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12:15 AM
cbg
@toonarmycaptain Maybe when: pythonclock.org
 
12:32 AM
@JonClements 2 away!
 
 
2 hours later…
3:00 AM
cbg
 
cbg
 
3:29 AM
I am not saying cv-pls since i was involved in the question, but i am not sure if you guys would think to dupe this: stackoverflow.com/questions/13650293/…
 
 
2 hours later…
5:27 AM
Heyo o/
I am back.
Looks like Andras and Kevin slept already.
For yesterday problem, I created a pastie with correct data format, Here it is: pastiebin.com/5cb95d2385c99
The bottom of the pastie has expected output.
I tried with copy() and update() functions which does not seem to be working. It always override with new data and old data goes away.
 
user7437554
6:27 AM
any idea why is it wrong?
 
user7437554
print subprocess.check_output(['shuf -n 20 ZINC_first_1000.smi > 20smiles.smi','-l'])
 
@U9-Forward I think that should do
 
user7437554
I read on the web that it should execute command 'shuf' for shuffling lines
 
hello. what are weak spots of this (specially in terms of efficiency):
def count_words(filename):
  handle = open(filename,'rU')
  text = handle.read()
  text = text.translate(None,string.punctuation)
  text = text.replace('\n',' ')
  text = text.lower()
  words_list = text.split(' ')
  words_dict = {}
  for word in words_list:
    words_dict[word] = 0
  for word in words_list:
    words_dict[word] += 1
  return words_dict
Some steps sound repetitive and it seems that I'm looping on the text many times but I think I'm obliged to do these in separate steps, for instance replacing newlines in one step, lowercasing the whole text in a separate step, and etc.
 
6:46 AM
@cs95 Thanks
 
7:15 AM
any reason you might prefer SomeClass.new(...) rather than SomeClass(...)?
someone said something about separating the user interface of the class from the implementation
and I can imagine that maybe what they're saying is that new can be user-friendly, but the constructor might want to be more technical
but maybe there's some other python pattern that explains this
 
Hello everyone, say I got a rather basic question that somewhy I can't solve:
I got a flask request with the following data: `'b'[1.0,6.0,0.4,18.0,2.0,3.6,6.0,0.5,0.25,4.0,17.0,30.0]'`
Trying to load this in a float array. but if I try to use `float_values = [x for x in request.data]` the first value becomes 90 odd(I assume bit value or something) and other solutions like `.splice` or `.split` don't work because it's not a string. how does one cast this to a float array?
 
exactly 90?
 
one moment let me rerun and copy
 
my guess is it's 91
 
Correct sir: [91, 49, 46, 48, 44, 54, 46, 48, 44, 48, 46, 52, 44, 49, 56, 46, 48, 44, 50, 46, 48, 44, 51, 46, 54, 44, 54, 46, 48, 44, 48, 46, 53, 44, 48, 46, 50, 53, 44, 52, 46, 48, 44, 49, 55, 46, 48, 44, 51, 48, 46, 48, 93]
 
7:24 AM
you have a binary string, not a binary array of numbers
91 is the char code for [
 
Ah then I might have been googling the wrong thing. I used print(type(request.data)) which told me that the class was 'bytes' and searched from then onwards
 
it is bytes :P
but of chars
good luck sir
 
Thank you
 
7:43 AM
There's probably a better way to exchange data... but you can parse that with ast.literal_eval(data.decode())
>>> ast.literal_eval(b'[1.0,6.0,0.4,18.0,2.0,3.6,6.0,0.5,0.25,4.0,17.0,30.0]'.decode())
[1.0, 6.0, 0.4, 18.0, 2.0, 3.6, 6.0, 0.5, 0.25, 4.0, 17.0, 30.0]
 
@Aran-Fey Good idea, just a tip that json.loads is most likely better:
>>> import json
>>> json.loads(b'[1.0,6.0,0.4,18.0,2.0,3.6,6.0,0.5,0.25,4.0,17.0,30.0]'.decode())
[1.0, 6.0, 0.4, 18.0, 2.0, 3.6, 6.0, 0.5, 0.25, 4.0, 17.0, 30.0]
>>>
 
I just had this:
requestString = request.data.decode('ascii')
float_values = requestString.strip('[').strip(']').split(',')
and was figuring out how to convert the str array to float. But I guess the ast solution is more efficient?
 
more efficient and less likely to have bugs
but yeah, depending on how that data is actually created, json might be more suitable
actually, scratch that: json is definitely more suitable
 
Springs RestTemplate from Java to python as a body parameter on a post request
 
so then it's most likely JSON-encoded
 
7:49 AM
But it's not in json format as far as I know? python prints the body as a byte array rather the {"body": value}
 
@Aran-Fey Yeah, once i answered a question using ast, but the one with json got tice as many up-votes than mine.
 
Which is what caught me offguard to start with. I can confirm that the ast solution works like a charm. Now trying json(since that seems more appropriate for a rest endpoint)
 
{"body": value} is a dict. [1, 2, 3] is a list. JSON is a data serialization format that supports both dicts and lists.
'[1, 2, 3]' is just as valid json as '{"body": value}' is.
 
Ah, my bad till now I usually just serialized whole objects in which lists also are like "key": [JArray] so I failed to catch onto that one. oops
 
@Aran-Fey Haha, i like that there are two strings.
 
7:54 AM
Okay json (logically) works too. Will be keeping that due to the context. Thanks for the help everyone. New to Python and I was just staring/searching into the wrong direction staring blindly at 'why is the body bytes'. Guess I should have tried the most logical solution of json first :p
 
@Arno Your welcome :-)
Don't know if anyone saw this:
@Arno I am only saying this to you, just saying this to everyone
 
Oops my bad, anyhow good to know. Guess goodbye python 2
 
@Arno Yup
in 2020
 
cbg-morning
 
Funny that i first got this here:
Austin's profile
 
8:19 AM
is there a good Q&A that explains the difference between assigning a value to a variable and mutating the object that's stored in the variable?
 
9:04 AM
@U9-Forward have you suddenly become my tag badge progress notification system or something? :p
 
I wish to one day be knowledgable enough to generate a tag score so good that I'd have to have my answer count catch up to my score to get the next badge.
 
Hallo people of Python
 
9:21 AM
I guess everybody has someone to look up to, eh? Except maybe Jon Skeet
 
@U9-Forward or have you become my stalker or something... 'cos that'd be rather creepy :p
 
9:45 AM
@U9-Forward no, you're the first ever chat.stackoverflow.com/search?room=6&q=pythonclock.org
 
@Andras that didn't ooze sarcasm at all did it? :p
Wondering what happened to that Luke guy
 
 
1 hour later…
11:14 AM
That luke who requested a deletion?
Did he present any note kind of thing from his teacher...saying "delete that question fast"
 
yeah - that's the one... don't think we've heard back.... well, here at least...
struck me as a nice fella... probably too honest for his own good, but hope he's still got his stuff going on after all that.
 
I am just wondering about his honesty
How could it be sure that he in reality told his teacher about his deeds
While I respect all you guys for helping him
Mr. Luke, I am not judging you, just a little bit sceptical
 
11:31 AM
@lmao assume good faith and intent until it's proven otherwise
I've been wrong a few times in decades of life thinking that way... but... I'd much rather take that approach than thinking everyone is a liar until proven they're not
 
@lmao he didn't do anything wrong. Just technically not allowed to ask for help. There would be no point in lying about the teacher part, he could've just laid low.
 
@JonClements: Yes sir, that's why I left a note to Mr.Luke, that I am not judging him...
In fact, I tend to believe in everyone and then I get cheated very often
 
@lmao being skeptical that they told the truth is judging
 
@AndrasDeak: No sir, Judging would be "you are wrong Mr."...While in this case I asked you guys about my doubt
 
Yeah, worse than judging.
 
11:37 AM
@AndrasDeak: Then I am sorry
Mr Luke, I am sorry, not at all sceptical about anything
 
You can be skeptical, just don't claim you're being nice
 
ok, point noted
Between, luke is still here, things are fine with him, I guess
 
umm... has youtube changed their UI (again)?
left navigation bar seems different and the content seems to be focusing a lot of "YouTube movies" stuff
 
12:06 PM
looks same as usual to me
 
@TheLittleNaruto your expected output has a syntax error due to a missing comma, but I see what you want. Here are 3 possible approaches:
>>> # automatic fragile version: keep all list-valued items
... out = {k: d1[k] + d2[k] for k in d1 if isinstance(d1[k], list)}
...
... # explitily included version
... whitelisted_keys = ['Tickets']
... out_whitelist = {k: d1[k] + d2[k] for k in d1 if k in whitelisted_keys}
...
... # explicitly excluded version
... blacklisted_keys = ['ResponseInfo']
... out_blacklist = {k: d1[k] + d2[k] for k in d1 if k not in blacklisted_keys}
These all assume that you only have 2 big dicts. For merging multiple such dicts, I'd either take a copy of the first one and increment with the rest, or use a new defaultdict.
 
@Aran-Fey possibly an A/B thingy then... definitely looks different to me... that or I've finally left sanity behind :p
@Andras "explitily"? :p
 
Yes, explitily. Go pick up a dictionary.
 
for which language?
I think you can miss the "c" when saying it, but written down, not sure... but you've got me hunting now...
 
let me know what you find :P
 
12:18 PM
only come across how it's meant to be spelled and how it can be pronounced... so I'm just going to shrug and pretend I never said anything? :p
on a side note... netflix want me back - offering a free month.... woo hoo
 
go for it :)
 
yeah... this is how they got me in the first place though... paying 'em for 2 years because I forgot to cancel
 
@JonClements: Why your name is in blue while everyone else's is in black?
 
@lmao I'm a site moderator... you'll also notice that @Andras's name is in italics - that means they're a room owner.
 
@JonClements I take it you don't get notifications when something gets charged on your account
 
12:25 PM
Oh yes...@AndrasDeak , being the owner got more power in this room?
 
@AndrasDeak I think I was doing it via paypal at first or something like that... and there was some credit left in there so it didn't have to charge a card/bank thingy
 
Ah, but I also get an SMS if a card gets charged :)
@lmao an owner, among many. And yes, for instance I can move messages or kick users if necessary.
 
well... my bank only does that if they suspect something odd
 
I have that as an optional service, and they only charge me a few buttons per message
oh, you mean paypal credit, no, that's different, sorry
I misread what you wrote as that you had a credit card in there and that's why you didn't get a message. (Which could've also been true, but still not what you said)
 
well, paypal credit is completely different from just paypal, but a paypal account with "credit" in it...
 
12:29 PM
ah, too fancy for me :D
 
Able to kick out users is really powerful
 
@lmao very rarely needed
 
I hope I am never kicked out, lol
 
lol.
 
To everyone in italics, I accept your lordship!
 
12:36 PM
oh boy.. the MI(Blue) never get any credit :p
 
Reminiscent of the attitudes of Discworld wizards towards Discworld gods. "We don't worship them... We believe in them, but we don't like to make a big deal about it"
 
Blue can kick out too?
 
yes, blue are much more powerful
they can ban you from chat or the main site
 
Good Lord, under your lordship as well Mr @JonClements
 
found my reusable bags, going off to the supermarket, rbrb for a bit
 
12:44 PM
Just burn some of your crop every solstice and try not to birth any affronts to nature, e.g. Frankensteins or similar
And the Hierarchy will keep their flaming swords sheathed
Interesting that Frankenstein is considered an affront to nature when it's typically Frankenstein's Monster that is considered the affront. Perhaps affrontness is recursively defined. Anything that creates an affront is also an affront. This means that Frankenstein's grandmother is also an affront to nature.
 
I thought it's the monster that's considered an affront but people always use sloppy wording to refer to the monster by the creator
 
This may be why chemistry so often leads to explosive reactions - they just happen to accidentally create some self-replicating amino acid chains, which could eventually become Frankenstein in a billion generations. So the Gods step in and Zot it with fire
This is my explanation of why abiogenesis hasn't been conclusively replicated. Thank you for coming to my TED talk
Whenever people use "Frankenstein" to refer to the monster, I give them a pass, because you could argue that the monster is essentially Victor's son, so he would inherit the family name.
 
1:08 PM
Hey quick question, is the itertools magic deterministic? list(itertools.chain(*error))
 
Of course
 
Ok :P
 
"magic"?
 
I'm questioning everything since I found out lot's of tensorflow stuff is not determinstic
 
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
1:09 PM
Magic=I know how to use it and what is input and output, but not how it works exactly. I guess it is a few for loops and stuff :P
 
if you know the input and output then you know it's deterministic
 
It's reasonable to wonder whether, say, permutations is deterministic, since the order of its output is not trivially predictable for us mere humans. But chain in particular seems pretty predictable.
There isn't much room for variation in "yield elements from the first argument, then from the second, etc"
 
i knew it's like flattens and it makes sense it doesn't do any reordering. But then again summing a vector I would expect it also to be determinstic, but it is not in tensorflow due to the order mattering how you sum floats
 
I suspect that you can't formally prove the deterministicness of all functions thanks to the Halting Problem, but you can probably make very strong guesses for 99.999% of useful functions
 
@Hakaishin there's a difference between deterministic and deterministic
 
1:15 PM
^^ what do you mean @AndrasDeak
 
floating-point errors shouldn't lead to qualitatively different results unless your problem is hopelessly ill-posed
 
Does it use methods from the random module? Does it depend on input from user peripherals? Does it use parallel processing? If no to all, it's probably deterministic
 
When you're looking for "non-deterministic behaviour" you shouldn't worry about relative differences of 1e-12.
 
@AndrasDeak So what if it is? I just give up?
 
@Hakaishin no, just don't go after red herrings.
tensorflow is a massive beast, don't go looking at itertools and summation of floats
find the hidden random state which is almost certainly there
 
1:16 PM
IIRC, float arithmetic is deterministic. a + b always eqauals c no matter how many times you try to add a and b.
 
Ah no I actually confirmed it is the float that is giving me different results
 
It might be the case that a + b != b + c, but this is not a problem of determinism
 
I have 3 loss functions and 2 of them don't use any cuda non-determinstic add_atomic operations and they are the same between runs, but the one that does is not.
 
Cross products aren't associative either, e.g. A . B != B . A, but nobody goes around calling that non-deterministic
 
@Kevin You mean a + b != b + a (not c)
 
1:18 PM
Yeah.
(Oops, I used the dot product sign, not the cross product sign. Well, you know what I meant from context)
Also when I wrote "associative" I meant "commutative". Yikes, it's not often my error rate is higher than one per message.
Let all querents beware the danger of listening to my advice when I'm sleep-deprived
Now one of you will say "yes, yes, we all know that noncommutativity is not the same as nondeterminism. But in the specific case of tensorflow's find_sum_of_lots_of_floats function, noncommutativity causes nondeterminism thanks to TF's parallel processing model"
 
The problem is both associativity and commutativity. Parallel workers finishing in a race will sum up the final terms in a different order.
 
There you go. TF fails to meet the third criteria of my three step determinism rubric: "Does it use parallel processing?"
You don't even need to think about the commutativity of float addition. You're doomed either way.
 
using MKL_NUM_THREADS=1 or whatever that applies will probably give slow reproducible results. But if the neural network is affected by float precision then you almost certainly have garbage anyway.
 
1:35 PM
Now that I'm done hyperfocusing on a single terminology nitpick, I agree with you on that point.
 
" almost certainly have garbage anyway." What do you mean with this? You mean the problem is chaotic?
 
Yes.
 
THe thing is my loss just does this sometimes:
Like that huuuuge drop and it is not reproducible, because of tiny differences because of float point differences. And it sucks :P
Like once the loss dropped the results are pretty nice and usable, but yeah you wait a lot and run it often untill you get this drop
 
Is loss between 0 and 1?
 
no
 
1:40 PM
There's a grey peak to 0.5 (or more) that goes away. Is 0.5 loss really significant?
 
Yeah definitely.
But I think I just found a bug yesterday in the simulation that generates the ground truth data. And it looks like some images don't have objects visible, that are recorded in another file that tells the loss functions for how many objects are visible
The worst thing you can do is use research code of other people. sooooo many bugs...
 
Just run the unit tests :>
 
On one hand it is nice that they put it online and it can help you on the other I wonder if I wouldn't be faster just writing a lot of things by scratch
hahahahah unit tests and research code^^
 
If the first person to try the thing wrote a buggy mess, then rewriting it from scratch will also probably be a buggy mess
If your research is contributing to medical science or the materials of bridges and airplanes, please focus on correctness and not speed. Signed, a person that has to live in society.
 
No luckily it is only killer robots :D
 
1:55 PM
Even if it was a study about the musical taste of flatworms, I would ask for diligence. But I suspect this is unreasonable in the cutthroat world of academic research grants
If you spend a hundred hours on the flatworm study, then your nemesis will spend 10 hours on the same thing and publish their shoddy results first
The fool! How can flatworms appreciate dubstep when the bass drop lies outside of the frequency range they are sensitive to?
 
^^
 
@Kevin perhaps they can't hear it and just wouldn't care... I doubt they're exactly, "oh great.. I'd like a little bit of Bach instead of that)
 
We just don't have the data right now. Hopefully Hakaishin's project will shed some light on it once he figures out this float problem.
 
@Kevin but what's wrong with "floats"? Surely you just use them to deliver milk (and other sundries)?
 
2:08 PM
^^ It seems like the parametrization is to blame for the chaos. Regressing to quaternions just doesn't seem to be a nice problem
 
Regressing what?
 
ice cream floats are a problem if you're lactose intolerant
 
you mean what is the input?
 
Well, just a vague description of the problem. I can imagine that three imaginary units might give you some kind of degeneracy which makes whatever you're trying to do underspecified.
note that I just don't know what "regressing to quaternions" might mean, I just vaguely know what regression is and know what quaternions are
 
If you are really interested look at the architecture here: arxiv.org/pdf/1711.00199.pdf Figure 2 the bottom right these fc layers are where the chaos happens :P
 
2:15 PM
Too ML for me. Oh well.
From what I can tell it tried to figure out where objects are and their 3d orientation, all based on a single 2d photograph. If this is the case I wouldn't be so surprised if the problem is ill-posed.
I imagine that playing with the distance would lead to different orientations, so trying to fit everything might lead to some "leeway" that can give you erratic behaviour. All uneducated handwaving of course, so don't take it too seriously.
And can the weird losses be related to symmetric objects? There's mention in the paper that symmetric objects are challenging and they attempt to fix that too, but it's probably something that still exists as a problem.
 
Despite my admonishments, Why exec() works differently when invoked inside of function and how to avoid it is a fairly interesting problem. I would naively expect f1 to be visible from within f2, since both are accessible within the body of foo.
 
see e.g remarks after Eq. (3)
 
I know that the name resolution system does some magic at parse-time which sort of "locks in" where a scope will look when searching for variables, but I wouldn't expect that to matter here
If I dis f2, I see that it tries to load f1 using LOAD_GLOBAL. Does that instruction bother to look at all nonlocal stack frames, or does it literally just jump to the file-level scope?
 
2:30 PM
a global keyword would jump to the file-level scope
I'd naively think that LOAD_GLOBAL is the same. But I'm not Dutch.
         10 LOAD_DEREF               0 (y)
what I see in a nested function for a non-global global and nonlocal name ^
In [3]: x = 1
   ...: y = 2
   ...:
   ...: def foo():
   ...:     x = 3
   ...:     y = 4
   ...:     def bar():
   ...:         global x
   ...:         print(x)
   ...:         print(y)
   ...:     bar()
   ...:

In [4]: foo()
1
4
dis.dis(foo) shows LOAD_GLOBAL on x and LOAD_DEREF on y
I don't know if this is relevant...
 
Whats the best way to read 10,000 records that my program wants to make use of, memory or redis
 
Isn't redis in memory?
Or is there a library called memory?
 
u can use redis or not use it
 
What's the "memory" case you're asking?
 
As in, "can I just store my records in one huge Python list?"? I think that's OK. Firefox uses a gigabyte of memory, so in comparison your ~100kb data structure is a drop in the bucket
 
2:36 PM
@Kevin ok
 
Unless a record is a strand of DNA.
 
Unless that strand is only ten base pairs long :-P
 
user7437554
Hello guys, I'm trying to solve a simple problem
 
hello
 
user7437554
Can I ask you for help?
 
2:38 PM
if you follow our rules, of course
 
user7437554
great
 
user7437554
So there is a folder with files ligand1.pqtb, ligand2.pqtb, ligand3.pqtb...and so on. And I would like to write a python line to get those names into a list (so then I can iterate the elements)
 
you can iterate them without a list
 
user7437554
how?
 
user7437554
2:41 PM
cool
 
glob.glob gives you a list, .iglob an iterator
 
user7437554
I'll take a look. Thanks @AndrasDeak
 
no problem
 
user7437554
Ive written something like this: for molecules in glob.glob([ligand*.pdbqt])
 
user7437554
But then, if I dont create a list, how should I replace:
 
user7437554
2:48 PM
out = shell('./program -r prot.pdbqt -l ligand*.pdbqt')
 
user7437554
'ligand*' is supposed to replace each element in glob list
 
if you do create a list, how would you do that?
 
user7437554
Hmm, ok im not sure but I'd write something like this:
 
And what's shell and why can't you just pass the same wildcard to the shell?
 
user7437554
what?
 
2:50 PM
If I get your meaning, try out = shell(f'./program -r prot.pdbqt -l {molecule}')
 
what's shell??
 
user7437554
oh, yes, i'm sorry. It is just a link to the shell command line
 
really.
 
If the problem is "how do I stick this variable into my string?" the answer is f strings or str.format or percent style formatting or manual concatenation
 
user7437554
whats {molecule}
 
2:51 PM
In order of descending preference
 
user7437554
I mean, the curly brackets @Kevin
 
I'm out
 
>>> molecule = "ligand_coconuts.pdbqt"
>>> command = f'./program -r prot.pdbqt -l {molecule}'
>>> print(command)
./program -r prot.pdbqt -l ligand_coconuts.pdbqt
Curly brackets within an F string is an indicator to the parser that the contents of the brackets should be evaluated as an expression. The variable molecule gets evaluated to its value, ligand_coconuts.pdbqt
 
user7437554
for molecules in glob.glob([ligand*.pdbqt])
  out = shell('./smina.static -r prot.pdbqt -l {molecules.pdbqt}')
 
user7437554
so that should work? If I undestand w you say
 
2:55 PM
No. molecules is a string, and strings don't have a pdbqt attribute, so that code will crash. (if you were using an f string; see my message two below this one)
If you want to evaluate molecules and then add .pdbqt to the end of it, then you want {molecules}.pdbqt
 
there's just so much confusion and unclarity
 
Also the string literal has to start with an f, or else the curly bracket contents will not be evaluated.
 
it's not even clear what they want to do
 
>>> "{1+1}"
'{1+1}'
>>> f"{1+1}"
'2'
 
user7437554
Should I paste the code in pastebin?
 
2:56 PM
I think we're at step Z in an XY problem
@santimirandarp no code. Your requirements are already unclear.
but as I said I'm out, if Kevin feels altruistic you can try :P
 
user7437554
Well, I've explained the problem in the first lines.
 
user7437554
Ok, thanks anyway
 
I don't think it's necessary to add .pdbqt to the filename anyway, since those files presumably already have that extension.
You're going to end up with ligand_coconuts.pdbqt.pdbqt if you do that
for molecules in glob.glob([ligand*.pdbqt]) is a syntax error as well. You want for molecule in glob.glob("ligand*.pdbqt"):
 
user7437554
yes, I was trying to figure it out, thanks
 
Interviewing for a junior Python position (yeah) at possibly the largest technological company in my country, and I just learned that this department uses Python 2 for everything
smfh
 
3:11 PM
ew :(
 
I'll ask them if they're interested in transitioning and offer my help, but if they aren't interested, I'll go elsewhere
 
Is using python 2 so bad??
 
yes
@vaultah do you think that ever works?
 
2.7's EOL is at the end of this year so you can expect it to steadily grow more out of date and insecure
 
@AndrasDeak hmm?
 
3:18 PM
Try to bring this up during the interview, and make it sound like the entire code base will self-destruct if you don't port it for them
But don't actually say that outright. You need plausible deniability.
 
When you interview to a department that is stuck with 2, and say "I can come here to work and I can help you migrate to 3" I'd expect (based on nothing at all) to be told "no thanks".
If migration were so easy they'd have done it earlier, so if nothing else then rationalization of their current situation (i.e. that nobody there has bothered to migrate yet) sort of compells people to reject such advances. That's my notion.
 
Yeah
 
But since I don't have any practical experience I was asking what you might think :)
 
Either the codebase is way too big and convoluted, or they're just a bunch of 2015's Zed Shaws, and in both cases I wouldn't want to work there anyway
 
or they just haven't seen the light :P
 
3:23 PM
@AndrasDeak I'll ask "I assume the Python 3 transition is coming soon?" first
 
Mm, sounds a bit presumptuous to my ear
 
Or when they tell you they work with 2 just ask how come?
 
@vaultah good thinking
@Kevin seems fair enough, considering.
If migration is off the radar or offensive then it's a no-go
 
Yeah, but maybe I should make it less passive-aggressive :D
 
"You will, of course, be performing technical debt payments in accordance with my wishes, yes?"
 
3:29 PM
Hey just assuming I do it right, rotating two points and taking the distance between them should have the same outcome whether I do it using quaternions or whether I use rotation matrices right?
 
surface-level word choice aside, I think the real trick is to avoid conveying "if you hire me, I will add to your workload, not subtract from it"
 
@Hakaishin rotations in 2d leave the distance invariant
In any dimension, really
 
"If I perform the same rotation two different ways, will the outcome be the same?" seems like a question that answers itself
 
It's release Friday. Hopefully we finished all the hard stuff yesterday so there's less stress for this release today...
 
3:31 PM
And the distance in R^n is well-defined
 
No matter what parametrization for the rotation I use. Yeah I thought so, then it is something else^^
 
If it's the same rotation, then the rotation will be the same
 
@AndrasDeak which distance?
 
l^2
 
Ah, I found it :P
 
3:32 PM
I'm assuming that both points are being rotated around the same axis, by the same angle
 
euclidian, manhattan, or something else?
 
I took the norm, they took the squared norm, because it's faster
 
Manhattan is l^1 I think
 
gottchya...not familiar with that notation
we used d_1 and d_2 in one of my math classes
 
I think in the context of R^n you can assume that "distance" implies Euclidean unless stated otherwise
 
3:34 PM
l^p norm (and L^p for continuous spaces) is the norm
 
usually...but I like to throw a wrench in things when I can
@AndrasDeak oh...is that lower case ell? I read it as an uppercase eye lol
 
Yup
$\ell^2$
 
yah, now that sounds familiar
 
Is there a specific name for squared l2 norm?
 
One might argue that manhattan distance is rotation-invariant if you're working in a space that only deals with integer-coordinate lattice points. Provided that the only sensible rotation you can perform in that space is by multiples of 90 degrees
 
3:35 PM
the only class I remember using those was Numeric Linear Algebra
 
@Hakaishin that, I think. It's not a norm itself.
 
I only took a few of the senior level math classes
 
(Or is it?)
 
@Kevin one possible definition of rotations is that they leave distances invariant
 
3:37 PM
yay! tests seem to have started fine...now time to get some coffee and wait an hour
 
ok, nvm just read the first paragraph not all needed things, might not be no clue.
 
Easter deployment, nice
 
we have a client that refuses to host things on a cloud service, so my boss goes on site to run tests before a deployment.
 
@Hakaishin OK, it's not linear, but that's not necessary for a norm
> p(av) = |a| p(v) (being absolutely homogeneous or absolutely scalable).
so it does have to be linear!
I'm glad my instincts were correct, even if I've forgotten the details :D
 
thanks good to know
^^
I guess that's why I couldn't find a name :P
 
3:54 PM
How long do you think does it take a "2 for loops 15 lines of python code" code snippet to port to cython if I have never used cython but used both python and c++ a lot? Is it doable in a few hours?
 
I think python is valid cython so it should be fast enough :P
 
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