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12:03 AM
heh. I mean...doesn't look like the sort of case I'd check.
You are slightly more cynical than me. Occasionally I'm proven insufficiently cynical as a result ;)
"disclaimer: this is somewhat-informed speculation; even mods don't know the exact algorithm" - we need a proper canonical on Meta for this. People keep asking. — Karl Knechtel 1 min ago
"What is the post-ban algorithm?"
"Something about the scores of your posts and your reputation. Other than that, we don't know; it's a secret. Bug staff about it if you must ask."
(okay, mods know a little more than that. but not much.)
 
There are canonicals...
 
about what the algorithm is?
 
12:20 AM
Broadly speaking, yes.
Not about the details, obviously, since those are intentionally not disclosed.
But literally about how the details are not disclosed.
 
<insert rant about security-by-obscurity here>
 
we need a canonical rant about the fact that keeping it entirely secret is largely unhelpful
 
I still am not convinced by that.
I do not want the vast majority of these users returning to post anything else. Tripping the post ban is extremely difficult to do, and means you're posting a serious amount of crap.
In other news, it's very hard to get hired as a bank teller or loan officer when you've been convicted of theft or embezzlement. Well...
 
1:23 AM
I disagree with that. It's not that hard. Most of the people deserve it, yes, but I've seen ones that really don't.
Sometimes they got hit with the meta effect, for instance.
Also some people have it due to posts from, like, 5+ years ago even when recent posts are fine.
Also the way to cheat it does not require knowing the algorithm! You just do voting fraud until you can ask again.
 
0
Q: Can I ask a question for explanations of specific blocks of code, instead of using ChatGPT, at StackOverflow?

Raul ChiarellaI've experienced a couple of times at StackOverflow a few disconforts when asking some questions because some users were a little passive-agressive with me, so I am kinda afraid of using StackOverflow and getting bullied by not knowing some things. But, since we are dealing with humans answering ...

 
 
2 hours later…
3:01 AM
0
Q: Developer survey 2023: circular graphs?

Nic3500I was reading the 2023 developer survey, and saw these circular graphs showing intentions from one item to the next. These are super neat, I would like to use such a graph to illustrate concepts at work. Ex. https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#section-worked-with-vs-want-to-work-with-programmi...

 
 
1 hour later…
4:25 AM
@RyanM-Regenerateresponse Transparency achieved \o/ The strike is having an effect
 
 
1 hour later…
5:40 AM
I have finally ascended.
 
Looks seedy.
 
I am not a leech.
 
6:05 AM
@VLAZ-onstrike- So they are still violating our demand for honest communication.
That is my most important reason for striking.
 
They are. Worse, it may be that they're trying to do some of this, and yet still failing. :-(
 
@Andreasdetestscensorship Just to be clear - it was a joke. Because the message I replied to said "transparent BS".
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- I know. ;) But a joke effective at shedding some light, nonetheless. Oleg was asked to reopen the userscripts room earlier today, because the data dumps are being re-enabled. The strike isn’t over. SE has actually improved upon anything.
 
@Andreasdetestscensorship I mean...not exactly what happened. Ryan asked Oleg if the userscripter's room would be reopened as an avenue to discuss the whatever API blind survey we get. Which isn't a request to quit the strike. And Oleg refused because, well, striking. Also, there is another room already where to discuss it.
 
6:22 AM
Compromise and open, honest conversation. It's what's for dinner.
 
And the dessert?
 
@Andreasdetestscensorship Some sort of dump.
 
No dessert. We shall eat too much dinner.
 
I think Andreas is subtly trying to propose you have some licorice of friendship.
 
6:40 AM
As long as it's not mixed with chocolate!
 
Licorice ice cream, then.
 
Green tea ice cream is better
 
@Andreasdetestscensorship sugar coated data dump.
Served cold, with a very long spoon.
 
For a limited time only, while supplies last, get yours before it's gone...
 
They won't remove what's already out, it's useless as people will just publish it again. They will stop giving new dumps, either now (i.e. lying by saying it will be back) or at later point after dust will settle down.
Might eat the banana I'm saving for later to calm down... D:
 
7:00 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike On behalf of all Zoes out there in the entire universe: ew.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype I bet Zoe knows what's good.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Generally not; she usually has no idea, but that thing there is just ew.
 
You have tried and determined that you do not like green tea ice cream?
 
7:20 AM
That's it. I'm on strike until waffles are back.
 
7:43 AM
@AndreasdetestsAIhype ew
@CodyGray-onstrike I indeed do, and tea does not make the cut :P
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Okay, now you're just being uncultured.
 
@Mithical I have plenty of culture
And I at least don't like licorice
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I don’t like the taste and smell of green tea, yes, and, also, the amount of caffeine in that is more than I want.
@E_net4isonstrike Waffles with brown cheese? :)
@ZoestandswithUkraine I knew you had some sense in you.
@Mithical Lack of bad culture, but lots of great culture, mhm…
@ZoestandswithUkraine Big shame on you.
@ZoestandswithUkraine On second thought… mhm, no.
@ZoestandswithUkraine Actually, I agree with that. Ice cream and licorice are both great, but not mixed.
 
Ice cream inside coffee. Yummy.
 
Ew.
Coffee is ew.
 
8:02 AM
@AndreasdetestsAIhype You eat licorice unironically, your opinion is invalid
 
I'm still not understanding how y'all don't like green tea ice cream.
It has this wonderfully delicate, complex flavor, and avoids being sickeningly sweet.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I haven't tried it. I think I tried to order once and they were out.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype ew is coffee.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I've never seen green tea ice cream, but I don't like tea in general
it just tastes like warm water
 
You don't like tea??! How did I not know this before?
Uh... if it takes like warm water, you brewed it wrong.
Also, did you know you can put ice into it?
 
8:08 AM
@ZoestandswithUkraine here you go!
 
I assumed so too. But I had tea in London once, and it still tasted like hot water
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine there's something you can add.... white or brown. Make everything taste better. :D
 
You drink coffee, I assume? That doesn't taste like warm water?
...brown?
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack I've tried that too, but that just tastes like warm sugar water
@CodyGray-onstrike brown sugar is a thing
@CodyGray-onstrike ew, no
I don't need caffeine; I have unlimited masochism :p
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine because you didn't put the tea in the water long enough.
 
8:11 AM
So you don't drink any warm beverages?
 
There are more warm beverages than tea and coffee you know
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine not really actually. :D
Hot chocolate?
Soup?
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack nope
 
I know! Hot Buttered Rum!
> Ingredients
4 tbsp. butter, softened
3 tbsp. packed brown sugar
1/2 c. vanilla ice cream, softened
1/2 tsp. ground cinnamon
2 c. apple cider
How you soften butter?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I know, right? I'm reconsidering my past votes for mod elections...
 
8:14 AM
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack You butter it up with compliments, duh
Blackcurrant syrup is really good though
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine that's a juice, not hot beverage. ;)
 
It can be warmed :p
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack Apply heat.
The same way you soften companies during a strike. :-D
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Roll intimidation
 
Did you ever come up with other hot beverages, aside from coffee, tea, and gross watered-down melted chocolate? There are some choice alcoholic options, but that's not your thing, either.
 
8:24 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike maybe warm juice then...
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine How wude!
@CodyGray-onstrike Ew.
@ZoestandswithUkraine Good girl. Now have a licorice.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype ew
 
Do you not like tea either?
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Nothing in England tastes good, though…
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype I refer to my earlier message on the topic of the validity of your opinions
 
8:28 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike Ew.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype They had lots of good food
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Depends on where you buy it. In general, their food is very bland and tasteless. Be it from restaurants, streed food, or grocery stores. Maybe you went to the more tourist places.
 
"In general, their food is very bland and tasteless," said the Norwegian, unironically.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Yes.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike We have lots of good food! It's licorice eaters that have no taste
 
8:31 AM
The entire world knows that traditional Northern European food is bland and tasteless.
 
Damn; I almost missed the bus stop because of all this.
 
Which brings us to my favorite joke about a potato being "mildly spicy" to the average Norwegian.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I asked for spicy stuff in my falafel and got weird looks, because apparently I do not look like someone who can handle spice at all :(. I popped a hot pepper in my mouth on the way out to make a point.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike lmao
Must be the licorice eaters ruining our reputation :p
 
8:34 AM
Yeah, I have the hardest time when I, as a pasty white dude, go into an unfamiliar Thai restaurant and try to order the spiciest thing on the menu, with extra spice added.
@ZoestandswithUkraine Isn't licorice kinda spicy, though?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike /shrug
 
@CodyGray-onstrike depends on which kind of licorice. If you mean the one with salamonniac and/or salt then yeah =D
 
Ask Andreas; he's the licorice expert.
 
No, I’m busy. :)
 
8:50 AM
@AndreasdetestsAIhype lol! Could be fun. :D
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype What could be more important than a discussion on licorice?
Are you being held hostage by Zoe against your will and forced to admit that you don't care about licorice? Blink twice for yes.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike New place to live. Finally gonna mess up Zoe’s perception of where to find me.
@CodyGray-onstrike 😑
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype Howdy, neighbor :p
 
9:08 AM
@AndreasdetestsAIhype hopefully not in a bus! :D
 
Which part of Norway has palm trees? :-)
 
9:20 AM
-2
Q: Feature Request - A stack overflow section for *shameful bugs that are never fixed* in large popular software/apps

rubAnyone in the software industry, especially developers/testers experience from time to time the agony of standing (sitting...) in front of a really shameful bug in some app they frequently use. We all know and love the development cycle, and we all know some bugs are... of low importance. Yet, so...

0
Q: For asking if a general case is correct, what should "What did you try" fill?

wcminipgasker2023For example, I want to ask if something is correct, like this question: Floating-point number multiplication: a * 1.0 == a guaranteed? What I actually want to ask: For float point numbers a,b and c, if a/b exactly equals to c in decimal, and a, b, c are all representable with float numbers withou...

 
@CodyGray-onstrike South Europe does. It's basically Norway, right? :p
 
@NewPosts *facepalm*
 
9:35 AM
@NewPosts SE itself has more than enough, thousands of bugs that never get fixed.
Some big, some small, but all sharing the same fate.
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Southway
 
@NewPosts did I miss popcorn?
 
9:38 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike flagged already.
 
And this is a user who wants to use Stack Overflow as a place to bash third-party software?!
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack You might be interested to hear about the ongoing moderation strike...
 
@CodyGray-onstrike well looks like the comment was directed at @Zoe so it's personal. ;)
I'll smite anyone calling Zoe loser, strike or no strike. :P
 
Stop me if you've heard this already, but did you know that almost all of the moderators are currently on strike?
 
Well, if the answer is "look no more! Stack Overflow is one of them"...
 
@AndrewT. it already popped.
 
9:41 AM
1
A: Have voting patterns changed significantly after the recent change in voting button arrow style?

Cody Gray - on strikeThe simple answer is no; voting patterns have not increased since this change was rolled out (at least on Stack Overflow). If anything, voting has decreased since this change was rolled out. The "site analytics" privilege allows anyone with 25k+ reputation to investigate this for themselves. Havi...

^ For those who still have popcorn left.
 
corning the pop
 
> You can see the effects of the ongoing moderation strike prominently in the downvotes. There's a significant drop in the number of downvotes on June 5, 2023, coinciding with the start of the strike.
Haters gonna love...
 
> It should surprise no one that there are fewer downvotes when the most quality-minded of users go on strike, whereas there is little or no change in the upvoting rate.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Could you imagine what the graph would have looked like without the 28% increase in voting? I'd have been a disaster! Good thing SE pre-emptively deployed the voting buttons to mitigate part of it.
 
Hmm yeah
Can't win against illogical arguments
 
9:55 AM
Even with all the recent practice? You probably need to practice more...
 
0
Q: Developer survey 2023: IDEs for programming languages

J Fabian MeierI wonder whether it is possible to find out something like: "Which IDEs are used by Java programmers (or for Java programming)?" Sure, this cannot be perfectly done from the data because someone might tick Java and Javascript as programming languages and tick Eclipse and VS Code for IDEs, so you ...

 
@NewPosts I dunno, maybe you could ask some Java developers? Or look at their questions on SO, since everyone always seems to tag their IDE...
 
Vaguely related, I watched somebody use Vim to write Java. It was fascinating.
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- did you stay at least two meters away?
This might be contagious, you know. :D
 
Why would that be fascinating?
That's like saying, "I watched someone use a lawn mower to mow their lawn."
 
10:07 AM
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack Meh. I'd actually like to try using Vim more. But not for Java development. Currently I only use it for 1. the text editor for Git (writing commit messages and interactive rebases) 2. if I'm SSHed to a server and need to make a change. Since Vi/Vim is very often installed by default, nano is also a good alternative but comes pre-installed more rarely.
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Hey, hey. Actually, one of the places I’ve been looking at, is closer to where you live. Neighbors indeed!
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack What’s wrong with a bus?
@CodyGray-onstrike Southern.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I hadn't used Vim or seen anybody use it to work on multiple related files. The way you do with programming languages. It just happens that I've only seen it used for Java but it would probably be the same with most other projects. Jumping around and navigating through the files and such.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype så hyggelig!
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Koselig! Kanskje jeg skal kjøpe en palme.
@VLAZ-onstrike- @Zoe would like to speak to you.
 
Luftputefartøyet mitt er fullt av åler.
 
10:11 AM
Wow.
I did not think it stayed warm enough for palm trees.
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- :P Hvor er skipet ditt, nå for tiden?
@CodyGray-onstrike I wasn’t kidding about overheating. It’s fucking hot here.
 
Today's high will be 36.
That's the outside temperature, mind you, not my internal body temperature.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype Vil du komme tilbake til meg?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Fun!
@CodyGray-onstrike Sad.
 
10:15 AM
Such a rollercoaster of emotions there.
 
@Mithical Yes, Norwegian is a pretty language.
@VLAZ-onstrike- Vil jeg hva for noe? Komme tilbake til deg? Oj, nei, hva har jeg gått glipp av? :(
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype בהחלט
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Just wants to rub it in.
@Mithical Takk. :)
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- Vim <3
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Ew.
 
There we go
@VLAZ-onstrike- I have used it for Java. It isn't fantastic, but it's doable
 
How/why would it be worse for Java than for anything else?
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine I need to play more Uno.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype Bingo.
 
10:23 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike No, Bingo is boring.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Because Java is a trash language, and the available LSPs are equally awful
The most commonly available LSP is based on eclipse
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine But then that's a Java problem, right, and it would be equally bad in any editor?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Sort of. Proper IDEs have better autocomplete, while the LSPs are generally unreliable
The main place it matters is imports, because like, 10% of a Java class is imports
 
Ah, like Python
 
Cody ➕ Zoe 🔜 🗑
 
10:25 AM
@ZoestandswithUkraine And also about 80% boilerplate code.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype Andreas 🔜 📦
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype I certainly hope that Zoe and I will soon be able to put AI-generated posts in the trashcan where they belong.
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- pretty much
 
Andreas will soon be put into a box? Will he be gift-wrapped? Seems like a terrible gift...
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Where are you sending me?
@CodyGray-onstrike But I come with licorice…
 
10:29 AM
@CodyGray-onstrike No. Remember the part where he's moving? :P
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype There's always something in the box nobody wants.
 
@AndreasdetestsAIhype And that would get you sent to a biohazard facility
 
10:49 AM
@VLAZ-onstrike- yeah, same for me with Notepad. :)
@AndreasdetestsAIhype you don't know what the thousands of people that it hosted did there... and if the bus still active, you'll have to share all your belongings, and the toilets, with all the passengers. :D
@CodyGray-onstrike I want!
 
in The Ministry of Silly Hats, Jun 6 at 12:05, by Andreas detests censorship
Also, I don’t know who did this, but you live in this city, so if you did it, Zoe, please don’t turn the bus seats brown again.
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- haha! Great minds think alike. :D
But I've seen worse...
Not to mention zillions of bubble gums that can never ever be removed.
So bus will always be sticky, wherever you step. :P
And those are the things you do know people were doing in the bus. :D
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack Not a problem here. Haven’t seen that in years.
 
11:05 AM
@AndreasdetestsAIhype huh! Well haven't seen it for years either, didn't use bus since army days, but doubt things have changed.
And as teenager, it was worse...
 
11:16 AM
People grow up. Most people used to smoke, too.
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack It hasn't. There's still gum stuck to the backs of the seats.
 
Immature bastards.
That’s disgusting.
 
You know what's worse? Licorice.
 
Licorice is so bad that not even SE's data department could fuck up the statistics proving how bad it is
 
11:29 AM
@ZoestandswithUkraine Double burn.
 
Hmm, now Mith's going to have to talk about how beautiful the Norwegian language is again...
 
licorice <- 🔥 ¯\_(zoe)_/¯ 🔥 -> SE
4
An artist's impression.
 
@Mithical and floor, naturally... :/
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- lmao
 
11:53 AM
Urgh I have a question for LifeHacks but I'm on a strike... :(
 
"What should I do to occupy my time when I'm on strike from Stack Exchange?"
 
@CodyGray-onstrike Go buy me licorice.
Aw, poor crab wants waffles.
Go cook waffles.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike :D
While eating lunch at work, I read printed (?) newspaper, and it leaves nasty colors on the table. Maybe some hack to help preventing it, besides the obvious "put paper beneath the newspaper". ;)
 
Read news on an electronic device like everyone else in this century?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I do, usually. But still, having it printed on paper has its benefits.
 
12:00 PM
It certainly seems to leave its mark.
 
e.g. nothing pops when you move around with the mouse... .;)
@VLAZ-onstrike- burning love?
 
I guess. Zoe does love burninating things.
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- except her own socks. :D
 
🔥🧦🔥
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- Where did you get this historically accurate footage? :p
 
12:14 PM
I hacked into your Vim and had it take a picture with the camera.
 
Oh yeah? Name all the Vims you impostor :p
 
@ZoestandswithUkraine Trick question, they are all just connecting to a single instance on the server where an overworked monkey is doing all the typing for you when you enter a command like :wbbqzuccini
"VIM" is actually short for "very important monkey".
 
Lies! Slander!
 
Live feed (currently nobody using Vim, thus no work is happening):
 
12:22 PM
@VLAZ-onstrike- gigantic alien monkey using a building as piano?
People screams adding bonus effects. :D
Also, glad to see they remembered to draw nipples, it's very important in monkeys! :P
 
It's how you know it's a monkey. Could have been anything, otherwise.
 
Why did you de-nipple the monkey?
2
 
@ShadowWizardStrikesBack What is that animal? Is it a polar octopus?
 
@CodyGray-onstrike it was... odd... ;)
 
12:37 PM
Hmm. I think we've identified the robot...
 
But look what I've done in the meantime! Can't believe I remembered the syntax and commands!
Served by plain VBS, written with Notepad. :P
 
You logged onto the MIR space station?
 
hahahaaaahhhhha
dies laughing
auto revive activated
Well many clients think we're related to MRI
 
what the....
 
Now need to iterate all those folders, iterate the sub folders in each, which are students, then copy their pictures to the new season...
 
12:42 PM
Is that where you hid the monkey's nipples?
I feel like I may be missing something here.
 
@aynber typical response when I arrive to a new room.... :D
@CodyGray-onstrike just a website I maintain, new season, they asked to copy all pictures.
 
@CodyGray-onstrike what monkey? That's clearly a screenshot of a bear :p
 
@CodyGray-onstrike I'm afraid they're lost forever in the void...
Which reminds me, balpha is in the original Tavern!
in Tavern on the Meta on Meta Stack Exchange Chat, 3 hours ago, by balpha
@OlegValteriswithUkraine Generic parameters are great! And an Action returns void, which is even better, because generic responses aren't my thing, even though they're also in fashion
 
0
Q: Is a comment about past questions of a user acceptable?

The Coding PenguinToday, while reviewing first questions, I looked up the past posts of some user. I noticed that he asked several questions in the past, which looked okay and all received answers from different members (some of which have lots of reputation). I believe these answers were correctly written and pre...

 
1:16 PM
looking for the coffee machine
 
2:08 PM
0
Q: Are comments that merely correct terminology acceptable?

Jan SchultkeIn C++, we say "data member" not "member variable". This led me to leave a comment underneath a helpful question which used the wrong term, along the lines of: The right term is "data member". The term "member variable" doesn't appear anywhere in the C++ standard. I eventually stumbled upon the...

 
What's with the latest trend of "Is doing X okay" on Meta?
 
2:25 PM
Still better than the 1000th "demand comments with downvotes" request.
 
@RyanM-Regenerateresponse yeah, but for the same reason people keep asking easily solvable questions, they'd rather ask than test their own intuitions
 
In 1942, the highest ranked opinion was that the Earth was flat. That means nothing. — Catriel 1 hour ago
wat
 
@VLAZ-onstrike- probably giving example of something that happened in the past and you can't see it anymore, and how it doesn't matter.
 
highly popular opinions (today) are irrelevant because people had highly popular opinions in the past
therefore all of science is wrong
 
@QBrute No one has moderators to guide them anymore. :-)
 
2:37 PM
But wait, Earth is flat. Isn't it?!
On top of four elephants, etc.
 
@KevinB Which is rather ironic, because "AI is da best u guyz" is a very popular opinion around now. Thus following the author's logic, it should be discarded. Because towards the end of WW2 "Earth is flat" was a popular opinion?
 
AI might be the future, but ChatGPT is not AI. It does not learn from further discussion. It's just a toy, nothing more.
Maybe that new thing Meta are planning will be more close to real AI, and less a toy, but coming from such a company, it will surely be a total and utter disaster to mankind. :/
 
0
Q: SEO Equivalent to ChatGPT in order to show up in chat results

Richard DawsonFor a website, it's common to create really good content with great SEO value in order to show up higher in search results for Google. These search engines have different criteria you can meet in order to get a better "score" per say and rank higher. Is there an equivalent to this for ChatGPT? Li...

 
@VLAZ-onstrike- Sigh.
 
@NewPosts Sigh.
More of "ChatGPT is magic".
ChatGPT is pre-trained on data. You can't insert new training data. — Cerbrus 18 secs ago
On-point. It's in the name.
 
00:00 - 15:0015:00 - 00:00

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