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11:01
Mornin' John
We probably should make that. But someone who has more artistic talent than I should do that.
If only we had a member of the room who was also a designer...
@IntrepidBrit I think you mean @PeterVaro
I'm imagining such a man...he'd have a beard...and be Hungarian...
4
And owning a dog
hey, i have a simple question?
cel
cel
11:06
@Inthuson just ask.
I been coding in python for a while now and recently started using pyqt4 to create gui in
windows
say i want to write an windows 8 app
how could i go about doing this?
cause i been reading and it says they use something called windows runtime? but it doesnt support python?
He's the kind of man who would once get a key stuck in a door, and come for help to his e-friends...
Man, this is creepy. I was thinking the same things
cel
cel
@Inthuson, I am not an expert in windows nor in gui programming. But the question is probably too broad to be answered in the chat. Have you tried googling tutorials?
well i been looking at them, most of them suggest i have to learn c++ or vb and go from there, i haven't found a way to use python as my base
i was wondering if anyone knew anyway i could?
cel
cel
11:11
Hmh, I just googled: Deploying PyQt applications on Windows
@Ffisegydd :D
I just went back through that conversation with the lock, was so funny :P
@Ffisegydd also LOL
that was a strange night, yeah
:)
11:14
Just make sure that you check that designer's work before you pay for a t-shirt
If you make a shirt use comic sans plz
Righto - I'll set up a wee list of people who would be interested in a Zalgo t-shirt so I can get accurate quotes
@Intrepid maybe make a wiki page so people can add themselves to it
11:18
# stupid phone url address copying
@PeterVaro My eyes. They burn~
who would pay $820 for a font, ?
cel
cel
@Vader rich people... :D
11:30
hello
cbg(reut)
Oh, since when does python use the ubuntu font
@PeterVaro So, would you be up for it?
umm.. well it depends -- I'm only available for such task on the next weekend
if that's okay, then sure I'm in ;)
Umm.... aren't we "sopython" - all lower case?
11:35
Probably ;)
time to whip out the git blame command :D
cabbages
cbg @Paolo!
@JonClements heya @Jon
11:36
God damn puppy overwriting my edit!
We need editing control on wikis.
@Ffisegydd sorry! :(
@PeterVaro There's no time limit on it. Will just go about doing it when people can be arsed :)
I reckon medallions like that, but with the sopython logo would be cool
Do puppies fear Zalgo?
11:40
can be used to recognise members of the cult group
sopython tattoo. And by that I mean an actual tattoo, not us throwing guns around like nutters.
@Ffisegydd that's probably taking it a bit far :)
I have a sudden image of the "Dark Mark" now from HP :)
Why would you want a shadowy picture of me?
so @tristan still around here?
11:42
@Peter looks like you've got the right words there... not sure what happened to the ordering? :p
Should I have separate git repos for different projects?
@JonClements yoda-syndrome
:P
(I'm too old and wise now..)
That's common practice, right?
you can manage a super-repo that contains sub-repos => git is extremely powerful and flexible
but yeah, the basic idea is, to have a git for every single project you have
okay, thanks
11:49
@Intrepid what company were you thinking for the t-shirts? Ideally it'd be a company that can easily post to North America etc.
Well, originally I was thinking of talking to the guys in my office building, see if I can get "mates rates"
But depending on how many folks want t-shirts and where they're based, that'll affect the cost :)
Ah right.
@IntrepidBrit I imagine they'd also be a min. order size?
Possibly
But if we can't get a decent MOQ, then we can just give everyone the finished design and they can get it printed locally at a place they like
(intend to but the files on sopython later anyway)
12:01
@cel that's a good idea on that matplotlib question.
In fact I've got a better suggestion for it :P using matplotlib.org/users/style_sheets.html possibly
Unfortunately I have to go to lunch now.
cel
cel
:) :)
So, as I predicted, we're going towards another stupid war with Syria and Lebanon.
cel
cel
@ReutSharabani what happened?
@ReutSharabani Can you also define "we"?
And cabbage to all!
12:09
cabbage (reut, fenikso)
Israel targetted a vehicle with some high-ranking officers close to it's northern border a week ago
so now Hizbollah has blown up an army vehicle and at least 4 soldiers are dead
this means I may be away for a while :( I wanna get to 5k!
Are you enlisted?
The combination of its neighbours all wanting to annihilate it and an extra-national military (ish) force currently trying to do that makes Israel's line a very fine one to walk; can't say I'd know what to do.
@cel: Thanks for cleaning up the tags on stackoverflow.com/questions/28191221/… . It's common practice when doing clean-up edits on questions to remove "fluff" like "thanks in advance", etc although a single "thanks" tends to be tolerated. See meta.stackoverflow.com/q/260776/4014959
@PeterVaro what are your goto web fonts? There are just too many choices
12:16
(Google fonts is good)
Indeed it is, but there are still so many to chose from, I am just looking for some modern looking text
Greetings to everyone.
I am quite new in Python, but trying.
I am building a website using django framework and I have one question. Cant find answer on internet, so I will try here.
I have model List and model ListField. ListField have foreign key to List.
Also, I have ListFieldForm where I can choose a List. In this form there is dropdown with lists, but I need to add an extra condition, so that not all Lists are shown in that dropdown. What is the way to achieve that? Can I override some method in ListField model to add new conditions?
cel
cel
@PM2Ring sorry, I totally missed the ' thanks' :(
@dpitkevics Is the listField condition client or server side?
12:19
@IntrepidBrit What do You mean by that? It makes an SQL query as I see in profiler, so it should be on server side.
popcorn
user4202350
Good Morning
cel
cel
@JonClements whoooa... the only thing I know about computer security and crypto hashes is, that apparently the higher the number at the end, the more secure the hashing. :) :D
@IntrepidBrit pastebin.com/efGfEQDs - approximate code
Sorry, I was trying to find my source code where I did something similar a while back
12:23
@cel sometimes - "mostly unique"/"mostly secure" is fine in exchange for a smaller hash size...
@dpitkevics I think this was the sanest way I could think of doing it - stackoverflow.com/questions/16055808/…
@IntrepidBrit we don't do sane here... you should know that by now, surely!? :p
@cel No need to apologize! And as you can see from that meta link, plenty of SO veterans tolerate tiny amounts of polite fluff; it's certainly not worth editing a question merely to delete a single "thanks". But if you're in there editing anyway...
@IntrepidBrit Ok, great. This looks like it could work for me. Thank You :)
@dpitkevics You're welcome and good luck!
12:25
mathiasbynens.be/notes/mysql-utf8mb4 wow, just how incompetent can mysql implementers be
@JonClements Well, in the world of Django. You start at "frothing-cthulu worship" and work your way upwards towards - "gently bites the butler"
cbg all
cbg Unihedro
hello @Unihedro
we meet again
Yes :p
12:38
cbg @Unihedro - how ya been?
@JonClements Banana(na)s. :p
Finally gotten better from being sick, so.
Good to hear... I had some sort of bug a while back... felt absolutely beep for a few days... all better now though... yay! :)
@Unihedro Ba(na)+s FIFY!
12:42
@AnttiHaapala Eh, your edit breaks the sequence. :P
Bananananananananas!
ok
backspace stuck :d
Ba(na(?1)?)s!
re-cbg
@Ffisegydd re-cbg
@Vader back
what kind of font are you looking for? (sans, sans-serif, mono?)
12:48
@Ffisegydd cbg
@PeterVaro I like Verdana for monospaced fonts.
@PeterVaro sans-serif, something modern
but not futuristic
just current
ya, know :D
polygon.com/2015/1/28/7927197/… I am bitterly divided on this. On the one hand, I <3 Chris Pratt. On the other hand, I am still traumatised by the last Indiana Jones film.
@Vader Adobe Source Sans Pro
(Adobe's first open-source font -- I use it all the time)
it has extra light to black variants as well, so it is quite useful
Thanks
13:04
Should I use different fonts for text and big titles? (h1 v p)?
Umm... Peter will know - but I think different fonts in the same page/document just looks rubbish
Doesn't so python use multiple fonts?
@Vader It is a preference. Browser tries to use the first one, if it is not available, it uses second etc.
Oh, of course. makes perfect Sense
13:11
@Martijn with open open("scores2.txt", 'r') as infile: is that really making sure the file is open!? :p
@JonClements corrected, thanks.
@DSM thanks for the clarification, I probably should have checked before I made such a strict assertation.
@Martijn think there's a dupe for that question
oh nvm... I think I was thinking of this one but it's far too general, and although the answers are along the same lines, the question itself obscures it and eludes to other stuff
(alludes (sorry))
@JonClements I think you are correct though.
Your call.
13:25
@Vader It uses a different font for code samples. This is plain
@Robert hey - I'm allowed to get the wrong word occasionally... it's a matter of "principal" :p
abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyzABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ
this is in backticks
abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyzABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ
@JonClements That reminds me of the old joke: "It's not school I don't like, it's the principal of the thing".
@JonClements your rite!
@Martijn I'm gonna leave it...
@Vader It's not uncommon to use a somewhat fancier font for titles than the font used in body text.
13:29
What do you mean by fancier?
serif?
I hate ppl who print sans-serif :D
Why?
just on paper?
Odd question here
He seems to be saying "I ran timeit and found no potential bottlenecks. How do I identify potential bottlenecks?"
Sentence 2, may I introduce you to sentence 1?
@RobertGrant so much wrong with just two words - good job! :p
A more generous reading might be "I ran timeit on a small sample input, but I suspect there's a larger difference for big inputs. How do I identify potential bottlenecks for big inputs?" but then the answer is still pretty self-evident: "run timeit with big inputs instead of small ones"
13:32
:)
@Kevin kinda the comment I made :)
@JonClements Maybe the X of his XY problem is actually "how do I generate a large input without having to type a lot?", in which case your "Generate a lot of random data" comment is right on target :-)
cbg folks! :D
@Vader This probably isn't the place for an in-depth discussion on typography. But take a look at ux.stackexchange.com/questions/766/… And then take a look at some books, magazines, good-looking web sites. Etc.
13:37
"good-looking" does tend to be an "eye of the beholder" thing :)
Vader, also check out the related questions sidebar on that link.
How can this question be answered?
@JonClements Sure. And an arty publication / website can get away with more exotic fonts than what would look professional in a scientific paper or site.
@thefourtheye Umm.... I appear to get the opposite of what I was expecting
Surprise :)
13:47
Is the mighty, mighty @PeterVaro still around?
But why would dict replacing duplicates would be a bottleneck? I would assume sets also should suffer the same then
I'm with roippi on that post. They work roughly the same, so look for optimization opportunities elsewhere.
Oh goodie.
That sinking feeling when the OP reveals that their problem statement omitted crucial details.
Like a dictionary that doesn't start empty.
@Kevin Its fine for the OP, but for us, things like this are very interesting :)
Not to me :-) when I optimize, I'm interested in reducing the big O complexity of multi-line algorithms, rather than trying to shave processing cycles off of low level expressions.
(Not that one is "better" than another. reducing runtime by a constant multiple without affecting complexity can be very very valuable)
13:57
Nice... Puppy and @AnttiHaapala have come up with explanations :)
@Antti I think we've hammered that one :p
Oh god. I tried to open a 1GB file with 4GB of RAM while running everything else on my laptop. I think it might actually explode.
@Ffisegydd good job well done - at least you're in a multi-tasking environment - that use to be fatal in the old days :)
The crux is
> Given a uniform distribution from randint, then there's 111,111 allocations and de-allocations of empty lists for 9 unique values over a set of 1,000,000 elements -- that's a lot more than just 9.
@Ffisegydd Quick! Fire up the Doom Process Killer and get rid of it!
14:01
If the vending machine has no energy drinks today, I will destroy the world with my grumpiness.
cabbage
cabbage
@JonClements just noticed there is an extra listcomp
14:02
I had to wait 20s for the screen to actually show that I had typed that message.
@Kevin not sure destroying the world with grumpiness fits in with your disaster but not malevolent approach?
ah no
{ x : None for x in set(i[0] for i in x2)} why is set creation from generator SLOWER than ...
@JonClements Puppy, @Kevin wants to destroy the world. Should we convince him to join the Puppy army?
I've released another library. This one's really simple and irrelevant to everyone here. mcafee-epo
@AnttiHaapala yeah, I did timings with the OP's list, then a generator, and then a set-comp...
14:04
rhubarb time
@davidism I work for an IT service provider, and, weirdly, was looking at something about ePO today.
ePO is a giant mess, our client uses it, I can tell you right now it's really poorly designed
and if you want more warnings, stay the hell away from Tenable Security Center
Well thankfully I don't do anything directly related to it, I just have to write stuff that supports processes that people that use it...use
yeah, the project I run is this meta analysis/control tool that has to communicate with all their crappy subsystems
And I'm not surprised. McAfee seem to be incredibly cynical about their cash cow
14:07
@JonClements nice, I didnt read your answer but they look like copied to each other :D
Nice :) you don't work for ServiceNow by any chance?
nope, a tiny defense contractor
@PeterVaro's avatar doesnt look like him :D
this is a product I designed from the initial requirement "here's a spreadsheet, can we put this online?"
@AnttiHaapala have an upvote anyway :)
14:10
you too
Oh okay, fair enough
@JonClements and @AnttiHaapala That's mine boys.
I think there's quite a lot of value in that industry with automated tools. Could you integrate your stuff with Nagios or something and sell a lite toolset?
(Just a thought; not fishing for a business venture)
Windows Task Manager is "Not Responding"....I can't even Ctrl+Alt+Del my way out of this mess >.<
@Ffisegydd press and hold the power button - all will be fine :)
14:12
I installed windoze today and realized that it is spelt as windows
@RobertGrant yeah, I'm rewriting it as a pluggable framework right now, so anything can be connected to it by writing a pretty simple plugin
@BhargavRao it's the sort of thing that seems obvious in hindsight, I suppose
@davidism and then DAVIDI$M
It is terribly slow .... And no python ... Most idiotic OS
It took 40mins to install
It took 40 minutes to install Python?
to install windoze
14:14
No, he's saying there is no Python for it
Is 40 minutes really that long? Really?
it takes not more than 10 mins to install ubuntu
That's quite good for Windows from my recollection
In SSD
@Bhargav It takes 10 minutes to get a basic-probably-not-fully-working-hellspawn of Ubuntu to install.
14:16
Reboot time ... Ubuntu - 2.5 mins, Windoze - 10mins
Back in '09 or so, I installed Ubuntu on two dozen old macs. Took about 30 minutes each, I'd say
@BhargavRao What version of OS do you have?
@Fenikso Some fake windows 8.1
Yeah 30mins is about right for Ubuntu
@Bhargav then honestly you're doing it wrong. My Windows PC can reboot in <1 minute on a HDD.
14:17
Same
@BhargavRao you appear to have rage problems. Would you like some help?
Please don't star all the things. We're clever, but not that clever.
12
@BhargavRao I mean, starter, professional, enterprise... You know.
We should definitely treat people coming here for help as the paperclip treats users.
@BhargavRao not sure what's going on with your machine, my linux takes about 20 seconds, windows about 30
14:17
@Ffisegydd :)
I guess starter ... Anyway I'm pulling it down
It should be the Official SOPython Method.
There's a page of one stars just from Monday.
Going back to ubuntu
@BhargavRao Guess?
14:18
You're trying to capitalise sopython. Would you like some help?
@Ffisegydd errr... .I'm fairly sure it's "sopython" - didn't we have a whole trello board and discussion about this!? :p
"It looks like you're trying to use Python 3.4. Would you like to upgrade to Python 2.7?"
@Jon yeah but I capitalised the SOP and it stands for "SUPER OWESOME Python"
@Fenikso How to check that ... Using windows for the first time
@Ffisegydd oh... we've gone all Irish pronouncing "Awesome" now as well?
Winkey + Pause
14:19
well - times they're a changin' I guess :)
Anyway, Windows 8 by most review counts boots incredibly quickly, so your thing seems weird already, and if they don't optimise for install time then I don't think that's the worst thing.
@RobertGrant You seem to be overusing the word "thing". Would you like to load Encarta?
Oh man. I loved Encarta.
@RobertGrant But Ubu >>>> Win ... I can start using ubu as soon as it starts up ... But in win the circle keeps rotating ...
As in: you aren't booting to a GUI with Ubuntu?
Let's just agree to disagree and recognise that OS X > Everything Else.
Seems like the best option.
14:21
I am ... But with no special features
@BhargavRao The thing is that when you install Linux, you can configure what is installed. But if you install for example Windows Ultimate, you just get everything. So you may compare very lightweight Linux install with very heavy Windows install.
@Ffisegydd I like it in Community where Pierce tells someone to "Encarta it" because he's too old to use Google
I have Windows 7 Ultimate and I don't experience such problems
@Fenikso Oh Oh... But how to check if it is ultimate?? and why no frikin python, gcc, javac, etc etc
@BhargavRao just seems as though a) your Windows 8 boots weirdly slowly; b) your Ubuntu that's booting to command prompt also boots weirdly slowly; and c) you're comparing a GUI boot to a commandline boot, which is also weird
14:23
@RobertGrant My parent's couldn't afford Encarta - had to use that at school - my PC came with a copy of Grolier :)
@RobertGrant Hey no .. Ubu boots to GUI itself...
I have windows 7 too, and I don't have any problems it, other than it taking some disk space. Disclaimer: I never boot to it.
Grolier! Amazing.
@BhargavRao Press Winkey + Pause. I suppose your keyboard has Winkey?
@AnttiHaapala That's the best
14:24
the worst part is
I paid for the damned license, separately
Still, you can get a free upgrade to Windows 10
really??!
@vaultah Well, but you can still install Linux which would be a few magnitudes faster. That does not mean you would compare those, right?
Magnitudes?
14:25
@Fenikso It does have ... And winkey + pause does nothing ...
So errr, this machine came with 8.1.... and next one is 10? What happened to 9? (or am I just completely naive to the Windows world)?
I guess it will format my harddisk
and it takes 1 year to sort out multiboot problems
So, instead of 10 minutes to boot, it would take 0.6s?
@JonClements they skipped 9. Versioning is marketing, and all that.
and it will be subscription based, so I need to pay them each year for my computer to boot.
@RobertGrant Overexertion. Or how is that thing spelled.
14:26
Exaggeration?
@AnttiHaapala I actually have a Office 365 subscription (need it for Excel stuff that Libre Office doesn't support), and that works out not too bad... better than spending a fortune on a DVD, plus free upgrades...
@Fenikso I was just saying that his points are not fair as I'm using a "heavier" version and still don't have problems he's describing
I agree that for some things, you could definitely replace "magnitudes" with "slightly"
@RobertGrant But the point is that I can install, you know, for example Debian running with 5MB memory. Does not mean that I would compare that to Windows 7 and cry that Windows eats so much memory.
14:28
Hi all, I hope you don't mind if I promote my recent area 51 proposal here:
53
Open Source

Proposed Q&A site for questions regarding motivation, marketing, organisation and licences pertaining specifically to open source projects.

Currently in definition.

it's moving along nicely but could use some more people working to define the scope more precisely
Huh, we do have the "Advocate of open-source projects" here
I'm also open to hearing about any objection you might have to it.
@vaultah Do you also have Ubuntu installed?
I'm invited to a security meeting in the company that owns the place I work for. I don't really know anything about security :(
@Fenikso yes, both run on SSD GPT drive
arrrgh, both OSs run from GPT SSD drive
14:32
@ReutSharabani well maybe you learn something at this meeting?
@Kevin not quite sure what that guy is asking...
@Vader Maybe I will, I hope I won't be asked to say anything
@vaultah is that from my twitter profile? :p
@vaultah So if the speed is comparable, I am wrong. It was just a possibility which occurred to me. That it may not be fair to compare OSes with completely different "packages" installed.
Start speaking in salad to them
14:33
speaking in salad?
@JonClements He's got two problems - his list structure is two lists of two elements each when he probably expects an ordinary four element list; and he's using the incorrect x and y in z syntax.
@JonClements yes :P
helped or hindered by ladders and snakes respectively... I just hate this construct
this is like a, b = None, {}
@ReutSharabani you must be a green bean
why not a = None; b = {}
laurel
How can I remove whitespace lines from a string in python?
@ReutSharabani that would be laurel
'line \n \n lineee \n \n \n lineeeeee' -> 'line \n lineee \n lineeeeee'
"\n".join(line for line in data.split("\n") if line.strip())
My real question is how do I identify whitespace
14:37
yaaaah
well played @Kevin thanks
remove what whitespace??
if you mean empty lines, then
>>> re.sub('(?sm)^\s*\n', '', 'line \n \n lineee \n \n \n lineeeeee')
'line \n lineee \n lineeeeee'
@ReutSharabani No problem. However, I must politely decline your star, as a code sample that solves a person's problem is not generally considered star-worthy.
probably not faster since python res are SLOOOW
14:41
@ReutSharabani yeah, it is not funny :D
I politely decline your decline (but won't do it again)
hmm
maybe I should do some timings wrt resub and kevin
Hey other than the note that win is slow... The apps are great ... Ubu comes nowhere to match
And the UI rocks
Classic map-territory confusion in this post. OP is trying to make a tuple by concatenating parens and commas and such.
Surprising results again,

In [3]: %timeit "\n".join(line for line in data.split("\n") if line.strip())
1 loops, best of 3: 3.06 s per loop

In [6]: %timeit re.sub('(?sm)^\s*\n', '', data)
1 loops, best of 3: 3.26 s per loop
14:44
Woooooo
In [7]: len(data)
Out[7]: 31000000
I wonder if re would win if you compile the regex beforehand
Might be preferable if you're zapping the whitespace of many many strings.
And I bet re wins for very big strings, even if you don't compile first
In [16]: %timeit "\n".join(line for line in data.split("\n") if line.strip())
1000 loops, best of 3: 502 µs per loop

In [17]: %timeit "\n".join([line for line in data.split("\n") if line.strip()])
1000 loops, best of 3: 423 µs per loop

In [18]: %timeit compiled.sub('', data)
1000 loops, best of 3: 587 µs per loop
@Kevin it was 1 loop :D
so no
FWIW re.sub('(?sm)^\s*\n', '', data) caches the compiled object after the first run
14:58
yeah but the regex cache has an edge case :d
the cache is very stupid
if you hit the max size, the cache is just purged :d

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