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2 hours later…
03:33
hey folks
what is recommended database if you want to store a hashtable of integer sequences?
so like a hashtable of integer lists, what kind of DB would one recommend using
04:22
Hey, I know Python is powerful and all, but what exactly is it used for?
What exactly would I use it for? Especially if I'm an average joe. Or what if I'm not , and I'm a full-blown stack developer?
05:09
Hi guys I am getting some issue & need some help Kindly check :
05:47
@JossieCalderon "exactly" is the wrong word... see here: python.org/about/apps
@JossieCalderon And please don't flag non-spam or non-offensive stuff for merely violating room rules.
@Mayur note that you're supposed to wait 48 hours to post a link in the room like this, according to the room rules (see the link in the room description...)
@frogeyedpeas Uncle Bob has a story about writing a wiki application where they intended to use a database, but since saving to files on the file system would be trivial to implement, they did that instead and just created an interface to make it easy to switch to a database when they needed to. They wound up never switching to a DB...
@AaronHall sure noted
 
1 hour later…
07:14
Aaron holding the fort while the rest of us are asleep
 
3 hours later…
user11585758
09:59
hi guys
10:10
@smci as much as I hate to consider this option: are there other questions explaining the problem in the question title? If yes, I'll gladly close that one
10:37
The answer has gotten all those votes uniformly in time
 
4 hours later…
14:48
Someone asked me where they can read more about classes and functions (and everything else) being objects/values in python. Does anyone have a clue where this is documented?
15:14
I'm looking at the pypi download stats for my project, and there are some massive spikes. Any ideas why that might be? pypistats.org/packages/moviepy
@tburrows13 something like CI in projects that depend on yours? It has 6k+ stars on github
Interestingly, all those spikes are from linux users
Docker then?
*shrug*
How reliable are the stats? Is that an official site?
15:24
Its just so strange that one CI project would download it 50k times in one day
I think the data is straight from pypi
But not an official site
> What is the source of the download data?

>PyPI provides download records as a publicly available dataset on Google's BigQuery. You can access the data with a Google Cloud account here.
@Aran-Fey I don't think something like that exists. At least the official docs are rather vague on these topics.
kind of a shame, considering how many people are surprised by that little fact
The execution model would be my best bet, but it's not particularly explicit. "Names refer to objects." implies that everything with a name is an object.
That reminds me. Which of these 3 statements do y'all agree with most?
1. "values" and "objects" are the same thing
2. there's a difference between a "value" and an "object"
3. nobody cares
I'm thinking 1 (although 3 isn't wrong either)
2. and a bit of 3.
objects imply identity, values do not
15:33
hmm, interesting angle
it's possible to model values as objects and vice versa, though
I'd be happy with statement 1 if you added "in python" at the end of it
Sometimes, it's important to emphasize to people that a language's design choices may not carry over, without actually having to mention other languages
true, good point
There's an interesting SO Q on the topic for C++. The TLDR is: values are a concept, objects exist.
@MisterMiyagi I was trying to put into words what's in your second sentence
To me a value is the value of something. So values are objects.
And nobody cares
15:43
boy I'm sure glad I included option 3
@MisterMiyagi In other words, in the lexing/parsing phase there are "values" and at runtime there are "objects"? That's probably the most accurate way to think about it
16:05
epitome of "needs more focus" stackoverflow.com/questions/60352325/…
16:18
"We're using PyGame. Would dynamic floating point precision save power?" Not sure if serious or just...
How normal is it for pip install to fail from pypi...?
$ pip install PyQt5
Collecting PyQt5
  Using cached files.pythonhosted.org/packages/3a/fb/…
  Installing build dependencies ... done
    Complete output from command python setup.py egg_info:
    Traceback (most recent call last):
      File "<string>", line 1, in <module>
      File "/usr/lib/python3.7/tokenize.py", line 447, in open
        buffer = _builtin_open(filename, 'rb')
    FileNotFoundError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/tmp/pip-install-cmshs68n/PyQt5/setup.py'
I only learned yesterday that pyqt is on pypi, but now it won't install. I'm on a rollercoaster of emotions.
sounds like sdist is broken for PyQt5, ugh
to add insult to injury the source is on sourceforge
uuuh except the newest version isn't there, what the yam
OK, there's no setup.py, just an __init__.py on the project level
16:34
aren't non-setup.py installs a recent pip feature? have tried updating it off and on again?
hmmm, maybe
let me try that
@MisterMiyagi genius! Thanks. (That was it)
pip could be so kind as to give a hint
as far as I can tell, pip serves two purposes: 1) installing modules 2) dying with absolutely incomprehensible tracebacks
though the latter can usually be fixed by twiddling with the pip version a bit
There's no way to have a --user install of a package outside a virtualenv if I already have the up-to-date version in the system python, right?
my installed packages are starting to look like a Rube Goldberg machine, but I really don't want to start using a virtualenv by default :(
@AndrasDeak No idea. I only know about the simple things in life, like quantum mechanics.
My global (including --user) install doesn't find the pyqt5 that's installed right there, and the same works in a virtualenv. Which might be the universe sending me a sign.
The virtual environment was not created successfully because ensurepip is not
available.  On Debian/Ubuntu systems, you need to install the python3-venv
package using the following command.
But why? :(
OK, this is getting ridiculous stackoverflow.com/a/39539571/5067311
why the yam is python-venv a thing if venv should be stdlib
OK I'll just install that stupid package >:(
there there. ./pat
17:16
Is the setup.py-less feature related to PEP517?
hmm, yeah, probably
 
2 hours later…
19:04
@AaronHall @AaronHall interesting... i was tempted to do the same but am afraid my roommates will make fun of me
user11585758
19:23
:( guys got error "TypeError: Tensor is unhashable if Tensor equality is enabled. Instead, use tensor.experimental_ref() as the key."
user11585758
I found answer but not working
user11585758
oh got solved :)

Actually that was importing error,
19:56
hello, I've been writing a CNN from scratch to train on the MNIST data, but its been producing strange results, for example the accuracy rising to 30% and then just falling back down to 10%, could anyone please look at my code and find out why this is, because I'm stumped
http://dpaste.com/0B3HPW7
[12:08]
its very loosely based on this tutorial:
https://towardsdatascience.com/a-guide-to-convolutional-neural-networks-from-scratch-f1e3bfc3e2de
Thanks in advance :)
20:26
@3141 does an out-of-the-box implementation of the same neural net work for that input?
Hi
is anyone free to help a poor soul here
One of these days I'm gonna write a bot that links the room rules whenever someone links their 3 hour old question
3
@uiu808 we ask not to post fresh questions here. And you have an accepted answer.
@uiu808 you've already accepted an answer?
Yeah i think it does andras
I havent exactly checked though so i may be wrong, but i tried the same thing with lots of different numbers of filters.
I dont have access to a computer right now so i can check im afraid
@Aran-Fey thinking about this more, I think the heuristic could be tricky. Block the auto reply for any user with more than, say, 50 previous chat posts?
Or we just compare the poster name with the question linked. I guess that's pretty foolproof. My thinking didn't cover the obvious option :/
20:46
Well, we do get a fair share of questions posted from ban evasion accounts. Counting the number of posts is a good idea, but might be hard to implement
I've never touched the SO API. Storing a username and a post count (say for all users in the last 6 months) would be relatively tiny in a db. How easy would it be to see the hyperlink to a question and then see the author of the question linked to?
As far as I know there is no chat API
not a public/documented one, at least
Hmm ok. The main problem I envisage is a bunch of regulars having a discussion and then one posting "I've asked on main [here]" and getting a false-positive directing them to the room rules
I'm actually not even sure if there's an API for SO itself. I was kinda planning on web scraping
@AndrasDeak Hi, im pretty new, i didnt know i accepted. oops. but i still cant get the code to work
21:00
I'm half-tampted to play around with this. I actually don't know how the existing bots function on a basic level at all
@roganjosh hi roganjosh, by curiousity, yes, but didnt get the code to work ):
any help would be nice :)
@uiu808 you're under no obligation to accept an answer. If it didn't work for you, don't accept it
I guess the bot could learn who the regulars are just by listening in for a while; after a week or two it should know most of them. That should be a lot easier than finding out how many messages a user has posted in the past
I'm not gonna discuss the question itself here, since you're now familiar with the room rules. But don't accept something that doesn't solve your problem
@Aran-Fey it depends on polling then, though? If you're gonna go with scraping, you need only get the user id and increment a counter on every post
500 users with an incremental post count is still tiny and a really simple heuristic
Nah, scraping chat would be silly. Scraping was only intended for finding the question author
21:05
Aha ok
Then I'm not sure what the chat-side implementation is that you're envisioning?
I remember hearing that there are some half-baked SO chat bot implementations for python
coldspeed wrote one a while ago, come to think of it
but if we're honest, it's gonna take quite a few more occurrences of this before I'm seriously going to consider writing a bot. I've got my website to work on, after all
I should probably be thinking the same :P v2 of my site is just broken biscuits right now. I guess I'll prioritise that
21:31
@Aran-Fey if you look at the people currently in the room you'll see a number in the bottom right for each person. That's how many messages they've posted in the room.
@Aran-Fey there are plenty of full-fledged bot implementations for python
but I wouldn't spend too much effort on anything that lives on *.stack*.com
Is P = Union[str, Dict[str, 'P']] a correct way to describe a "arbitrary deep dictionary tree ending in a leaf string: string"?
Pycharm tooling seems to fall back on "any type" when using it though....
21:50
@AndrasDeak ha, can't argue with that
@paul23 Certainly looks like it should do what you want
I have to say I miss Flow as live type checker/type hints when working in python.
22:10
hmm what do you guys recommend to debug/test when a program is chiefly a management of subprocess calls? And nearly all bugs are in wrong ways subprocess' arguments etc are defined?
another programmer who owes you a favour?
jokes aside, id imagine that just on principle, it's tough to validate a callee's code from a caller's code. Add to that how subprocesses communicate at a very basic level, It would really fall on the callee's code to have robust handling. With the doom and gloom version out of the way: perhaps essentially treating subprocesses like black boxes and building tests MIGHT help?
Granted, this is coming from a guy who hasn't written a single test yet in any real sense of the word..so. :P
Sounds about right. Testing is calling a function and checking if it returned the right result. What's it matter if that function uses a subprocess?
Well the calls are basically all git & docker commands (It's a custom build & deployment system, but since the host os will not have git itself first temporary dockers are created that get git, then build commands are sent to that docker etc).
The "checking the return" is itself also subprocess, so I have a hard time decoupling those.
22:20
obligatory reminder: parse the piping, not the porcelain git-scm.com/book/en/v2/Git-Internals-Plumbing-and-Porcelain
Hmm not sure I'm up for that :P
Oh, so you're running commands with side effects. In that case I can think of two approaches: 1) Mock subprocess and verify that your code passes appropriate arguments to git/docker, or 2) Treat the external programs as a black box and check if everything is set up correctly after they complete their work
@paul23 I mostly meant making sure you use parse-friendly commands when there are multiple options
like using find rather than parsing ls
Slight tangent, but uh, my searching skills are failing me, was wondering if someone could help me with ideas on how to track down an older message from here. It was a youtube link to an almost 2 hour long python talk that i believe someone else had linked, 4 advanced python concepts or something like that. I "must" have replied to it i assume. however, so far no dice on tracking it down. :/
is there a way in chat to see only messages that were replies?
Well I'm using clone where I guess there's a more basic command.. git clone --single-branch --depth 1 ... . As well as git reset --hard for updates.
But the git is really a 'black box that gives code' - I'm not actively interacting other than retrieving data from it.
22:31
@ParitoshSingh not that I know of
if you starred it you can find it somewhere here
roughly when was it posted?
I wish i could say with any certainty. It must have been 2019, but not sure beyond that.
I hope i starred it, that seems promising enough
Hmm if you replied to a person you could search for "@xyz"
if you know which person
Have you tried looking for it in your youtube watch history?
oh, youtube watch history eh?. hmm, that route might be easier, let's see what that's about
looks like i must not have been logged in when i saw it. bummer
I now am seriously wondering if i misremembered or imagined this video being linked here
stackoverflow.com/questions/60288671/… < if this problem wouldn't have occurred I had 2 days less of work lol
22:41
@ParitoshSingh sorry, I can't find it
Don't worry, really appreciate the assist. Im going through every single starred message now on that link you gave :P
It has to have been starred i feel. I didn't star it though.
I wish they were time sorted.
this one seems to fit the bill quite nicely
@ParitoshSingh the ordering on the general star list is a mess
oh what the heck, I was the one who shared the link. O.O i found it though!
No stars. :P
Ok, it wouldn't help with validating non python subprocesses Sadly.
goes back to random surfing
23:33
I just realized that Times New Roman is significantly smaller than Arial and Verdana. No wonder I was having trouble finding a suitable font size for my website -.-
naive little me thought leaving the font and font-size at their defaults would be fine, but... nope
23:52
Your font was fine for me viewing on a phone FWIW
I had to rotate for code blocks but that's standard

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