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8:00 PM
But you know what else I don't like? Bugs in production.
 
OK, Java's type system concerning interfaces isn't so bad, but oh g** the type declarations...
 
@MadaraUchiha Don't lie, you love those
 
And being a nazi with my structure and tests reduce the bug rate in production to the level that I can actually e-mail myself each time an exception occurs.
I get like 10 of those a year.
That's not to say that it destroys bugs completely, obviously
 
Haskell has a great type system.
 
Nothing ever will (bugs is such a bad name, "programming errors")
 
8:01 PM
I dislike tests almost as much as I dislike types in my javascript.
 
oh, to all participants in type discussions: If you haven't, read this great paper and then a bit on ADTs
4
 
@ndugger Have you ever worked on a product for more than a couple of months?
 
Yes
 
@MadaraUchiha in short, TS' contract-interfaces do jsfiddle.net/hfsgc9rj/1
if the compiler knows that X meets contract Y, it doesn't matter how they're related
 
@ndugger Well, are you not afraid pushing changes to production?
 
8:03 PM
i.e., it enforces duck typing
 
(Are those projects that actually matter, people use them? Money at stake?)
 
We have all sorts of tests that surrounds the release cycle; I'm not saying that they don't have merrit, I just personally don't want to write tests... lol
 
@ndugger Well, but you write the code...
Who else can write your tests but you?
 
Yes, and my code is beautiful.
 
Testing something you don't understand 100% is hard.
@ndugger And I'm sure your mother told you that too when she code-reviewed you, but that's besides the point.
 
8:05 PM
I have yet to see testing done well. I usually just see testing for the sake of testing... expect x to be an a function... great...
"an a"
my grammar
pls
 
@ndugger you're not actually testing anything there
expect(require('foo')).not.to.be.null()
 
Has anyone tried rollup? Is it good?
 
@MadaraUchiha I've never trusted should
 
rrrroll up the rim, baby
 
@ssube Eh, matter of style.
 
crl
da fuck.. why this doesn't work: output.jsbin.com/jegovo
 
@crl
 
crl
it should prevent ctrl+W from closing the tab
 
@crl your hatred for white space makes that a headache to read.
 
8:11 PM
e=> {} ?
 
crl
yes?
 
> e.ctrlKey&&e.keyCode===87
It's ok to have spaces...
 
crl
no time for that
 
in fact, I'd say that it's good to have spaces
 
ain't nobody got time for spaces
 
8:13 PM
@MattSizzle lambda expressions in es2015
to the google with you!
 
@crl The browser probably blocks you from doing that as a security feature.
 
Nah I know a lambda
just looks so damn unnatural in there with no spaces
 
crl
@MadaraUchiha yes I guess, thanks
useful to force close a tab anyway
 
@ndugger you could be looking at my snap right now
 
@BadgerCat omg
 
8:21 PM
Now I just have to convince @copy to do a face swap with me
 
sneak up on him
 
@BadgerCat sorry :(
 
@BadgerCat that was adorable
 
@BadgerCat What'd you put in the snap?
 
crl
ah finally we can edit js in devtools
 
8:25 PM
I feel like most of BadgerCat's snaps are her painting her nails.
From the way she talks about it.
 
@Trasiva I just used the cat filter and meowed
 
Finally. My life is complete.
 
I never saw a snap of her that was her painting her nails
 
She sent me art the other day
 
8:26 PM
yeah, I was in a museum in Prague
 
some of those art ones were pretty sweet
I miss visiting museums
the French have real good ones
 
@BadgerCat Hah! That's hillarious.
 
hahah I just saw a great Doritos commercial
 
@Zirak jobs.drupal.org/platformsh/job/12151 look at the "Nices to have"
 
@KendallFrey Guess you should have watched the Superbowl, you pleb.
 
8:31 PM
cc @MadaraUchiha
 
Who watches ads during the superbowl?
 
@FlorianMargaine Can we just torch Drupal instead and have a party over the charred corpse?
 
@FlorianMargaine lol
Your workplace?
 
I didn't know that people still used drupal
 
8:33 PM
@ndugger People still use drupal. There, now you know.
 
umm, maybe a stupid question. is there a node package that will handle message passing for me on a domain socket? like I can write server.write(..) server.write(...) server.write(..) and it will block for me, or queue up the writes and not mangle them all together
 
Oh my god, it's completely different than I remember it
 
I just wrote my own queue and it is ugly.
 
@KendallFrey The ads play in between every third play or so.
 
drupal has evolved a lot since I last saw it
 
8:34 PM
@MadaraUchiha Primarily spammers do
 
@ndugger more than ever
 
@JanDvorak How so?
 
I personally don't
 
@FlorianMargaine is it still php? Looks like it
 
@FlorianMargaine I wouldn't jump that wagon just yet.
 
8:35 PM
@MadaraUchiha Drupal.SE is notorious for getting a lot of spam
You can ask in the Tavern
 
@JanDvorak Heh, fair enough
 
Yeah, php, uses twig
 
I never got template languages in PHP
 
@FlorianMargaine more?
 
I get it in Node or in Java, they aren't very well suited for the task
 
crl
8:36 PM
!!> ({ '+'(){}, '-'(){} })
 
@crl {"+":"function (){}","-":"function (){}"}
 
@ssube more people are using drupal now than ever before
 
Seeing as how php is a templating language with extra programming features built on top of it, I always thought it strange as well
 
But PHP was literally a templating language originally...
@ndugger Exactly.
What more do you need? You have variables, loops, conditions, macros (in the form of functions)
 
crl
template string is a good templating language
 
8:37 PM
@crl back under the bridge
 
user5870134
Can anyone help me answer this question?
 
user5870134
0
Q: JavaScript templating engine - Converting left hand ternary (without an assignment) into conditional statement(s)

MangoI've found the perfect JavaScript templating engine, built by Krasimir, it is just what I needed. The templating engine works great but naturally I couldn't resist the urge to hack at it a bit and maybe even add a couple of features. Unfortunately I am having trouble understanding some of the cod...

 
@crl No, it really isn't...
 
crl
why?
 
It has no conditionals, no loops, no structure traversal.
 
8:38 PM
@crl you're confusing interpolation with templates
 
crl
you .map inside a ${ ... }
 
@crl That's JavaScript, not template string anymore.
 
crl
templating with js then, seems fine
 
@crl You can .map() an object now?
 
crl
yep
 
8:39 PM
!!> Object.prototype.map
 
@MadaraUchiha "undefined"
 
> A Pound of Quarters vs. a Pound of Dimes: Which Is Heavier, and Which Is Worth More?
no article, no
you are not being clever, you just sound stupid
 
@rlemon I like the pound of brick vs pound of feathers one better.
 
they are pointing out that they are worth the same
which is neat.
 
Which is heavier? The pound of feathers, because you also have to carry the weight of what you did to those poor birds.
 
8:40 PM
It's to make myself look stupid. If I have an error:

> Uncaught TypeError: Failed to execute 'appendChild' on 'Node': parameter 1 is not of type 'Node'.

But the argument to `appendChild` logs as

> DOMElement {tagName: "DIV", class...
 
so in the context of the 'they are worth the same', trying to make the weight joke (like the bricks vs feathers) just is stupid
 
@Oleg code?
 
@Oleg What's a DOMElement object?
 
@rlemon they have five expert opinions and a thorough foray into rounding error in the process
 
Also yeah ^
 
crl
8:41 PM
!!> <ol>${[1,2].map(i => <li>${i}).join('\n')}</ol>
 
@crl "<ol><li>1\n<li>2</ol>"
 
huffpost is pretty much buzzfeed for politics now, though, so that's normal for them
 
Euh... I guess a DOMElement is a dom element? A div.
 
@Oleg DOMElement is not a built-in DOM object. My assumption is that it's a custom object that does not inherit from Node
 
Oh.
 
8:42 PM
2
Q: MongoDB Sort on high volume data

Sterling ArcherUsing NodeJS, if I rename my telemName table and grab fresh data, this code works absolutely fine. Always has. However, the collection I have now has breached Total Results: 1649272 db.collection(telemName).find(options).sort({ "d" : 1 }).toArray(function (err, telemetryData) { console.log(t...

halp D:
 
@Oleg That would be HTMLElement
 
crl
2 ` nesting
 
Alright. Hmm.
 
@Oleg are you actually seeing" DOMElement"? Are you using a library?
 
@crl I don't know why, but you seem to like unreadable code very much :P
 
8:43 PM
@SterlingArcher stop sorting
 
Yea. I'm using virtual-dom.
 
@ssube can't, need to sort
 
don't
 
@Oleg You can't append a virtual element to a real element
 
8:43 PM
What's wrong with
 
not even sql will happily sort 1.5m records
 
Somehow when I try to bundle the code with rollup, it generates the error.
If I use Browserify – all is well.
 
sort requires having the entire dataset in memory
 
But it's indexed
 
or most of it
 
crl
8:43 PM
@MadaraUchiha vpaste.net/vdtBw
 
is the index sorted and the field you're using?
 
I believe so yeah
 
<ol>
  {{for item of items}}
    <li>item
  {{/for}}
</ol>
 
crl
mine is clearer, a .map does a map
 
and sorted in the right direction?
 
8:44 PM
My boss did the indexing, he knows what he's doing (but he's gone, so I'm lost)
 
@crl Debatable.
 
crl
yea, kidding:)
 
HA! did crl just say his code is clearer? bro you need spaces and new lines for that
 
crl
there are spaces in vpaste.net/vdtBw
 
And 4 whole newlines too @rlemon!
 
8:45 PM
^ I'd rather eat a shoe that that
 
@phenomnomnominal I'd like to see you eat a piece of code
 
print it out and eat it
easy
 
-1
Q: Access property within javascript object

Matt PriceI am trying to access a property within an object and return it. Note the name of the object can change, so accessing it using title_can_change.property will not work. Take the following object: { "title_can_change":{ property: 1 } } How do I return the value of 'property'? MORE INFO: ...

omg somebody smash that question
5 answers already and definitely a dupe
 
@FlorianMargaine You have knowledge of the universe!?
 
@ssube I guess I removed the index somehow
MongoError: Executor error during find command: OperationFailed Sort operation used more than the maximum 33554432 bytes of RAM. Add an index, or specify a smaller limit.
 
crl
8:47 PM
createIndex or find a smaller limit
 
server porn: using all 20 cores to compress a file: imgur.com/wNFXMeK
 
use a different database
it'll be faster and easier than making the index
 
@copy Figures. It's something that I just kept seeing over and over.
Thanks
 
@crl no shit? lol
@ssube not an option
 
@Zirak obviously
 
8:50 PM
@Zirak those other servers also have pretty robust restart/crash handling stuff
thread dies, it can pass the connection off to another worker, then respawn later, etc
 
It comes down at the end to these libraries being fancy route handlers and the like, and not byte-perfect networking programs.
 
what's the topic?
 
24 hours ago, by Zirak
@copy eli5: I have a program using flask/django/SimpleHTTPServer, it's all API so it doesn't serve any static assets. Why would I use nginx/gunicorn/wsgi/etc?
 
free my boy django
 
nginx and haproxy do a million billion things to be byte-perfect networking programs
and they're crazy good at it
haproxy forwarding 10gbit on a phenom and all
 
8:55 PM
byte-perfect? are some programs byte-good-enough?
 
crl
error-rate
 
@Luggage actually yes, mostly with networking. A dumb HTTP server will drop the incoming connection when a worker dies and leave the client with a partial/no response. A good HTTP server will have the connection and worker in different procs or threads, letting it spawn a new worker or return a 500/503
 
akka and node do that in weird ways, nginx just does it normal like, and apache takes all your memory and pretends to do something
 
i see.
 
8:58 PM
Networking is really hard to get right
 
@rlemon SethBling is fucking amazing.
 
networking is the worst. I just refuse to do it.
networking and security. Just give me a floating IP, HAProxy, and OAuth.
 
I once wrote a DNS server as a pet project, it was all fine and well until the complexity genie started wispering
Gave up and played Terraria instead
 
!!afk Hangouts later.. you all miss me
 
Make a DNS server in Terraria
 
9:01 PM
Sure, I'll get right to it
 
!!s/Terraria/Factorio/
 
@ssube Make a DNS server in Factorio (source)
 
!!s/Factorio/DNS/
 
@Zirak @ssube Make a DNS server in DNS (source) (source)
 
then an HTTP server, then use the Lua scripts to actually bind them to ports
and make it so factories output different strings
so you have to produce headers and have them ready, then pick the right one when a request comes in
 
9:08 PM
hey guys
why is it that sometimes I'm about to answer a question
and suddenly, I get a page not found?
 
@Zirak handling simultaneous requests, for one
@GregBorbonus deleted question
 
Are users able to delete, or only mods?
 
@FlorianMargaine I think they're threaded
@GregBorbonus You can delete your questions and answers under certain criteria
 
ohh, ok
would be nice if it popped up with a message saying "Deleted by X" if mod: "For: ....."
 
I think there is such a notification. At least I vaguely remember reading a meta post about it.
 
9:21 PM
so, my boss asked me what kind of version control system do I use. Adding that he uses "subversion" but he thinks it'll be easier for him to learn mine rather than the other way around...
what do you people use?
 
@towc what do you use?
 
and from googling a bit "version control system"s are just a way of naming files, right? But then "subversion" seems to be some sort of software...
 
hoo boy
@towc VCS is a way of storing multiple copies of the same file and tracking your changes.
 
rubs hands together in anticipation
 
9:22 PM
Have you never used github?
 
github is one of them, right?
 
git is. github is just a popular online git hosting service
 
Do I just say github? Btw, github is always only for open source, right? Or am I losing at life?
 
You can have private repos on github
 
oh, so maybe we can have some private git...
 
9:23 PM
@towc yes
 
but then...
 
Bitbucket or more of a private repo git service
 
!!xkcd git
 
you do not say github, you say git
 
9:24 PM
Depends if you are talking about the tool (git) or the site (github).
 
github has a paid version
although there are other tools for larger companies (gitlab)
 
I am the guy the tooltip to that comic references.
 
beanstalk sucks ass
 
is there anything specific and practical you people think I should learn and love?
 
bitbucket has some problems (and is slow like all atlassian products)
 
9:25 PM
I couldn't login for 3 months because their google authenticator broke and they couldn't fix me
@ssube slow maybe, but JIRA is so intuitive idc
 
if you haven't learned git, that'll be useful.
 
I love it's agile boards
 
@SterlingArcher are you kidding? jira is the least intuitive tracker I've ever seen
 
no way man!
 
github/gitlab's issue+tags is so much better
 
9:25 PM
I've seen worse (custom)
 
hell, redmine is better
 
Never used those
 
Jira is decent, but could be streamlined. You can't beat it's customizability, though.
 
I also like confluence
 
you've seen github's for the room repo
both jira and confluence are almost impossible to install correctly and crash all the time
 
9:26 PM
general idea: I should go for git
 
I liked confluence back when they used a wiki markup language, now it's all WYSIWYG.
 
and their advice is like "eh, add memory, restart it every hour"
 
WYSIHYD
 
Yea, git is a must-learn.
 
@towc most software is using git
 
9:27 PM
We use jira at work and we all hate it.
 
to not sound completely dumb, I should ask if they already have a private git hosting system?
and if not I shrug my shoulders?
otherwise bitbucket?
 
@towc I would do what your boss says, considering you've never touched anything in the field.
if they run something, use that, otherwise github
 
If they have SVN, you can use git with it, but it's awkward. You can learn SVN, too.
 
subversion's website is confusing AF
which is what the boss uses
 
if you don't know what you're doing, svn and git may as well be equal
cause you bet you're going to use them wrong for the first year
just be glad you were born after cvs stopped being a thing
 
9:29 PM
no idea what that is, but I guess I am
 
You'll need git for interacting with many many open source projects, so I still think it's good to learn even if you'll be using svn at work.
 
he definitely doesn't want my code to be open source btw
 
though, sounds like svn might be first, if you'll be using that in anger, soon
 
@towc git/svn have nothing to do with OSS
they're just VCS tools
 
git is used in-house for private code, too, but you'll likely USE open source.
 
9:30 PM
git became the defacto when the kernel started using it
 
:,( just gonna cry... Any good resources to learn svn?
 
you on linux or windows, towc?
 
Also, I find it lame to have to start emails with "Dear ....". Do you people always do that?
@Luggage linux
 
@towc Not "dear," that's for relatives.
 
@ssube oohhhhh shiiiiiiiiiit
 
9:34 PM
@towc "Hello" usually works
 
Hello So And So,

Stuff,
Things

Hope to hear from you soon, Thanks, Cheers,
Your Name
@towc did you even elementary school bro?
 
@ssube not really.
 
in whatever country he's in.
 
it is just a classical formal way to intro into a letter.
Dear Mr. President,
Lower my taxes
Singed,
Everyone.
 
@rlemon I was taught that dear is creepy for professional letters and you should use hello.
 
9:36 PM
Everyone truly is singed
 
but I guess in Canada you can use dear or deer or even moose
2
 
aww man.. gotta set up a repo with svn. git has spoiled me.
 
I don't have any ketchup, so my hotdogs only have mustard on them. Still dank.
 
@ssube not that it matters, but it got me thinking. and I cannot find hard numbers but without doing very much math it is apparent you guys have more deer than we do
too cold.
 
crl
i.imgur.com/X9GPyDm.webm dat creature (wait a bit for it)
 
9:47 PM
@crl likely not very large
 
crl
a stingray it seems
 
I'd have pooped my scuba suit...
 
judging by the corals on screen, I'd say the octopus is less than a foot long
 
crl
oh, good point, so it's less impressive than I thought
 
too late. still gotta change suits
 
9:49 PM
the pinkish/salmon looking roundish nubs are leather corals. I've owned them before. From the size of those 'nubs' I'd say it is pretty small.
also the macro algae growing on the rock you see in detail. those are like half the size of common grass.
man, I miss my reef tank :(
when I moved one thing died and took the rest with it :(
 
crl
well that's what you get by going backward, never go backward (the octopus I mean)
 
was it wearing a tiny water-proof suicide vest?
 
@Luggage a lot of oceanic life does
philosophy is "if you kill me, I'll kill you and everything around you.. ha!"
hard to tell who the culprit was in my case, because there was a few options and I came to find them all dead.
 
The internet just disappointed me. I couldn't find an image of spongebob wearing a bomb vest.
 
but I think it was a sea cucumber
 
9:52 PM
Anyone that tells me that ocean fish are smart obviously never saw finding nemo
 
anyone who tells me humans are smart obviously never met nick
 
crl
I never spot-Nick
dang.. wanted to clone an object with JSON.parse(JSON.stringify(..)); but I have circular refs
 

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