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12:33 AM
@SamuelLiew I have a retract room access request request.
 
testing... 1 2 3
 
4 5 6
 
I'm awesome
 
what is my candidate score?
 
@AnnZen You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election as you are missing the required badge: Convention. If you really must know, your candidate score is 20 (out of 40).
 
12:41 AM
Who is Samuel Liew?
@ElectionBot Who created you?
 
@CodyGray While a low rate (by comparison for rate, I've cast just under 2000, and the vast majority of those were cast this year), that is the second highest total of the candidates so far. The others are Tschallacka at 578, Travis J at 2053, and Dharman at 12077.
 
let's see what this bot recognises
who candidates
who are candidates
 
Currently there are 4 candidates: Travis J, Machavity, Dharman, Tschallacka
 
(sorry for triple ping, I need to proofread better...)
 
are candidates
 
12:44 AM
candidate who is
 
Currently there are 4 candidates: Travis J, Machavity, Dharman, Tschallacka
 
I am a candidate.
 
who am candidate
 
@RyanM that's cheating
 
12:44 AM
Are you a candidate?
 
@ArtOfCode but efficient! :D
 
I know what are moderation badges!
 
It's any message with at least one of 'who‎ are', 'who‎ is', 'who‎ has', or 'how‎ many', and also at least one of 'nom‎inees', 'nom‎inated', 'nom‎inations', or 'can‎didate', except for this message.
 
I was wondering, why should I be a moderator chooser?
 
12:48 AM
What are required badges?
 
The 4 required badges to nominate yourself are: Civic Duty, Strunk & White, Deputy, Convention. You'll also need 3000 reputation.
@AnnZen You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election as you are missing the required badge: Convention. If you really must know, your candidate score is 20 (out of 40).
 
@ElectionBot I said chooser, aka. voter.
 
@ElectionBot what are you?
 
@ArtOfCode I'm a teacup, short and stout. Here is my handle, here is my sprout.
 
Thought so.
 
12:49 AM
@ElectionBot shouldn't that be "spout"???
 
@Nick It's a chia teapot. Comes with free sprouts.
 
@RyanM nooooo... I thought they were dead and buried!
 
@RyanM Ooo, typo!
 
@Nick you...you do know what happens when you bury seeds, right?
 
I answered the wrong comment, how to relocate?
 
12:53 AM
@RyanM facepalm! :-(
 
Hello World
 
Hello you!
 
 
2 hours later…
3:06 AM
We have a new nomination! Please welcome our latest candidate Yvette!
5
 
 
1 hour later…
4:08 AM
@AnnZen Please don't spam the bot here, you can test it after the election
 
4:28 AM
can you vote for me plz
 
@zachwilcox You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election.
 
 
1 hour later…
5:33 AM
perfect
 
wim
6:10 AM
@Zoe I am kind of surprised there are any serious candidates at all
were the reasons for the big wave of mod resignations ever adequately resolved? The community and the company still seem to be pulling in orthogonal directions
 
6:27 AM
true that. And Companies and Communities don't change course overnight. So I'm pretty sure they still go in different directions.
 
... There's been a pretty huge change in leadership over the last months. September marked the first change in CEO here since... ever... and, in January, we got a CPO/CTO who has strong thoughts on how to participate with the community. But, like any changeover in management, things aren't immediate. You don't just wake up under the new leadership and forget what you'd been doing for the years prior. There are projects still in flight, furrows of thought that have to be turned over.
 
We've failed pretty spectacularly recently to follow the promises we've set forth ... and that's not good. But we're aware of that and working to prevent it... and ... we'll probably fail again... but preferably not so badly. We have stopped testing and innovating on this platform. We want to go back and do more of that but we need to properly define those tests, what outcomes we expect, and what tells us to go back to the drawing board.
 
@Catija I didn't see "consult with experienced and dedicated users, who are the literal lifeblood of this platform, in order to get both their reactions and also their suggestions" in that list of things you need to do before you resume testing and innovation.
The Moderator Council is (could be?) a good first step towards that, but that shouldn't be the only route by which the company engages with its users.
 
I don't know that the causes of the mod resignations will ever be adequately addressed - at least in part because the reasons those mods left are somewhat different. Some (most?) left because of how we acted, some because of how we failed to act. We lost some of their trust and completely deleted their accounts and others saw things they didn't like in the community and stepped away for their own safety.
@CodyGray That's... literally what Teresa promised.
 
6:37 AM
@Catija Sure, but it wasn't in your list, which implies that maybe it isn't getting the importance that it deserves
 
I didn't write a list.
 
@Undo let me ping you here as well. I find your comment under Yvette's nomination not cool, at all.
 
@rene Why? It seems to be a fair question to me.
 
6:54 AM
She can't honestly answer that. You ask her to dig her own grave. If the mods don't want her as mod they have to explain that to the community.
But I'm sure the process prevents making detail public so the mods can't.
Nor can Yvette
 
@rene Absolutely not. No grave-digging is required.
There are two layers of concerns here. First, clearly someone or multiple someones on the current mod team objected to your reinstatement. That's a fact, and it's one that's in the past. We don't want to re-litigate that, but we do want to know if you can work with the current mod team, given that fact.
Yvette has answered that pretty well in her reply. But it's still an important question to ask: would you hold grudges? Are you still upset? Would you be able to trust your fellow mods, if elected? Etc.
 
Rob
@philipxy Please keep the comments on nominations related to the nominations themselves, not issues on other sites
 
The second layer of concern is, do you have any idea of what the concerns were and whether they were addressed. Again, I think that's a fair question. If the answer is "no", she has no idea, then that's totally fair. But if the answer is "yes", then this is a perfect opportunity for her to explain to us and to the community why/how those concerns have been addressed.
Undo could certainly lay out his concerns publicly, but I'm not sure how that would be any better or less confrontational.
 
I totally imagine she answers "yes" and then explains the wrong root cause as being the issue and y'all go facepalm in your blue room.
 
Why?
This isn't a witch-hunt by Undo or anyone else.
It's not designed to trap her or anything like that.
It's an honest, genuine question.
 
7:02 AM
That might seem so to you and me. For those that are unaware it certainly reads like an attempt to create a negative vibe around a candidate.
 
Understand the position we’re in here - we aren’t really sure what we can share. There are layers of confidentiality from mod rooms, reinstatement processes, emails with staff, revealing who voted what in the reinstatement, etc.
I can’t say much more than I did without us all getting together and figuring out what we can say - which by then will be comment #104, below the fold, never to be seen by anyone
 
user3956566
@Undo you can take me to a private chat room. @Catija Cesar has an email from me that can be shared privately with the mods, would you mind prodding him to do so, it will help this.
 
@rene I'm just not seeing this at all. It honestly seems to me like you are failing to presume good intentions.
 
user3956566
the thing is, the question is loaded, as I actually do not know who objected to me. And the reasons were a broad summary of the conversations. Bringing it into the public arena is difficult, mainly because I don't have all the answers and the comments are too small to manage such a long conversation.
 
I’ll gladly share the whole email thread I had with staff - nothing to hide here, I just don’t know if I can. And it’s too late for me to think straight anyway
 
user3956566
7:06 AM
@Undo publicly?
 
Okay, I'll accept the explanations so far and assume everybody is doing their best to make this a fair game.
 
@Yvette We just got told we’ll get it tomorrow in $timezone
 
@Yvette To be fair, the "who" is irrelevant. But the rest... I totally understand and agree with.
 
@Yvette Sure, pending sanity check from Blue Room, a CM, and... honestly probably you
 
user3956566
@rene I see exactly what you're saying, and in the past I would have jumped to that conclusion. I can see Undo's concern. I don't know how it should be approached. The CMs told me more than once I can run in the election, so I am
 
user3956566
7:09 AM
@Undo I think I would be upset if you posted a private email thread about me publicly. I haven't even seen it. You would probably be dismissed as a mod. me thinks you are tired.
 
Hence “probably you”
But you see the problem - can’t talk about concerns, can’t not talk about concerns
 
user3956566
I don't bear any grudge against you and never have. I have always told you I've admired you as a good young man, doing so well. I wish my sons' were like you. That is not changing. I can see everyone's points of view Undo, The issue isn't insight here. If that makes sense, talking between the lines
 
user3956566
@Undo that's why I flicked off the email before stepping up.
 
user3956566
Do you want me to send the email to you directly?
 
No, let the process work
 
user3956566
7:12 AM
I still have your email address
 
I’m not interested in holding more questionably-confidential stuff than I already do
 
user3956566
I'm happy to have a frank discussion with you and any of the mods, I just don't want to do it publicly, as there's a fine line between what we can discuss and not. I even wondered if I'm allowed to mention how many flags I've handled.
 
user3956566
You will be surprised, I understand your concerns more than you realise. The issues are these - understanding others, whilst trying to promote oneself are difficult to marry.
 
No concerns with mentioning the number of flags handled. That isn't confidential.
Yeah, I share some of Undo's concerns, and I'm sure you know what we're concerned about, @Yvette. It's a very fine line to walk, because we definitely don't want to tank your ability to win an election or be responsible for any sort of hate/misjudgment. I think we all want to leave what happened in the past in the past, as long as... well, you know, it is the past. :-)
 
user3956566
The issues the mod team has is actually the same as the meta community anyway afaik. That is what I was led to believe, plus the mod team knows me more personally, so there's that also.
 
7:16 AM
@Yvette You only handled 75,000 flags? What kind of lazy is that ;)
 
user3956566
@CodyGray totally agree. I cannot cope with any more drama. Last year was awful - in my personal life alone. And we've made MASSIVE changes to our lives to protect ourselves
 
user3956566
@rene ikr! there's a few obsessive types on the mod team, as on the site, hard to believe not ;)
 
But, you know, there's a lot of drama waiting here on SO, if for no other reason than because of actions taken by (and subject to being taken by) the company.
So there are some ways in which being a moderator is like being at the center of a dramatic production.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray oh the drama has substantially subsided from the "event that shall remain nameless"
 
Yes... things are going in a positive direction... But I still worry it could change with a single announcement...
 
user3956566
7:18 AM
@CodyGray to a point, there's ways to run into the drama like running into a tornado, and ways to batten down the hatches... let's face it
 
Can we just do both? That works for me. :-)
 
user3956566
@CodyGray nothing changed from a single announcement.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray there's some things, I addressed in my email that lead to running headlong into the tornado. Those are the key points.
 
user3956566
dammit, Maybe I should mention them here. Let me check it what's open for public viewing
 
user3956566
> Lessons learned:

The ways to help manage excess stress as a moderator for me are and something I have been doing for many months:
1. be moderate on meta. Only post when browsing and in the right frame of mind and do so as a pleasure to help people, not as a crusader to "save" people or the site or even myself.
2. browse more and comment less. It's easier to absorb what people are saying as a third person than to put myself in the mix.
3. No need to have the last word. It causes an endless thread of misery otherwise. I do not need to convince people of my viewpoint, we are going to differ
 
7:21 AM
@Yvette Of course, there were a large number of events that brought us to where we are today. But I'm saying that there could be a single announcement at any moment that would totally change everything. At least there could be for me.
 
@Yvette It's past 4 am for Cesar now but, as Undo already mentioned, that's forthcoming.
It's also past 2 for me so I'm out.
 
user3956566
@Catija yep I couldn't edit out the ping
 
user3956566
night
 
\o Cat
 
user3956566
@CodyGray not on this site, no. In my personal life, yes.
 
7:22 AM
Uhhhh
so, uh, tiptoeing around the hot coals of the past
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka which ones?
 
I don't know, nobody says
but what I want to know Yvette
 
user3956566
I was referring to Monica's sacking.
 
user3956566
you can search it on MSE. rather than getting into it here
 
user3956566
It's so hard to discuss any of this without dredging up... stuff
 
7:25 AM
@Yvette This is a very good list. All excellent advice for everyone, really. If I could add one thing (again, not just for you, but for everyone), it would be to try to keep in mind not to take things personally. There are lots of strong personalities here, deeply invested in what we do, which is a good thing overall, but it inevitably leads to clashes of opinion. ...
 
You running anew for moderator takes a lot of bravery as there is aparently some strife or issues in the past with other moderators. Working with ex partners where there might be past issues can be hard. Would you be able to not jump the gun when there is a percieved comment your way on your actions but to see it as a constructive critisims?

Asking this with absolutely no knowledge of what happened, but I can imagine that it would affect interpersonal relations.
 
... It's important to remember that almost none of these are judgments about you as a person, and that we all deeply respect each other if for no other reason than we share almost all of the same goals. Disagreeing on the details of how to get there is just part of the process, and needs to be taken in stride.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray yes! and assume good faith - like Undo's comment
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka it takes a lot of effort to keep one's mind straight
 
user3956566
I don't want to hijack this room, so I'll leave it at that. I think that's enough about the declined reinstatement in here. If the mods want to talk to me, happy to have a private chat.
 
7:29 AM
@CodyGray @Yvette based on previous situations (e.g. The Meta Room), this is probably the single most important thing for you in particular to keep in mind. Disagreeing with an action or method isn't personal.
Aside from that, I'd be glad to see you back. Good luck!
 
user3956566
@Mithical yep back with the MSE issues, that had a lot of trolls in the mix and that really didn't help.
 
user3956566
@Mithical thanks :)
 
... demonizing folks as trolls probably isn't the best attitude.
 
True, but ever since your last election, I've kinda kept my eye on your and I've noticed a fiery temperament that sometimes dictates your actions, before the rest catches up. I'm just curious, if you're honest with yourself how that might affect working with people where one might perceive a comment more as a personal jab than a constructive critisism.

I'm just talking about how brains work, and I'm curious how working together would work and if both parties need to be mindful.
I'm autistic, so I might often be perceived as blunt and uncaring, I have to work hard for it to become "normal".
 
user3956566
The great shog himself mentioned it in the Tavern. @CodyGray People who were not around and turned up for the fires.
 
user3956566
7:32 AM
@Tschallacka you just said you knew nothing about it and now you said you've been following me... Anyway, I answered Undo's comment and Cody and you and there's nothing more to add
 
@Yvette I knew nothing about the issue with mods, but I have seen your public actions as a mod where you've jumped the gun a few times and then retracted/apologised for actions/undid them. I have seen though how you've grown and learned in your role since your election and how to interact with the community.

But since you feel like you have answered, I won't pursue this further.
 
I'm just wondering if I really want to wade into all of this moderator politics. Leaning towards not interested. Question: How much of a moderator's time is spent talking about moderator stuff versus actually doing moderator stuff?
 
@ouflak Personal choice. Some mods tend to spend a lot of time on Meta, essentially discussing site policy, supporting users, etc. Other mods tend to spend more of their time slogging through the flag queue, deleting garbage and whatnot. All of us do both, but to different extents, depending on mood, personality, and a variety of other factors.
In reality, there is very little "talking about moderator stuff", unless there's a case where you just don't know what the best thing is to do and you want to talk it out with your fellow mods, or when you disagree with one of your fellow mods and want to discuss it. Both of those happen pretty rarely, except maybe when you're a brand-new mod and still learning the ropes.
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka the issue with the mods is confidential. I thought you were asking about stuff on MSE. A miscommunication.
 
Zoe
@ElectionBot That's also a way to bypass reinstatement ^^" Didn't know that was an option
 
7:52 AM
Right now the best outcome for the site would be for the mod team, CMs, and Yvette to reconcile so that she can be reinstated and withdraw the election nomination, and we will actually be electing two new moderators.
6
 
wim
> The reason I was declined was not being stable on meta.
@Yvette what does that mean, not being stable?
Is it like, changing opinion and flip-flopping on issues? Or it's unstable as in a crazy ranting person? (genuine question, I'm not familiar with whatever is this history on meta)
 
Zoe
@SamuelLiew Technically, we'll be getting two new mods even if Yvette gets elected. Two new as in newModCount - oldModCount = 2. If Yvette manages to push through reinstatement instead, we kinda get 3 instead
 
@Zoe Yo, get up outta here with that "math" stuff!
 
It's at least more than 1
 
wim
I think mod should work together with the same goal and a blocked reinstatement is a huge red flag. But maybe it was all drama/resolved now, then it can be a non-issue.
 
Zoe
8:03 AM
snort The integral of the mod graph indicates a rise of 3 moderators is more than a rise of two, especially in a non-deterministic quantum superposition. totally didn't just say random words at the end there to sound extra math-y
 
> "quantum"
 
Zoe
ssssssshhh >.>
 
now you just sound like you're spouting movie technobabble
 
Zoe
nah
 
Heh. The beginning, too. The integral wouldn't show a rise of 3.
 
Zoe
8:07 AM
Just ask the other Mith :p
 
Can you write up a GUI in Visual Basic to demonstrate this?
 
Zoe
I could, but I really don't want to :D
 
@wim What I have seen from Yvette over the time as a moderator, from her election she had quite a fiery questionaire that dipped down hard at first, kinda like mine. During the election though she made it through. Her questionaire had rubbed me the wrong way like being hitin the head with a red flag, hence that I've noticed her actions more than than those of other mods. I have seen how yvette made strong statements on issues and then sometimes deleting or retracting them, sometimes with an apology. I've seen her close a post pre-emptively when it was still under discussion what should be d
 
user3956566
@wim emotionally and also like - making a decision and sticking with it. I've slip slod on what it the best approach to meta participation. That concerned some mods.
 
user3956566
It's important to remember some mods wanted me back.
 
user3956566
8:14 AM
And I don't know how many objected, It needs to be at least two on a large site,
 
Zoe
so 2 out of 21+ mods say no and reinstatement fails?
 
mmm not even a simple majority vote
 
user3956566
The crux of the issue is I have a mental health issue and sometimes I'm not stable. So the mods are witness to this and they want to know I'm going to be stable or at least manage myself. I'm pretty sure that's it in a nutshell. I really do not know all of it. Now that is private, but mental health shouldn't have the same stigma as physical health. In fact mental health is a type of physical health
 
Zoe
I could understand it if it was a 3/4 vote (those actually exist in the real-world), but just the number 2? That's really broken xd
 
user3956566
@Zoe yes and that's my main reason of objection. If the mods could veto people running, I wouldn't have been elected, that's my point. Thousands of people voted for me and I was vetoed by two maybe more, but not definitely people.
 
user3956566
8:18 AM
and I'm allowed to be a mod elsewhere and I'm allowed to run. I've actually applied to be reinstated again as I'm running for election. So it's entirely possible to:
Be elected and reinstated,
not be elected and not reinstated,
not be elected and be reinstated,
be elected and not reinstated. Franky, it's insane.
 
Zoe
yeah :/
 
Yeah, regardless of personal feelings, the procedure here is really broken. We were just discussing that with Catija earlier in the mod room.
 
user3956566
I worked so hard to be elected all these years and struggled with poor mental health and trying to survive despite it. It's sooo hard living with mental illness and I bet 20% of the people who read this will understand. It makes living like walking around dragging concreate blocks. This does not mean unacceptable behaviour should be accepted, not at all. Just explaining the insides over here.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray I have no issue with mods objecting, it's the process. My ongoing issue with life here and everywhere is my mental health. That's the elephant in the room. As long as my kids are healthy I have a fighting chance. When they're not good I find it really hard to stabilise,
 
Being "different" than the accepted normal standard can be hard. I feel you there. Do you feel you can discern when you enter for yourself a "dangerzone" and are you able to distance yourself from performing harmful actions? Or is that a border that's hard to discern in the heat of the moment? I know I took 15 years to learn where my limits are.
 
8:22 AM
Yeah, exactly. It's the process I'm talking about. The fact that you can be simultaneously barred from reinstatement, yet be allowed to run for election. The fact that you can be simultaneously running for reelection and applying for reinstatement. It's a combinatoric explosion, and it's ridiculous.
4
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka Oh I know when I go off, its disengaging that's been the challenge and I've improved a LOOOOT. And I'm not intending it to be the site's problem. Just complaining about my lot in life. I did see your remarks earlier and yes it would be very hard.
 
Well I have seen how you have grown in the last few years, and I just want you to know you will have my vote.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray and all I need to do is all self control on meta and chat. The flag handling is good 99.9% of the time. And I love handling flags.
 
I like votes.
 
Just give it the best effort possible :-)
 
user3956566
8:25 AM
@Tschallacka thanks. I was concerned before that the room was being hijacked and I think I was a bit abrasive and I'm sorry for that.
 
My concerns are basically two-fold. (1) Would you be able to work with the existing/current mod crew, knowing that at least two of us (and probably being able to find out which individuals once elected) had blocked your reinstatement? Would you hold grudges and/or be unable to trust us? That would make it difficult to work together, which is really important for the mod crew.
(2) Are you in a good place in your life where you can handle the barrage of crap that gets repeatedly thrown at a moderator, whether on Meta, off-site, by the company, or whatever other source? You and I both know there's a lot, and it can be trying. We all want to be sure that you can handle this, not only for the good of the site, but for the good of your own emotional health, because we love you and care about you.
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka try to in all things. I think there's a lot of people like that on the network, We give 1000% The network (SO Inc) really should work hard at fostering that. I think they may have learnt some things. I'm sure @Catija agrees. But the CMs do not have the final say.
 
I raised the second concern when you applied for reinstatement. I kinda wanted to just have a conversation about it, and have you address that concern directly to convince me, but the process didn't really allow for that.
So... I don't know if I was one of the people who blocked your reinstatement or not.
Because honestly the process is opaque even for those of us involved in it.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray 1) well I now know Undo was one of them and I really like Undo. My opinion of him is independent of his opinion of me. I admire him and we need more young people like him on the planet. I've always said that.
 
Wait, undo is young?
ehh, what do you qualify as young?
 
8:28 AM
@Tschallacka Yeah, still in university. Was elected when he was a teenager. (Like two other mods, BoltClock and Ry-.)
 
user3956566
2) we are in the best place. We are selling in the city and leaving it and to buy a property in the country. @CodyGray a lot of the stresses you'd know about from our mod room are ok and please God stay that way. If anything like that happens, I think I need to take a breather, rather than step down. As that was the main issue.... I can't say and it's nothing to do with the network, but I think you may remember
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka in this forum, under 25 as young, in my life, under 40 :)
 
Zoe
@Tschallacka Lots of mods are young actually
 
woo, I'm on the edge of being young xD
37
 
Zoe
at least around the network
 
user3956566
8:30 AM
Undo and Art are both amazing. They've done a lot for this network in charcoal
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka yes you are! I'm 53
 
user3956566
the thirties are awesome. Enjoy!
 
I will, but the 40's are knocking on the door
 
Zoe
huh, I thought you were younger ^^"
 
Hmm, that's good to know. I wonder when the "awesome" will kick in...
 
user3956566
8:31 AM
@Zoe how are you my dear? I haven't talked to you for ages
 
need to finish renovating my house before they barge in
 
user3956566
@CodyGray you need a change of avatar and your awesome will zoom in (I'm really just making this up )
 
9 years ago I was mistaken for an 18 year old.
I have a youthful demeanour :P
 
user3956566
be grateful for that!!
 
it does not help in the workplace
they equate youthfulness with not taking their opinions seriously
 
8:32 AM
@Yvette Because then no one will recognize me anymore? :-p
 
but hey, it's always fun to say I told you so in retrospect
 
user3956566
@CodyGray oh dear Cody, I did not mean that... it was like buying a new outfit not dsigusiing yourself lol
 
Zoe
@Yvette Yeah, ti's been a while ^^" I'm alright-ish. How're you?
 
@Tschallacka The fun doesn't last, though. People get mad... :-/
 
user3956566
whewn we're young we always want to be older and taken seriously until we're getting old
 
user3956566
8:34 AM
@Zoe I'm good, we are getting our place ready for sale. My kids are all good and so are the horses. We lost our baby horse last year, she was 18 months, that was devastating. One of the mods was at my house when it happened.
 
I'm really, really glad to hear that your kids are doing well now, @Yvette.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray same!!!!!!! and thank you xo
 
user3956566
my daughter and I are moving to the country together.
 
For some reason, I assumed you already lived in the country.... You kept multiple horses in the city?
 
user3956566
we want to get about 100 acres
 
8:36 AM
@CodyGray true, but for that I am happy to repeat to them what went wrong and why. My ex manager insisted on an on premisis voip call center. I recommended a cloud voip provider where we have full control and low prices. Guess what the mayor issue is now. we are locked out of hte voip server and have massive costs when anything needs to be adjusted. I like to rub in that I warned them about this.
 
user3956566
the horse are just out of the city - an hours drive away, we only just moved back to fix up the place and sell it
 
user3956566
I did have horses in the city, but it's expensive and the land is small, they can run around where they are.
 
@Tschallacka Based on my experience, people probably think you're an asshole. ;-) It's a hard lesson for me to learn that sometimes it's better (or at least equally as good) to be nice as to be right.
 
user3956566
@CodyGray @Tschallacka it's so easy to misinterpret people isn't it?
 
Yeah, country living seems like it'd be a better fit for you and your passions, @Yvette. What about teaching? Are you planning on continuing that after the move? COVID-19 might actually make it easier to do that, with so many things moving online now. Or you might be ready to give that up and focus on other things.
@Yvette Nah, I'm pretty easy to read.
 
8:38 AM
@CodyGray "Nice" and "right" both become less important when/if you're the "boss!"
 
Oh, my bosses accept it, because they agree, they are just locked in an expensive contract now. And my bosses are stone hard people that will go over bodies. If I'm not hard back, they don't respect my opinions. I rather have a nicer work enviroment. but hey, I adapt and survive. At least I have my own private office and five monitors and a pc that would make a gamer jealous.
 
@AdrianMole Disagree!
As the boss, you have to be right, and you probably should be nice.
 
As expected. I was just being (atypically) provocative.
 
My bosses opinion, translated "Employees need to be shouted at every now and then"
 
user3956566
@CodyGray oh no! My work is all online and work is fantastic, i'm getting more subjects and more responsibility. I enjoy it, it's actually helped my mindset towards moderating also.
 
8:41 AM
Why do you spell your location in Dutch, when you live in Germany? Are you a Dutch transplant paying homage to the homeland?
 
Yea, I'm Dutch by birth, but I married a German woman and live just across the border, but I work in the Netherlands.
 
Do we have a quota/limit on ex-patriot Dutch moderators?
 
@AdrianMole Shouldn't we?
 
Zoe
@CodyGray there's a difference between should and does. What should happen isn't always what happens IRL
 
Don't I know it. But you have to just keep throwing a fit until should == does.
 
8:45 AM
Well I just managed to get mac os running in a virtualbox after 4 hours
getting past the install with a mouse that moves every 5 seconds and then too far, and every key that inserts itself 16 before you can install the virtualbox toolset is painful
do not recommend
 
user3956566
@Tschallacka have there been border restrictions with covid?
 
Hmm, I do not remember it being that painful many years back when I installed Snow Leopard Server in VirtualBox.
 
yes. but they have been lifted like 3 months ago
and outside of the EU, only 14 countries are now accepted as holiday destination or accepting tourists from. The USA is basically blacklisted for a long time
 
The USA has decided that viruses are a political issue, that the Democrats are making it up as an excuse to rob the Republicans of their liberty by forcing them to wear masks. It's a circus. And no surprise that other countries are afraid of letting in stupid, virus-addled Americans.
 
8:50 AM
@CodyGray this was sierra running on a windows 10 host. I tried increasing ram, more cpu cores, everything, but all the same, after 5 seconds running the lag came. Was resolved when I was finally able to install the virtual box toolset. but entering an account password is tiresome if your keys repeat an random amount of times.
 
Visitors from the USA are welcome in Europe, so long as they carry a large bell with them, ringing as they walk around, and shouting, "Unclean! Unclean!"
 
@Tschallacka Yeah, probably something to do with the chipset that VirtualBox emulates not being well-supported by newer versions of the macOS.
 
user3956566
@AdrianMole yeh, but has there been changes due to the COVID 19? :p
 
You might have had better luck changing which chipset it was emulating.
 
@AdrianMole Is that woman from GOT still for hire? Maybe a stern faced woman shouting SHAME over their shoulders would be more effective.
 
8:52 AM
hehe
 
Or... a customized macOS install disc with the VirtualBox drivers installed? I don't know if that is possible. Windows supports something called "slipstreaming"; it should be possible to do something similar by hacking the macOS packages.
Yeah, it's been suggested here that kids should start pointing to these idiots who refuse to wear masks and say, "Look mom! A spreader!"
The idea is that we might be able to shame people into doing it. I am...not optimistic.
 
@CodyGray I tried changing all the chipsets. Most of the time was wasted trying things from random fora with people having the same issue, and no real solutions.
 
Wow, that sounds awful. Someone should create a website that avoids such problems.
 
Managed to get it running with a one char password and deleting the extra keys with shift end
xD
If only there was a better way
I saw an idea on Imgur that might work for the USA
Those who can stay at home the longest, win a year long free taco bell
 
haha
Make it free ChickFilA, and it would totally work.
 
8:56 AM
And make mexico pay for it! that would pull in the republicans
 
user3956566
I love watching the US politics, it's genuinely entertaining. I'm starting to like Trump (and that was the last they ever saw of Yvette)
 
Well, I'm honestly impressed that a bag of air has the entire republican party by the 'nards. I wonder what dirt he has on them.
 
@Yvette *squints*
 
user3956566
@Mithical hahahahaha I love it.
 
user3956566
Honestly though, is Biden's brain ok?
 
user3956566
8:59 AM
It's entertaining, but sad for Americans, I say this all the way from Australia
 
@Yvette I changed my mind. You are not fit to be moderator. I think everyone will agree...
 
Well, worst case scenario, he's the face that puts down an autograph and the senate will rule
 

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