
@tristan Man, that's so inviting to big bucks land
 
user6568562
So many docs to procrastinate over
 
user559633
11:00 PM
just download it and crack it use it in trial mode
 
user6568562
What about the for MacOS Thing ?
 
user559633
Oh, you're on a Linux? There's likely an open source equivalent
 
user559633
 
user6568562
Ouuuh that's f*cking awesome ! Thanks, dude
 
user559633
on flights, i like to drink, watch tv, or just write mindless code because i don't like being around a lot of people, heights, or closed in spaces
 
user6568562
11:05 PM
I'm ready to sleep and dream about all these offline docs. Laters everybody [ :
 
user559633
have a good night buddy :)
 
11:43 PM
I'm off too, good night
 
11:54 PM
later @AndrasDeak
enjoy the evening
 
it's bedtime;)
but I will:D
you too
 

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