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@IluTov are you still looking for rfc ideas?
 
From the back seat: I have some RFC ideas
 
oh I got loads of ideas... most of them are rubbish but quantity counts for something, right? :-P
 
9:25 PM
I asked ages ago about adding constants to traits and Nikita mentioned it’s big enough that it needs an rfc. I started putting some points / specifics of use together but I have no idea how much work the implementation would be.
@DaveRandom quantity is a quality of its own… or something
 
I also have ideas not requiring RFCs :P
 
@Stephen I'll take "something" for 10 points please Steve
 
I would like to ask for opinions on wiki.php.net/rfc/parse_str_alternative before I post on internals
 
@Stephen No, George and I settled on one. But you can always share for the future :)
 
@Dharman I like it. 👍
 
9:37 PM
@Dharman kind of seems to rely on people thinking out parameters are si bad it's worth breaking working code to get rid of them.
 
The name parse_query_string is a much better name than parse_str, just looking at the function name, what is it parsing exactly? 🤷‍♂️
 
@Danack It's not inherently bad, but it's certainly not good either. Especially when the function returns void
I could understand if it changed the array in place like sort() does but it doesn't do that
 
Kind of think that out parameters have worked themselves out of the language since most functions both internal and userland don't really use them anymore. When was the last time anyone saw a new function get added that used out parameters for instance?
 
@KimHallberg it's parsing a string, tbf :-P
 
cmb
Maybe someone wants to implement a well-defined and working alternative to parse_url? Would save us a CVE every other month.
 
9:42 PM
I'm just hoping that Nikita brings ANY of his current RFCs to a vote. readonly and new-init would be very welcome, even if they're not as much as I'd like them to be.
 
pretty sure m6w6 has done that several times over
 
@cmb The URL object in PSR-7. :-)
 
I guess, but with the parameter being named $string and the function name parse_str is hard to figure out at a glance what's being parse from the string, the alternative name in the RFC is easier to understand.
 
very sure that pecl/http contains an alternate/better impl, at least
parse_str() still conforms to the "transliterate All The Things to _" rule which is so unhelpful in the modern world
 
@KimHallberg I think I prefer out parameters over Go style multiple return values. If only because reading the return type of functions that return multiple values is kind of hard.
 
9:44 PM
@Crell ...is flat out wrong in several respects (sorry)
 
@DaveRandom How so?
 
And so one day, they may come back as part of the work to get rid of warning around things like fopen.
 
@Danack Monads! </joke (mostly)>
 
I don't have the lucidity to discuss this rn, however I will happily do so at length tomorrow
also you can search for previous discussions on the topic in here in the distant past :-P
 
9:46 PM
@NikiC Is it too late to suggest more deprecations? I would like to propose deprecations of aliases user_error, pos, is_double, is_long, is_integer, doubleval, key_exists, ini_alter, doubleval.
 
remind me tomorrow though I will hapily discuss this in painful detail
 
@Danack Depends on where you learned to code and the style you learned in most likely, I started in HTML and moved to PHP, never really used out parameters or reference pointers, and most people who learn PHP today never really use them either and probably don't understand them well.
 
Oh, Kim is here.
 
/me sleeps at a reasonable hour for once
 
@KimHallberg Older people who started with C prefer OUT parameters as they are used to it. They don't have any real use in PHP though.
 
9:49 PM
4 mins ago, by Danack
And so one day, they may come back as part of the work to get rid of warning around things like fopen.
Trying to think about inheritance for objects that have multiple return types is perty hard. And the return type info doesn't fit nicely on a line...
 
@DaveRandom I'm not, it's almost 12 PM and I'm going to go put on my seconds cup of coffee for the day.
 
try cocaine
 
@Dharman there are definitely use cases where they’re handy but it makes things harder to reason about. I agree that they’re not usually needed but that doesn’t mean there are zero reasons to use them
 
@Dharman yeah, too late
 
10:05 PM
next year then
 
10:30 PM
@Stephen What's the use case? I'd be in favor only for consistency but since interfaces can already contain constants I'd probably always prefer interfaces over traits for this case.
 
11:20 PM
I should just build a form letter that I can send using a script.
"This belongs in userspace"
It'll save me so much time,.
 
but it'd be so boring...
 
11:38 PM
I mean the str_contains and co made some sense to have in core
This right/left thing is like why on earth do you need them
 
1 message moved to Trash can
 
@PeeHaa ಠ_ಠ
 
wat? I don't need that garbage in my room
 
str_left/str_right are ambiguous names. I have to stare at the names and think about what the intent is. PHP 3 or 4, yeah sure, full of bad names, but it's not a transgression that should be repeated.
Sara "This Belongs in Userspace" Golemon
 
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