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12:29 AM
@JeanneDark Ack! Renamed that one. Normally, Meta is the best place for this kind of thing, as others have mentioned. (Moderators can rename tags with no hassle whatsoever. Burnination is a different process, which is sometimes warranted, but much more difficult and time-consuming.)
@JeanneDark Oops. Just noticed you already brought it to Meta. Fantastic! Now you're earning some good imaginary rep!
@CodyGray But, but... we don't earn reputation on meta!!
@Braiam That's why it's imaginary
I think SEDE actually will track rep earned on Meta
As does this tab...kinda...
Yeah, SE do track it (you can earn mortarboard)
It just shows you your main reputation instead.
12:34 AM
Not only can you earn Mortarboard, but you can earn Legendary. I'm not sure what it says about a person that they've done so....
@Braiam You do earn on Meta, but instead of being imaginary reputation, it's imaginary, imaginary reputation. :)
What's just happened to my del-pls? When I posted it, the del-pls and 20k+ merged together to form del-pls:invalid request. Now it's fixed, so has an RO done that? Is there a magic way of writing it that I've missed in the FAQ?
@CodyGray A moment of self awareness there?
@DavidBuck It sounds like you're running the URRS, which adjusts those in you browser only, based on the current state of the post.
@KenWhite I can't imagine why that person has had questions downvoted and difficulty getting help eyeroll
12:39 AM
@crinklywrappr Generally, what you should do is ask how to accomplish what you want, rather than asking for recommendations of a library. The former types of questions are on-topic here; the latter are not. See also: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/251602/…
@RyanM I don't have a clue why they're having difficulty. They're clearly so willing to learn and accept constructive advice with an open mind. It's so clearly stated in the question itself in the last paragraph.
Upon further consideration, I've flagged the question as R/A. A little under half the characters in the question are dedicated to a very rude rant about curators, including insults ("There are plenty of crappy bots that are taking your job anyway.").
@RyanM I thought about that, but it's about to be deleted anyway, and with that sort of behavior there are bound to be others that have been deleted already, so I didn't want to waste a mod's time with an account that will be suspended soon anyway.
@Makyen Ah, yes. I didn't realise that could affect tags, but I can see the + goes away without it (part of my hurried attempt to fix the 'invalid request').
@RyanM It just got nuked as rude or abusive or spam by Meagar.
12:45 AM
@KenWhite True...well, if it's deleted before mods get to it, the flag will go away and not waste their time, at least
Excellent. Thanks for the update, since I can't see that just yet :-)
@DavidBuck If what it is currently doing isn't to your liking, the URRS has a few options which will affect what changes it will make to request messages, which can be adjusted from its option page. Anything that it changes in the message should have a tooltip that indicates what change was made.
@KenWhite Nope. Only deleted.
But the spam/abusive flags were left marked as helpful, so it has the banner displayed on it to 10k+ users indicating that it is spam/abusive.
user12867493
@CodyGray By nuked, I meant deleted. The reason is mentioned as spam or rude or abusive in the question body. I didn't mean to imply that the account was nuked.
@Makyen I'll take a look. Thanks. Not that I del flag very often, but it's quite hard to diagnose when you've only got 2 mins before the message is uneditable.
12:54 AM
@KenWhite Right, so, you know how when users raise 6 spam/abusive flags, the post is nuked as spam/abusive? Mods can do that, too, with a single flag (because their flags are binding). But it's also possible for a mod to just delete the post, leaving the spam/abusive flags pending, but without nuking the post as spam/abusive. That's what happened here. All of this is completely distinct from nuking the account, of course.
Basically, if a mod just deletes instead of nuking as spam/abusive, none of the penalties associated with the latter are put into play. (These penalties include a 100-point rep loss, feeding the account information into SpamRam, etc.)
@CodyGray I knew most of that, but thanks for the explanation. Based on the content of that original question, it probably won't be long before that account is nuked anyway. :-)
They have a couple of other legitimate questions
But...we're not going in a positive direction
I wondered if that might've been the case, since they got the rep loss from their 6 downvotes back. Assumedly that would have been countered by the -100 from the nuke had it been nuked.
@DavidBuck Yep, I understand. That could be quite disconcerting to see for the first time on your own request. It's not helped by the fact that the URRS currently indicates an invalid request based strictly on if a delete-vote can be placed on the post in its current state, but we actually permit del-pls requests, and the Request Generator tests for prior to posting the request, where the post is one down-vote away from being able to be delete-voted.
@RyanM Yes. Although no one can ever go below 1.
@Makyen I really have no idea what y'all are talking about since I've never used URRS, but it seems like this kind of thing should be addressed by adding some kind of subtle visual indicator that the post has been modified by a script.
1:00 AM
@CodyGray The script adds tooltips to all the elements it changes which note that it's been changed.
Mmm.... tooltips aren't exactly what I was thinking of. They require hovering over something.
@CodyGray, thanks man. That isn't the first time I've posted an XY problem, and it probably won't be the last. I'll rework it and post later.
@RyanM Got a moment for a question? Is there any advantage to having a [custom-notification] tag for Android? In other words, is there anything unique or special about a "custom notification" that wouldn't be captured if I just merged that into [notification]?
@crinklywrappr Yup, no problem. It's something that a lot of people miss, and it's kind of annoyingly subtle, but it's an important distinction. As someone who spends a lot of time cleaning up those spam and low-quality answers to recommendation questions, I can tell you that it really does matter how you ask the question.
I love linking to psubsee2003's answer, because it's really excellent at explaining it and giving advice on what to do instead.
@CodyGray Hmmm, I'd have to take a look at the questions, but off the top of my head, notifications with custom layouts specifically are a bit of a beast of their own, and they can have issues that aren't universal to other notification usage, or to layouts more generally (they share some of the same limitations as home screen widgets, but not entirely).
That's what I was afraid of... that it wasn't going to be simple, and that Android is complicated/confusing.
1:06 AM
@CodyGray I'm not sure there's something which is both subtle enough to not be annoying the 1000th time you've seen it and yet noticeable enough such that it would have prevented confusion in situations like what happened above, but I'm open to suggestions.
@Makyen A little pencil icon? Or maybe some other icon, like a star or something to denote a bot, so it doesn't look like the user edited it? Changing the color? Adding a dotted underline?
@CodyGray The basic issue is that these are RemoteViews - a layout that is under your control, but isn't running in your process (it's running in the System UI's process, as that's the one displaying the notifications). This means, for instance, that everything has to be built out of framework UI components - no custom draw code, for instance, because it can't execute code from your process.
most of the questions are using the tag that way. There are a few misusing it (I see you already removed it from one of those).
@AdrianMole :D
:) ^
1:13 AM
@CodyGray I should note that there is a very clear indication that there have been modifications made to the message, just not that there have been modifications made to the message text. There's additional post state information added visibly to messages containing a link to a SO post. Here's a GIF showing the tooltips, in addition to other changes.
 
1 hour later…
2:21 AM
Question for <3k users: Are you able to see the list of reasons for "Unsuitable for this site"?
@RyanM Yes except for the "Other"
2:42 AM
@RyanM The difference between the close-vote and close-flag dialogs is that users with <3k rep see "Blatantly off-topic" instead of any of the "other" options (e.g. just "other", or the custom reasons other users have provided), and 3k users don't have the ability to add a custom reason.
3:18 AM
@NathanOliver Does this tag seem necessary to you?
This C++ question is the only one using it
@Machavity FYI: that suggested edit has plagiarized content.
Oh, nice find. Rejected
3:36 AM
@Machavity this request should be binned, as it's been closed and reopened before the cleanup script got to it
or...grave(yard?)ed, I suppose, is the more appropriate term. thanks!
@RyanM np. Either term is fine. Admittedly, I probably wouldn't have shortened it past "moved to the Graveyard". :) The important thing was bringing it to our attention. Thanks.
Normally requests for official links are on-topic...but since it's old and the link is dead and I can't find any evidence that the official thing, I'm having trouble finding any lasting value
@RyanM * that the official thing still exists, or that the problem of finding only RC links still exists
4:15 AM
ugh that repository-design tag is a disaster
Can't think of any witty repository-design puns, though...
Can anyone think of any redeeming value for the tag? Note that this is not to be confused with (though it often is confused with) the tag.
@Machavity No. It's covered by the attributes tag. We dont need one tag per C++ attribute.
I've removed the tag from the Q and added the attributes tag
4:39 AM
0
Q: Replace [android-mvvm] with [android] and [mvvm]

Ryan MThe android-mvvm tag is completely useless. Its description is: Questions regarding applying a Model-View-ViewModel in android application We don't need an android- prefixed tag for every single concept that can be applied on Android, and this one is no exception. The same logic in all the com...

5:20 AM
@Burnination-Feed part of me wants to delete this post for the peer pressure badge...but actually I'm more curious for the feedback/still think it's a good idea, so I'm gonna leave it up.
5:53 AM
It'd be nice if someone edited the duplicate target's title to something more general
7:12 AM
What's the policy on creating an account just to edit things? Given that the reputation gains would also be gained if used by one's other account, should that be used?
@Scratte As long as you're not, like, approving your own edits (which you can't do anyway) that should be fine
I'm thinking if a user has OCD and doesn't want a mishap to falsly mark their edits as rejected when they're in fact "conflicted with a subsequent edit". So that if that happens, then the user can just be deleted and one can try again with a clean slate.
@RyanM Yes, I wouldn't be able to since I lack the reputation
Also occasionally suggested edit reviewers screw up. I've incorrectly rejected at least one good edit, and then had to go reapply it myself after someone told me why it was correct...
@RyanM When it happened to me, I thought of deleting my profile entirely
though with this rather fun number of reviews I think that's still a pretty good accuracy, assuming I got the other 1336 correct...
although some of those are audits, which I've never failed because the suggested edit audits are terrible and blindingly obvious
Why not just propose the edits anonymously?
7:20 AM
Heh.. but what's your editor rating? bad/good edits?
@RyanM That doesn't get the badge.. but a merge may. I'm not sure if merges actually cause a calculation.
@Scratte IMO, you are unduly concerned about things which might "tarnish" your record. While I understand that you might feel better without some of those things recorded on your account, it really doesn't matter to other people.
@Makyen We're all like that :) In whatever way..
To be honest. If I were to review an edit, I'd most certainly click on more and look at the statistics.
@Scratte I have no rejections, but I've only ever proposed 15 edits
@RyanM I'd much rather have that :D
I have 13 declined flags, though.
7:26 AM
Oh!.. The horror! :( Sorry about that.
Most of them were correctly declined when I was learning to flag, one was a long-shot on suspicious votes, one was definitely an incorrect decline where I should have used a custom flag to explain why the content was offensive.
A couple others I can no longer see to know if the decline was correct or not.
@Scratte Yes, and most of us do, sometimes. But the person shouldn't be judged on perfection. It should just be a basis to get a feel for the general quality of their edits. If you have 30 edits and only a couple rejects, that shouldn't really be considered any different than 30 edits with no rejects. Anyone who has used the system knows that there are times when an edit will be rejected regardless of the quality level of the edit, so a small number of rejects shouldn't matter.
I've never once looked at the statistics, I'd rather judge the edits by their content. I'll look at the suggester's rep, but that's about it.
@Makyen I suppose. But I like it when the system is fair.. and I also like 0% and 100% ;)
@RyanM I only sometimes do. I'm actually much more likely to look at the record of the reviewers.
7:31 AM
@Makyen Congratulations on your gaining your only remaining privilege.. :)
4
Oh, I've checked reviewer records a number of times :-)
@Scratte Fair and perfection would be nice, but humans are involved. While we strive for those, they rarely happen.
@Makyen What do you mean by record? The rejected vs. approved?
@Scratte ...well, there is one more privilege level... but seriously, congrats Makyen :-)
While we're confessing mistakes, I also accidentally said a post in LQP looked OK the other day. My brain hit the wrong button.
@Scratte Thanks. The information is interesting, but anticlimactic. :)
7:34 AM
@Makyen That's why I figured I could create an account just for editing.. until I had done enough so that it wouldn't conflict with the reputation gain that is maximum on my current account.
@Scratte Yes. Reject/approve/edit/improve/etc., depending on which queue it's in. I mostly look when I'm wondering how they could have chosen the review result they did. :;
yeah, that
@RyanM Unfortunately I seems Makyen is passing on the last level this year. Which is a shame in my opinion. Makyen has inspired me to do more than I would have done just by being me..
While I am sad that we will not get to have Makyen as a moderator, I understand the decision. @Makyen if you do ever choose to run, it'd be hard to imagine a better choice.
@Scratte As long as you're not breaking the rules, you're welcome to create an additional account (or more than one). I just think you're putting out effort for something that doesn't really matter to other people.
7:37 AM
and that's with plenty of good choices in the field.
@Makyen I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that it's not the other people Scratte is concerned with
@Makyen But if I get to 79 edits... and one get rejected. I'd just delete the account and start over. In a way, it would potentially make me edit forever they way :)
Thank you both. The jury isn't actually out yet, as to my nominating. However, if it happens it will be today.
I need to go somewhere today.. I'll be in a rush to get back, just to see what happened :)
@Scratte I understand that's how you feel about it. It just feels like you're putting too much focus on perfection.
I'm imagining a group of sock accounts, stratified by level of editing risk...
7:41 AM
@Makyen It's not perfection, really. If I did a bad edit, that would be fair and I'd own it. It's the misinformation that the edit was rejected that I can't do with.
@RyanM Yeah, I agree, it's mostly a personal standard, although the first I recall hearing about things along those lines was when it was found out that there was a moderator userscript that had a category with a ridiculously high standard.
@Scratte Why not just one sock-puppet account per edit? That way you can request a merge of only the ones which are not rejected.
I'm always amused when I see a colleague's name as the target of a suggested edit...
It's the same with flags. I have no issues when I'm wrong and get it declined. I just don't like the ones where I wasn't wrong.. and I also dislike the ones that were marked "helpful" that shouldn't have been. They bother me just the same. There is at least one.
@Makyen That's a lot of email addresses.. :)
@Makyen Is merging automated?
The descriptions make it sound semi-manual
You can merge yourself by editing the email address to the email address of your other account.
But merges always goes to the oldest account, so watch out.. I would advice you to "contact us" if you want to merge two 10K accounts though :)
7:45 AM
@Scratte Get a domain, or use gmail. With either, you have a number of available email addresses which is effectively indistinguishable from infinity, for this purpose.
@Makyen I tried that.. but gmail asks for phone numbers now :(
@Scratte You just add "**+**whatever-you-want" to the end of the username for your Gmail email address. It doesn't create an actual new address, but appears to be different when you give it out. The email then goes to the same actual email box.
@RyanM I thought it was mostly manual, but it sounds like @Scratte has better information.
@Makyen Not sure I get that.. if I have a gmail account with something987 at gmail.com, I wouldn't expect mail from someone writing wot something987whatever at gmail.com
@Scratte something987+whatever, though, would go to you. the + is the key; it and everything following it are ignored.
@Scratte If you have "something987 at gmail.com", then all addresses which are "something987+moreText at gmail.com" will go to the same email box.
7:51 AM
@Makyen There's a meta post on stackexchange about a user that accidentally merged their accounts by updating the email :)
@RyanM Ohh.. got to try that then :)
also I think SE takes arbitrary OAuth, so you could use a domain and just set up OAuth
which, from what I can tell about OAuth, is about as much fun as dancing barefoot on LEGOs, but if you need accounts...
@Scratte Yeah, I recall seeing some questions along those lines, but I didn't remember that it was always automatic just based on matching verified email addresses.
@Makyen I'll try to find it.. it bothers me that I didn't keep a link somewhere :)
OTOH, I can understand why it would happen, given that SE uses email address + password for login.
7:57 AM
I suspect they do not advertise it because it's better for Stack to check that it went OK, I suppose.
There could also be reputation recalculation if one has two accounts with identical association bonus.
 
1 hour later…
9:18 AM
@ChristopherMoore You don't see "other", but you do see "blatantly off-topic", right? At least, <3k used to. I don't know if that's changed with the revamp of the close reasons. They've probably changed the name, since they're called "unsuitable" now, instead of "off-topic".
@Machavity That's a heck of a reviewer team on that suggested edit. Also, yeah, even if it weren't plagiarized, that'd be a useless tag, at least at this point.
@RyanM I see that part of you won out in the end. Is that the evil part or the good part?
@CodyGray it's the part that gave up around -6/+0 and decided to maybe rewrite the thing entirely
I'm not entirely sure why that idea was universally hated but a very similar proposal (which I also agree with) got to +29/-0
I'm unclear on if everyone just hates the idea of losing that tag, or if my post just sucked at explaining it.
@RyanM Wait, where did you hear that official announcement?
I didn't even see your Meta post, so none of the downvotes were mine.
@CodyGray From Scratte, on the previous line
it turned out to be at least premature and possibly fake news
@CodyGray I did figure this much. I assume that you would probably have told me what I did wrong if you did decide to downvote it.
@RyanM You think I would comment on a downvote? You don't know me very well.
9:34 AM
@CodyGray More specifically, I think you'd comment with your feelings on a Meta post
Sometimes, I even comment with facts.
9:53 AM
I thought that only happened on Twitter?
Facts? On Twitter? I think the bird is allergic...
10:10 AM
LOL
10:51 AM
@Dharman You're looking for something more minimal? Or is what they have not complete? (If it's not minimal, I prefer to leave a comment explaining that, because it is often not clear to people that they need to shrink it down.)
@CodyGray Yes, there's a couple of reasons. For me the question is too broad, unclear, unreproducible (v. old PHP version) and does not really point out which code is not working "i am unable to do above thing"
I'm gonna make some mildly grumpy noises at "old software version = unreproducible" but I otherwise totally agree with you, it's basically "here is my code, here is my feature request, how do I do it?"
Nicely recovered @DontKnowMuchButGettingBetter ;)
I look away for 15 seconds...
@rene LOL. It's called SOCVR jiu jitsu
10:59 AM
it certainly is ;)
What happened there?
Where?
@ArghyaSadhu Are you protecting questions when flagging NAA?
@Dharman a wrong -pls was issued, edits happened
@Dharman Yes..
11:03 AM
There is almost no situation where you would need to protect a question manually. It happens automatically when a question receives a disproportionate number of non-answers.
How else would you gain the Protective badge?
You just made that up.
Did I? I might have confused that with a FR I read
Ah! You're getting confused with the "Thanker" badge.
I got a "Thankee" badge.
@AdrianMole [screams, runs from building]
11:09 AM
@CodyGray Got it..I was not aware of auto..just reading about it now in meta
11:56 AM
@MikeM. Should it be closed maybe? stackoverflow.com/a/62848558/1839439
12:11 PM
@tripleee I found a better dup in my opinion
12:52 PM
Why was it closed as off-topic? stackoverflow.com/q/62841237/1839439
@Dharman Probably because installing software doesn't look programming related
It's installing PHP modules, which in my opinion is very much on-topic
I agree with that ^
Sure, it is an obvious duplicate, but it is still an on-topic question
^ +1
Shall we reopen then close as a dupe?
12:57 PM
No real point in re-opening just to re-close as a dupe, but... you've got a moderator here for at least another few minutes, so if you want....
I vote let's do that
Who has the dupe target? (Cody doesn't do PHP, I think.)
Dharman already posted one in a comment
Cool. He hadn't posted that comment when I first looked at the question.
I have posted another one if they really want to enable this extension
1:00 PM
Don't you have PHP gold yet?
Far from it
Oh. You only need 233 answers.
That's a couple of days work, right?
nice joke...
It's actually 230
Oh, I actually misread
You have plenty of answers. What you need is score.
I always have the opposite problem, especially on Meta.
I just assumed you were in the same boat
Meh, I'm not even sure why it should be closed as duplicate, since it's already at -1.
1:05 PM
Why would the score have anything to do with how it's closed?
Roomba doesn't eat dupes, I think.
@AdrianMole It does
OK. TIL.
Heh. So, Braiam inspired me to try searching for "mcrypt ubuntu", and this is the very first result.
Does Roomba get hiccoughs when it eats dupes?
1:07 PM
There are many, many others.
Yeah, it's a low ball problem, specially if people is misguided to install packages from PPA's
I've literally written several answers where the problem is that people is mix-matching repositories and dpkg doesn't like it.
@CodyGray That's for PHP 5
In at least 3 cases I've written bug reports for the packager maintainers to fix their crap.
Let me guess: in 0 cases have the package managers fixed their crap
I've not received an ack
One was particularly nasty, since it installed the packages elsewhere and then used a postinst script to move those files and replace those installed by other packages....
It was a "wtf are you doing" moment.
1:15 PM
Yeah, that's... Not good
I've always kind of been afraid of package managers for those kinds of reasons.
I mean, I use them, and they're handy, but always have this suspicious feeling about what they're doing.
I'm more afraid of package maintainers.
That's kind of the same thing
Nope, Debian package maintainers are sane, so are WineHQ and Kxstudio.
They correctly use the conflict/replace entry.
2:15 PM
The question Linux Debian double video output is an example of general hardware/software, isn't it?
Yes it is
An approved edit added although it's for the CSS style property.
I agree. It looks like a completely unnecessary edit
@JeanneDark That tag is confusing, seems was inevitable to have a misuse
3:10 PM
Haha! Mak for Mod! Mak for Mod!...
5
The guy doesn't understand that a duplicate is a duplicate and should stay closed meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/399287/…
@oguzismail Not sure why you decided to let us know of this meta post. Do you expect us to take side or act upon it?
3:26 PM
@oguzismail If something exist or is empty isn't the same as just checking if something exist. One is a subset of the other, but not duplicates.
I'm very tempted to modify the question to ask only if it's empty, since the answer introduce the caveat already.
@Braiam Please do not make edits that change the meaning of the question. I reverted your edits because I do not agree with it. We should only make edits to clarify the problem statement, not change it completely. Please do not remove relevant tags either.
@Dharman I'm fixing the problems with the duplicate, since it confuses people thinking they are the same question, when further consideration should be taken.
@Dharman as you guys are more experienced at handling these situtations, I kind of expected both
@Braiam Doing so you actually made them two more similar.
3:42 PM
@Dharman How? I removed "exist" from the one that is interested in "empty" and left the other to only ask "exist".
Without the "exists" part, the question is silly. Just: Q. How do I check if an array has a length of less than 1? A: if (array.length < 1).
@AdrianMole That doesn't take into account other objects that also have .lenght.
Your array could be in a completely different castle.
Then that's a different question. Not "How to I check if an array is empty?"
Yeah, defensive programming is hard.
Because nobody ever would try to process bad data, that would never happen :)
@AdrianMole Thank you.
I feel all of the SOCVR regulars who've nominated themselves would make good moderators. I wish good luck to both @Machavity and @Dharman in the upcoming election.
3:49 PM
Why should these questions be duplicates? Because they are slightly similar?
@Dharman Because someone somewhere misunderstood that duplicate questions means duplicate answers, and then someone doubled down in that misunderstanding saying that if any answer answers the other question then both are duplicates, and everything went downhill from there.
I blame Jeff with his rule of thumb.
@Dharman Maybe the duplication situation should be reversed?
But I can see there's plenty of room on both sides of the argument.
@Makyen That's far too sporting an attitude :p
@AdrianMole No, that would be worse, since the array is never created.
Yeah, and I think the more people we drag into this argument the bigger the discussion gets without actually arriving at a conclusion.
3:55 PM
The most important question is "why?"
@Braiam Then merge?
Somehow?
@AdrianMole How would that make things better?
Those questions are only incidentally related.
- How to properly create a probably non-existing array
- How to make sure my array contains something
^ This is how it should have been asked instead.
Then I don't understand why the asker of the 'duplicate' even mentions the undefined stuff.
Remember that people try first the naive approach.
@AdrianMole Because if the variable doesn't exist you would get a runtime error
It's your NPE
3:58 PM
... and we come full-circle! Leave it to Meta.
This is a problem with interpreted languages. You need to check if a variable exists before you start using it.
4:18 PM
@HovercraftFullOfEels The OP of that question asked in a comment on an answer what the formula to calculate income tax is. Maybe needs a little more focus.
@Makyen I'm not going to write a comment under you nomination, because it would have to be praise, and -as the nominations stand- my writing would incur in unbalancing something.
4:36 PM
@IanCampbell true
@bad_coder Why would it have to be praise? It can't be a personal attack, but as far as I understand it, there is no requirement that it must be praise
@JeanneDark I went with "needs more focus"; you should generally mention one of the specific close reasons (though I agree this one is hard to categorize, but definitely red-flaggable / VLQ)
@tripleee I flagged as "Blatantly off-topic".
5:11 PM
@HovercraftFullOfEels I think you misunderstand. @bad_coder is saying that anything they write would be praise.
@HovercraftFullOfEels put simply: I don't have anything to ask of Makyen, his writing leaves me no doubts that would require clarification. I would have nothing but praise for him.
@HovercraftFullOfEels (I read his Q&A from the last election, his writing is noteworthy in that you have to look at "how" he says things -to get "a feel" of the person- instead of focusing on "what" he is saying. In that he's not obvious and some voters may overlook the writer, looking at what he writes.)
@HovercraftFullOfEels I also won't praise or announce my support for any of the candidates. If I see something requiring a critique I don't want any endorsement, stated or implied, for any of the candidates, to get in the way of a necessary comment.
6:07 PM
@Makyen Tremendous text this year. I see we enjoy the same writers. Your answer to the first Q was knock-out. Only nit-pick, you used the same word more than twice ("however" stands out).
@bad_coder Thanks. Yeah. "However" tends to be a word I have to work at not using (i.e. finding other ways to reword sentences). I'll see if I can do some copy editing.
@bad_coder Thank you for the clarification
@Makyen You can leave it, it's perfect. The small imperfection shows the effort.
@Makyen I really love conjunctive adverbs, but some people complain they are unneeded.
6:16 PM
"Nevertheless" and "notwithstanding" are good, sometimes, to reduce occurrences of "however."
I've been known to break out "in contradistinction" on occasion.
Personally I need to use "on the other hand" less often
Because it's technically ableist?
lol
@AdrianMole Yeah, they are. However, :) in some cases, those have a stronger negative connotation to them, which often doesn't feel as appropriate, but they are good alternatives.
@IanCampbell I don't think I've used that one. :)
6:21 PM
@IanCampbell I've never heard it before, but I like it.
I was expecting it to be a butchering of on the contrary, and in distinction, but apparently it's a word, TIL
I agree with Adrian though, I should use "nevertheless" more
@Nick I also use that one a bit much. It's just so easy to say "OTOH". But if you use it enough, then you get to say "on the gripping hand". :)
6:46 PM
@Makyen Notwithstanding your repetitive use of however, your post is, nevertheless, just fine. :-)
@AdrianMole :) Thanks.
How do you help someone who insists on posting code with 23 library calls?
See the edit history and question linked in the first comment for context: stackoverflow.com/questions/62852965/…
I want to help, but I just don't know how. Obviously I could just write their web page for them, but that seems like... you know, not my job.
7:15 PM
@Dharman I don't like interfering. But you have my respect and esteem. Since you decided to change your initial text. I would advise that in your questionnaire, answer #3 is a wall-of-text that should be divided. In A#4 it may be best to put an empty line between the 3 parts. The same applies to A#5. Also, A#7.1 and A#9 could use some division.
@Dharman both A#1 and A#2 serve as good examples of what should be the maximum extension of a paragraph. Notice, the correct way to write is by using paragraphs. The problem is, its current form places a burden on the concentration of voters - it's dissuading.
@Dharman notice that many of us are tiered, the worst nightmare of a programmer is a wall-of-text (in documentation, or elsewhere). Hence, the common trend to almost write in individual sentences, with blank lines in between.
@Dharman I say this, because your readers, the voters, want to get "a feel" for "the man"...And that is legitimate, in making their choice. Formatting would help them towards that end.
@bad_coder Thank you. This is actually amazing advice and I really appreciate it.
How do I abbreviate "question"
Would it be "Q1" or "Q.1"?
@Dharman abreviate the word? Q1 is more elegant.
@Dharman if you need anything I'm available.
7:59 PM
@bad_coder I have made the edits and added whitespace
@Dharman I'm taking a look.
@Dharman there are a few possible tweaks, I'm making a list.
@Dharman Oh, yeah, probably. Thanks.
Gotta love those. "Is it this?", "No, definitely not." ... "Oh, wait, it was that."
"recognize" to "recognizing"
"about one of the flags I handled"
"about a flag I handled"
"by any other user"
"by any user"
"I will share as much of the details as I allowed to share "
"I will share as much detail as allowed"
@Dharman Q3
how to flag user accounts, if they never asked a question? have a look at stackoverflow.com/help/badges/9, there is a flood of users called: 湛江开建材发票131一4587一8890湛江开建材发票
8:12 PM
@Dharman make a list of the proofreading, so you make the edit all at once. (These are just recommendations, my opinion.)
@Vickel You don't
@bad_coder Thanks, I fixed them
@Vickel You can flag your own post; but usually it isn't worth hunting down these profiles, really
their userprofile translates to some protest and spam content like:
Zhanjiang open building materials invoices

1 minute ago Zhanjiang opened building materials invoice [electricity: 131 1 4587 1 8890,] Zhanjiang opened building materials invoice (deduction: 21094969091) 〓 100% genuine ticket 〓 [100-year-old shop, integrity guarantee] Fengqu Dengge tune order, Long Yu set dances in a pan-xiang style.

Cai Yanyun returned to Zhao Ruide, and Zhu Qiandian made a magical performance. Preparing for ritual music, respecting relatives. Honesty, kindness, love and love. Offer a long life,
@Vickel They are created by the thousands and moderators do not have time to deal with those
Anyone have any thoughts on what they are up to? Are they using SO as an invoice system? Is it an attack?
8:14 PM
@JohnDvorak so they just stay, or is there a clean-up bot?
for me it's spam through user accounts
I tried to raise this with SE in the past, but I was a little bit ignored. It's not a very important issue
@Vickel I don't trust google Chinese -> english
@IanCampbell It's spam. Just that. SEO or just free advertisement.
Hmm, SEO, I like that idea.
wait until they ask their 1st question :)
8:19 PM
Not sure how you translated this but I get this:
"1 minute ago, where can Xining invoices be issued [Telephone: 131 1 4587 1 8890,] where can Xining invoices be issued (deduction: 21094969091) 〓 100% genuine invoices 〓 [hundred-year old store, integrity guarantee] Liu Haoran and Monkey What is going on? what expression? [Picture] Qu Chuxiao's Love: Qu Chuxiao denied that the woman had issued a document saying that "separated" Korean artist raised funds from Chinese fans, but supported Wuhan in his own name. [Generation-Faculty Ranking +Q: ⒐⒈⒊⒈⒈⒍⒈⒉⒌]"
@Dharman I think text varies from account to account, the question is how could they create so many accounts in such a short time?
@Vickel Bots
so it is a kind of an attack...
It's chinese spam now. But in general these accounts have always been created. Hundreds or thousands per day.
8:22 PM
I just got attention of it because of SOBotics Badger
Q4
"you should assume"
""should you assume"
Q6
" see if any of comments"
"see if any of the comments"
Q7
"Then the moderators' job"
"Then the moderators job" <- notice the apostrophe
"which is important"
"which is why it's important"
@Vickel I also found out by asking about the bout of Badger barrages in botics.
Q8, Q9 and Q10 are alright (I saw 1 detail that could be changed, but it adds authenticity and is consistent, so should be left.)
Q1 and Q2 are alright.
@bad_coder Thanks. The apostrophe is correct. If I remove it then the grammar check underlines it in red.
@Dharman yes you are right! It's plural and pertains to the moderators, the apostrophe is correct. (Nice detail of punctuation btw...)
@Dharman Ok the structure is good, consistent, the grammar proofread. Anything else would be changing your peculiar style, and that is in fact a fundamental plus.
8:33 PM
Once again, thank you.
@Dharman My only "if" in terms of structure is the last part in Q3....If you join the 2 paragraphs it becomes to large...If you split them, there's a discontinuation in subject. My option would have been to shorten it into 1 piece. But you can opt to leave it or rewrite, as your prefer. I just wanted to mention it.
"(...)to some explanation.
I will explain(...)"
@Dharman ^^ this break here us what I mean.
I removed one sentence
@Dharman Ok, in terms of "structure" looks good.
@eyllanesc Maybe that should be converted to a del-pls
8:57 PM
Is there a meta post about "hope it helps"?
@Dharman No thanks dammit?
Is there a one about exactly that phrase?
I remember there were many phrases used as closing words included there.
I think this is the best: stackoverflow.com/help/behavior
Although I was looking for something exact that would say you should not end answers this way
9:29 PM
How about if instead of linking to help page when I edit the answer I leave this message "Removing clutter. Please do not end answers with "Hope it helps!" or signatures." Is this polite enough?
User Gibolt posted these three near-identical answers about logical assignments (and null-coalescing assignment) yesterday: javascript set a variable if undefined, Replace a value if null or undefined in JavaScript, and Is there a “null coalescing” operator in JavaScript?.
@user4642212 Duplicate answers often mean duplicate questions, but in this case I’m not sure if the answers are 100 % relevant to each question. What should we do here?
@user4642212 Please flag for moderators attention and clearly explain to them what the issue is. They can delete the answers if needed and link questions together.
@user4642212 FYI We avoid talking about specific users in rooms like fire. We are not allowed to discuss what a user has done or what actions to take against them. A room owner might move your message out of this room.
@Dharman I’m not targeting the specific user. Read my comment as “The same user posted these three near-identical answers […]” instead. I just wanted to differentiate it from plagiarism (i.e. identical answers from different users), and focus on the three posts (and the questions they’re under).
9:45 PM
@user4642212 It's not plagiarism if they copy their own answer. However, we still frown upon duplication and such answers are generally flaggable and should be deleted by mods. A mod will investigate and decide on the best course of action.
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