« first day (2965 days earlier)      last day (854 days later) » 

 
2 hours later…
3:15 AM
 
 
2 hours later…
5:42 AM
@Dharman dang not even in top 50 :p
 
6:01 AM
 
6:24 AM
@richardec even I only get a few metasmoke autoflags per month, and I'm in the privileged caste
though my flagging conditions are rather constrained, so that probably reduces my chances
 
6:48 AM
Is this a serverfault question?
 
7:06 AM
@SurajRao, @tripleee, also "No repro", as per Op's comment
 
@Vega this one ? "Did a proper research and discovered there was a malware, and have also fixed it."
 
it's in the nature of these questions, and one of the reasons they should be closed
 
That isnt no repro.. That means OP found a solution...
 
Note that the typo/no-repro text ends with: ...this one was resolved in a way less likely to help future readers.
 
Argh, add my name to the list of people bitten by the "Revoking your delete vote looks really similar to casting it" issue.
It definitely said the right thing, I just wasn't paying close enough attention.
 
7:27 AM
We think you're not using your delete votes properly. Please pay more attention to the information text provided by the UI popups.
 
8:05 AM
 
8:32 AM
^ suspicious number of upvotes
 
8:51 AM
@tripleee Suggested another dupe that I think is a better match
(printing function result vs. code of function)
 
thanks, though probably delv-pls worthy, once it's old enough ...?
 
yeah, probably
 
9:20 AM
 
10:00 AM
Can a RO delete my last cv-pls request?
 
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null (by request)
 
10:32 AM
probably a good idea
 
11:03 AM
 
For the Kitsune mask, does my answer need to be upvoted or does the question need to be upvoted?
...I guess the question needs to be upvoted because my accepted answer didn't trigger it.
 
11:20 AM
is such a mess.
 
are these kind of questions never eligible for migration over to softwarerecs.SE?
 
OP seems to mistake this for Big Ugly Fat Mafioso Death Threat Overflow
 
11:40 AM
Interesting fact: in 2021 less 440,080 questions were asked on SO compared to 2020. Overall close percentage increased 0.41% (almost constant).
@E_net4isnotinablockchain you are the right curator for the job.
@mickmackusa from the description the answer needs to be upvoted but the "it" is vague.
 
12:06 PM
@bad_coder I agree.
 
@RyanM Hey :) since when do you have write access?
@RyanM let me rephrase that, since when are you an RO?
 
@bad_coder see the top pinned message on the right
 
@tripleee oohhh, I was expecting the year in closing post so my brain didn't process the top pinned messages.
 
happens to the best of us (-:
 
12:20 PM
Does this need more focus? I don't know the tech, but so far it's received only recommendations. There's also a suggested dupe that is an explicit resource request.
 
@cigien I would call cropping a video a specific enough operation. Low quality indeed, regardless.
 
@E_net4isnotinablockchain Ok, sounds good, thanks.
 
1:07 PM
Morning
 
@bad_coder if we are closing this (irrespective of the close reason), why are we not closing this
(I'm not addressing you specifically, bad_coder)
 
@blackgreen ^ but we are! thanks for bringing it up
 
@tripleee Actually, I just asked about that, and got feedback that it's focused enough.
 
1:22 PM
@blackgreen I'm not a Flutter expert, but I know OpenCV enough that the counter is an Nth dup for sure. So I'd have to think about casting a CV on one while the other is an instant close for me.
 
@cigien to me the two questions seem equally focused (not much)
although I didn't use "lacks focus" as close reason in either one
the problem I have with "needs more focus" as a close reason is that the reminder description is almost never reflective of the actual issue with the question (too broad)
but that's another story
 
The flutter one does seem marginally better than the python one, but yeah, they do seem to be a bit unfocused.
 
People (including some regulars in here) seem to use "Needs focus" as a close reason when they actually mean "lacks effort" ... which is not a close reason (but a downvote reason, for sure).
 
either way, it rarely provides actionable guidance for those who have their Qs closed as unfocused
I would be extremely confused to see that as a close reason on a question that indeed asks only one question
 
Agreed. I see lots of Qs closed as "needs focus" in the reopen queue that are well-focused. I generally skip, rather than (reluctantly) voting to reopen an otherwise very poor question.
 
1:30 PM
@Dharman @RyanM congrats on the RO invitation, you both deserve it by always having kept with the high standards we're accustomed to in this room. On a personal note I consider you both SE friends as can be, so I'm sure you'll bring your unique personal qualities to your new role.
 
unrelated: suppose I created a chat room about a tag, and then were advised by a reputation millionaire to inform the top users in the tag about the existence of such a room. How would you go about informing them?
a meta post seems overkill
 
@blackgreen find their most recent answers and leave a comment linking to it
 
most recent you say
 
2:11 PM
For the record, I despise requirements dumps. My opinion aside, should this requirements dump be re-opened because it is sufficiently clear or remain closed because it has asked a compound question (multi-technique) task? stackoverflow.com/q/70555508/2943403
 
@mickmackusa I'm not sure "requirements dump" is a fair description of that question. It's simply asking how to achieve something, which is... the same form of all questions
a requirements dump is typically "I need X Y and Z" and doesn't even bother including an interrogative
 
I thought I wasn't allowed to say "giv me the codez" in this room.
 
well, you're not, because you're describing a downvote reason a best, not a close vote reason
 
The question is certainly asking for multiple techniques -- each which can be dredged up from elsewhere on SO.
I don't find the accepted answer to be incredibly refined, though it works as desired.
 
I think the question is certainly simple and focused enough to be on-topic. I don't know if it's a duplicate, but it sounds like you may know a couple good ones.
We don't typically reopen questions just to close them for another reason though
If anything, I'd say posting the good duplicates as a comment would be sufficient
otherwise, let's leave it alone
 
2:17 PM
How else can SO stop help vampirism in the regex tag pool if these kinds of questions are not closed? I certainly cannot close the question with a single, pre-existing question.
Should I downvote the question AND vote to reopen it?
@DalijaPrasnikar seems controversial given the comments on the page.
 
@mickmackusa It does not matter whether someone can answer it with facts as it is not a practical programming problem.
 
@DalijaPrasnikar I can get behind that reasoning.
 
@mickmackusa downvoting helps a lot, and voting to close as a duplicate if it's been answered. There are several folks in the regex tag that help out with closing such questions
 
2:35 PM
@Dharman They did ask on MSE for things you need API-wise as they rewrite all their JavaScript... you could mention it there if there isn't a post already covering that
@blackgreen Thanks, both of those should be deleted...
 
@TylerH agreed. about the bug, were you able to test it?
(assuming you were even interested in doing so)
 
@blackgreen No I don't have any way to make API calls
@DalijaPrasnikar I voted to keep it closed in the reopen queue and left a comment for future readers; personally I'm OK with just leaving it there and not deleting it since it has a correct answer and the thread clearly has been useful to people (not deleting useful information and all that).
 
@TylerH @blackgreen I wouldn't use their most recent posts, as such comments are more likely to be seen by others and, potentially, be disruptive and/or considered spam (Yes, spam, even for a chat room, as you are specifically promoting your new room, even though the promotion is targeted to people you feel will actually want to know).
Chat has an "invite this user..." feature which was intended for this type of use. If the user has a chat profile, I'd use the "invite this user..." feature. However, I wouldn't do so for a large number of people, as doing so could be viewed as spam, particularly if you send such invites to a substantial number of people.
If the user doesn't have a chat profile, and you really want to contact them through a comment on one of their posts, then I'd pick an old post with no other comments on the post (so no other users are pinged) and low views, preferably a low-score answer with no comments on a question with very low views.
I'd leave the comment up only long enough for the user to have seen it. I'd be sure to delete any comments added for this purpose on the post after a relatively short time, and definitely after they have served their purpose, as the comments are not about the post and are just noise to anyone else reading them.
In general, using comments in this manner is discouraged. Depending on what you're doing and how you're doing it, it might result in a warning from a moderator. However, informing one or two people in this manner is unlikely to result in moderator attention unless inappropriately worded and/or flagged.
 
@SurajRao It's their own site - see the MS entry they got blacklisted for
 
@snakecharmerb yes...
edited my comment
 
2:50 PM
@Machavity a question you closed last year has been significantly edited: stackoverflow.com/questions/3731918/oracle-debugging-techniques
 
@Makyen thanks, as a matter of fact I was wary of using comments in such a way, especially to avoid being considered pushy. I haven't yet posted such comments, btw. However I'm really not sure how else to let them know. They seldom participate in meta (basically never)
 
@TylerH not entirely sure that should be edited... metasmoke.erwaysoftware.com/…
 
Another option is to leave things as they are. I have added a link in my profile, and if they are interested, eventually they'll naturally become aware of the chat
or let the reputation millionaire weigh in... (joking. sort of)
 
@SurajRao I'm just making it clear to others that it is a wholesale copied post; I didn't really "improve" it in terms of trying to keep it around
added bonus if by some miracle the OP learns from my edit that that's how they should be formatting such posts in the first place
 
uhm they do have a chat profile
problem solved
 
3:00 PM
@blackgreen I disagree with Makyen; I think it makes little difference whether you comment on one of their old or new answers, since lower rep users often aren't in a good position to interfere anyway (and you can make it a private room easily enough if people drop in just to spam en masse, but that really has... never happened in the history of chat, to my knowledge). And comments are by nature transient, so it's OK for the target to flag as NLN when they see it (or you can delete it yourself
after a week or so)
I'd tsk at any moderator who issued a warning for that, unless of course you are in fact doing it to dozens of people or something at once. Personally I'd probably not do it to any more than 5 people total, at any given time. Beyond that I'd try to look for a way to contact them elsewhere, e.g. Twitter or some Slack/Discord maybe, or if they have an email account listed
 
@TylerH I literally have no account on any other social network, would you believe that?
 
@blackgreen Yes, sure
a lot of people are not big into social media, especially programmers who are stereotyped as anti-social to begin with :-P
 
Anyway, I sort of share the idea that such promotional comments may be excessively unrelated to the post. Since the top users in the tag who are still active are few, and the top one appears to have a chat profile, I'll try that as first step
I appreciate your feedback
 
@TylerH I would upvote your pitchforks meta post.
 
@TylerH that's debatable. Look at people like Arun Gupta, Kelsey Hightower, Uncle Bob, Martin Fowler, ... They're pretty active on social media.
 
3:05 PM
If nothing happens, then it's destiny. 缘分
@TylerH yeah that's the bag of stones we gotta go around with
 
@Turing85 I don't know any of those people (unless you are talking about my uncle, Bob)
in which case, how do you know him?!
 
@TylerH You should look them up =) especially Uncle bob (Robert C. Martin) and Martin Fowler. They - among others - defined the agile manifesto
 
Yes, there are many programmers who are on social media (including yours truly). But that doesn't change the fact that many are not. I could throw a stick into a crowd and probably hit one who decries Facebook as the root of all evil and deleted their account a decade ago (or never made one)
 
@TylerH why did a stick just fly through my window?!?
 
@TylerH The difference is similar to: Going into a crowded room, or a room which is still frequented by multiple people and then announcing to everyone there something you are, effectively, advertising vs. going somewhere mostly private and mentioning it to a single person. The latter is substantially less disruptive.
 
3:20 PM
^that would roomba in 5 days
 
user17242583
oh oops, yeah, sorry, forgot about roomba again
 
@mickmackusa Was it, maybe, a broken boomerang?
 
@Makyen That's not a particularly apt metaphor; leaving a comment under an answer is not announcing to everyone in a room, or particularly disruptive. Or do you feel disrupted any time you read a comment under an answer that is not directly relevant to a problem you are trying to solve in that moment?
It's much more like leaving a sticky note on someone's box in a mail room vs putting a letter inside the mail box itself. You don't have to read the note if it's not on your box, and even if you do, it's a moment of your time to find out it's, surprise, not for you
In my mind, though, yes I admit I was associating "find their most recent answer" with "determine if they are still regularly active on the site"
 
3:39 PM
@TylerH Your suggestion is to go to the user's most recent answer, which, without any qualification, could easily be something that was posted within the last few minutes or day. Such a post is likely to still be frequented by other users, who you are not attempting to contact with your comment which has nothing to do with the current post.
Posting your promotion of your chat room there is substantially more disruptive than spending a little bit of time to find a post which is currently getting less traffic and where your comment would have the same ability to notify the user you are trying to actually contact. IMO, choosing to barge into the, potentially, more active post is self-centered and, potentially, rude.
 
Imagine you're in high school (in the US--most people have seen some terrible high school movie, right?) and someone left a yellow post-it note on a locker "Hi, we're starting a chess club, would you be interested in joining? Here's a link!" I think that's pretty innocuous. It's not like you're profiting from the chess club. Someone thought you would be interested in chess. They aren't putting post-it notes on everyone's lockers. Sure, other passers by can read the note.
But I don't think it's rude, and I don't think it's that big a bother to other people.
 
A lot of these Hyper-V questions are off-topic
 
@Makyen how is it self-centered?
 
@TylerH about this, @Makyen let me clarify that the chat room in question is about a somewhat popular tag on the main site, it's definitely not my room. I'm only one who took it upon themselves to create it
following discussion with one of the top users in the tag
 
@blackgreen I suspect Makyen is considering it your room because you created it (respectfully, a myopic view in my opinion)
 
3:52 PM
that's why using a comment for this may actually have some merit. it is indeed potentially interesting to those who browse that tag
although surely unrelated to the post under which it appears
 
Personally I think the more people who see such an effort/ room, the better
Most efforts/desires to clean up a tag in some way fail because of lack of participation
sure, the main point of such a comment is to get the attention of the high-rep/active user, but it's certainly a beneficial side effect if other users see it as well, if not to contribute then to at least be aware of the effort and maybe learn (or reinforce what they already knew) what not to do to prevent exacerbating the issue
 
The attempt to contact the user about the chat has succeeded. everybody is happy
 
@blackgreen and there was much rejoicing
 
4:17 PM
@richardec it looks like you've retracted a delete vote here; given that it will Roomba, would you like me to bin this request?
 
4:38 PM
@Adriaan indeed
 
@Dharman I suppose this one has been clarified.
 
user17242583
@TylerH yes please, thank you :) I forgot to request that after I retracted
 
@IanCampbell As an analogy, that is much closer to my suggestion to post the comment on an old, low views post, rather than the user's most recent post, without regard to how long ago that post was authored, or if there is an active comment thread, or if the other people actively engaged in the existing question and answer might want to have a conversation in the comments on that post.
@TylerH The person who would be posting the comment is focused on promoting the thing they are interested in to the point of doing it in a way which is, potentially, disruptive. While I understand that you would not find such a comment on one of your answer as inappropriate or disruptive, please understand that other people may find it disruptive and inappropriate.
The comment poster's actions should take into account how other people might feel about it, particularly when mitigating a significant portion of the possible concern is easily within their ability with a little bit of work (i.e. finding a post which isn't currently active on which to post the unrelated comment).
@TylerH I'm considering it "their" room because they are the one interested in promoting it. It doesn't matter if they "own" it or not it is "their thing" from the point of view that it's what they are promoting.
@blackgreen So, because the promotion is, potentially, interesting to the people who might view it makes it OK to post? So, all targeted spam is OK, as long as some of the people who see it might be interested?
 
@Makyen It is not OK, I'm not advocating doing that. In fact, I used the "invite user.." chat feature, and that worked out just fine
 
@richardec → 1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null, assumed to be the request mentioned above
 
user17242583
4:52 PM
ty @Makyen
 
@Makyen that's not addressing how it is self-centered, but rather how you might find it disruptive
@Makyen that's again not a fair comparison. Spam is de jure not allowed on the site. Site moderation is allowed and relevant meta commentary does often happen in comments.
The only difference between posting it to an old answer vs a new one is if you don't want others to be aware or if you do. IMO there are pros to the latter and cons to the former. The more recent answer is more transparent and likely to draw more people into the effort. The older answer is less transparent and not likely to draw more people into the effort.
Frankly any concerns about "this is disruptive" are going to be a matter of opinion that varies from one user to the next, and thus should not be a concern, so long as we're talking about a single invitation and not something done en masse or as a habit.
Discretion is encouraged if there is an ongoing conversation happening in the comments, sure, but again these are mitigating circumstances at best, not cause to modify the rule
 
@TylerH IMO, it does address self-centeredness. The person posting the comment is focused on what they want to accomplish without regards to what the impact is on others or how it will be perceived by the intended recipient.
 
@Makyen I don't presume blackgreen (or any user) posts the comment without regard for the impact, only that they might disagree with you on whether it's a problem.
self-centered and disruptive are not synonymous, after all
 
@TylerH I strongly disagree with that. You made an unqualified recommendation as to how to proceed. It's better to have the general suggestion avoid the potential pitfalls.
@TylerH Yes, the spam is more effective if more people see it.
 
And that aside, this isn't some topic about the commenter personally gaining (otherwise we've got bigger issues like potential fraud going on); it's about an effort to moderate the site. Someone who kicks off a clean-up effort isn't really personally gaining from that
@Makyen again, this isn't spam, so that's a dishonest remark
 
5:03 PM
@TylerH Calling it spam might be engaging in a bit of hyperbole, given the generally strong negative connotations, but, at its base, posting a comment like that is trying to get more participation in a particular room, which is promoting the room.
 
@Makyen I agree it's better to have the general suggestion avoid potential pitfalls. I consider an effort that dies due to lack of involvement or that starts off without potentially necessary community review (e.g. some inexperienced user making bad cleanup efforts) to be much more of a pitfall than causing a couple users to potentially read a comment that isn't relevant to them
@Makyen Sure, in the same way that pointing anyone to anywhere else on the site is trying to get more engagement happening on the site called Stack Overflow
 
@TylerH If that's your reasoning, then just say "post on meta".
 
It's hardly "spam" to say "Hi, I am starting an effort to clean up [tag] which you are a SME in, and efforts like these are recommended to involve SMEs. If you are interested, could you please weigh in at [room]?"
@Makyen I'm assuming this advice to blackgreen from said 'reputation millionaire' came from Meta
Otherwise it would've had to come from chat (OK, we've already solved the problem we're discussing), or comments under a post (OK, we've already done what we're asking how to do)
 
@TylerH Then your arguments about lacking community review are substantially off-base. You're now arguing "I've assumed there's been community review on meta, but we need more community review, so go post comments under some posts."
 
Community review is an ancillary metric, not a core one
I only suggested that it's of more importance to consider than whether untargeted users might see the comment under discussion
However, after reviewing the original question by blackgreen, it actually sounds like this is just a conversation room they're talking about, not necessarily a cleanup effort. So I would revise my advice: I would not really recommend commenting at all (on new or old answers, at least on Main) for inviting users to a general conversation room. I was under the impression this was for clean-up of a smaller/low-activity tag.
 
 
1 hour later…
6:15 PM
@TylerH the room is supposed to be the [go] tag room, just like CSS, Rust, Java have their own room. I don't envision it to become primarily a base for tag-wide cleanup, although that kind of activity may naturally arise after users start interacting. The primary purpose would be to drive off-topic questions off the main site (recommendations, dupe finding, etc.), and give external observers less opportunity to claim that Stack Overflow is unwelcoming
(which was one of VonC's links in his latest meta post)
this just to name things with their name
I ended up not posting comments anywhere
I appreciate yours and Makyen's advice
 
@TylerH I am more for deleting things that don't hold much value - knowing why some library skipped some versions is not something worth keeping around. It might have been somewhat useful at the point this change happened, but it is not relevant any more and it is off topic.
 
I tend to agree. It's not serving any use, Watching a 2-hour video to hear the overall reason isn't useful. 3k views isn't worthy of a lock either
 
6:42 PM
@DalijaPrasnikar fair enough
I didn't click through any of the links but I didn't realize all three were videos
 
@Tomerikoo Can you tag that as ?
 
@snakecharmerb Done. Thanks in advance ;)
 
@snakecharmerb closing as a dupe of a dupe? @Tomerikoo
 
@snakecharmerb While I understand your desire, asking for someone to retag a question in order to allow you to use your dup-hammer is explicitly not permitted. Please see #17 in the FAQ.
 
@Makyen Oh, I'm sorry, I wasn't aware of that rule. I shall respect it in future.
 
6:48 PM
Sorry @Makyen. Wasn't aware of that
 
np (both). Thanks for being aware of it in the future.
 
@Ruli The use of that is to have people flag things if you're out of flags or your flag was incorrectly invalidated. There's a flag on it already so more flags are not needed
 
@TylerH Why not? Gives more options for whoever finds their way to that question...
 
@TylerH Added it to the dupe list; thanks for the nudge.
 
6:52 PM
@Tomerikoo Well, typically you want as few clicks as possible to get to the best answer
usually that means updating either the question that just got closed to point to the ultimate target
 
@Machavity sorry, will know for the future :)
 
sometimes it's certainly called for to use both if they both solve the problem from different perspectives or something, of course
but that's uncommon
 
@Machavity @Makyen pls dump this re-open request of mine (as @Tomerikoo pointed out, it is essentially a typo): chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/53762415#53762415
 
@desertnaut binned per your request
 
@desertnaut was about to ping you here if that is the case... It is technically just missing a () but maybe holds a common problem others might have?
 
6:57 PM
@Tomerikoo dunno man, looks like a typo to me...
 
There's probably a dupe target for not instantiating an object before using a method.
 
@HenryEcker well, there is for Java: stackoverflow.com/questions/2394205/…
dunno about other languages
 
Ah, that's a good one
 
@HenryEcker !!! good job!!!
 
7:03 PM
Should the edit on this question be rolled back?
 
I would not bother; OP has the right to change their question when no one has answered yet
 
No, I don't think so. The edit looks like an improvement.
 
It doesn't make it reopen-worthy, but it doesn't cause any problems, either
 
Once again, a duplicate?
 
The original question was improving speed over the current implementation (?)
 
7:07 PM
@Tomerikoo yes, a dupe of this (slightly newer) canonical: stackoverflow.com/questions/9086880/…
But where did you see that one? It hasn't had activity in nearly 2 years
 
Okay if it's not going to be rolled back I'm going to fix the spelling of "Excle" because it's bothering me.
 
lol
 
@TylerH A simple C# export sql to excel Google :)
 
ah
 
7:45 PM
 
I'm not around alot lately so a late congrats to @Dharman and @RyanM for the new role!! :)
 
Thanks
 
8:12 PM
Thanks! (both to you and bad_coder, who posted similar congrats earlier)
 
8:26 PM
Oh hey, Ryan and Dharman are doing even more things. Congrats to you both, have fun keeping the site AND chat transcript clean :)
 
8:53 PM
@Spevacus I'm supposed to be keeping the transcript clean?! I thought I was supposed to be filling it with messages-moved entries...
 
9:12 PM
Is this question opinion-based?
 
@Turing85 I would say it is
 
@Turing85 Yes
 
9:40 PM
Is this question on topic?
 
@HenryEcker nope.
Damn @Machavity you're fast...
 
Probably should be general computing but... not really a good question for SU either. Oh well
 
9:55 PM
@jps should we really translate the question on the user's behalf?
 
@Turing85 No
 
jps
@Turing85 no, we should not. I'm asking here for a review of an existing edit and hope someone here will reject it too (like I did)
 
@jps ah okay. Well seems like your wish was granted :)
 
@Turing85 It was. It's been discussed many times on Meta
 
jps
@Turing85 such edits always have the risk that an inexperienced reviewer will approve them, therefore I prefer to rely on the experience of the SOCVR regulars.
 
10:00 PM
@DavidBuck 👍
 
Does Getting past location barrier need edited or closed?
 
10:27 PM
Any db-experts here? If I, in one transaction, delete a row and then insert another row, such that - if the deletion did not happen, the insert would result in a unique key violation - should this also happen in one transaction?
 
@Turing85 I'm pretty sure that constraints are checked at commit.
At least on postgres is like that
 
@Braiam so it should not fail?
 
it should not fail
but it depends on the engine and the transaction mode
 
sheesh... that's always confusing the hell out of me...
 
Also, even if it was two transactions and you were reusing the unique value for the new row, it shouldn't fail either.
As long as the order is delete > insert.
 
10:31 PM
@Braiam that the two-transaction case should not fail is obvious. It's the one-transaction case that confuses me.
 
Install postgres and try it, since you can set the isolation level at runtime postgresql.org/docs/current/transaction-iso.html
 
@Braiam I am asking due to this question. But as-is, it seems that not enough information is provided to answer the question.
 
10:47 PM
 
10:58 PM
@Turing85 For the people interested: Hibernate/JPA screws up in this case. The EntityManager seems to reorder the recorded actions, executing the INSERT before the DELETE...
 
@Turing85 Oh cool, a reason to not use that db manager.
 
@Braiam yes and no. This is normally not a use-case covered by hibernate. We would normally try to merge the data sets. There are other ways (e.g. using multiple transactions, or inserting manual flushes). But yeah... in this particular case, the entity manager does not what one thinks it does.
 

« first day (2965 days earlier)      last day (854 days later) »