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00:09
@Andrea /me feels a bit frustrated and not knowing what to do … I need some help from someone who also supports union types and wants to find the best solution…
@bwoebi the current approach is a good attempt
I don't think there's a good solution
Wes
Wes
00:39
i finally understood how utf-16 works. it's crazy
data processing in the BMP range could be faster than utf-8, but it's too crazy in the 4 bytes range
@Andrea current is what exactly? Shall it produce notices? Just cast to bool??
TBH thinking more about it, bool should just be exact match in multi-scalar type unions...
01:12
@Wes Which is where UCS-2 comes in (in theory)
Wes
Wes
i always knew utf-16 was bad, but as long you have text that is mostly in the BMP range, it could be more efficient than other encodings, am i right?
that could be the reason it is used a lot still
Trouble is, everyone has gone emoji crazy, and most new emojis are where? That's right ladies and gentlemen, the Supplementary Multilingual Plane!
Wes
Wes
that is a problem for twitter and facebook, not mine :P
It will be.
Wes
Wes
how is important having a "mostly" fixed (utf-16) length encoding compared to utf-8?
because if the handling is the same for both, then it's not going to be a big advantage, compared to a real fixed encoding such as utf-32, right?
01:24
What until the post-millenials start showing up with names like 🌈 Johnson, and 🦄 🍿 Hirschowitz?
Wes
Wes
lol
i have no idea how these things work. for instance, is utf-16 stored in arrays of both 16 and 32 bit, or it's always 32 bit regardless?
utf-16 is stored as a vector of 16-bit values, that what the 16 in utf-16 means :p
Wes
Wes
but isn't that just the BMP?
Sort of, that's where surrogates come in.
If you're dealing with a codepoint above U+10000, then you get two 16-bit values back to back
So you get 22 bits of effective storage space, but the storage unit is still 16 bit
Wes
Wes
the code units, right? not sure if they are said code units, but i got it. i thought it was 1 entry = 1 code point
i see...
01:38
So like, U+1234 is stored, literally as 1234
But U+12345 is stored as D803 DE34 or something close to that
and I miscounted earlier, it's 20 bits of effective storage, not 22
Which, btw, is why Unicode stops at U+10FFFF, which is otherwise an odd number.
'cause you have 20 bits of surrogate storage (0x10 planes), plus the BMP, which makes 0x11 total planes
Wes
Wes
with storage space you mean? what are these 4 bits?
Whereas four utf-8 surrogates technically have space for 21 full bits (U+0000 through U+1FFFFF)
Wes
Wes
i have no knowledge of low level programming :B
In a UTF-16 surrogate pair, the first 16-bit value is always 1101 10xx xxxx xxxx, and the second is 1101 11xx xxxx xxxx. So each surrogate half has 10 bits of storage space
Or 20 bits total. To fit your potentially 21 bit value of 0x10FFFF, you subtract 0x10000 from that (which fits you into 20 bits and you split the bits between the two surrogates
Wes
Wes
i see :P thanks for the explanation
01:44
You can shift that 0x10000 off the value because GMP codepoints will never need surrogate pairs
Wes
Wes
instead how is utf-8 usually stored? byte array?
UTF-8 is more complex
The good news is, there's a great explanation on the php.net site... sec...
Basically, the first byte encodes the total length of the codepoint, and the first 3, 4, or 5 bits of the codepint. Each following byte os 10xx xxxx, where the next six bits are stored, and so on
Wes
Wes
the first byte tells how many bytes the code point is composed
right
Wes
Wes
01:49
thanks a lot for the explanation sara. really very much appreciated
if ($b < 128) // one byte
elseif (($b & 0xE0) == 0xC0) // two bytes
elseif (($b & 0xF0) == 0xE0) // three bytes
elseif (($b & 0xF8) == 0xF0) // four bytes
else throw table;
Wes
Wes
i got lost on that one danack. possibly because i was reading it in italian...
Wes
Wes
up to how many bytes the BMP takes in utf-8?
3
1110 xxxx 10xx xxxx 10xx xxxx <- Check it out, 16bits on the mark
Basically, UTF-8 is great if you're expecting most of your data to be ascii, but once you start dealing with a lot of non-ascii, UTF-16 starts to win pretty quickly
BUT, even then, when it comes to names, most name charaters (apart from CJK) fall in the ascii or 2-byte utf-8 range (U+0080 through U+07FF). So for non-CJK content, UTF-8 will still likely win on storage size since it'll have some ascii.
Then you add in CJK and it's like... table flip time. Gonna see a lot of four byte sequences regardless.
Anyway, speak English, ya damn foreigners!
Wes
Wes
02:03
instead the 2 bytes range can represent up to 2048 code points, right?
Yeah, up to U+7FF (which happens to be 2047 in decimal)
Wes
Wes
so wait, anything that is not in the BMP is going to always use 4 bytes?
i'm guessing yes, but since i can't do math... :B i ask for confirm
so utf-16 is not so stupid after all... utf-8 is certainly the best option for html (tags, attributes are all in the ascii range) but for text storage and processing utf-16 could be better, depending on the type and language of the document
@Wes Yes. And that's true in UTF-8 and UTF-16
Moin!
Wes
Wes
ty very much sara for the explanation :P
so now i think more than before that intl functions should support at least utf-16, just because it is what it uses internally...
One more thing about UTF-16 you might not have considered though.
UTF-8 is always network byte ordering. Most significant bits come first. UTF-16 can (easily) come in little endian or big endian orderings.
So what you really, properly need to do is support UTF16LE and UTF16BE, and map into the UChar buffer appropriately.
In example: U+1234 is expressed in UTF16BE as "\x12\x34", simple enough. but in UTF16LE, it's "\x34\x12".
Wes
Wes
02:42
doesn't icu have a preference?
yep i know the difference
But hey, what kind of crazy cpu would use little endian ordering? THE ONE YOU'RE USING NOW DOES
Okay, wasn't sure.
ICU uses "Machine byte ordering"
And yes, we could use straight UTF16 (defaults to machine byte ordering), but you KNOW FOR A FACT that 99% of PHP code written to that interface WILL assume that the byte ordering is fixed and we'll get "bug reports" about it being wrong on some platforms.
That WILL happen.
Wes
Wes
lol
So personally, I would recommend either "Require specifying the byte ordering with UTF16BE, and UTF16LE" or "Treat UTF16 magically like UTF16LE everywhere and correct as needed." I prefer the first.
Though again, this is the kind of place where I'd be down for having a UString class which hides this detail from you for strings that only live for the life of the request.
If you wanna write to disk, you can either specify ordering there, or write out a BOM.
@Wes would you like to co-author an RFC for introducing UString and modifying the existing intl functions/methods to take (utf8-string | UString) and return UString (with a __toString() method that provides utf-8) ?
Might need to make the return type ini-setable... :/
Wes
Wes
i would like if i had the knowledge :P but what i'm doing right now is a userland ustring
Best way to get the knowledge :)
Wes
Wes
02:50
or rather, i'm focusing more on the api than the implementation
but it's part of a bigger project that is basically never going to see the light :B
The best toys are.
github.com/sgolemon/six is useless and distracting, but it was still a fun write.
Wes
Wes
vape went into my stomach when i saw the poop emoji
:D
:D
Wes
Wes
anyway... my guess as a very ignorant person is that processing regardless the encoding is always preferable over converting encodings. in other words, if icu uses internally utf-16 and i'm going to call grapheme_strlen 100 times i should work in utf-16, because with utf-8 it means i'm converting my string 200 times...
and that's just too wrong...
It is, indeed wrong.
But it's where we are.
Wes
Wes
02:56
a ustring class hiding the encoding stuff would help, but the problem is defining an api that doesn't suck
maybe it could have just the bare minimum functionality, and be mutable
like a CodePointSequenceBuilder thing with just slice splice normalize encode, iteration, count
and maybe a GraphemeSequence (not directly modifiable, no splice) using ^ that internally that does the same but on grapheme clusters
Wes
Wes
03:19
how does that sound?
i wouldn't have a full blown ustring class for now. i would allow frameworks to experiment apis in userland, and eventually port to core php the best one
Mar 25 at 1:31, by Wes
http://i1.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article5765055.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/tallest-man.‌​jpg little endian, big endian. sorry.
Wes
Wes
\o
 
1 hour later…
04:46
HELLO HAPPY SUNDAYS
04:57
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/37638459/any-great-books-on-php-a‌​nd-mysql-programming-as-well-as-some-books-on-object-or
Wes
Wes
05:33
someone in my neighborhood is playing "strong enough" by Cher at high volume (it's 7:30 AM)
.... repeatedly
this is so fucking funny....
Ekn
Ekn
try answering back with this :p
05:55
I want users to stay on the front page (one page layout)
Is it a better practice to have seperate php files for each <form> request and use the header function, or should I have all my forms inside one large file and use <input type="hidden"...> to determine the <form>?
Ekn
Ekn
morniin
so ... the boy goes back to school tomorrow ...
they are having police officers and psychologists in ... we've told him his school friend is dead, but I don't know how to explain to a 6 year old, or any child, that their school friend is gone because her father killed her ...
I don't even know if they are going to be told what happened, I assume so, the older children are old enough to read the news by themselves ...
I really hate the world at the moment ...
Ekn
Ekn
it must be really hard to explain indeed... :( such a mad world we live in...
I'm not sure how they'd explain or... make it sound/seem less saddening or effecting at all..
06:08
I'm also a bit worried, they are having a vicar visit also ... I really hate the idea of those children being told their friend is still alive somewhere, I'm not sure what they need to hear, but I'm certain it's not that ...
the truth of the matter is absolutely brutal, and I'm not sure I want them exposed to that ... he either drowned her in the bath, or smothered her, he then stabbed the two family dogs with a kitchen knife and hung himself ...
Ekn
Ekn
... that's just... too brutal to even mention just 1% of it to any child...
yeah, but what are they going to tell them
without lying about the nature of the world ...
why is a vicar needed, I'm worried about that ...
Ekn
Ekn
:( I'm really not sure if that's okay to do...
I think the only thing that'd be sensible to explain is the death of one...
we've gone that far ourselves, he knows she's gone ... there was a lot of crying, he's still very whiny, hasn't slept properly ... I think I shall accompany him into school
Ekn
Ekn
it sounds like that'd be the best thing to do in my opinion... with police, vicar, psychologists it might get a bit chaotic for a little child...
I hope he and all his friends be (somewhat) okay tomorrow, best of luck :(
it is really a hard situation to be in...
06:21
I was young the first time a friend died, early teens, drug related ... I can't imagine how a 6 year old processes it ... I'm pretty certain they can't and shouldn't have to process murder ...
Ekn
Ekn
I was 9 when my favourite teacher died... I was at funerals before, family visits, but that's a bit..err, softer to process than the former...
Agreed on not having to process murder. It would be best to try to preserve the innocence of a child for as long as possible, until that child is in a position to rationally understand the world
I guess age doesn't really matter ... I know what happened, but cannot begin to figure out why ...
I mean there's no age that's right to hear that ... but yeah, definitely too young to know details ... but then, there are children at the school that will have read the details for themselves ... rumours will start, he's going to be exposed to some version of events in the end ...
You are right, it's definitely a tricky situation, and you don't necessarily want to create a false bubble reality for a child. If you were to explain it, I would explain it as that, this father was sick and did not mean to do what he did, rather than this is just a truth to the world we live in. Deep down inside I think everyone contains and is made in love, but unfortunately people are subjected to the emotions/problems of the mind.
that may be a good way to actually explain it
thanks for thinking clearly for me ...
06:34
Too many people default on that the world is evil, and that goodness is a rarity. But it should be the other way around, we should think that goodness and love is the default, but that ignorance/sickness/lack of love causes evil.
objectively, the world is brutal ... it's a brute fact that we have to accept ...
Ekn
Ekn
I think it comes down to having two sides of everything... like the good and bad, love and hate, madness and sanity... eventually you get to experience and process both sides of it all...
Tis indeed a brutal world, but not because of the nature of life. I don't think brutality is the default case. In truth, we really have everything we need to live peacefully and in harmony. I think when we believe brutality to be the default, then that mindset effects the way we live on a daily basis - causes us to be mistrusting and closed off. Next thing we know we have a society without fellow compassion. But if we chose to believe that good and love is the default case of life, then that..
mindest will foster that type of behavior, where then badness and hate becomes the outlier, and pe
Good point @Ekn, the ying and yang of life. The this or that, the yes or no, the breathe in the breathe out, the 0 || 1.
I'm a realist, the world we see, both in nature, and in society, has very little to do with the positive aspects of the human nature, or society ... it's a result of famine, death, conflict, and war ... that's the truth of it ... we are capable of rebelling against that, but it doesn't change the facts, and it doesn't make us adept rebels either .... if I'm angry at anything at all, it's precisely our failure to rebel ...
goodness is a thing we have to work at, improvement doesn't happen because "that's the default", it isn't at all, by default things get worse, and then we die ... if we want things to improve, if we want to leave a better place than we found, then it's not enough to say that positive things will happen because we live in a positive world ...
no, if you want positive things to happen, then you must work hard to make them happen ...
07:00
'famine, death, conflict, and war', all results of ignorance and ego, granted to us by free choice, influenced by accepting emotion and thought as identity - set by a minority group of elite, accepted as a way of life to the majority. we may just have to agree to disagree, but i like looking at the innocence of a child as evidence that we are born in goodness. *shrugs*, i don't have all the answers and many times find myself going into nihilism, but i really think that it takes effort to
enact evil, but if we separate from our thoughts and ego, we still a world that is peaceful by nature
objectively, the innocence of a child is an illusion ... it may surprise you to learn that some of the first social skills children develop are deception, and manipulation ... you do have to teach them right from wrong, I'm not saying they want to go around killing each other, but deception for social reasons they have no problem with - for example, telling lies in order to make friends (my dad is an astronaut etc), telling lies when they done something wrong and so on ...
some children are capable of lying before they are capable of understanding the social taboos they are breaking in doing so ... it's not as simple as we are born innocent, we are not, we are born to make a living as easy as possible, and that can involve what we consider negative behaviour ...
there's experimental evidence to justify this view also ... there is a famous experiment they do with children about stealing food to feed the family, it shows them without doubt to have no problem with deception when it benefits them, it's only social conditioning that makes the older children choose correctly, young children almost without fail, do not ...
Any Sphinx experts online??
Ekn
Ekn
I feel the nature of life doesn't differentiate between any sides until the moment any type of event occurs. It is the experience and the effects of it that creates...say, a result set... which is a huge bubble of probabilities. I cannot say the world we live gives one everything to believe and live in harmony. That would disappoint me so many times and can lead to the exact opposite. I cannot say it is pure evil either. There is no default perception...
07:18
evil is too strong a word ... all of the things we would call positive in society are a result of our rebelling against nature, or older more primitive forms of society ... we feed the hungry, we cure the sick, we donate to the poor and so on ... all of the negative things in society - inequality, racism, all kinds of ism's, are a result of our failure to rebel, or rebel effectively ...
I wouldn't say the world is evil, the world is indifferent, but if we want good things to happen we have to work hard at it, we have to make them happen ...
Ekn
Ekn
Indeed. The negatives are also results of the whole process of us again, as humans, the societies we ourselves shape. This differs all around the world by the fact that there are many factors influencing the resulting society, but overall and in the end, it takes quite the effort of us, in anywhere, to have the good, positive things.
I do feel it's getting harder and harder though, as the most disgusting, evil and mad gets to the top of many places, it creates a giant cloud that rains depression and oppression over the people living in the society.
08:12
O///😉
Ekn
Ekn
\o
user924016
08:40
mornings
Ekn
Ekn
09:11
:D
09:22
posted on June 05, 2016

New Cyanide and Happiness Comic

2
morgen
@Andrea I don't need a good one, I need a good enough one. Is it? Dunno. If it isn't, I need a better one.
Ekn
Ekn
stackoverflow.com/questions/37640304/… this somehow grinds my gears...
specially the answer
Ekn
Ekn
09:50
he now added a 2nd answer because someone suggested that's the right thing to do.
10:04
The sun is working so hard I am thinking about running inside because I cannot read my screen. #DeveloperProblems
1
Q: How many rollback should I write in a transaction?

stackHare is my script: $id = $_GET['id']; $value = $_GET['val']; // database connection here try{ $db_conn->beginTransaction(); $stm1 = $db_conn->prepare("UPDATE table1 SET col = 'updated' WHERE id = ?"); $stm1->execute(array($value)); $done = $stm->rowCount(); if ($done){...

Why do you have multiple truy/ctaches?
Because I need it
Also why is the start of the transaction i nit?
Why do you *think you need it?
Nothing in your code tells me you need it
The duplicate row is not an exception
And you should not have to rely on exceptions for that check imo
I need to first try-catch to rollback on its catch block. and I need to second one, because I want to detect duplicate row on insert
10:13
Query the thing to check whether it's a dupe row
@Ekn that is gear grinding indeed.
@PeeHaa yes it can be possible too
there, all is going to be well, the ninja's in the place
Anonymous
Can one program with surface3? I found a good deal for a used one, but am afraid.
@samayo Don't do it to yourself.
Use a decent computer with a nice large monitor and an external keyboard/mouse
Programming on a laptop is harder already, don't punish yourself with a tablet...
Anonymous
10:24
If I wait 3 months, I might buy a decent laptop .. but I can't wait any longer. My laptop has been fully dead for 2 years now
Anonymous
It crushes, lags severely, switches off and the fan noise is unbearable
Anonymous
I have to sit alone and far somewhere in the library ... like I'm watching porn all day :\
@samayo If it's either one or another, don't settle for the tablet.
If you can get both, go for it.
Anonymous
Nope, I can't afford one, let alone both. The surface is used and costs $530.
Anonymous
Yeah, surface pro3 is fine for programming reddit.com/r/learnprogramming/comments/2uvh4w/…
10:30
@samayo for that price you could buy correct pieces and build a desktop
Anonymous
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I'm homeless (kinda) so there is no option for desktop ..
Anonymous
I've had my laptop for many years, and before it started to die, I had a fine experience with it.
Anonymous
10:44
Anonymous
yum yum
I am running a couple of tests. Each test returns either \ProjectX\Preflight\Pass or \ProjectX\Preflight\Fail I am going to put these results in a collection. Is this collection called \Projectx\Preflight\Results or \ProjectXPreflight\resultCollection or something else?
@samayo Any computer with a keyboard is good for programming
But you'll suffer with the tiny monitor and annoying keyboard.
Anonymous
Yeah, but I until I buy another one.
@samayo I'm working mostly on a laptop, but the thing is the size + weight of a desktop basically :P
10:47
@samayo But you said you can't have both
Either the pro or the better computer in 3 months
If that's the choice, I'd go with better computer in 3 months.
If you can get your pro and still get the computer in 3 months, go for it.
Going with Results for now and if somebody complains in the future I will direct them to the above silence and say you all agreed
legit^^
with such an aggressively silenced consent, there should be no problem.
inorite :)
@PeeHaa Results sgtm.
\o/
Ugh damnit I need nullable return types one way or another :(
10:56
@PeeHaa How about an array?
It just wraps an array with an extra method to check whether a single results in the collection fails
So I can now just do CollectionWhatEverTheName::isPassed()
Just add a function for that, no need for a wrapper.
@PeeHaa Doesn't PHP have array_some or something like that?
@kelunik A function to what?
I want to prevent having to loop somewhere to find out whether some test failed
$passed = (bool) count(array_filter($results, function($r) { return $r instanceof Pass; }));
10:58
// in JS
[1,2,3,4].some(n => n > 2); // returns true
[1,2,3,4].some(n => n > 100); // returns false
@MadaraUchiha Yeah it does. I just provide a single conveniencemethod
@PeeHaa Why does it have to be a method? Why not a function?
@kelunik Yes and that is what I am preventing
Because now I can typehint against it
@PeeHaa It's not so convenient anymore if you need to implement a whole wrapper around an array, IMO.
^ that.
11:00
Can't you hint Result[]?
Or is that not yet supported in PHP
(or array(Result) or whatever)
@MadaraUchiha Not yet... :(
Not in PHP, just PhpDoc.
@MadaraUchiha some is js function?
@MadaraUchiha it would solve a couple of "problems", but it is what it is
11:02
@PeeHaa It is what you make.
Correct. And I work around it by being able to pass around typed stuff instead of typeless arrays
And you create new problems. Do you plan to add a ::getArray method to the collection class?
Yes probably something like that
What probem does it introduce that I am missing?
So it's leaky anyway. You'll work with the array again. Then you can as well just go with the array from the beginning. IMO at least.
The differenc being I can make sure / am enforcing it's indeed Result[]
Instead of again a typeless / faith driven array
It's indeed not so much about encapsulation, but more about type enforncement
And the convenience method
11:08
So you're constantly using getArray and wrap it again? In that case I'd rather build a real class that suites all the things instead of providing getArray I think.
I didn't get the first part? The wrap it again part
$elements = $results->getArray(); $elements = array_filter(...); $results = new Results($elements);
No more like: $results = New Results(); $results->add(new Pass('this test passed')); $results->add(new Pass('this test passed too')); $results->add(new Fail('this test failed because of something'));
But for a Collection, we need generics again. :-(
And somewhere else in my code if ($results->isPassed()) echo 'shit broke'; } else { foreach ($results) }
psuedo psueod code
Also I can't type
 
1 hour later…
12:15
Someone submitted a patch file via github....
heheheh
Evenin'
Oh shit. I just realized you actually was around when people did that :P
hola @Saitama
12:56
I still remember working on live servers via FTP
D&P
Lmao. "Go: What if we tried designing C a second time?" #programming #humor https://t.co/6fk2jZ6nZt
this is my favourite new summary of programming languages
Hi PHP. I was wondering if I can get some bashing (constructive criticism) on the database abstraction framework I've been working on: github.com/atk4/data. Thanks!
disclaimer: i've did my homework, wrote white-paper and achieved reference implementation as well as seriously considering following through the implementation by end of August, so your time shall not be wasted.
@romaninsh It's... an empty branch?
it has some PR's but it's work in progress.
Well the most constructive critism I can give on an empty project is that it is empty :P
I know that myself ;) I'm expecting feedback on the concept.
Apologies, i didn't express it correctly.
14:10
Well from the readme "Enterprise Quality". I hate buzzwords in read me
Do you also have "military grade" somewhere in there?
Other then that. It's yet an orm so it's probably not for me
it's not orm.
Anonymous
> Simple, Efficient, Database Agnostic, Enterprise Quality, Works Anywhere, Agile Toolkit, Aggregate Models, Extensible, Full Featured ...
It looks like an ORM to me. What's the difference?
Anonymous
So many buzzwords ...
Anonymous
> Q: When can I use Agile Data in my project?
A: Summer 2016.
14:16
It's not just a database abstraction is it? @romaninsh as the headline tells me?
some people who reviewed said it's not ORM.
there are plenty ORM's why would i create another one.
i'm trying to do something useful here.
@samayo, do you suggest me remove the above words?
Anonymous
I suggest you take it easy.
i'ts just so damn hard to innovate in PHP :)
let's stick with "constructive" not keyword analysis.
Anonymous
Even Jesus never bragged about G-d, the same way you are trying to sell your app.
I'll go over the readme to make sure it sounds more "neutral" ..
i suck with texts...
14:20
@romaninsh emm ... the "project" has only one file with code
@samayo ?
@tereško, i need to be sure i'm on the right way before i invest considerable amount of effort.
lol
you have a class called "model"
i know ;)
0
Q: How to create a like/unlike system?

stackI'm trying to create a Like/Unlike system. Currently I do that like this: try { -- like $stm1 = $db_conn->prepare("INSERT into votes (post_id, user_id) VALUES (?, ?)"); $stm1->execute(array($post_id, $_SESSION['id'])); } catch(PDOException $e)...

14:28
when I try to composer.phar --self-update for twenty minutes.
@stack I already told you to not use exceptions for this...
oh well, thanks for the feedback, was quite naive of me to expect constructively, but i've made few points on which i can improve.
@PeeHaa You did .. but still I don't know the reason
@stack Because it's not an exceptional case. It's normal operation
@romaninsh It's really hard to judge a project without code. Also as @tereško pointed out: whenever we see something called "Model" it seems like somebody made a wrong choice somewhere. Either when naming things or when icking a sane architecture
@PeeHaa emm, in fact you are right .. but it works as well. Still you believe I shouldn't do that by try/catch?
14:31
I'm pretty sure I have made the above clear. Now you are just waiting for somebody to tell you you are doing it right.
fine :)
@PeeHaa, I'll write some more code and will ask you to look again when I have more to show, if that's ok.
@romaninsh No problem. :) Just keep in mind your audience and what might work for them might not work for people in this room.
tough crowd, heh? I understand.
PHP community is really tough to float new ideas and get any type of support or advice.
i think a more encouraging environment in general would help more new good ideas appear and develop.
Not so much tough. I think the word I would use is something akin to experienced. As in experience in the trenches :)
@romaninsh If you think an idea is cool and has use there is at least 1 person :)
14:36
that's why we have as many frameworks as there are developers.
When there is at least one person there are probably others :P
yeah, but how to find out.
@romaninsh Yeah, but the problem with framework is that most of them are not really that good once you start looking at them sadly
@romaninsh Not sure. Most projects of mine (the "finished" ones anyway) gained traction automatically because people needed it
i released framework 5 years ago. got 10k downloads. but still was super tough...
now trying something new.
so when you build something new, how you go ahead getting more people to discover it?
Also most of my projects started out because either what I wanted / needed wasn't available yet or the current solutions sucked at the time
14:39
i started Agile Data because ORM sucks. :D
but not many are 'open' for new concepts.
@PeeHaa, can you point me towards some of the projects you have menitoned?
@romaninsh Most things start out with a tiny group of people interested and once the project is actually useful it will just attract people just by users telling others
Anyone can think of a case where -(float)$int === (float)-$int does not hold?
i suppose you're right. but waht i'm trying to build is not really a "small" project.
@Andrea I'm pleased Python is not considered important enough to have an appearance at all there.
14:41
@romaninsh this is one or perhaps this
@bwoebi It does, you just fail at Twitter :D
You gotta click on the image, it's the first item
I'm also pretty sure the project I am now working on (if it will ever be finished) will be useful for people
pretty to-the-point.
please do share.
Let me check chat transcript
@NikiC only in case you put s/float/int/ … but this should never fail
14:43
Hi room, can someone remind me what is the status of simple getters/setters optimization in PHP 7/master? There was some PR about that which was postponed, but I can't find a link to it.
@bwoebi I'm wondering if anything terrible can go wrong if the int is outside 52 bit precision
I don't think it can because the cast truncates, but still
@NikiC I doubt it as we're always rounding towards zero
Oct 5 '15 at 22:17, by PeeHaa
Aug 20 at 9:15, by PeeHaa
@Jay Every time somebody asks me that the plans for the project have grown bigger :P In short; a self hosted git platform / project communication / code quality thing (which will eventually also run on rpi's)
My biggest issue with OSS projects is time and other OSS projects :(
!!google commitstrip side project
Search for "commitstrip side project" (https://www.google.com/search?q=commitstrip+side+project&lr=lang_en)
• West Side-project story | CommitStrip - The blog relating the daily life of web agency developers. (http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2014/11/25/west-side-project-story/)
• CommitStrip | The blog relating the daily life of… - A single platform · Very very old projects · If this strip was a side project · The Internet of Th… (http://www.commitstrip.com/)
• What happens when I try to start a side-project :… - What happens when I try to start a side-project (imgur.com). submitted 1 …. Dea
@Oldskool are you there?
Someone know where I can find @Oldskool ?
14:47
@PeeHaa, thank you for your insight.. This actually helped me a lot.
Someone can answer this question ? I need help stackoverflow.com/questions/37625943/…
@JasonMonts I doubt anyone will read through so much code
But I need help
Ekn
Ekn
!!is the cake a lie?
14:55
I think so.
i've passed 7 day try to solve it
and tomorrow I have to send the project
@JasonMonts Badwater Basin
please try to help me
@JasonMonts Well then, you better start reading that link I sent you, and edit your question
Boy I'm glad I dodged that one
14:56
Well if I put less code
noone understand
you have to see all code to understand the association
@JasonMonts If that is the case you haven;t debugged your code
@DejanMarjanovic For you?
00:00 - 15:0015:00 - 00:00

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