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2:00 PM
>>> def test():
...     try:
...         raise Exception
...     except:
...         try:
...             raise Exception
...         except:
...             print('returning 10')
...             return 10
...         finally:
...             print('returning innerfinally')
...             return "innerfinally"
...         print('returning 100')
...         return 100
...     finally:
...         print('returning outerfinally')
...         return "outerfinally"
...
... test()
returning 10
returning innerfinally
 
I can't find anything on SO that explains that behaviour
 
@PaulMcG It's what I'm dealing with at work XD
Having trouble pulling an element out of this XML file with minidom
 
@AndrasDeak oh, that's actually pretty nifty, thanks.
this gives me a hunch now..
 
I'm trying to pull obj1 x1 data out of this gist.github.com/biggidvs/fb7c5e5d0534352f11a56cb8df4c1c9c
 
@Aran-Fey I think I figured it out. sopython.com/wiki/Riddles is "works on my machine" certified.
 
2:08 PM
Can confirm it works on my machine
 
same, let me check from mobile
works like a charm (tap toggles hidden state)
very zen with the "asks" preambles
 
yep, works just fine
 
Oh, nice. I didn't even consider how onhover selectors work for non-mouse-having systems.
 
Once the list has grown a bit longer we should sneak a "Simon says" in there as an easter egg
 
import inspect

def test():
    try:
        raise Exception
    except:
        try:
            raise Exception
        except:
            print('returning 10', len(inspect.stack()))
            return 10
        finally:
            print('returning innerfinally', len(inspect.stack()))
            return "innerfinally"
        print('returning 100')
        return 100
    finally:
        print('returning outerfinally', len(inspect.stack()))
        return "outerfinally"

test()
#Output:
returning 10 29
fwiw, the hunch was wrong. :P
still dont quite understand stacks, but atleast i can say there's no additional stacks being created for the inner context manager try except finally.
and apparently, if im reading this correctly, functions are implemented as a lower level on stacks. (something i didn't know)
 
2:13 PM
I was about to say "there's only 1 stack", but then I remembered generators and now I'm not so sure anymore
 
@ParitoshSingh I don't follow it at all and it's the first time (I think) that I've seen a return not breaking out of a function. I'd be interested to see a proper answer to it
 
mhm, same
 
It was your example; I think it would be a good SO question :)
 
i.. havent had much luck with SO questions :P
 
I'm sure there are more riddles than these four but my transcript-fu isn't very powerful today
 
2:16 PM
I don't have time right now, but I'll try to dig up my old ones later
 
@ParitoshSingh From all that I can see, that's a sample size of 1 and an upvote score of 2 :P
 
Where do you get these puzzles from @Aran-Fey they are pretty interesting, do you have a page where all these are published
 
Nevermind, got the XML to parse right with minidom
 
... We're in the process of creating that page right now
 
2:19 PM
Just took some finagling
 
@Kevin Very much appreciated!
 
gracias :)
 
@roganjosh guilty as charged :P o well, rbrb for now. i want to try digging a bit more, and then perhaps if i come up empty handed, we'll see.
 
(sopython.com/wiki/Riddles is the URL for those that missed it two pages up)
 
rbrb Paritosh
 
2:22 PM
thanks :) But how do you guys came up with these, maybe I will ask them in my next interview of a candidate applying for my company :D
 
hi
 
cbg
 
does somebody know what a: pixel-wise Gaussian with fixed scales. means? What does fixed scales mean?
 
Mine are a 50/50 mix of "after a very frustrating debugging session, I discovered this strange behavior" and "after reading through the darkest depths of the language specification, I discovered this strange behavior"
@DeveshKumarSingh I believe that these puzzles are a very very poor indicator of whether someone will actually be a good developer
 
@Hakaishin probably that the half width at half maximum is fixed?
Does that fit in context? A Gaussian with no free parameter.
 
2:24 PM
j=0
z=0
sum_hrs=[[0]*2]*len(np.unique(employee_list))

for employee in np.unique(employee_list):
    for i in range(len(data_agency_array)):
        if employee == data_agency_array[i,0]:
            sum_hrs[j][1] += data_agency_array[i,5]
    sum_hrs[j][0] = employee
    j+=1
Anything you guys see wrong here?
I get this as output :/
 
sum_hrs=[[0]*2]*len(np.unique(employee_list))
that's a lot of copies of the same 2-element list
 
I get duplicates
I thought that was initializing it :/ damn
 
@AndrasDeak I don't get this explanation. :P What is this supposed to mean? The text goes on: the first "background" component scale was fixed at σ_background= 0.09
 
In Ancient Python, try... except and try... finally were two different animals. See python.org/dev/peps/pep-0341
 
2:26 PM
@Hakaishin hmm, OK, I'm not sure about that because I've never done any image things and I don't want to say anything stupid
 
How do I initialize correctly in my case?
 
sure, but atleast they will kick off a good conversation about how to tackle it. Man there are other links attached to this page, nice thanks @AndrasDeak :)
 
@Pherdindy did you read the link? And, more specifically, the Q/A at the bottom that answers it
 
But a 1d Gaussian is c*exp(-x^2/x0^2), and multidimensional Gaussians are the products of such functional forms. You have x0 as a free parameter if c is a normalization constant. Coming from a stochastics angle that's what I'd expect "scale" to mean.
 
hint, use two for loops for the sum_hrs instantiation @Pherdindy
 
2:29 PM
Oh it's a post I didn't see the link
 
Since they 1) aren't asking the quizzee to write any code; 2) are asking the quizzee to write a substantial amount of code that might not fit comfortably in one code block; 3) are asking a question that the quizzer doesn't know the answer to
Respectively.
 
@Pherdindy The real question is why are you using lists & for loops with Numpy?
 
why not, to each his own :) post them and let people think it out
 
I was going to post my code in codereview
After I got it to work because I don't know stuff about data structures
I am a complete noob btw
I have no background on numpy and pandas
 
no worries, people start from somewhere, even I don't know about numpy or pandas, but you learn slowly
 
2:35 PM
That's fair enough. If you could formulate an MCVE/minreprex then we can try help you out on that side
 
I went straight to matplotlib to get some charts out
Not caring about efficiency yet lol
 
For example, you could create numpy arrays in several ways
 
Trying to jumpstart as fast as possible since I am quite busy as well lol just trying to expand my decision making to higher levels with programming so i have lots of holes
 
But it's more based on what you want to do
 
Yeah my problem is finding relevant resources I end up jumping around pages not understanding anything hah
 
2:39 PM
But if you want to use arrays like lists and do appends etc. then just stick with lists. Crossing between the two and not knowing how numpy works will probably make the code slower than it needs to be
 
Right what is a good order to learn the libraries though
Numpy before pandas?
Then matplotlib? To fill the holes in
 
matplotlib can be learned independently of numpy and pandas
 
numpy before pandas, matplotlib and pandas are largely independent but pandas has plotting routines using matplotlib
 
and numpy before pandas
 
numpy before pandas is probably a good idea, though it depends. matplotlib doesn't really require knowledge of either to work
 
2:42 PM
yes, you can plot normal lists via matplotlib
 
Well, that looks pretty unanimous on the numpy-before-pandas side :)
 
I see thanks lol time will find the time to do so probably juggling several people's worth of work with my sched
 
python3wos.appspot.com is looking good these days
Mostly because the moz- ones seem to have disappeared off the top 100 list
 
under the rug?
 
x = 2
x += 1
x
# 3
What is the dunder that enables that?
 
2:50 PM
__add__
 
I thought it was x.__iadd__
 
if it's missing it falls back on __add__
 
Then how does it know to assign the result to the name x?
 
__iadd__ I think the integer class defines that in the class definition?
 
@piRSquared x += 1 is x = x.__add__(1)
 
2:52 PM
It's not like x.__add__(1); x does the same thing.
 
same as lst = lst.__iadd__(item), which is why x = ([1],); x[0] += [2] works and it doesn't
 
okay I didn't realize the mutability stuff could be multiplied. Well fixed it with the list comprehension thanks
the reference rather
 
Hmm, ambiguity problem. Some of the riddles at sopython.com/wiki/Riddles have no known answer, so I put "Unknown" in the solution field. But some riddles have a solution and it's literally the word Unknown.
 
.?.,m;[
 
@vaultah I had assumed x += 1 is the equivalent to x = x.__add__(1) but that seems like Python is seeing x += 1 and looks for an __iadd__ if it doesn't find one then it does x = x.__add__(1)
 
2:54 PM
Is there a price to solve one of them :)
 
Well, apparently that's the output of dropping a rice cake on your keyboard
 
@piRSquared that is correct
 
For the open-ended riddles, I have no prize, other than my high regard
I will be very impressed if #7 ever gets answered in the affirmative without ctypes-level bithacking
Meta-riddle: fix the CSS for .spoiler elements on that page so links inside black bars aren't colored orange
 
I believe @Aran-Fey posted a riddle a while back around some surprising leading __ name mangling
 
@vaultah @AndrasDeak thx. I wasn't aware of the fallback
 
3:01 PM
inheritance from an instance object, now that's a first, as per the last riddle in the page
how do you even wrap your head around that
 
@Kevin Another Python riddle, from @Aran-Fey: chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/6?m=44300476#44300476
 
Thanks, I will add it in a moment.
I've definitely asked this riddle before but I can't find it in the transcript, so I will ask it again:
def f():
    raise Exception("Oops")
    #add a statement here so this program does not crash

f()
 
that's easy, name-mangling in python
Any identifier of the form __spam (at least two leading underscores, at most one trailing underscore) is textually replaced with _classname__spam,
 
Well, that explains what's at work, but it doesn't explain the outcome
 
The _Cls__var = 'option 2' outside the class overrides the inner mangled name.
 
3:09 PM
@Kevin yield something
 
which was `_Cls__var = 'option 3', is that correct?
 
@PM2Ring Very good :-)
 
In [10]: def f():
    ...:     raise Exception("Oops")
    ...:     yield
    ...:
    ...: g = f()
    ...: next(g)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Exception                                 Traceback (most recent call last)
<ipython-input-10-cb59f91e1eca> in <module>
      4
      5 g = f()
----> 6 next(g)

<ipython-input-10-cb59f91e1eca> in f()
      1 def f():
----> 2     raise Exception("Oops")
      3     yield
      4
      5 g = f()

Exception: Oops
the next on that iterator actually causes the exception to be thrown then?
 
Basically.
 
Basically. The g = f() just creates the generator. You have to start iterating over it to get the exception raised.
 
3:12 PM
so a yield basically keeps the last computed state of the function in it's memory, even if that state is a exception
 
cabbage
 
cbg
 
While yield does effectively store the state of the function when it executes, I wouldn't say that's directly related to the solution. That yield statement never executes.
 
@DeveshKumarSingh After g = f(), no code in the generator has been run yet.
 
ohh, so the code runs only when the next is called, which causes the exception to be thrown
 
3:15 PM
Yes
 
what about this
def f():
    while True:
        continue
        raise Exception()
        yield
 
what about it
 
hangs on first next
 
I predict that that code will never execute yield, and never raise an exception either, so trying to iterate over it or call next() on it will just make the program run forever
^^nice, independent verification
 
yes, the yield and raise Exception() doesn't do anything
 
3:18 PM
Yield does
 
but they won't be reached due to the continue right ?
 
Yes, but without yield it would be a regular function
 
Many of my riddles have a running theme of "code that never executes can still change the behavior of the program"
And by many, I mean three.
 
@DeveshKumarSingh True, but the presence of yield makes f a generator.
 
just the presence of yield, even if that is unreachable, that's interesting?
Is that just by semantics, or the code is interpreted in such a way ?
 
3:22 PM
What does that question mean?
 
I meant to ask, if the yield keyword is mentioned in a function, but that yield is unreachable, does that still mean that function is a generator, like the f() I defined above?
 
Yes, unreachable yields still make a function into a generator
 
do you meant to say this?
In [12]: def f():
...: while True:
...: continue
...: raise Exception()
...: yield
...:

In [13]: print(type(f))
<class 'function'>

In [14]: print(type(f()))
<class 'generator'>
 
Also f() won't hang
Remove the yield and it will
 
so the function is a generator, or it returns a generator?
 
3:25 PM
It returns one.
It's a generator function?
 
you are right @AndrasDeak it didn't hang, I means to ask since we have to call the function in order to get the generator object where we iterate on, It makes sense that it returns a generator
 
May 5 at 7:56, by Antti Haapala
@Arne it is slightly off... a generator function is not a generator, the return value is.
 
morning cabbage
 
cbg
 
hmm, guess I was right then great!
 
3:29 PM
Here's what the tutorial says: docs.python.org/3/tutorial/classes.html#generators Generators are a simple and powerful tool for creating iterators. They are written like regular functions but use the yield statement whenever they want to return data.
 
it remembers all the data values and which statement was last executed
but what does it remember before it was first executed, nothing?
 
Anyone have a second to see why my 'dist' isn't updating on my Tkinter window? gist.github.com/biggidvs/60a47f02d3ab956c1ae27200545ad753
 
def this_is_a_generator_function_also():
    return None
    yield
 
parse_xml is running in a thread and the tkinter window is on the main thread...it's always displaying 0.0
 
@DeveshKumarSingh Correct. Also, you can send data back into generators, using the .send method.
 
3:32 PM
@biggi_ Have you checked that the else branch of if float(xml_distance) <= .28: runs?
 
Yes it does
I've debugged it. The dist calculates up there and it stores it...it's just not transferring down to the Tkinter window
 
I basically never use global but it's in the scope of the class rather than the function that uses it. I need to check whether that's an issue.
 
It has to be an issue with scoping
I thought I did that right....globals are so much easier in embedded XD
 
What happens if you move global dist into the functions?
 
Then it works. Thank you.
So they have to be in the function, not in the class
 
3:38 PM
globals are not a property of the variable or the name, rather it's "local" information about the name
it also makes their use a bit less prone to bugs: nobody can magically turn your variable into a global three header files up
 
This is true. For some reason I guess I have more debugging to do...it just kinda locked.
Yay
 
how can I explain this code?
def fn():
    raise StopIteration
    yield
The StopIteration is raised on the first next which causes the generator to throw another StopIteration?
   Traceback (most recent call last):
    raise StopIteration
StopIteration

The above exception was the direct cause of the following exception:

Traceback (most recent call last):
    next(g)
RuntimeError: generator raised StopIteration
 
@biggi_ Why do you have self.lbl.pack() in the .run method, rather than in the __init__? It probably doesn't hurt, but it does seem a bit odd.
 
Because that's the example I found on doing what I needed and I'm starting to look into why everything does what it does :)
 
@biggi_ Excellent answer :)
 
3:45 PM
OTOH, having both __init__ and run starting updateGUI loops is probably not a good idea.
 
@DeveshKumarSingh how are you running your code/catching that error? because that traceback looks weird, and i cannot replicate it when directly running some code.
 
Here's what I was referencing (copy pasta'd most) and working on stripping what I don't need and figuring out what's going on stackoverflow.com/questions/10574821/…
 
g = fn()
next(g)
 
how did you run it specifically? what code did you write?
 
@PM2Ring I fixed that. What would that cause having 2 loops spun?
 
3:48 PM
@ParitoshSingh see above
 
I don't get the same error either. But I do get DeprecationWarning: generator 'fn' raised StopIteration and I have no idea what that means
 
got it. can you change it to raise KeyError or some other error and see the traceback that happens?
lol, what? i get much more reasonable/sane errors
 
@biggi_ In that code, it just means you have two updates of the Label every second.
 
@ParitoshSingh looks related to python.org/dev/peps/pep-0479
 
3:51 PM
@PM2Ring gotcha. so no huge issues, just for future sake it's best practice to only spin up one loop
 
@roganjosh yep, bingo, mine raises a runtimeerror, so that sounds right
 
so we found a PEP for this behaviour
 
i want to see your traceback when you raise something other than stop iteration
because your message post is still weird.
 
Traceback (most recent call last):

next(g)
line 2, in fn
raise Exception()
Exception
def fn():
    raise Exception()
    yield

g = fn()
next(g)
 
hm, alright. i find this part weird then "The above exception was the direct cause of the following exception"
i usually only see that kind of messages when some other exception handler is running code that raises an exception, and it lets the error bubble up. It's throwing me off
 
3:53 PM
here: another PEP: python.org/dev/peps/pep-3134
 
@biggi_ Yep.
 
yes the StopIteration which was supposed to be hit on the first next() was interrupted by the inner StopIteration, so it ended up chaining them, is what I think
but yes generally I have seen During handling of the above exception, another exception occurred:
 
Mar 6 at 18:30, by vaultah
You can no longer raise StopIteration inside generators
 
thing is, i don't get that message. i get a much nicer runtimeerror, no "during handling" clause included.
 
I still say generators are scary :(
Mostly beause I still don't quite 100% understand them
 
3:56 PM
which python are you running? I am running 3.7 ?
 
Traceback (most recent call last):

  File "<ipython-input-36-200409f11d8a>", line 10, in <module>
    next(x)

RuntimeError: generator raised StopIteration
 
On the topic of generators, I remember that Martijn once posed a fiendish riddle involving [yield x for x in range(10)]. I think that syntax is now illegal, which is a shame.
 
@biggi_ eh, dont worry, you'll get used to them. they're pretty powerful
 
... A shame for our Riddle collection, not for the Python community in general. Good riddance to it, really
 
@biggi_ the simplest generators that you usually use are just functions with persistent internal state that you can pause
 
3:57 PM
I know. I'm just used to dumping everything to an array and accessing it that way haha
Again, I'm a sparkey gone noob programmer because my boss told me to
 
@DeveshKumarSingh yep, 3.7.3
 
That's fine, I'm just saying generators are your friend ;) Though often not needed.
 
The dark is scary before you turn the lights on.
 
same here, then how come we are getting different errors?'
 
3:58 PM
you probably have different code
 
i blame pycharm
def fn():
    yield 1
    raise StopIteration
    yield 3
    yield 4

x = fn()
next(x)
next(x)
code is frankly just about the same. i added a couple extra yields to play around
 
ipython
In [1]: def fn():
   ...:     raise StopIteration
   ...:     yield
   ...:
   ...: g = fn()
   ...: next(g)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
StopIteration                             Traceback (most recent call last)
<ipython-input-1-f9cd90fdba5a> in fn()
      1 def fn():
----> 2     raise StopIteration
      3     yield

StopIteration:

The above exception was the direct cause of the following exception:

RuntimeError                              Traceback (most recent call last)
 
Correction: yield in a list comp isn't illegal yet, but it's going to be real soon.
 
@ParitoshSingh with your code
In [3]: def fn():
   ...:     yield 1
   ...:     raise StopIteration
   ...:     yield 3
   ...:     yield 4
   ...:
   ...: x = fn()
   ...: next(x)
   ...: next(x)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
StopIteration                             Traceback (most recent call last)
<ipython-input-3-06e8e790b941> in fn()
      2     yield 1
----> 3     raise StopIteration
      4     yield 3

StopIteration:

The above exception was the direct cause of the following exception:
 
@biggi_ Ok. It's probably ok to use a global here for your data, but it's not guaranteed thread-safe. If more than 1 thread can modify the value of dist Bad Things can happen. And I guess you can still have problems if the Tkinter code tries to read diff while the other thread is writing to it. As Bryan says:
you should use a thread-safe Queue object to communicate between the threads instead of using a simple list variable. — Bryan Oakley May 13 '12 at 21:26
 
4:01 PM
hm, weird
 
@AndrasDeak that Lidar I was working with output to a generator. PyLidar3
 
good, good, good ;)
 
I guess the OS doesn't matter? mine in installed via brew on a OSX
 
@PM2Ring yea I put a try and exception in there just in case something wonky happens
lunch time
 
yeah, os shouldn't matter for this.
 
4:03 PM
@DeveshKumarSingh I can repro your behaviour with ipython on 3.7
(3.7.0)
 
aah
btw how does this evaluates to three yields one by one?
def fn():
	(yield (yield (yield )))
it evaluates from outer to inner yield, or inner to outer yield
aah, inner to outer! but why ? is there a simpler explanation for this
 
i..uh..both? :P the code flow is as usual, it tries to evaluate what to yield
but the evaluation encounters another yield
and so on.
 
If it evaluated outer to inner, how would it know what value to yield?
 
I also noted today that they have different integer handling in 0.24
Maybe not news to others but I haven't been following the releases and that seems like a nice addition
 
Yes, nullable integer types
 
nani(nt)
 
mhm, it was brought up in here a couple weeks back coincidentally.
 
4:24 PM
it's optional, they've introduced new types for it. The handling and implementation is different
 
laurel
 
they've introduced a new backend for series called ExtensionArrays which make this possible
hmm, calling it a backend for series isn't accurate... they're more like wrappers over numpy arrays
in most situations you will never need to work with, or use the extension api directly, so you're safe for now
 
It sounds like you think this is a bad thing, or am I misreading?
 
not at all. It is a step in the right direction because extension arrays improve consistency in behaviour across various features
 
@cs95 sounds like a backend from the pandas side
Is this for pandas2? Or unrelated?
 
4:30 PM
No, it was introduced in 0.24
I'm not aware of a pandas2. I was under the impression they were still struggling to release pandas 1.0 :p
 
Part of it is detaching from numpy (if I recall correctly)
 
By all accounts I found maybe 6 months ago, pandas 2 is dead
 
Could be
 
I'm taking some real creative liberties transcribing Riddle #8 so the problem fits in one self-contained code block.
 
Interesting... yes ExtensionArrays wrap numpy arrays but I can see how easy it would be to just detach numpy and attach their own implementations
 
4:32 PM
I'm basically copying 80% of the solution into the problem and making up comments whole cloth. Oh well!
 
the code is too entrenched in numpy, I see numpy detachment as little more than a pipe dream
 
I'm trying to find the post by Wes
@cs95 Something along these lines
Wes, somewhere, has a bigger blog post about the reasons for it but I don't seem to be able to find it :/
 
those are some lofty goals to be certain...
 
Well, the first goal seems to have already started coming into play in the existing pandas library :)
 
I thought I once posed a riddle whose solution was "nonlocal/global statements work even if they're at the end of your function" but I can't locate it
 
4:43 PM
uh oh, Kevin's talking to himself again
 
I guess it's just as well since it's not legal syntax any more. Nobody wants to do riddles that are only compatible with 3.6-
 
wim
first usage of python-3.8 assex seen in the wild, and it's already an abuse stackoverflow.com/a/56212092/674039
why would want to assign to the exception instance, instead of raising exception?
 
Yuck
 
I still believe assignment expressions have potential, but that isn't it
 
wim
yeah it ruins an otherwise good answer
 
4:47 PM
I want assexp to be illegal in every context except if m := re.match(pattern, s):
 
wim
oh somebody here downvoted it. mean.
 
What if we removed the oddness of creating an exception but not raising it? Would the assex be more acceptable? i.e.
if (x := isqrt(n)) ** 2 != n:
    raise ValueError('input was not a perfect square')
#do things with x here
It still reads a little oddly to my eyes but I might chalk that up to unfamiliarity with the syntax in general
That said, my instinct is to limit my use of assexp to places where I don't need to add any additional parentheses to get the precedence to work right
 
wim
it just doesn't call for an assex at all
x = isqrt(n)
if x**2 != n:
    raise ...
 
"You could just replace that assex with an assignment statement followed by a conditional" is true, but doesn't that also apply to contexts where you would want to use assex?
For example, my re.match snippet
 
wim
@Kevin to be honest, yes, which is why the feature was so controversial in the first place.
 
4:55 PM
Well, the docs know everything apparently.
"The return value of a function is determined by the last return statement executed. Since the finally clause always executes, a return statement executed in the finally clause will always be the last one executed".
[Source](https://docs.python.org/3/reference/compound_stmts.html#the-try-statement)
 
Looks like our friend has been spamming assignment expressions in quite a few places
 
wim
hmm, I would think it's somewhat welcome on that question
certainly not on the isqrt one though
 
If you're saying "my question is specifically about nice alternatives to i = int(math.sqrt(n) + 0.5), and so any answer that suggests ways to improve the exception-raising code is largely off-topic", that's a reasonable objection.
 
when I said spamming, I really meant it. Literally 90% of all their newest answers spam assexprs
 
wim
yeah, I see that now. ugh.
 
4:58 PM
take from that what you will ┐(´∀`)┌
 
wim
wow this guy really likes assex
 
I occasionally add mostly-irrelevant style tips to my answers, but I try to explicitly label them as such. So as not to confuse readers into thinking that my style changes are necessary to get my solution to work.
 
If I understood correctly, assex is just using assignment based on a condition inside a list comprehension for example?
Which is a syntax error in 3.7
 
"Use isqrt and also assexp" might mislead readers into thinking that assexp is a precondition for using isqrt
 
it's a 3.8 thing.
it's also something I'm excited to see introduced in the language but not thrilled to see its misuse
 

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