« first day (3292 days earlier)      last day (1655 days later) » 

6:00 PM
@OTLT-LCar Hey, you might have a legitimate reason to be using Kali Linux, but it's hard for us to know that. Kali is a distro aimed at security experts who are already very comfortable using Linux. But tons of kids without the necessary knowledge try using it because they think it's cool.
So on Stack Exchange we tend to be a little cautious when a new face pops up asking for help with Kali. Please see unix.stackexchange.com/questions/399626/… for further details.
 
AAB
@roganjosh hi just wanted to know if python had any way to sort as in C++ without creating a new list that's all
 
user11867329
@PM2Ring I totally understand. Thank you for clarifying.
 
user11867329
I also was bugging my high school teacher about "Backtrack"
 
user11867329
I get it.
 
user11867329
But I legitimately need to scan my new office's infrastructures
 
AAB
6:02 PM
@Aran-Fey if u have some time to spare
just wanted to ask a personal opinion about something...
 
Not sure why you're singling me out there. Just ask and whoever wants to answer will answer
 
AAB
well you took time to answer my query so :P
anyhow
 
@AAB You could possibly do that with numpy but it's not totally clear to me what you're asking (I don't know C++)
 
AAB
I am actually trying for interviews "again" when I was in college was using C++ for online coding rounds, Some companies just didn't like it if you wrote code in anything except C++ or Java
how is it after you gain some work ex. /
 
Also, python does have an inplace sort, so it's tricky to really answer fairly
 
6:05 PM
I'm definitely not the right person to answer that
 
AAB
Do companies care which language I solve the coding problems in ?
 
user11867329
@PM2Ring so if you have some protips, it'd take em.
 
AAB
I see that python greatly reduces code and also while writing in pen and paper makes things look clean
 
What position are you going for?
 
I'd say, when dealing with python, only "loosely" associate it with C++, but don't try to dig into finding exact same functions across languages, the exercise quickly turns from beneficial to harmful
 
AAB
6:06 PM
I never quite was able to write well in pen & paper in c++
@roganjosh SDE 1 mostly
 
Also that largely depends on the company
 
@AAB What do you mean? The standard Python list.sort method sorts the list in-place. There's also a convenience function sorted, which builds a list from an iterable and then sorts that list in-place.
 
More specifically, the kind of work
 
no idea what that means
 
AAB
@roganjosh Software Development Engineer 1
 
6:07 PM
software development engineer im guessing?
Im assuming it's a US based abbreviation
 
How can they not specify the language?
 
AAB
@ParitoshSingh I see people keep saying language does not matter but I am not sure about it
as of now I sort of know java C++ but I suck at both
 
@AAB I never said language doesn't matter. On the contrary, it's more about the "right tool for the right job"
 
AAB
as in c++ I don't know much about templates & java much about generics
I know each language has lambdas and a ton of stuff but what do they judge in an interview?
 
If you're programming games for example, you'll probably never get anywhere serious in most companies using python. So, it depends on "where" you're applying
 
6:08 PM
I'm still baffled by the question. The job description mentions nothing about the languages and tools?
 
@OTLT-LCar Sorry, I'm not a security expert. I just wanted to let you know the reasons underlying our policy about Kali. There's a whole Security Stack Exchange where security experts hang out.
 
AAB
@PM2Ring yes python does have but C++ had something like sort where I specify the start and end index and it would sort till only that all in place no new array was just seeing the similarity between the 2 tats all...
@roganjosh the company says Java mostly
 
But you said you're poor at Java so I'm not sure what we're supposed to be answering
 
AAB
Well I just wanted to know if companies care about which language you solve the DS Algo problems at
 
DS? Data Science?
 
AAB
6:12 PM
And though they say Java I am not sure the level of expertise they require
Data structures
I mean I am just applying for the entry level position
People who switch jobs here how does it work?
 
Then shouldn't you be asking in the Java room rather than here?
 
AAB
Well I felt this was general interview stuff :|
My questions really was
 
The last entry level position I interviewed for, all the questions were language-agnostic. I guess they figured as long as I knew OO principles in general, the actual syntax involved was just window dressing. I got hired, so I guess it worked out OK.
 
I'm more than ready to give a pep talk to interview candidates but I'm not sure I can help here
 
AAB
When people switch jobs, say I worked on c++ and now going to Java company how much knowledge does the company expect?
 
6:15 PM
@AAB I think you're looking at it the wrong way
 
AAB
Are they like he can learn stuff here after he starts or like nope nope you should be already good at it
 
@AAB Being pliable and able to learn accounts for quite a bit
 
AAB
@Kevin So they are like you will able to come to speed in the new language anyway?
 
A company "wants" something, regardless of what language you used to work in. If the company specifies a language, they expect you to use that language. Depending on the position, if it's entry level, it's pretty, well, entry level. But It really depends on the specific company what they expect when it comes to language specific questions and expectations.
 
AAB
honeslty I have no idea what to do :|
My dream company does most of the work in Java
 
6:17 PM
@AAB Basically. And I did. The vast majority of my formal education was in Java, but I acclimated to C# quickly enough.
 
AAB
but I am right now in a place where they work on c++ mostly
 
Not too difficult a feat since C# and Java are evil twins of one another
 
Good thing you can learn another language very easily once you pick up any one language
If you need to apply somewhere, you need to play their game.
 
Switching from Python to anything else may be more of a speed bump than what I experienced
 
AAB
@Kevin as in harder?
 
6:18 PM
Yes, it's harder, but only because Python is the easiest and best language, and all others pale in comparison
 
yes. Python is a fairly "abstracted away" language so to speak
It's amazing to work in
 
AAB
@ParitoshSingh well that is exactly my prob I have no idea which language to focus on as of now
I feel If I keep moving this way I may clear the online coding round but kicked out in 2nd or 3rd
 
This is not a programming question, it's just a case of being flustered by the languages. There's no reason to work yourself up here about that; you've submitted a CV that shows what you've done in the past, and (I presume) the language. So if you need to pseudo-code, do it in the language you're most-comfortable with
 
AAB
@Kevin @ParitoshSingh true about python the number of lines or soooo lessss the same code in C++ and Java is way way bigger
 
Ok. stop. Recognize one thing: languages are "tools". You keep focusing on the language itself too much.
 
AAB
6:20 PM
I feel its gives me an edge in pen and paper round as well
 
What gives you an edge is solving the problem
(And not all interviews give problems that can actually be solved on the day). The point is the thought process
 
Also, you need to narrow down your "field of view" so to speak. The questions will answer themselves automatically if you can make up your mind. Are you seeking guidance on how to join "that one specific dream company"? If yes, then essentially, your path is clear. find out how others did it before you.
If you're instead asking "how do i get a job in general". Then the language question itself disappears instantly, because there's always jobs for most major programming languages. You can also narrow it down based on "what kind of work"
 
AAB
@roganjosh agreed
 
What becomes more important is being familiar with the interview process itself. See if you're comfortable with it or not. Sometimes watching youtube clips of mock interviews can help
 
AAB
@ParitoshSingh Yup I have seen guides and well am preparing again hope I crack it
Well I am comfortable with the online round
 
6:25 PM
So, let me ask you this. what "kind of work" do you want to do? and what "kind of work" are you doing right now.
 
AAB
but the whiteboard / pen paper I make a mess of things
 
@AAB Paritosh is also giving good advice. You've got yourself in knots about the language and not focusing on the actual problems to be solved
 
AAB
Well I honestly just want to code and learn new stuff
in my current company all I do, all day is run debugger find the place where an error has occured report it
 
Are you fresh out of college? How long have you been working at your current place?
 
AAB
Its been 3 months I have written a single line so far
Fresh out of college
Post grad :P
been working for around 3+ months not written a single line of code...
just debugger in c++
@roganjosh Yes I am just confused about which language to use
I should fix one and just keep working
 
6:29 PM
Spend four hours debugging, and another four hours loitering in a chat room, absorbing knowledge by osmosis
 
Fix one what?
 
AAB
@roganjosh one language
since college, I keep hoping between Python and C++
I never even went deep in both
 
Fix as in "repair", or fix as in "fasten securely in place"?
 
AAB
whenever I had an assignment I used python and for online coding rounds C++
 
"hopping" :P Yes, fix on one language and just stick with it
 
AAB
6:30 PM
I need to make a decision
 
you keep talking about "which crayon should i use". I feel you really should focus on "What should i draw". The crayons get picked automatically.
 
AAB
@roganjosh yes poor choice of words and typos :P
 
This is all irrelevant, btw, because I'd be more interested in what the code actually produces rather than some whiteboard output
 
AAB
@Kevin Its not office hours back home its 12 am
@ParitoshSingh yes I am wasting on which crayon
 
Before we just get stuck in cyclical advice; you should probably be more concerned about the algorithms, and getting the correct answer, than what language you're going to pseudocode in
 
AAB
6:35 PM
@roganjosh yes I have been practising a lot. I still get super confused in Dynamic Programming and some Binary search application problems but I believe I am making progress
 
So stick with that line of inquiry
That actually gives results. What you write on a whiteboard does not.
 
AAB
@roga
where you practise stuff anyway?
algorithms and stuff
 
Find a project that interests you, work on it, repeat forever
 
Not quite sure what you're asking. I can test things in the console or I can be put in my place, as earlier, by Paritosh/Andras :)
 
AAB
No, I meant coding problems for interviews any place you practise them at...
 
user11867329
6:44 PM
@PM2Ring but reputation is needed for chat :(
 
(I'm not afraid to admit that I'm wrong. That's a pretty decent way to learn)
 
I get all the practice I need from my own projects. Pathfinding algorithms, tree traversal, gratuitous amounts of recursion, you name it.
 
AAB
@Kevin Is it some open source project or work related..
 
@roganjosh Pretty much how i've learnt/am learning as well. :)
 
@AAB I find that the best projects come from within. You don't need to be given requirements. Make your own.
 
6:49 PM
@ParitoshSingh Tried and tested :)
 
AAB
:) Thanks all
 
an interesting problem I had recently was to generate an unused file name from a template (like %artist% - %album% - %title% (%tags%)) in such a way that you can fit in as many tags as possible. Ended up having to write a local search algorithm for that one
 
7:21 PM
@roganjosh wait, we did? Let me read the transcript then :P
 
@AndrasDeak Yeah, you did :)
 
ah, factor of 200, nice
 
I had my doubts but that was truly a defeat :)
Fair play, though. I need to research map some more here
 
it's probably just that Series.map gets to work on a single type, and more importantly, it knows its input is either a dict or equivalent, so it can even use the C API to do all the work in C
there's no way to truly optimize a method that eats generic callables (without jit)
 
If I were the pandas dev team I would simply solve the halting problem
 
7:28 PM
Aye, i assume in any case map is able to optimize for specifically knowing the kind of operation it needs to work with, since it's a much smaller subset of apply.
What AD said sounds pretty reasonable, i'd be surprised if it wasn't the case
Also, if i was a pandas dev, i'd make Kevin a pandas dev.
 
I still don't think it can drop down to a CPU instruction
 
@roganjosh same goes for C, yet the 200x speed difference is easly there from python to C
 
Something else is going on. It happens in C, but not for the CPU
 
@roganjosh what does that mean?
I mean "it happens in C, but not for the CPU"?
 
@AndrasDeak From my understanding, if you want to multiply the array, you can load the instruction set for multiplication once into the CPU and it just ploughs numbers through.
 
7:33 PM
Vectorization? I don't think the map is vectorized
But your statement was kinda confusing.
 
@roganjosh I thought that there's few operations that the CPU can do at the same time, and the real kicker is playing nicely with various levels of caching
but compiled C code and vectorization are different concepts
it's just that the former tends to be the prerequisite for the latter, because there's no way to play nicely with the cache from a high level
at least that's my (admittedly limited) understanding
 
@ParitoshSingh probably because I am confused :P The much faster method of map still should run in a python loop?
 
python loop? no. C loop? I am willing to bet on that
 
There is no guarantee on types at all with the dict you give to map
 
@roganjosh I bet there's no 200x speedup for weird types
 
7:36 PM
Oh, that'd be a good experiment to try
Given link in source code for pandas, im actually not able to figure out where the super call is going. Where are these being imported from? What am i missing here?
 
8:06 PM
oh, ty
I still don't get how the import itself got there, and it's bugging me
 
wim
8:24 PM
...it's imported at the top of the module as usual? github.com/pandas-dev/pandas/blob/…
past your bedtime maybe
 
doh. definitely. my ctrl+F failed me though
thanks
or maybe it didn't, and i was too tired to see it. Honestly, not too sure at this point
on that note, rbrb :P
 
rbrb mate, I'm probably gonna do the same :)
@AndrasDeak challenge for tomorrow for me is to try find how it makes the transition :)
 
@roganjosh assuming there's a transition
 
There has to be (?). I could feed any old garbage of types (I think) into map
 
And hypothetically it could still be 200x faster :P
 
8:32 PM
:P
 
9:05 PM
anyone knows why PEP 584 says {**d1, **d2} "is only guaranteed to work if the keys are all strings"?
I thought that only applied to dict(**d1, **d2)
 
I'd like to see where it doesn't work
/sarcasm
for i in range(1000):
    {**{1: 2}}
Seems to work every time
/endsarcasm
 
wim
To paraphrase the PEP:
> If the keys are not strings, it currently works in CPython [and the 0 other serious implementations of Python]
 
9:25 PM
it works in pypy3 at least
regardless if there are any other implementations that would count as serious, I don't see why it should not work in any hypothetical, conformant implementation.
 
wim
neither do I
maybe they were lame and re-used code paths from dict(**d1, **d2) in the implementation
 
 
2 hours later…
11:54 PM
cabbage
 

« first day (3292 days earlier)      last day (1655 days later) »