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8:00 PM
@Kevin there's the 2 forward, 1 back approch, but that's essentially a spin on the same idea
 
DSM
Parachute question?
 
@corvid are you talking about git?
 
@DSM, originally discussed starting at chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/26553086#26553086
 
@corvid try looking under the cushions
 
8:02 PM
Aug 24 at 14:00, by tristan
2 days ago, by Kevin
scratch another mark into the "contextless corvid questions" tally
 
@idjaw Yep. I basically just want to see when a set of lines changed, and by whom
 
git log I think should get you what you want
there are a few commands you can give it.. In particular a good start would be something like
 
DSM
If this were an SO question we'd have VTCd. :-)
 
git log -p filename
hahah
 
yeah I tried that to begin with, but it doesn't really show what changed, just that it changed
 
8:04 PM
?
-p gives you the patch
so it shows the diff
I don't understand
 
Oops, sorry, missed the -p, but that was what I was looking for exactly, thank you good sir
 
np
 
@idjaw no, p
 
?
sorry =/
 
@davidism How come nobody ever discusses the ever-prevalent "p-complete" class?
 
8:08 PM
Suddenly I want to create a webpage that will serve dynamically generated versions of this clip starting at 0:28, using the text of the user's choice. But it requires considerably more Photoshop skills than I possess.
 
was that directed at me? =/
I'm confused.
 
@idjaw Context, context, context.
 
Not in particular. My terrible business ideas move unbidden through the aether with no destination.
 
welp
i just accidentally deleted like 15 hours worth of work
 
I know that feeling.
I usually find that implementing something the second time around is quite a bit faster, since you already know how to do it. Less hemming and hawing over design decisions.
 
8:19 PM
@PatrickMaupin Hard to process on the internet sometimes. So confusion got triggered.
 
You'll get back to where you were in five hours or so, I just know it :-)
 
DSM
Plus, if you use this as motivation to permanently change your workflow patterns to make it impossible for you to lose a day's work, then you'll save yourself far more than you lost in the long run.
 
@idjaw Some people implicitly assume that everybody else knows exactly what is going on in their heads. I know that's not true because I haven't been arrested yet.
 
@davism Sorry, I spent an inordinate amount of time working on the official docs precisely so I can refer people to them instead of answering the same questions explicitly ten times over. — bigreddot 2 mins ago
Guy doesn't understand "answer locally, not with external links"
 
DSM
Shall I give it a go, or is this better left alone?
 
8:23 PM
He also doesn't understand tab-to-complete, Davism. :^)
 
@DSM if you have a good way of explaining it, go for it. I was about to reply politely.
 
DSM
If you're still at the reply politely phase you're welcome to it. :-)
 
I hope so, haha
 
According to the rules here (which I myself have been reminded of by a moderator), he should probably also disclose his relationship to the project if he is, in fact, spending a lot of time writing official docs.
 
8:26 PM
oh yeah, that too
 
oh my god, so much work
 
FizzyGirl has been offered a job at FizzyCorp.
 
Nice.
 
i am the most bummed out ever
 
I hope not in a position where one of you must destroy the other for political purposes
 
8:28 PM
someone hold me
 
DSM
(oops, wrong window)
 
@AmagicalFishy no.
 
@Ffisegydd but i need it
i need your love
 
@DSM I have a distinct feeling of deja vu.
 
@Kevin we met while doing our PhDs together (in the same group) so she's used to me beating her intellectually and academically by now (•̀⌄•́)
 
8:30 PM
Good, good
 
@AmagicalFishy still no. You lost some work. Deal with it and move on with your life.
 
DSM
Aww. I had my own DSMiss in my research group during my PhD. :-)
 
@AmagicalFishy I think I could probably love you, if you were prepared properly. Perhaps seared with lemon butter?
 
@PatrickMaupin how about deep fried? ;)
with a side of fries
 
It also states: "Links to external resources are encouraged, but please add context around the link so your fellow users will have some idea what it is and why it’s there. " I believe I have done exactly that. — bigreddot 2 mins ago
 
8:33 PM
I like deep fried, but too often people use flour to hold the fishies together, and I'm gluten-intolerant. So if it's just in cornmeal, sure :-)
 
excellent. that'll be $9.50 at your first window
 
Awesome!
 
I've edited your question to fit the standards we expect here. Notice that it is well formatted and includes a relevant example, but is only a few lines longer than your original. It no longer delegates entirely to an off site resource. Hopefully you find this instructional for improving your future answers. — davidism 16 secs ago
you guys can remove downvotes now
I don't know why I bothered, it got 3 upvotes anyway.
 
DSM
Above and beyond there, davidism. Admirable.
.. wait, "your question" should probably be "your answer"
 
oh well, close enough there was still time to fix it
 
8:43 PM
... if git were a woman, I would wed her
 
@AmagicalFishy I guess she'd be okay with committing
 
Would she be liberal enough for an interspecies marriage?
 
Your condescension is not appreciated. And this fixation on "off-site" resources is ridiculous. People are volunteering their time and effort, and very many times the best answer is to point someone at official resources. — bigreddot 2 mins ago
the saga continues
 
git add interspecies_marriage
git commit
git push origin master
@PatrickMaupin ... yes
 
8:49 PM
On second though, I'll take the chat link out given the current weird going on here.
 
Now it's weird? ;)
 
Somehow, there's something obviously weird right up front whenever I decide to link to chat.
unfortunately, it looks like he has a lot of other link only answers
sometimes it's really frustrating knowing there's something wrong and not being able to do anything about it
 
I can understand him being frustrated for writing documentation, but there have been times where the links are broken and the answer is pretty useless, in my experience.
 
hey
if i wanted to write a tutorial-via-example on multiprocessing/threading, would that be something appropriate to community-wiki?
 
No, probably not.
It seems like too large an issue.
So would be better suited to a blog series.
 
8:57 PM
@davidism To be honest, I can appreciate that. Sometimes docs can be tricky to find out how to do something if you're fairly new to the language
 
ah, alright
 
@IntrepidBrit Not sure what you're saying here...
 
He appears to be the maintainer of the library, so I'm sure he's familiar enough with it.
 
I mean, take pickling in python. It's not immediately synonymous with serialisation. I could see situations where someone would ask a question on SO and get a link only answer. But apparently it's moot since I've misunderstood the context here :)
 
@davidism Yeah, same picture here: github.com/bryevdv
 
9:00 PM
@PatrickMaupin Official documentation is a good reference, but tutorial it is not.
 
Yeah, but that was exactly my point with that whole thing: he's just linking to docs, he needs to add context to the SO post as well.
He also appears to be responding with "there's a new version that does this now" rather than examples.
 
yeah, as a package owner I've done something similar - it doesn't hurt to actually include example code to not act snobby and elitist.
 
Surely just some gentling prodding and muttering about 'for science! posterity' works most of time
 
I regular break docs to my packages to keep the users on their toes. Well, I would do if any of my packages had docs.
 
FWIW, I was dinged for not explicitly stating I was a package owner even in contexts where it was reasonably clear that I was the package owner. I try hard to be very explicit now. Those answers will probably get him in trouble just for that eventually.
 
9:03 PM
@Ffisegydd Crazy pro way to 'harvest' SO points.
 
@Ffisegydd and assuming your users have toes
 
I regularly break my users' toes if they don't pay for their packages. #pythonmafia
 
@Robert they won't once I've finished with them.
I take one per SO question about my packages.
 
So, fizzy, tell me about your "package"...
 
Is it well maintained, etc?
 
9:05 PM
My biggest package...I call him Gwydion...
 
re-cbg
 
So, really, what you're saying is that your package is a mythological thing?
 
The docs certainly are.
Though there's a README, so what else do people need?
 
9:08 PM
@Ffisegydd has a great naming convention - same as Nidaba :p
 
Yorp.
 
I tell them to read the doctests haha... to be fair that package is catered towards developers
 
I always thought for that sort of package that a how-to video might be more useful than a README.
 
"How To Drop The Bass With Gwydion - A Fizzy-Grant Production"
 
mind you - my current server clusters are named "forseti" (for accounting stuff) and "minerva" for some data mining stuff
 
9:11 PM
@metatoaster My main package has a readme and a bunch of tiny examples.
 
Those Fizzy-Grant people sure do get around. To date I believe they're lawyer consultant video producing python certification masters..
 
Have you been learning Python in a hard way that wasn't your fault?
 
I believe that's where the business was born.
 
Heh yeah
 
That bit about the cider-swilling mutton-chopped business strategists still makes me laugh now.
 
9:17 PM
Fun fact: if you haven't been living in the UK for at least a year you may struggle to get finance for a car, regardless of how much money you make
Lol yeah me too
 
awww gawd - more embarrassing school book photos of me on FB :(
@RobertGrant actually, even if you have a very good income, if you haven't got a credit rating, it doesn't matter full stop
 
What's a very good income?
 
This is a reason I went and got a credit card.
 
Oh sorry, I didn't see the negative there
 
So I exist in the eyes of the money gods.
 
9:18 PM
Yeah same
 
what you do... is just get a credit card - then use it, but pay it back immediately
 
Yeah that's what I do.
Cos I'm a good boy.
 
BigCorp's changed ye! shakes mutton chops
 
You can't use it too much, though, because one of their metrics is how maxed-out you are.
 
for some strange reason, you need to prove you're willing to owe money even if you don't want to
 
9:20 PM
Yeah it's because they actually want you to owe some money, and just pay back interest. That's their ideal customer
 
things were different when I was 21/22, I use to have a credit with a £25k limit
 
You need to prove that you're willing to owe money, but don't need to owe money. Then they will hand it over to you.
@JonClements Yeah, at one point I calculated that I could buy a house using credit cards. But then I scaled way back.
 
well, actually I had a 100k one, two 25k ones and a 4k one (for emergencies cough)
 
Woah
 
I think my total was probably around half that -- a bit under 100K USD.
 
9:22 PM
I'm going to be getting an Amex FizzyCorp one soon probably.
 
Nice
What for?
 
sopycon. General expenses, to save me paying it then claiming back I just charge to the card directly.
 
but being 21/22, I was massively foolish
treated 'em as "printed money"
 
I used to have a corporate card. Then they pulled all of them except the ones for the admins. Now I either have to find an admin, or use my personal card. Personal card gives me 2% back. It's usually a no-brainer.
 
9:23 PM
so errr, managed to rack up about 100k on those
 
Ouch!
 
DSM
Fizzy's going to make it glaw!
 
How'd you get out from under that?
 
Gonna make it rain! Cos I'm Welsh! And I like rain!
3
 
@PatrickMaupin got the cards frozen and paid it back £30k a year
 
9:24 PM
Discipline.
 
then got myself arse over tit in debt again when my mum was dying of cancer
 
That sucks.
 
Good expression.
 
well, the NHS was good, but I wanted the best I could even though I couldn't
so nearly 3 years of private care, nurses and 24/7 treatment/response - I was 190k out of pocket
 
On the one hand, wow. On the other hand, the NHS probably acts as some sort of cost-containment field over there.
My dad died a couple of years ago, of a heart attack. He was in the hospital for 5 hours, tops. Hospital bill was $106K.
 
9:28 PM
presumably covered by insurance?
 
Yeah. That's part of the problem. But if you're not covered by insurance...
 
I have FizzyCorp insurance.
 
so yeah - paid all that off in - think it was April
 
Congrats!
Currently I owe on my house and my most recent car. The car loan was too good to pass up -- 65 months at 0.99% interest.
 
@PatrickMaupin I think the last time I had a car deal was 20% up front, then 0% for 3 years
 
9:30 PM
I only owe davidism 7 upvotes for our monthly voting ring.
 
This (a) wasn't from the manufacturer (from a credit union, similar to a building society); (b) was for 100% of the cost including all fees; and (c) since the car was energy efficient, I got $10K in rebates (on a total cost of 26.4K) after getting the loan...
 
Yeah Vauxhall are offering 0% APR
 
I'm considering buying a car at Christmas.
 
Nice. What car?
 
The Mitsu i-Miev.
 
9:33 PM
Or do you prefer Which car?
 
Toyota Aygo I'm thinking.
 
user559633
Ayyyyyeee Go
 
Nice
 
Sorry, context...
 
I'm still tempted by a Jazz
 
9:33 PM
I'll be buying my mum's if I do.
Worth £4k, buying it for 2k.
 
Get little painted hand-prints to put all over it.
 
Wow, ripping your mum off. That's stone cold.
 
All my siblings do that constantly.
 
I'm thinking I'll re-paint it with the blood of my enemies, though it's already red so won't make much difference.
 
Does your mum's bank account being in the black actually have blood? Sounds more like a concept.
 
9:35 PM
The blood of my main enemy is my blood (recycled through the damn mosquito).
 
user559633
Like you have enemies. (thanks again for paying on time for my services last month)
 
I have only one enemy. Time Davidism.
 
Bah, I'm up for a game of MTG or Portal 2?
 
0
Q: Is there anything that can be done to educate established users about how to contribute better answers?

davidismI recently interacted with this user, who appears to be a maintainer of a popular library. He answered a question with what amounted to only links, and I commented that the post should include local explanation and example in addition to external resources. In further comments he seemed unwilli...

Go forth, meta effect. I know the answer's probably, and unfortunately, "just ignore them", but there it is.
 
@davidism I think the concern is there - but the practicalities - not sure of :(
 
9:45 PM
Ban users.
 
exactly, it's not practical, but the behavior is still detrimental, which is the frustrating part
 
In general, just ban all users.
 
@davidism I'm not sure if it's detrimental. Having answers where answers once were not is still of benefit
it's just not ideal.
 
DSM
When did half my podcasts balloon up to 50MB or so? Is using reasonable audio compression levels a thing of hte past?
 
Where did the ninja puppy go?
 
9:47 PM
@AdamSmith Not when link-only answers break (i.e. their links die).
 
Ah, it's not just the ninja puppy -- anybody else having trouble seeing user pictures on the main site?
 
Nope? Could it be HTTPSEverywhere or similar?
 
or when code only answers encourage blind copying
 
I'm not condoning link-only answers or bare code blocks, but the user is still volunteering their time to the benefit of the question-asker. It's tough to call that detrimental
It's certainly not ideal
but I'm not sure what you can do to correct human behavior that the site gamification hasn't done already.
 
I wouldn't have an issue calling it detrimental, just because someone puts in effort doesn't mean they've done gud wurk.
Anyway I'm going to put some effort into sleeping.
 
9:54 PM
Do gud wurk
 
i wil do. tanks for the suport.
Byee Adam Smth.
 
DSM
Six o'clock rhubarb for all.
 
hmmm. bookmarked for later
 
10:11 PM
Looks interesting!
 
10:27 PM
@AdamSmith Provide real money?
 
Hmm an interesting thought. Tie that into The Game and use the new "Impact" metric to dole out mountains of cash to Martijn?
 
10:50 PM
Martijn's new employer apparently doesn't think much of that business model
 
11:11 PM
Bah codewars has the worst feedback if my code is just too slow
> Process was terminated. It took longer than 6000ms to complete
On what input? Maybe I got caught in an infinite loop due to a bug I can't introspect because you hide your test cases from me!!
bleh
that said -- in this case I'm pretty sure it's just really stinkin' slow
yeahhhh it's just really really slow. Bleh I was hoping I could do a kinda-optimized brute force
 
I made an ai in that game along time ago ... I think all the robots did was attack closest enemy
 
OH. Yeah that's gonna be slow...
I misjudged the algorithm. It's O(N^N)
 
11:27 PM
@AdamSmith that typically means they are expecting a certain optimized approach to meet the execution limit set. I've solved a few that had that exact time limit and had to keep refactoring to pass some of the bigger tests. I agree it would be better if they did give the input. My trick was to simply print whatever they were sending to my method
 
that would only work if they dumped their stdout when execution times out. I just made a hash table of each incremental input and expected output so I could see their largest input
which is 275
my function was:
def helper_combos(total, cur=0):
    n = total - cur
    print(total, cur)
    if n == 0:
        yield []
    for i in range(1, n+1):
        for el in helper_combos(total, cur+i):
            yield sorted([i] + el)
yeahhhhh that's neverrrr gonna finish
I mapped to tuple and converted to set after
which works fine for very small n
 
11:53 PM
If I have some bound method doThing() that I use in a loop a kabillion iterations long, does it make any sense or do any good to set a reference to that function locally? Using doThing = self.doThing; for n in xrange(kabillion): newThing = doThing(*args) instead of for n in xrange(kabillion): newThing = self.doThing(*args)...
 
Anyone Familiar with github here?
 
I'm familiar with git
what are you trying to do? just ask
 
I know that [sic: 'seem to remember something about'] local variables run a little bit faster than object-bound variables, but it may only be significant if the number of iterations is on the order of trillions of operations.
 
(is trillion < kabillion?)
 
(Let's say it's 500 billion.)
 
(So a kabillion is on the order of trillions, in a dubious participation-award runner-up sense.)
 
I mean I'd profile it, but I doubt it's going to be significant even if it does anything
@LiamHardy please don't post brand new questions in here. If you haven't gotten any response from SO in the next few hours feel free to ask again
 
Hmm...
 
though the comment seems to have answered (or at least requested further information) on every question you had
 

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