4:53 AM
What you do with your rep is entirely up to you. Why would you want to do that, though? Bounty system is designed to attract attention to posts that otherwise would go unnoticed, or increase your chances of getting a thoughtful and thorough answer. Why donate rep if you do not want to choose whose answer is correct? That said, you can always leave it pending, and the bounty will be distributed according to guidelines — Oleg Valter 58 secs ago
5:15 AM
Honestly I don't know why someone would want to do that. But I just had that idea and realised i've never seen it discussed. I mean maybe someone out there has so many points they don't need that they would just want to give it away. — The Grand J 48 secs ago
5:35 AM
Actually, some of the users with high rep do that. But they usually do that to help out a question, there is no point in just doing a giveaway. That said, there is a good read: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/307512/… — Oleg Valter 48 secs ago
6:11 AM
6:55 AM
7:09 AM
I really don't think we need a progress post for retagging, but it doesn't hurt to have one! I have updated it with some additional guidance. :) — Bhargav Rao ♦ 1 min ago
I observed that it usually appears on burnination requests (at least it used to), so decided to add one (usually I do that on my proposals). Noted the second guideline - I usually only do the first when editing, thank you! — Oleg Valter 45 secs ago
So there are at least 15 people as of now who thinks everything is fine as it is? Happy customers, huh? — Sinatr 6 secs ago
7:45 AM
The "organic approach" is certainly more intuitive and will lead to less wrong tagging by new users. An inexperienced user will most likely only tag his question with google-apps-script and might be overwhelmed when he sees 15 different tags including the word [google-apps-script], while a more experienced user can refine the branching of his question by adding additional tags - like the above mentioned [google-apps-script]+[arrays] — ziganotschka 46 secs ago
8:01 AM
Oh I never meant to just do it. I was more curious as to what the thoughts on the subject was and if there was any rules about it. That being said I don't understand why this subject is being given a negative rep in voting. — The Grand J 1 min ago
Can you please evaluate that tag against the criteria for burnnation: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/324070/… I — rene 10 secs ago
It's because meta is a bit different: on meta it is how many people agree with you or disagree, basically a thumbs up/down. Note the lack of reputation change due to that. You will at least get an answer for "is it frowned upon?" :) — Oleg Valter 32 secs ago
8:33 AM
It looks like it is allowed: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/349555/… the only concern I heard from a CM is that we kept that question "hostage" on the featured tab for 2 to 3 weeks so all the bounties could be set and awarded. — rene 11 secs ago
@SecurityHound Would it be the answer to this meta question here to make the naming question a discussion forum question here on SO meta instead? — Lorenz 47 secs ago
Most actions mentioned like dealing with script project management, verification process are highly unlikely to be considered to be ontopic. Even if they are, they're not about programming and border line super-user category and don't warrant a new tag. Neither is google-apps-script-menu or google-apps-script-dashboard. Furthermore, none of these branches are recognizable or usable easily by new users. It'll be a retagging mess. Strongly Disagree. — TheMaster 31 secs ago
@TheMaster - that's exactly what I propose - either synonymize or merge into a single google-apps-script-project. About google-apps-script-menu - that's different, I think it should be merged into main too — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
Also against google-apps-script-project. Use google-cloud-platform or google-oauth should be sufficient. — TheMaster 34 secs ago
@TheMaster - the problem is that GCP is much broader, it is not a correct substitute for the script project ( in fact, the only part of GCP that is relevant here are default and standard Cloud Projects ). google-oauth is also much broader and intersects with Google Sign-in — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
The problem I have with it is that google-apps-script + google-cloud-platform are just two platform tags. Our main tag serves visibility to SMEs well, the other includes a broad spectrum of issues not related to Apps Script at all, the same goes for google-oauth. I am not arguing for sub-tagging, but I think 1-2 branches (that represent a domain of issues) should remain. — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
@TheMaster that's not what I mean at all, quite the opposite - I referred to google-cloud-platform. That said, if there existed a cloud-platform-project that is a synonym of google-cloud-platform I might consider switching to google-apps-script + google-cloud-platform or logging or ide depending on the situation. — Oleg Valter 11 secs ago
I think that
google-apps-script-project
is unnecessary. It's barely used, very loosely defined, and there are better tags which fit it. google-apps-script-project
should be synonymised to google-cloud-platform
and google-apps-script-editor
to google-apps-script
. — Rafa Guillermo 1 min ago@RafaGuillermo - I think we have a misunderstanding here, Apps Script projects have very little to do with Cloud Platform, and can't be made a synonym. See the whole chapter of official guide: developers.google.com/apps-script/guides/… — Oleg Valter 37 secs ago
You're speaking as if google-apps-script-project is different from gcp. It's not. It's the same thing attached to google-apps-script. — TheMaster 1 min ago
@TheMaster, I apologize for insisting, but how about a direct quote from docs? "every Apps Script project has an associated Google Cloud Platform project". They are not identical, that said, I do not say they are not intricately connected. — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
@OlegValter Apps Script Projects are GCP projects on the backend. If it's not manually tied to a GCP project then it has its own unique identifier anyway. If it's a question not directly related to the GCP side of things then I see no reason for
google-apps-script-project
to not be a synonym of good old google-apps-script
. — Rafa Guillermo 1 min ago@RafaGuillermo although I disagree with the notion of them being identical (if they were, you could manage libraries and manifests through GCP directly, also Properties are part of the apps script project that are not available in GCP) and think that the confusion arises due to them being interconnected (especially because one cannot live without another), it is not my intention to hinder the effort - if I am in the minority here, I am ready to accept it as a synonym. — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
No need to apologize. @RafaGuillermo makes a good point here. If the question is not about GCP or it's management(do note: In which case, you need 3 looong tags: google-apps-script,google-apps-script-project,google-cloud-platform), If it's just about dealing with script project management, deployment, debugging, The last one should just be tagged [debugging] or [stackdriver] [logging]. The first 2 uses: Every script is managed. Not every script is deployed, but that alone don't warrant a separate tag. — TheMaster 57 secs ago
9:39 AM
@OlegValter Don't all basic logs go to stackdriver with v8? And rhino is no longer a default. — TheMaster 34 secs ago
@TheMaster - I don't entirely disagree with the approach, that's why I apologize. That said, I feel compelled to defend the specificity of the domain of apps script projects. On the note of long tags (I think you meant something else, and not two apps script tags, btw :)), I also dislike the long naming, I think it should be referred to as apps-script-project or, ideally (but that won't probably happen), gas-project. With logging there is a problem - all is good when this is stackdriver, but what if we are talking about basic logging? — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
@TheMaster that's true, but they also go there, but
Logger
still has its own issues (alongside what is displayed in the execution dashboard). In fact, we've just been discussing a problem very specific to them and newer runtime that still does not have anything to do with Stackdriver. That said, I am hesitant to convert this into a discussion about validity of apps script project itself - it is an alternative proposal after all — Oleg Valter 35 secs agoI remember 1 or 2 issues about the logs showing up late or not showing at all. Again, Don't think it warrants a separate tag. — TheMaster 30 secs ago
@TheMaster - I am talking more as a whole, not individually (that is, counting Libraries + Logging + GCP + Editor). With just logging, it would not be enough, I agree. Anyways, I really do not want it to become a stumbling block, so I will be content with a simple vote in our room, what do you say? I may have more compelling arguments by then. — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
10:27 AM
Does this answer your question? When is it justifiable to downvote a question? — user4642212 2 mins ago
1 hour later…
11:43 AM
@Lotenz - What? Stack Exchange communities will never be discussion forums — Security Hound 51 secs ago
I was indicating that your Stack Overflow question was seeking a discussion — Security Hound 1 min ago
@SecurityHound Yes I understood that, which brought up the perhaps working solution to simply post it here on meta, with the tag "discussion", as you are right. The points of philipxy show that SO is not good for "naming questions", they may lead to opinions and how would you vote for that. — Lorenz 1 min ago
12:09 PM
12:21 PM
Sometimes, it is not so random (reputation points laundering through the bounty system (to protect reputation points gained in voting tings)). — Peter Mortensen 31 secs ago
12:43 PM
1:53 PM
Like I said on MSE, it's more useful to ask in your question whether there are any spam/offensive deleted posts on your profile (or, like Martijn pointed out, any invalidated bounty awards). Just reporting this a bug isn't very useful if it's one of those two, that's why I said you could ask about deleted posts/bounties on the meta of the site it was on... — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago
2:13 PM
I think this should be synonymized with identifier as CÅ“ur suggested in a comment. — TylerH 18 secs ago
In general, I agree we could use more incentives for answering well-asked unanswered questions. Maybe we need a network-wide "stumpers" list for well-received but unanswered questions that have been hanging around for a while, limited to communities you're a member of. Maybe Community bot could offer a bounty? Maybe "stumpers" get featured on the home page? Maybe there are badges for answering questions flagged as stumpers by the system? That's just off the top of my head--I'm sure there are a thousand more ways ti could be done. — ColleenV 1 min ago
2:41 PM
Yesterday was the 20th anniversary of the Joel Test and I wrote a blog post about it. Only 8 of the 12 questions are still relevant today, at best. There are also several aspects of engineering culture, such as onboarding, career development, diversity and inclusion, and continuous improvement that are not part of the Joel Test. Do you think that, in 2020, scoring well on the Joel Test is indicative of "good engineering culture"? — Thomas Owens 1 min ago
My question was "what does the flag with this name currently actually indicate", not "is the name appropriate for the way it's being used", so this is a valid answer. I wish it came with a citation, though. — SOLO 16 secs ago
2:55 PM
@SOLO John's profile indicates that he is Staff. However, he doesn't indicate which team he is on. This may be technically correct, it's very misleading if this is indeed the correct answer. That leads to my comments and very likely the down votes. — Thomas Owens 38 secs ago
3:37 PM
If I saw an incorrect answer I would immediately downvote it. I would also flag the question, while the bounty was active, for moderator attention. I would vote to delete the incorrect answer. — Security Hound 1 min ago
3:59 PM
Linux alone doesn't make enough of a difference - different Linux distros may do things differently (some may have, others don't). — BoltClock ♦ 1 min ago
If I'm not mistaken, they read the
prefers-color-scheme
CSS property with the value dark
or light
. — Heretic Monkey 1 min agoDoes this answer your question? What does the "System setting" option do for the Theme preference? — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
4:21 PM
Note that the problem also exists in the other way around. If you see a badly written question, its best just to quickly answer. then edit the answer into shape later. This is the fastest gun in the west problem. this also makes answering questions like yours uninteresting - any answer will be a difficult research project, but without activity on your question won't receive many votes. So going for the gazilion crap questions and getting some answer in before it is closed is often better, rep-wise, then answering the questions that actually need answers. — Polygnome 1 min ago
@S.S.Anne Yeah, I'm sorry SO Inc. made some decisions that took the heart out of this process. The mod in command is picking up some work but assured me they will not touch burninations until tooling on the mod-side is improved. We simply lack the CM capacity atm to be effective on huge effort burns. Please nibble at the smaller ones ... and again appologies we can't get this on track any sooner. — rene just now
4:41 PM
Thanks! - I needed to write https://stackoverflow.com/tags/npm-live-server/synonyms into the URL of my web browser to remind myself of how to see which tag is a synonym which. — Henke 1 min ago
5:11 PM
@Polygnome the thing is... those... "crap" questions are the ones more developers will have. so if they're not duplicates, and edited into shape, they'll often be far more useful than the kinds of questions this question is asking about. Most of them however (unfortunately) are duplicates. — Kevin B 1 min ago
5:31 PM
@Makoto and I worked to provide that, the example I was able to give is the pure virtual interface pointer that I dereference successfully, call a function from, and then crash inside that function. — Tim Gordon 39 secs ago
5:49 PM
I'm curious how anyone is supposed to be able to help when they don't have access to your code, environment, or hardware. At the very least, code should be doable. — fbueckert 28 secs ago
@fbueckert Again, it's a memory error. If I were able to get it down to a few lines of code, beyond the one crashing it, I would. That isn't possible, and the code base is ~200-300k sloc. Plus corporate policy, and I really can't give anything more useful. — Tim Gordon just now
6:03 PM
This is catch-22: if you can reduce your problem to a very small example - you don’t need SO for debugging, if you cannot - SO cannot help you. This makes SO useless as debugging service for something more than absolute beginner error. Alas, there are still too many debugging requests which can be „served“... — ead 23 secs ago
6:25 PM
Does this answer your question? Should we have a more specific close reason for vague debugging questions? — gnat 1 min ago
yes, I am an engineer on the Talent (aka Jobs) team and checked the code directly to verify this answer. I will also pass along the feedback about the Joel Test's relevance. — John M. Wright 1 min ago
6:45 PM
"My program crashed but I can't show a minimal, complete example that reproduces the problem" is always and forever off-topic. What can anyone do except tell you other than to use a sanitizer or a debugger? Please create a minimal. complete example. — ggorlen 32 secs ago
That's when I figured out the bug myself because I could isolate the code block causing the problem, then I applied it to the source machine, and it worked without ever hitting the "ask question" button ;) — Davy M 8 secs ago
I had a similar issue on our product's code base. Dozens of C functions in various files calling one another, memory error that corrupted the debugging output. I was dying to post a question on Stack Overflow, but I knew (1) I couldn't just copy/paste proprietary code, and (2) The code base was too big, and I couldn't even be sure the problem was actually in the code as opposed to an environment issue. Long story short, I removed all possible function calls until the issue vanished, then added the last part back in, removed other parts and repeated until I had it reproducible in one program. — Davy M 21 secs ago
@S.S.Anne I wasn't aware of this but it turns out mods rather not have flags on burnination request to feature them. It is buried in the small print at the end — rene 9 secs ago
7:43 PM
Full support, these are essentially one tag. There is also a spa-template that may be worth synonymizing for visibility (or dealing with altogether with 18 questions attow). — Oleg Valter 1 min ago
7:57 PM
It's called debugging and logging. Writing code is trivial, (yes, really), debugging is not. You need to record everything, try different cases, comment-out calls, check arguments with your debugger, every trick you can think of to narrow down and, eventually, exterminate the bug. As others have commented, only someone with access to all the environment, OS, source, compiler, linker, debugger and logger can do that. — Martin James 1 min ago
'For seemingly random segfaults, what I provided would be absolutely enough to answer the question posed' no, not even close:( — Martin James 1 min ago
8:31 PM
I've seen similar reports. Please edit your question to include browser, OS, any userscripts, ad blockers, virus scanners that you're using and what you had for breakfast. It would have helped if you had a developer console open when this occured as that would have revealed any errors, either javascript or network load errors. — rene 1 min ago
@oscilatingcretin This has happened to me before, all I did was close out of the page(I copied the question body and title first) and then reopened the "Ask a question" page and it worked fine. Edit: Try eating something else for breakfast. Cheerios can cause bugs like these. — 10 Rep 2 mins ago
@10Rep :D fair enough. I thought maybe you deleted the meta post. What was your browser, os, etc? I guess you can't recall what you had for breakfast that day ... — rene 39 secs ago
9:03 PM
I feel there are a couple issues with this stance. 1) There is often great benefit that comes out of solving complex problems, especially in the plethora of smaller problems that get solved along the way, even if that benefit is less direct and obvious. 2) If experts can't ask expert questions on Stack Overflow because it's "not useful to the community," then there will be no more experts on Stack Overflow. Their wisdom, effort, and problem solving is no doubt a solid reason why SO is still around and a popular tool to this day. — zcoop98 26 secs ago
Content on SO is scored based on how many people find it useful (and in some cases interesting, unfortunately), not on how challenging, or hidden or weird the question is, or how much fun the answerer has solving it. — Kevin B 22 secs ago
You can leave a comment under the question or if you don't mind to chat you can post a so called cv-pls in the SOCVR chat room but do read our FAQ first. — rene 24 secs ago
Updated to
status-planned
since we have some active research on this scheduled. More here soon! — Jon Chan ♦ 1 min ago9:41 PM
@wjandrea Python would get something like python-id then. Or we can replace the ID tag on Python questions with the identity tag. Or some other process. — TylerH 51 secs ago
If you don't feel the questions are valuable, and you can't answer them, I see no reason not to delete them, but also don't think you have an obligation to delete them either. On some level, old, unuseful questions just add clutter to the site, but the algorithms do a fine job of raising fresh, relevant content over the old, so I don't think the questions are doing much harm either. So, a long winded way to say, up to you! — zcoop98 1 min ago
10:17 PM
@zcoop98 Ahem… User's suspension period has expired, but they're still suspended?. — user4642212 51 secs ago
11:11 PM
Well it's on topic, while not exactly the same in all contexts but it conveys similar concept, it's not crystal clear but I won't go as far as calling it ambiguous, and can add meaningful info. to the question, at least just looking at it in the context of tags. It's not the most helpful tag, but there are many more to go before this one IMHO. — M-- 42 secs ago
Where in my post did I say software tools/IDE are off-topic?The first definition is vague where it fully excludes any "script development issues".It can be interpreted to exclude debugging,script saving/running or almost anything related to script development, but something exclusive to the editor- say, "How to change the menu button color to black". Even if that can be considered software tools usage, My entire point is: Anyone familiar with apps script is also familiar with the default IDE and thus does not need a separate tagand it causes harm by hiding questions from potential answerers. — TheMaster 29 secs ago
11:41 PM
I think that the second paragraph is the longer version of "and is a practical, answerable problem that is unique to software development". — Braiam 9 secs ago
11:51 PM
Also, @Machavity, we have extremely tight character limits when we respond to flags. I can get may be one sentence there, if I work hard at compressing it. So it's not about the privacy or lack of notice, so much as whether you want more than 3 or 4 words. — Cody Gray ♦ 46 secs ago
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