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06:51
In no uncertain terms, the .015% of the Stack Overflow community that is on Meta does not speak on behalf of the entire community


I believe this idea is factually (and morally) wrong and it's the underlying reason why CMs are having a hard time. Meta *is* the community.
Being a tiny minority does not mean much: meta users have more contributions than non users. They are the most advanced users, that know the site and dynamics best.
6
(btw fragging fix chat markdown already)
Of course they are not the ultimate authority on many things, e.g. newbie experience, but they do deal with newbies a hell of a lot more than community managers for example, many of which are not contributors anymore
The attitude of dissing meta by the company is a problematic attitude that needs to be corrected.
 
1 hour later…
08:11
Look, jpmc26, I don't want to start a crousade to change your viewpoint or anything. I respect you vision, but I will also confirm what I said. Maybe there is not a "lot" of them, maybe the issue is far less common of what I have experienced... but to me the issue exist.
If someone is trying to use a javascript grid library and after trying to replicate an online sample found in the official documentation asks why the pagination in his poc doesn't look like the one in the sample.... you don't tell him to "just remove the pagination if you don't need it, dood".
(see full text)
08:21
Now, I can agree that the SharePoint example may be a little more disputable - you see the warning as on-topic, I don't exactly feel the same since I was just documenting why two should-be-equivalent methods of the same api gave different results with the same input without really advocating using it in the first place (if you noticed in the question, I came to that method only because it was already used in the legacy code I had to maintain ).
And I think we at last can agree that we once again should be grateful to the SharePoint documentation for not making clear what of the two outcomes is the intended one (and in all honesty, I do agree that it makes much more sense for the id to be readonly)
Atlas, @jpmc26, can you at least agree that if someone is asking for guidance on how to make grid pagination in his poc look like the one in the official online sample... telling him "just remove the pagination" is at best ignoring what he asked in the first place?
It is like someone asking how to complete level 7-4 in the original Super Mario Bros game (the level loops infinitely unless you take a specific path thru it) ... and then getting a reply that tells him that he can skip to 8-1 if he takes a warp in 4-2. After stating in the question that he has already completed the game by warping and now is trying to beat all the levels.
 
1 hour later…
09:42
@jpmc26 To be fair, I think the opposite happened. It was not SO staff who "pointed them out". Twitter post about the problem were made far before the first "incident" (read: April's post).
The difference was that before (no offense meant) most of the posts were made by random twitter "nobodies". April had a lot of followers, lot of visibility and basically works in the field of making people feel welcomed.
so... yep, I fear that PR damage handling had indeed a lot of influence in that sudden decision to go full force on the Welcome route.
Notice that I am not saying they went on the route just because April. I am saying that April put them in a situation where they could no longer wait 6-8 time units before acting.
They had to do something and they had to do something fast.
 
5 hours later…
14:44
@TylerH wasnt one of the mods comments there that comments shouldnt be deleted just because they should be written as an answer, or something to that effect?
15:32
@Dragonrage Possibly; I don't recall the contents of every mod message. However, that's an incorrect assertion; comments should be deleted if they're an attempt at answering. At the very least they should be deleted after a request has been made to the commenter to convert it to a proper answer.
Additionally mods should be able to convert comments under a question to an answer, just like they can do the opposite. If the commenter doesn't want their content as an answer they can choose to delete it per the normal answer deletion route.
 
4 hours later…
20:02
Can someone please write up a TL;DR epilogue for those of us who drifted away two or three days ago and are now astounded by the sheer volume of comments that have been added? BTW is every comment on-topic?
20:15
Basically (I gave up reading when I reached July 29) it's a lot of chat about reporting bugs, whether the feature of FRs are useful, and why isn't there a star for every upvote a comment receives that is then migrated to chat.
user3956566
@Mari-LouA I don't think anyone knows
user3956566
It's become the goto chat for meta atm
user3956566
a chance for people to air things
user3956566
I can try to help
@YvetteColomb A lot of chatty comments reaching no conclusion. I shall go and lurk somewhere else.
user3956566
20:18
@Mari-LouA I'm not sure there is a clear answer, it's more people getting things off their chests
user3956566
it's all a bit up in the air atm
user3956566
thanks for dropping by :)
My pleasure, I rarely chat but the issue of bullying struck a chord within me.
user3956566
our meta site has been difficult for many years for many people
user3956566
and we're a bit burnt out in places as a community asking for tools to help with reviews etc
20:25
To clarify, I consider any form of censorship and telling others what they can say or think a form of bullyism. Obviously, this excludes verbal abuse and stalking online.
I believe one person's rights end right where the rights of the next person start. And I also don't believe we should act as if Stack Overflow was a democracy. It never was and it isn't supposed to be. The only democratic thing is our mod elections.
4
user3956566
@AndrasDeak perfectly put
user3956566
@Mari-LouA you'll have to forgive me. I have the flu and it's forcing me back to bed
hope you get well soon, Yvette
user3956566
thanks :)
23:05
BTW @SaraChipps AFAICT the "0.015%" of the community is not a realistic figure for meta. Meta users are about 5% of the total community and own about 80% of the total Stack Overflow rep. They are by no means as insignificant as your answer makes them: data.stackexchange.com/meta.stackoverflow/query/1084617/…
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Rob
Rob
23:53
@Sklivvz Probably a bunch of yearling badges there. Removing the badges from the query yields 0.325% and 26% of reputation: data.stackexchange.com/meta.stackoverflow/query/1084689/…

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