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23:00
And my point before was that I don't equate a people person with an outgoing person that can easily talk to people. To me a people person is someone that can motivate others. Someone that can inspire them. Someone other people trust.
So.. you seem to be able to do those things, so I'm confused why you don't consider yourself a people person.
(what is this Asterisk thing that's got all these old bad questions?)
@Scratte I am significantly different here on SE than in person. The first time I went to NYC to have a meetup with the other CMs, I saw Nicolas in the hotel before we'd "officially" met and I hid instead of saying hi. Another time I saw Juan in the airport here in Austin (we were on the same flight) but I didn't talk to him until he saw me after we arrived in NYC.
The definition of people person I ascribe to - google.com/amp/s/dictionary.cambridge.org/us/amp/english/…
...looks like Wiktor has taken to his LinkedIn account to increase his tribe in the epic regex war.
23:13
There's caring and respect for others in that definition, no? It's not about ease of talking to strangers :)
is it time to start regex.stackexchange.com yet? :)
"Donna was a people person. She was warm, outgoing, and an excellent listener.".. So, you're just not "outgoing", but the rest, fits, no? Maybe not the Donna part either :D
@KarlKnechtel no, that only shifts the same war to a new battleground
out of sight, out of mind? ;)
"people person: someone who is good at dealing with other people: Colleagues say she's a good people person who can really motivate a team."
23:15
No, because people who give/receive regex support will still see it.
Oh.. is answering regex posts a no-no now? :D
someone who is friendly and enjoys meeting and talking to people
^^ That's the base definition. I don't enjoy meeting people. I like talking to them if I don't have to be the first person to say something... so, once you get me started, getting me to shut up is the trick, but I will generally feel like I'm always on the edge of welcom.
That MSO Discord I was always like that. When I first joined it I was very cautious and gave people ample opportunity to kick me out.
So.. the first one minute you're not a people person, but the rest of the time you are. In just one hour that's less than 2% non-people-person :D
Right, but if no one comes to me to talk, I'll never say anything.
So? I talk to people.. sometimes they don't respond :D
23:24
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@mickmackusa ... this seems... less than excellent?
@Catija It is merely a symptom of frustration. I prefer not to take teams/sides on SO. I feel I do the greatest service to SO when I am not behaving as part of a gang. It is always by coincidence that I more-often-than-not agree with Wiktor.
Even if SOCVR is a "gang", I always make sure that every time I something or act on someone else's that I am willing to stand up in court (MSO) and defend my actions on my own.
o/ good evening
@bad_coder good morning (I live in your tomorrow)
@mickmackusa You mean getting people to vote?
@Scratte not explicitly. He is asking people to say no to trolling.
23:32
@mickmackusa I appreciate that. Otherwise it's practically robo-reviewing. And I think it's important for a project like this that the participants are being thoughtful about how they're voting and not just blindly accepting what others think without reading the question first and judging it. :)
@mickmackusa That is very vague, isn't it? What is trolling in the regex tag?
I understand the frustration of an influx of questions some might consider problematic and so I sympathize - but I find that (in my limited expertise) there's an element of "too basic" that's crept into close reviewing at times that was never intended as part of the platform.
@mickmackusa reason I joined MSE and MSO. I don't agree with a lot of the usual stuff and felt my vote was needed.
@Catija They seem to have their own rules in the tag. I meddle of course..
23:34
@mickmackusa Apparently only selected people can view that.
@mickmackusa That requires that I have an account :(
@Scratte ... but that's... not really appropriate. We have enough issues with helping people understand what's in scope to ask about on the site in general without each tag having their own sub-rules. No one will ever be able to succeed in that situation. To some degree, the joke about a REGEX.SE ends up making more sense. :P
imgur keeps breaking when I upload the screenshot. Is there another service that is commonly used?
@Catija I do not disagree. I find the rules to be very.. opaque, to be honest. I'm not even sure there are fixed rules. To me they seem pretty random or randomly applied by the same users.
Here you go: ibb.co/dKMvrXY
Part of the problem with regex is that the titles of pages are not searchable. Finding duplicates is much easier when the error is in the title or the generalized description of the resolving technique is in the title. Too often the titles simply do not have these identifiers. So you end up searching (super basic dupes) for specific regex patterns.
23:41
@mickmackusa Thanks. Interesting. Considering some of the questions I've heard about him closing, I find it interesting that he has a question that he thought shouldn't be closed but that was... I wonder if he understands that he does this to many questions on a daily basis.
Beyond that, my opinion is that regex questions are often Too Broad (especially when there is no attempted pattern). This is because crafting a resolution can involve 10 or more specific techniques. These multi-part dupes are impossible to close.
I noticed that closure. I didn't agree with it.
@Catija Just because someone is often wrong doesn't mean they can't be right sometimes :)
@Scratte I'd say that we set some pretty transparent rules at the outset and that those have been interpreted and reinterpreted over the years with little oversight from CMs and guidance from the company... and so now they've fractured into "whatever works best for the person voting to close"... that's not a kind (or even possibly fair) interpretation but I put the fault for this drift firmly on our shoulders.
@Catija yes, I think there is some ego involved with the super-high reppers. If they answer it, they are proud that they resolved it best and first. If someone else posted an unbeatable answer already, then the reflex is to hammer the page as a duplicate. People probably think I do the same thing on questions -- but I prefer to hammer over answer every time (not in a competitive way).
@Scratte Sure. :D I'm not saying he's wrong. It's just interesting to see him on the other side of the argument and calling the person he disagrees with a "troll"... but I wonder whether he sees himself as one.
23:46
@Catija The opinioned and interpreted closure has been the biggest frustration on this site for me. There are no rules, just whatever is applied. That's what I learned and I see it every day. It's the reason I'm not a regular in this room anymore.
I did comment on Wiktor linkedin post: ibb.co/fF3SXYj
@mickmackusa I'm not averse to true duplicates - really, I'm not. I'm a huge fan of pointing people at an existing answer rather than having to rewrite the same answer ad nauseam. Where I struggle is when a post is closed as a duplicate of an answer that's so exhaustive that not even an expert would have an easy time sussing out where in the thousands of characters the specific answer lies. There's a benefit to a short, 500-1k character answer that a 20k character one doesn't have.
@mickmackusa I was going to say that, but I thought it may only be me seeing that. I tend to wait answering until some high reputation user has already done so, or else.. I feel it will surely be closed.
In many cases, I'd love a solution where you could maybe mark something as a duplicate but cite a specific passage that answers the small question rather than leaving the asker with thousands of characters to sift through.
I am far more likely to lean toward hammering a duplicate if the OP shows zero proof of research/toil.
23:48
@Catija A subset of this: many times I've wanted to mark a question as a duplicate of a particular answer on the target question.
@Catija I doubt that. Not because it's him, but people rarely think of themselves like that, unless they deliberate try to be one.
@RyanM Yeah, that's a good example, too. :)
Would avoid the whole "Does this answer your question?" "No" "Did you read the third answer? [link]" "Oh that fixed it"
When I hammer a page and I want to point the OP to a specific answer (because it is uniquely appropriate or I don't endorse other answers on the dupe page), I leave an explicit link to the "right" answer on the dupe target. (because I don't close to punish, I close to support)
That's appreciated - I think it'd be great if we built in a way to do that rather than relying on people realizing that leaving a comment was necessary.
23:52
I was disappointed that the community deleted my valuable comments on the pages in the regex war. I felt both comments improved SO. @Catija can you see them in the deleted comments?
Link to the post?
Is there something in them that makes them unworthy of persisting? Do they need to be edited before undeleting?
It looks like the long comment you posted that was deleted was caught by the regex (irony) that single flag deletes comments.
@Catija What was the keyword that I used? (you can tell me, no one else is listening)
My money's on "accept"
23:57
I'd need to find the regex in GH but... accept is one of the potential words. I don't think the trigger words are totally secret.
That said, "accept" isn't in the comment unless I'm missing it.
I feel like the nominated duplicate isn't a great choice because the only answer that offers the necessary logical requirement for this page is arguably an incorrect/inappropriate and unexplained answer on the duplicate (and it was only upvoted today because of this page). That said, I am not inclined to vote to reopen because there are plenty of other pages that revolve around this basic task.
Namely: https://stackoverflow.com/q/43705853/2943403 , https://stackoverflow.com/q/25962929/2943403 , https://stackoverflow.com/q/1538676/2943403 , https://stackoverflow.com/q/880597/2943403
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