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4:00 PM
2 mins ago, by Unihedro
(Of which mediocre programmers use to get around the guilt caused by writing horrible and few documentation.)
 
fge
SIGSEGV again in i915_dri :(
 
Programming without comments is bad in that it leads to maintenance inefficiencies and unreliable flow.
So does documentation.
 
fge
@Enissay not really a solution for it, since a month can have various durations by definition
Anyway, try TimeUnit
 
@Michael Sure :)
 
The idea goes: You should code in such a way as to make the code self-explanatory. This means that you don't have to write documentation, which means that you don't have to keep the documentation updated, along with code. Keeping documentation is a little dangerous, because inaccurate documentation is worse than no documentation.
 
4 mins ago, by Unihedro
Ease of self document-ability is a lie.
 
I worked at a place that used this coding style. I understand the reasons behind it, but I still didn't like it.
 
No, there will never be truly self-documented code that is reliable.
CommitStrip has proved this.
 
@Unihedro lol
 
4:03 PM
And documentation in the form of comments goes out of date, always. That's why you only should document why you're doing something. Years of working on a codebase in a bigger team will teach you this.
 
One downside is that you end up having these methods with ridiculously long names.
 
8 mins ago, by Unihedro
Code understanding is best represented by its structure, how well documented it is, and the ease of expanding.
@SebastiaanvandenBroek Which is exactly what I said? ^
 
I never said you shouldn't add why you're doing something
But you shouldn't be explaining WHAT the code is doing
If that is required, it was bad code in the first place.
 
8 mins ago, by Sebastiaan van den Broek
documented... meh, if lines of code needs comments other than WHY something is happening, it's bad code
 
Yes you see, it says 'other than WHY', thanks for showing yourself
 
4:05 PM
@SebastiaanvandenBroek I feel like you're trying to mock the KISS principal but you're doing the wrong thing.
(Keep It Simple, Stupid)
 
fge
@SebastiaanvandenBroek that is, sorry to say it so bluntly, bullsh*t
 
^^^^^^
 
Sorry you feel that way :)
You honestly feel the need to explain what your piece of code is trying to achieve?
 
@SebastiaanvandenBroek "other than WHY" != "WHAT the code is doing"
@SebastiaanvandenBroek You mean you don't?
 
fge
Honestly, for tricky pieces of code? Yes
 
4:07 PM
Yes for very tricky stuff possibly, but those would be very exceptional
 
fge
If largetext didn't have comments and documentation in the code you wouldn't be able to follow what it does
 
By no means there should be comments in every other class telling what should be happening there
that's why you have unit tests and well written code
 
fge
I do have unit tests and well written code
Better than your average joe if I may say so
This is not why I don't document however
Quite the opposite, I document a lot
 
@SebastiaanvandenBroek Then you are not justifying having every other class.
 
My feeling is that you should strive to write self-documenting code, and back that up with well written comments.
But the thing is, not all programmers are good writers.
Especially if you have people who don't speak whatever the company's native language is.
That's another benefit to self-documenting code.
 
4:09 PM
Ah yes, the multilingual coding experience.
 
Hmm I don't really believe in teams that don't speak the same (natural) language
Development is as much about communication as it is about coding
 
What?!
 
Well, they might be able to speak the native language, but it might not be their native language, which means they may not be very good at writing in it.
 
fge
Now, if only I knew how to smooth the lines
 
For example, an American company with teams in America and India.
English is the native language, but for the people in India, English may not be their 1st language.
I think that's a huge benefit to self-documenting code. That and many people are not good writers.
The self-documenting code theory is basically saying: "We know most of you guys are not good writers, so instead of hurting you're feelings, we'll just ask you not to write anything." xD
 
4:13 PM
Yeah true, but I think it's a big danger if development teams cannot communicate both in spoken and written form in the first place
 
@SebastiaanvandenBroek For sure.
 
And I mean communicate well, not just being able to get some understanding after a lot of effort
 
Yep.
 
fge
Well, you should learn to document anyway
Any developer should
And yes, this is hard
 
Hard? Kidding.
 
4:15 PM
Documentation for me is different from explaining every other bit of code left and right
 
fge
But lowering the barrier of entry to software development is not a solution either
@SebastiaanvandenBroek and who said it was about that?
I just told it: documentation is hard
And it is not an exact science
 
Personally, when I use the word "documentation" I'm thinking of Javadoc-like comments--comments at the method and class level.
 
Oh wow, these statistics I found are killing me!
 
Well I never made the point that documentation shouldn't happen, it's a bit of a generic term. I just don't like lines of code being commented all over the place.
Yeah same
 
fge
If it were I wouldn't have had to do sessions on java.nio.file and nobody would use File today :p
@Michael that's only a part of it
 
4:17 PM
@SebastiaanvandenBroek The official definition of code documentation is "written text that explains how objects and methods operates and how to use it", nothing about it remotely hints explaining every other bit of code left and right. What are you trying to convey here?
 
Apparently the average woman spends 21 minutes of every day thinking about going on a diet. The irony is; if they spend those 21 min exercising, they wouldn't need to go on a diet b:')
 
Software documentation is written text that accompanies computer software. It either explains how it operates or how to use it, and may mean different things to people in different roles. Documentation is an important part of software engineering. Types of documentation include: Requirements - Statements that identify attributes, capabilities, characteristics, or qualities of a system. This is the foundation for what shall be or has been implemented. Architecture/Design - Overview of software. Includes relations to an environment and construction principles to be used in design of software components...
 
"Commenting" is adding notes deep inside the code to help make it clearer. "Documentation" is adding class and method-level descriptions that make it easier for other programmers to use the API you've written, without having to inspect the code themselves.
 
Requirements, architecture, design and overview. That is all to software documentation. Littering code with comments? None of us promoted that.
 
Alright, then we're basically agreeing
 
4:18 PM
@Unihedro +1
 
No agreement is to be made. You just abided to the fact, finally. That is all.
 
@fge Speaking of it, I just completely edited my code to use nio. Not even an ounce of io left :P
 
Now if you excuse me having said that I am preparing for an alpha preview of JChatExchange.
Dun dun dun.
 
Not really Unihedro, you're still miffed 'cause you can't understand scala code :P
 
@Gemtastic Applies to men too, I'm sure. xD
 
4:19 PM
@SebastiaanvandenBroek I obviously code in scala.
 
@Michael yep. You'd be surprised what only 20 min of exercise per day will do for you
if you increase it to 30, even a normal stroll will count
 
As a matter of fact, I code in a handful of languages, but only focus on the useful ones I can "just get things done with it". I've used Scala for our back end architecture once, then dropped it and used C++ as a replacement.
 
You should follow the coursera course on functional programming by Odersky himself, it's really great
 
No thanks. I am not willing to invest time in methods where better alternatives exist. It's just not what I do.
 
@Unihedro I don't get it.
 
4:26 PM
@Michael Me neither.
 
fge
@ItachiUchiha good :p
 
@fge are there any performance improvement with the nio package?
 
fge
4:57 PM
YESS
@ItachiUchiha very probably so since it was rewritten from scratch since Java 7, so they use better I/O primitives when they are available
 
@fge \o/
 
fge
@Michael I had to adapt code from here for that
 
@fge Huh?
 
Duck duck go!
 
fge
@Michael this is not standard in JavaFX
 
5:07 PM
hi
is there any math chat room on here?
 
fge
On StackExchange, yes, I believe there is
 

 Mathematics

Associated with Math.SE; for both general discussion & math qu...
 
(y)
 
1
A: "Why shouldn't I answer off-topic questions?" FAQ

UnihedroAnswered off-topic questions make them seem OK and therefore fade into the depths before attention is attracted to remedy the situation. Questions are only closed because sufficient users see them to cast their close votes. While it's true that users may subscribe to tags and therefore sift thro...

♪ ♫
 
This is the question, I can't seem to find any tutorials on how to draw the diagram up, has any of you guys worked on this type of math before?
 
fge
5:24 PM
0
Q: Can I keep integral tick marks even with autoranging on an Axis?

fgeI "stole" some code from here to have an AreaChart with "smooth lines" which I use in my FXML and it works: <SmoothedAreaChart fx:id="chart" legendVisible="false" title="Tree depth by line" animated="false"> <xAxis> <NumberAxis fx:id="xAxis" tickUnit="1.0" autoRan...

 
javafx??
looks more like xml/html..
 
fge
Well yeah, you can use (pseudo) XML files to describe your UI elements
 
XML sucks.
 
fge
Yeah, I'd have preferred if they used JSON, but now it's too late, right?
(and javax.json is not part of J2SE anyway)
 
I'd love to use YAML for some of the front end stuff I'd be doing, but I can't find a good technology that parses it.
 
fge
5:31 PM
Urgh
I hate yaml
But uhm, have you trief org.yaml:snakeyaml? (TestNG has this as an optional dependency; I pruned it out since I don't need/want YAML)
 
Firstly, it would had worked if I was doing it entirely out of Java, but snakeyaml is a decent dependency bind.
 
Off to lunch. Later @all.
 
6:08 PM
@uni der?
 
6:32 PM
He should be sleeping
 
yeah got it
 
6:46 PM
Does any1 use IntelliJ here?
 
@fge does
 
7:09 PM
Android studio
 
kya
I started last week, to use it. I am still a java learner, so I cant say much about it, except that I prefer it compared to Netbeans. Netbeans = headaches
 
Personally I don't really see why one IDE is better than the other when it comes to java. All JVM compiles the same and the GUI is just looks; they all kinda work the same and you can customize most things...
 
hello everybody
 
JetBrains IDE's are awesome :)
 
I have a question guys.
 
7:14 PM
@HamZa why? what makes it different?
 
kya
I struggle to import jar packages into Netbeans
but its easy with intellij
 
what should I learn J2EE or JS , I wanna be a web designer
 
kya
We are in the same boat Zawinski
 
so help us guys
 
kya
One thing I don't is why its so difficult to import a jar file into Netbeans. I would add it successfully, but when I type the "import statement" it just doesn't pick it, but I haven't had that issue with intelliJ
 
7:21 PM
@Gemtastic I've heard great stories about it. Also I've tried Android Studio and PHP webstorm and it is awesome
 
@Zawinski a web designer should learn JS. A web developer should learn the web part of JavaEE
@HamZa that's not very convincing at all :P
 
@Gemtastic, what is difference b/w web designer and web developer
 
@Gemtastic I know and I'm not trying to convince anyone.
 
kya
Designer you do Web interfaces, looks and feel
 
@Gemtastic One does not simply build a website's backend with Java
 
kya
7:23 PM
Developer is where you do the backend, basically giving the interface a brain
 
@Zawinski Technically, a web designer only design the layout for the site, they don't actually code. Though in some countries (like mine) a designer both design and code the front-end code for the design. A web developer only does code.
 
Also why the heck should a designer learn JS? Is this a startup company?
 
@HamZa I am well aware of that; I've just done it :P
 
575
A: What's the difference between JavaScript and Java?

Greg HewgillJava and Javascript are similar like Car and Carpet are similar.

 
7:28 PM
So what pays u more a JS or a Java Developer
 
@Gemtastic I find that blog post offensive "JavaScript belongs in the same category as PHP, Python and Ruby, and they are cookies." BS
 
@HamZa They do belong in the smae category
However, they have their own sub-category
 
kya
No way, Hamza. php has evolved
 
You can't really compare raisin cookies to chocolate chip
 
@Zawinski Learning a language just for the money is not a good start
 
7:29 PM
I know but to get a job as a developer which one pays more
 
kya
Why dont you just learn both ?
 
@Zawinski you never know. What if after 10years there will be Jabbascript which will take the market
 
so J2EE is the correct choice
 
kya
it helps to know some JS Framework and a backend language
 
> Jack of all trades. Master of some.
 
7:30 PM
I can only speak for the market in my country, and here the designer job is really overflowed with people so the wage is terrible and jobs are hard to come by. Developers earn much much more.
 
I agree @Gemtastic
 
kya
Yeah! even in my country, developers earn higher, except if you are a php developer, then they expect you to know HTML, JS, JQuery, Ajax
Gemtastic has point
 
@kya "knowing" and "mastering" is two different things. Also as a PHP developer you should know some frontend languages.
 
@KYA i LOVE U
 
@Zawinski yet another online confession...
 
7:34 PM
HAHA
 
kya
:) you left me speechless. hahaha
 
JUST KIDDING DUDE
 
Something that's very important to know is that programming is a craft just like carpentry is. Anyone can nail a plank to another, but to build a house you need to master a lot of different techniques and put some art into it. Noone will hire a carpenter that builds a fence like this:
 
@Zawinski Loving someone is alright bro.
 
nor will they hire a programmer that codes in a similar fashion.
 
7:36 PM
I know do u love me @hamza
 
@Zawinski was that a question?
 
What do u think?
ok guys goodnight
 
@Zawinski No offence but I don't see a question mark. Also one of the reasons I'm not participating that much on the main site is that I'm tired to guess what the OP really meant.
 
@HamZa there's a flag for that
 
@Gemtastic I can vote to close it. So no need to flag in my case
 
7:38 PM
Though I agree :/ some people you can't help because you can't even understand what they are asking :/
@HamZa Well, how great then!
 
@Zawinski good night
 
kya
Sometimes writing English can be challenging. stackoverflow is international
 
@kya SO is an eye opener to the developer's world. I don't know about you but I'm sick and tired of code written in foreign languages
 
@kya Indeed, but there's a limit to how poorly you can write
 
kya
I agree, the question needs to be clear, the OP must need to show some effort as well.
I tend to use the comment section to seek clarity from the OP.
 
7:44 PM
@kya unless it seems interesting I skip lol
 
kya
lol! Sometimes I use Google translate, then I get more confused and give up
 
If the english is just poor, it's a golden mine for editing points
 
@ItachiUchiha do you know why the weekend hangouts is at 1:00gmt?
after 2000 reps you don't get any points trollolol
Well, at least your edit doesn't get in a queue for review
 
@HamZa That's fine. There are plenty people like me to harvest up until that point
 
kya
Right now I am struggling to migrate a Netbeans Java-struts 2 project into intelliJ. I thought it would be easy. ****Shocked*****
 
7:49 PM
Java is so well documented I don't have any questions that aren't already answered and I'm not advanced enough in Java to have questions that haven't been answered.
@kya what is about it that's hard?
 
kya
Cause intelliJ doesnt have the struts Framework
I saw Maven, Spring, and something else
 
fge
still coding and debugging
 
I should draw the visuals for my VP
 
kya
I am still a Java newbie, so I am still trying to figure things out. I wasn't expecting to expecting to experience any issues with importing a project
 
fge
Well, struts 2 is not a simple framework either
Actually I still don't use any "heavy" frameworks of sorts... I like my tools to be Unix like (do one thing, and do it well)
 
8:01 PM
Now I kinda feel like DL inteliJ just to try importing a project
 
kya
I interited the project from a veteran developer, so I don't much of a choice.
I am sure I will get it right, it just needs a little bit more time
fge, so you dont use frameworks in Unix ?
 
What you're saying makes no sense to me :P
 
kya
haha, Gemtastic, I know, I don't even make sense to myself cause I am still trying to figure out what the real issue is.
I just went to file, import Project to import the Netbeans project to intelliJ. Then I get to a screen where I am suppose to select a Framework. but to my surprise Struts 2 is not listed
 
I've been forking projects built in other IDEs just fine
 
In the Java 8 Date/Time API..why is there no Duration.MAX constant?
 
8:09 PM
@brcolow good question
 
doing Duration.ofDays(Long.MAX_VALUE) seems ... lame
 
Hello everybody, does anybody knows anything about the n bodies simulation using the barnes hut algorithm?
 
kya
Yeah! Gemtastic, I will get it right. I am sure I'm missing something very small
Gemtastic, have you heard of Tastic Rice ? I am not sure if its a international product
 
fge
8:27 PM
@GuidoCelada you already asked that question here, didn't you?
 
Never heard about the rice brand
My name is a mix between gem and fantastic
 
yes nobody answered
 
hello I have two int example:
first = 10;
second = 20;
and I want have first + second = "1020"
any ideas?
 
make it a string
 
I need int on output
 
kya
8:31 PM
its a popular Rice brand in my country. Its the best quality rice
 
Integer.parseString on the return
sorry
parseInt
 
thanks
 
you can also add 0 to the right
 
fge
Well, 10 * 100 + 20?
 
so check it :D
work, thanks
 
8:36 PM
@fge why is the hangout meeting at 2:00am?
 
kya
what if you convert the integers to string, then add them
 
fge
@HamZa uh, the last hangout is long overdue already, it was 6 hours ago
No next one is scheduled for now
 
kya
Guys its nap time for me! will deal with Java in the morning
 
@fge I meant the weekend hangout
 
fge
9:10 PM
Well, yes, it already happened
I mean, today is Sunday, right?
 
9:28 PM
Good evening
Got a question about POST data, and I think Java will be about the same as C#
I'm trying to use POST with HTTP to invoke methods and I thought I just send a specific string and with that string I know which method to invoke
 
Did you add your servlets to the web.xml?
 
:P yeah this is where it gets different i guess
Im gonna try my luck on C# forums
Thanks anyway!
 
Wait, are you doing it in Java or C#?
 
C# :P
 
Aah
Well, then you'll have better luck on the forum
 
9:41 PM
:)
 
Good luck! :)
 
9:59 PM
The forum is already full with easy questions. How I can improve my reputation as most of the questions now being asked are very difficult
 
 
2 hours later…
11:46 PM
@AmeyJain become an expert in a field and target specific tags
 
fge
11:58 PM
@AmeyJain well, if they are easy, answer them
 

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