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00:00 - 14:0014:00 - 00:00

00:03
hey up @zero. Is that in your neck of the woods, then?
250 miles from here.
Well, 250 across and 7 down ;-)
Strongest one I've felt in the 2½ years I've been here.
Kinda entertaining actually :-)
I guess, once you know no harm done...
Apparently no serious damage anywhere. A wall fell over near the epicenter.
Santiago in particular has world-beating construction standards, so there's usually no problem. The worry is always a followup tsunami (if you're on the coast, of course).
00:52
Cabbage all :D
And @PatrickMaupin, yeah, the question got deleted seconds after I posted it. Someone was asking how to make a "1 line Python file via semicolons". Only the most egregious of LPTHW
There were a few enlightening comments aimed at helping the user, such as "If you do this, Guido will personally come to your house and break your keyboard"
01:18
Seems it could be legitimate useful in some cases, i.e., command line scripting
02:00
echo text > file.py; python file.py @Sean
(This was like a 30 line algorithm too)
02:14
check out here docs, if you like that.
$ python << EOF
> print 'hello world'
> EOF
hello world
$ echo 'print "hello world"' | python -
hello world
Yeah also piping and EOF is awesome, but that's moreso general shell.
Like...

└──> lua << EOF
> a = 1
> print(a)
> EOF
1

Still is awesome for fast commands and the like.
02:53
There is python -c.
 
2 hours later…
04:23
yay 47 days at 200 rep
@AlexanderHuszagh If you do this, Guido will personally come to your house and break your keyboard" -- that's why I keep spares.
@AnttiHaapala Congrats!
Keyboardless Python -- Truly learning Python the Hard Way
And congrats Antti :D
why congratulate me, you should be congratulating the users who've gotten my answers to their problems ;)
We don't know them.
The thing is, if Guido comes over, I hope he doesn't hurt himself.
Patrick, saving that
I'm looking to get a tower soon (I've been using a laptop forever)
04:45
You have to not mind the clicky -- it feels great, though...
Don't mind, especially with noise canceling headphones.
05:37
cabbage
does the Counter class have an api which returns a dictionary of characters along with their counts...?
the items() call on it gives me a list of tuples ... not exactly what I want...
You can iterate the Counter object like a dictionary. In fact, it is a Subclass of dict
okay in that case... for x, y in c where c is an instance of Counter...it throws an error saying... ValueError: need more than 1 value to unpack
I mean I know dict.iteritems() does the trick...
but why that err msg..?
You can use items then
When you iterate over a dict you iterate over the keys
If you want to iterate over (key, value) then iterate over items
ah...makes sense...
Q: how do you wisely choose between iterating only over keys vs iterating over key,value pairs?
06:02
@deostroll, if you need only keys, iterate over only keys. If you need only values, iterate over only values. If you need keys and values, then iterate over keys and values.
06:50
Cbg
Hey up Boberto.
8 more working days, including today
Awesome.
Hey up all
How's the wife and little Fizzy doing?
06:52
Haha
Minifizz is good - wife is struggling still
She's gone from happily working much longer hours than me, to barely being able to work a 3-day week
And if you didn't know, sickness like this is meant to stop after about 12-16 weeks. She's on week 22, which probably means she'll have it all the way through pregnancy.
Slightly daunting prospect
That's unlucky :( hopefully it'll lift a bit
Yeah, in 18 weeks :)
The number of times I've had to turn the tv volume up, it's just not fair on me
Listen Bob. I get it. You're embarrassed to ask. It's fine! Completely understandable. So, let me say it for you: Yes, me and JRS will be the Godfathers of your unborn child.
07:00
The oddfathers
It's the least we could do for Fizzy Intrepid Martijn Grant.
@tristan I did something stupid
Bah, what about omuerto?
(spelling?)
@tristan have a SQLA model object thingy that if it doesn't exist, gets created like Model(id='new') in various places. Decided it'd be better to just define it once, in the __init__ method of the app, as default_model, and import it where I needed it. Don't think SQLA models like that.
Yes you have bobby. Watch out for bald sicilians kissing you now
07:06
More than I do already?
Nods imperceptibly
cringes
What's weird is, I don't really know any bald people. Even old people I know are all grey
JRS is bald, that picture is actually photoshop.
I know very few. Although next door's fancy man is a spectacular example.
My true likeness is known only to 4.
As in the guy from I Am Number 4?
07:10
Right, enough silliness for this hour:kids to skewel. Allez!
It seems bizarre that people here have actually real things to do like that. To my mind you all live in an internet-only bubble, similar to how characters in my dreams seem real while I'm dreaming. My dream-characters don't nip off to the shops for a pint of milk; why should you all?
I'm already at work #bloodylazyphdstudents
Yeah me too
Although it's only 9:15 here
0816 here.
what would be the reason not to use HTTP there?..
07:18
SSH+rsync
That is literally what I'd do :)
07:45
Anyone found a python3 way to connect to active directory?
Ah hm. ldap3
Hey
I'm new to Tkinter and I'm trying to define a function to delete a frame, made in the main body. How do I do this?
What have you tried?
def newuser(self, root):
self.destroy()
F2=Frame(root)
Second two lines are indented.
No idea how to do code on a iPad
No internet on my rpi2
also tried global commands.
Don't worry got it working.
08:07
Life is a rollercoaster
Are you riding it?
Let's get decidin'
Cbg all
08:28
No, I'm not riding it. I'm a member of the Undead, reanimated by a futuristic AI. I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.
Apropos of nothing: we quite like the name Harry, but I don't want to give the kid a nickname as his actual name. But I'm not a huge fan of Harold. What to do?
I always associated "Harry" as a nickname of "Henry", not "Harold"
Henry, not Harold
:D
Harry is a male given name, the Middle English form of Henry.[1] It is also sometimes used as a diminutive form of Harold.[2]
Mind. Blown.
That seems to think that it's a name in its own right
I might just do the irritating thing that kids do where I mimic Fizzy all day
08:38
It is a name in it's own right, too.
OTOH - I may end up saying some things I regret
@JRS you'll definitely sound more intelligent than usual if you do.
~@~@(*)&^&(%^(&^(*&$££$£$
Expletives deleted
Bloody Lancastrian can't even swear properly.
<- Bloody Lancastrian, can't even swear properly.
08:39
I think it works both ways.
I think Fizzy's online persona has definitely become more edgy since he started working
It's become more edgy since the start of September, that has nothing to do with work.
He's a hexecutive now
The only problem with Harry I guess is that people will either think we love the royal family, or we love harry potter
When nothing could be further from the truth
(About the royal family)
As a Snape, I can confirm that the Potter assumption is a valid theorem.
08:41
Yeah heh wow I just thought of your kids' surnames.
Do you hate JK? :)
They've got their mum's ;)
(BTW - by choice - you're not accidentally treading into some complex family arrangement)
if that's relevant
ho hum
I was thinking of asking about it over a pint someday rather than on here, but thank you for clarifying :)
Cabbage!
08:44
Hey up
Cabbage!
In a comedy turn, I'm going to be teaching maths on the physics course :) So it turns out Engineering > Physics after all, @Ffisegydd :D
All I can say is may God have mercy on those poor physics students.
Right - now to go to a meeting where they tell me how to use a tool I've been using for 5 years. Deep joy. Arrivederci
09:22
Oh god. I'm in TLA hell.
"we need to adopt the process with thorough thoroughness" I kids you not
I'm quite impressed with BigCorp so far, no one is full-on "Consultanty".
We just get stuff done.
That's cool
And RIPE FOR A BOBBY-STYLE CONSULTYSPEKE SALES PITCH
Have you yet based your TPS reports on an SOA, RESTful, lightweight, Agile raft which will survive the waterfall? HAVE YOU?
6
Cbg :)
 
2 hours later…
11:19
tumbleweed
appreciates the sound of silence
It's one of their best
appreciates reference
leaves the free WiFi zone
user559633
11:42
Lancastrian is the most interesting family in Game of Thrones
Morning you kitty cats
user559633
That's highly offensive to us noble Khajiit
M'aiq thinks Nords wish they were Khajiit
12:06
Morning cabbages
Hey up all
Tried to watch a show using VLC yesterday, but it was all artifacted and weird.
Last time this happened, the problem was my codecs, I think. I know nothing about codecs.
I could google "codecs" and download whatever the first result presents to me, but somehow this seems like a bad idea.
Could be your computer's bits are too big
If, you know, it's possible for your bits to be too big
A sufficiently determined malware distributor can make their page look arbitrarily trustworthy, so what I really want is to find an obscure hole-in-the-wall message board that couldn't possibly be worth any malefactor's time to fake.
Then I can be reasonably confident that any recommendations I find won't destroy my computer.
first_world_problems.png
user559633
google drawings is great chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/google-drawings/… . not in the flow of conversation, but awesome if you're looking for a free/simple diagram tool
12:19
Maybe the hackers have already infiltrated your computer and they're attacking your TV shows first?
user559633
@Kevin if it makes you feel better, most non-script kiddie malware is mobile apps now because you have to trust them with far more privileges
user559633
field day for black hats when everyone decided web browsers are too convenient for displaying arbitrary content
I feel like they don't need more than 50% of the privileges they request though.
user559633
@Programmer You should e-mail the coder and tell them to check that they need those privileges.
The issue is that privileges can be too broad. So they need access to one photo which means they request access to "all yo mediaz"
user559633
12:21
@Ffisegydd I see that you have also written an android app.
I mean I feel most of it is for data mining, rather than being able to run the program
user559633
"The message is 'offline access to camera'? I just wanted to scan a QR code :["
IIRC Android is a bit better than Apple for having more granular privs.
user559633
@Ffisegydd It's more granular, but IMHO, you end up having to chain through most of the concerning ones to get your application to properly work anyway.
12:23
I've never actually had to develop one, thankfully.
I downloaded PushBullet for the one and only purpose of pushing notifications from my computer to my phone. It required about ten permissions.
From the reviews, the app seems to be suffering from serious feature bloat.
I always wanted to take a shot at that on my own..
Some marketing drone overpromises "yeah, it can share images between all your devices and the cloud", and suddenly I have to give this thing full media access. I just want to send text ;_;
user559633
For an application I'm working on, I have to read/receive/send SMS, view precise location, read contacts, read calendar, access network state, directly call and a bunch of other scary sounding permissions -- all I'm doing is detecting if the user is near another and giving options to call
"Is tristan near you? If so, here is a number to call a taxi to get away."
user559633
12:28
@Ffisegydd Yeah, basically.
"Is tristan the taxi driver? If so, you're f**ked."
user559633
"the call came from inside the house! i'm so sorry about your life choices"
I got a new work shirt and the collar is too tight... I feel like I'm being strangled by a weak person.
user559633
@Kevin Isn't that joke about turtlenecks?
It is, but I'm not wearing a turtleneck so I had to modify it.
user559633
12:30
I only work in black turtlenecks. I mean I go to work wearing non-turtlenecks, but the point stands.
user559633
Did the page CSS change on SO? The display seems more pointlessly small and centered
@Kevin nice rollback.
Kasra being <REDACTED> again.
user input = 21/12/1999 \n output = (1999,12,21) is valid Python syntax, FWIW
It really doesn't seem likely to me that it's actually code though, from the context
That's not valid syntax, is it?
The space between user and input?
12:37
Oh nice, OP responded real fast to my nagging.
@Ffisegydd Haha oops. Never mind.
Still not an MCVE though. shakes fist
My work here is done. Well, I could do more work, but I'm not going to.
That's the spirit
I’ll never get the SO C# community.
Python: Duplicate question is posted, people start finding duplicates and cv’ing. Question is ban-hammered without an answer, or added answers are ignored from voting.
C#: Duplicate question is posted, nobody bothers to find a duplicate. I cv it with a duplicate question. Two-line answer is added, gets lots of upvotes, duplicate cv is ignored.
It's because they're not super best friends like all of us.
Bask in the free rep
12:49
That's why Martijn will never beat Jon Skeet.
I can’t wait until I have a gold C# hammer…
Thank you for cving it..
mornin
Our internal "10 minute" rule sometimes makes me sad.
Because we keep forgetting about it? :-P
@poke even non-C# readers can see it, surely?
12:52
hm?
@Ffisegydd Which rule?
@poke well we generally wait 10 minutes to cv-pls (I'm not mentioning it because of your cv-pls, but because I have a Q that I want closed but am waiting -_-)
We do? Never heard of that! TIL! :D :D
Rule 3 and 4 mainly.
I think we brought it in while you were MIA. Basically the room was getting a bit nukey with closing stuff. We were closing questions within 30s and the OP barely has a chance to improve them.
Is rule 4 really correct in referencing rule 2 and not 3?
So we kinda said "wait 10 minutes unless it's a certain type of closure"
It should be Rule 3.
I will edit it now Can someone else fix that as I'm at work? :P
12:54
The ten minute rule is prominently displayed on SoPython... in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying 'Beware of the leopard"
@Ffisegydd Sure, I’ll fix it from work.
Not if I fix it from work first!!!
I'm not even sure I can access sopython.com from work.
Done
Augh
12:59
I don't get why people are downloading my highly specific NPM packages... I can't imagine anyone actually has a use for it
Accept your fame. Accept it!
I don't know what NPM is, but I want three. Do you accept bitcoin?
@corvid There is a lot of people analyze packages. So their bots download many packages daily
Analyze in what way?
What kind of JS style do you write? Tabs or spaces? Semicolons or nocolons? Where the curly braces, etc.
(just one example)
@Kevin pip for JavaScript.
That actually sounds useful. I'll take eight.
13:03
I just have a hook to call jsbeautify before I save .-.
NPM is kinda nice because of how it manages dependency's dependencies
It’s actually a huge mess if you think about it
@corvid dependencies your project uses, if your module uses any deprecated functionality, and of course, your style and etc
And how many type errors are there after running TypeScript on it.
In my work project, when X.js depends on Y.js, we just have //WARNING: include Y.js before attempting to use this at the top of X.js, and also on every page that uses X.js.
It's the worst thing in the world and I hate it.
@Kevin You could use browserify, webpack, common.js, etc
13:07
I like how js has to depend on a third party to deliver functionality that other languages have had for literal decades
You could also do stuff like load X.js; load Y.js; load X.js and you could be sure that it can run at some point with all dependencies available
(not really, but it would be fun)
Pretty embarrassing to be less feature-complete than C
JS doesn’t come with a stdlib. That’s all
Think of it like Python with only the built-in module.
@Kevin NPM's been around a while
Ok I'm done slagging on JS.
13:09
Or C without libraries…
Node is fairly complete, especially since 4.0. I use it for lots of things (because I have yet to learn python's asyncio)
@corvid It’s still a PITA in many situations
Yeah, I wish I understood asyncio better
I saw guido's intro to it, and kind of get that, but that's it
On the other hand I'm pretty happy to use cool async libraries that I don't understand very well
I'm attempting to use the Kivy language and this line is not grabbing the text from the textinput box 'if len(self.ids.barcode.text) <=1" but when used further down in the code to write to a csv file it is being written
Not often can you answer a question with "nope"
Hmm, maybe I should add s .= replace(x,y) syntax to KevinScript...
13:17
@Kevin I had one of those too, but I wasn’t bold enough to answer it.
@Kevin but it's a bad reason
when 'self.ids.barcode.text' is used it works
The reason is just that there is no built in syntax, not that it's an immutable type
@Kevin .= is this PHP?
It's whatever I want it to be :-)
13:19
KevinScript is looking like it's going to be surprisingly web-scale.
I just need to actually work on it instead of talk about working on it
Adding an import statement is surprisingly hard because the AST evaluator doesn't have access to the parser, so it's hard to eval new code after initial setup
@Kevin that guy was fastest gun in the westing that q, so his answer now looks like mine, even though his was totally different before.
The (parser / evaluator / class hierarchy) dependency triangle is already tangled enough so I need a really good justification to add another edge
Just have a compile step
And a linker
And make it a thin wrapper over the bare metal
I'm going to, once I get started on CKevinScript and asmKevinScript
13:25
And a JIT version, KeKe.
The JIT version will be called KevKev.
That might get confused with KSKevinScript, the KevinScript interpreter written in KevinScript.
In that case I'll make a package index for it called cevcev (hard c)
I really better get import working, then.
I'd better get started on LKTHW also.
13:29
cbg
@Kevin you should support hq9+ in kevinscript
@Ffisegydd step one: the lark. The lark.
But what is KevinScript? It's a difficult question because KevinScript is impossible to describe.
I always thought it was a toy language written in Python by Kevin Kevinson?
Not that difficult to describe...
Isn't it Kevinsson?
The same might be said about birds. What are birds? We just don't know.
13:32
Wow the US education system really is that bad...
Has anyone read any good books or seen any good guides on how to async? Especially futures, they're confusing right now
from __future__ import Futures
HOW DOES THAT EVEN WORK?
Excelsior!
from __future__ import __past__ getting real existential here
Today is merely tomorrow's yesterday.
13:36
Tomorrow is merely tomorrow's today
@RobertGrant only if Kevin is Swedish
@corvid Fluent Python is quite good.
Except that I didn't read the asyncio chapter yet, but extrapolating from the rest, should be fine.
today is merely today's today.
Yesterday is merely yesterday's today.
Yesterday is merely today's yesterday.
Today is merely yesterday's tomorrow.
Today is merely today's today.
Today is merely tomorrow's yesterday.
Tomorrow is merely today's tomorrow.
Tomorrow is merely Tomorrow's today.
I've got a serious case of semantic satiation right now.
I still don't even get what futures really are though, do they differ from promises?
13:42
@RobertGrant Metafuture!
@corvid yeah I think so in some small way
> Specifically, when usage is distinguished, a future is a read-only placeholder view of a variable, while a promise is a writable, single assignment container which sets the value of the future
thank you, wikiped
@corvid nice
Cabbage
Morning PM
13:49
I'm thinking of setting up a walk-in clinic for children's health care in Hawaii. I call it "Wikipediatrics"
5
@Kevin you're just itching to get on the star board today!
Fine.
Once I get a terrible idea, I have to let it out or it will slowly poison me.
Speaking of time, I added another answer to this question Kevin, mostly so I could rave about how struct_time objects behave like a tuple if you treat them like one. But I guess that might be a bit too advanced for the OP.
@corvid Caw, caw.
13:52
Good use of str.format, which I was too lazy to put in my own answer.
Ta.
I just love this young Scottish woman's accent: Salt House - Setting Sun. And the rest of the band aren't too shabby, either.
Half of them are barefoot. Is this some kind of metaphor.
Perhaps.
It represents man's inhumanity to man.
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