« first day (2654 days earlier)      last day (2310 days later) » 
00:00 - 16:0016:00 - 00:00

4:00 PM
Holy fuck
So canadian :DS
 
@Tiffany holy shit that's quite funny
 
Kendall lives right around the corner from where that show is loosely based out of
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier :P
 
@rlemon :D
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier you'd prolly like the ted talks he gave as well, then
 
4:02 PM
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I know tone doesn't translate well online, and when I'm asking questions in an attempt to understand the other point of view, it can often come across as me arrogantly asserting my own view. This is not at all intended.

So, are you asserting that https://stackoverflow.com/questions/48282621/extension-from-http-www-sqlforexcel-com-not-working-with-phpmyadmin does not comply with https://codeblog.jonskeet.uk/2010/08/29/writing-the-perfect-question/ ?

I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I am saying that I don't see how, and would appreciate any assistance in understand
I strongly suspect that you are correct, and I'm just missing something obvious.
I would love to be able to just say, "Yes, question my assumptions. Got it" and be able to ask perfect questions from now on. But I think it's going to take more than that to teach me what I'm doing wrong.
 
Well, first, remove all that fluff about googling, mystery and wanting to learn of people's keywords. This is "noise", as opposed to "signal", and will generally be removed.
After doing so, you'll notice your question is quite smallish.
 
Got it, Will do.
I see. How would you make it larger?
 
I like small questions, easier to read
 
Ah, or should I have left it small?
 
Next, never ever use screenshots.
 
4:08 PM
(Sorry, I thought its smallness was a criticism)
 
@JonathonPhilipChambers In XAMPP you are using MySQL - not MS SQL which can be seen in pop up window where error appears.
 
I mean, stuff like "top right is database information" is useless. You don't want answers from people who won't figure that out.
Following the screenshot comment: always copy paste the exact error message.
 
@Tpojka yes, I already know the answer to the question. Right now I'm asking about formatting.
 
if someone is tempted to answer, you can be really sure they will walk right away if they have to painstakingly read and retype the error message from an image
then, read, ten times, dream about, recite in your sleep, everything you can know about xy problem
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier this is genuinely good advice you are giving me right now. I apologise if I have ruined the chat experience for everyone else, but for me, it has been worth enduring this far to learn this.
 
4:11 PM
!!xy
 
1219
Q: What is the XY problem?

GnomeWhat is the XY problem? When asking questions, how do I recognize when I'm falling into it? How do I avoid it? Return to FAQ index

 
@PeeHaa haha did you delete the gist?
 
when you're sure you are not being in an xy situation, explain (in the most brief way you can) the problem you are trying to solve by using that extension.
just these, keeping fluff out of the question, pasting exact error codes, explaining why you are doing that, will improve massively your chances of not being doenvoted right away
 
@rlemon Yeah. He asked for it
 
4:13 PM
ohh well. my fork lives on
 
You want it?
ah k
:)
Was nothing much in there besides some crappy python
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier will be reading the link Jeeves posted for a bit, but please feel free to keep saying stuff to me while I'm gone. I will respond when I get back.
 
If I think of anything else I will
thanks for keeping there with the criticism
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier if you told me to do things I felt I was already doing, I would tell you so. But you definitely told me to do things that I have not been doing, and I'm not afraid to tell you that either.
@FélixGagnon-Grenier Are there exceptions to the screenshot rule? Or workarounds not yet mentioned?
 
@rlemon sings "my fork rages on" in a spartacus's accent
 
4:18 PM
(Going to re-read that XY post. I don't think it entirely sank in the first time.)
 
@JonathonPhilipChambers I believe this question is the single exception to the no screenshot rule of thumb.
I don't remember seeing any other image that was so useful to the question, while teaching stuff to the reader as well.
 
Had to click the link within the link, but I understand the XY thing now. It's the difference between "How do I make spray paint go where I want it to go and not go where I don't want it to go?" and "How do I make my car red?"
 
yeah well, feel free to come back to it now and again. I am slow, I keep getting eurekas about stuff I've read about months ago.
 
I think I've got all that. Thanks again @FélixGagnon-Grenier Definitely the most actionable advice I've had in a long time. Any more parting words of wisdom before I get back to it?
 
Remember to have fun.
 
4:26 PM
(That last question was open to the room)
Thanks @FélixGagnon-Grenier I generally apply that advice to my life where I can, or were you suggesting more fun in my PHP?
 
That was programming related, but I guess that can be broadly applied as well.
 
Ah, I just noticed your revisions. Good work.
Is there a way to upvote a revision?
 
votes are related to a question. when it is edited, people vote on its content as they see it.
 
I just wanted to acknowledge your good work publicly in some way
(Did you notice I just picked myself out of the XY trap I fell into?)
 
Wes
4:33 PM
fun and php... there's no such thing :P
 
@Wes I was trying to think of a cheeky edge case exception just to take the piss, but I think you have stated a hard and fast rule.
 
Wes
:B
 
come back here around friday next week, you'll see
 
Wes
i joke. programming sucks regardless of the programming language :B
 
4:36 PM
@Wes yes, but other languages can at least make fun video games.
 
Wes
lol
 
@Tiffany OMG I would totally lose my cool with a flatmate like that
like... I am totally not wired to handle that kind of humor
I'd as much want to punch his hairless head and high five him
high five him in the face. with a chair.
 
hahaha
this one is the funniest youtube.com/watch?v=N682eopajzA
or on ted without the flashy stuff youtube.com/watch?v=_QdPW8JrYzQ
@SaitamaSama @MadaraUchiha youtube.com/watch?v=6H1WrfDhwNc .
 
4:52 PM
heh :) I'll watch these sporadically, ta!
that being said, I have an emergency.
When cooking coriander seeds dry in a pan, should they explode in the pan, or just heat?
I just noticed just heat and just eat are the same.
 
Wes
put a lid on :B
 
Wes
if they explode, like pop corn :B
 
oh :)
should they? I mean, should I heat them until they do, if they do at all, or stop before?
 
Wes
i have no idea
we toast chick peas, they don't explode
 
4:56 PM
:)
 
Wes
roast* toast*
 
@Wes do you only draw digitally?
 
Wes
i can draw on paper too. i'm good at drawing, less or none with paint
 
:P
 
Wes
i should do some videos
 
5:02 PM
I haven't really learned how to draw digitally, I'd like to learn sometime. I just know that graphics tablets are awkward to draw on
but couldn't adapt to drawing on a tablet
though, newer tablets aren't as bad
(tablet as in iPad)
 
I can draw some anime characters on paper
the one I have scanned atm is that ^ , is bit old tho
 
yeah, I used to draw a lot. now I mainly doodle on postit notes at work. I need to back into painting though
 
5:18 PM
if you're serious about wanting to improve your drawing, Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain is pretty good
I have a copy of it somewhere in my boxes, I need to get it out
 
@Tiffany the reviews seem nice
 
@Wes Do you have a static analysis tool that checks for the symbol naming conflicts that would exist if we unified constants, functions, and class-likes as well as class-like properties, constants, and methods?
 
hmm... I'll tell my 兄貴 to buy it for me :B
 
If you really want this to succeed a tool which can detect those is essential.
 
@SaitamaSama I guess the newer edition isn't as good as older editions? my copy was from around '05, so I dunno
 
5:22 PM
tbh, from the picture in the review I liked the 2012 edition one more
 
If you are interested in making one we can talk about it in detail later.
 
hey, folks! does anyone know how to make PayPal payments in php?
 
idk, but the font style of old book never really worked with me
I like smaller font-size, not #000 color, and the general aesthetic of spacing
 
@Multis there are developer tools through paypal, but from what I've learned from people in the chat is that they suck
there's an alternative but I can't remember offhand
stripe.com perhaps
 
Question time! Let's say I'm writing a console application in PHP (for use in PHP), based on composer dependencies. How would I make it extensible? Seems to me that everyone out there doing this already forces end users to write config files pointing to dependencies(extensions). eg; behat extensions/contexts, phpunit formatters/listeners etc.
The objective would be to simply have "my/app" and "some/extension" in composer.json and my/app somehow picks it up automatically.
Due to the nature of autoloading, I don't think it's possible.
 
5:27 PM
@Tiffany thanks. I need PayPal, not stripe. I looked through out their website and found too many ways to do same job, so I'm confused when they are talking about certain way and finally cannot find one complex solution
 
@Multis as far as I know, Stripe can handle paypal payments I'm wrong
 
@Tiffany lets say it's a matter of honor. I want to do it with PayPal anyway :)
 
@Tiffany ok. thanks :)
 
Wes
5:49 PM
@LeviMorrison i might do it relatively easy
suggest me a project that has a high potential of such conflicts?
i have a plan. shouldn't be too hard
 
Wes
6:03 PM
i'm on it @LeviMorrison not sure yet how hard it is, it should be easy
 
6:17 PM
@LeviMorrison everything but merger or partial merger of the symbol tables is messy and inconsistent, alas
 
Wes
@NikiC namespace Bar; const FOO = 123; Const_ doesn't receive namespacedName
is this by design?
oh nvm, i should look into stuff better before complaining about them :B
 
6:34 PM
@Andrea I don't understand; can you say that again?
 
@LeviMorrison er… I think that any new syntax we add for referencing functions or whatever just makes things messier
 
Oh, I see. I agree that unifying the symbol tables is the preferred approach, except for BC concerns.
I disagree that adding array_filter($data, callable even) is messier than our existing array_filter($data, "even"), though.
 
Wes
nearly done levi
 
@Wes Comparing case sensitive or insensitive?
 
Wes
right now i'm just collecting the data
 
6:44 PM
I recommend having an option to toggle it. The purpose of this tool is to explore possibilities, so having either possibility is useful.
 
Wes
after i did that, i need to resolve extends etc
 
So you aren't actually "nearly done" then :D
 
Wes
well, i did the hard part
should i keep track of symbols with the same fqn
like two classes in two different files, both being Foo\Bar\Baz
 
@Wes I don't know. That's why we are writing the tool :D
@Wes We probably do need to evaluate all possibilities there.
 
Wes
6:48 PM
ok that's going to complicate stuff a lot lol
 
It's hopefully uncommon, or if they exist they share the same signature or something.
Can probably just report it as an error with a TODO about it.
 
Wes
too late :D
not a big complication, it's just keys that will be "$class:$file:$line"
 
Wes
7:03 PM
@LeviMorrison i think i'm gonna skip traits' uses lol
i have no idea how to do that
analyzing how methods are aliases is going to be nuts
it's not impossible, but hard
 
@Wes Emit a warning if {} gets used noting the incomplete behavior
@NikiC Why are zvals never passed by const pointer? We pass other thing by const in various situations.
This convention makes no sense to me - if you want to ensure you haven't altered the value it's definitely useful. Why should a zval pointer be different from other types of pointer?
 
Wes
imagine if multiple traits with the same fqn lol
i changed my mind, i'm just going to error if i find two symbols of the same type and name on multiple locations.
if we want to support traits analysis better not doing that
would that be ok for you?
like interface Foo{} in two different files, is going to throw
 
Unexpected fatal error invoking static method as callables – #75853
 
@Wes Don't throw; just emit some warning and say that the duplicate has been ignored until the tool is improved.
And say where the duplicate is and where the original is.
 
Wes
ok
 
7:16 PM
The mistake occurs when php7 executes as by command line as by webserver. – #75854
 
Wes
7:29 PM
> which is a perfectly valid form of callable
i doubt that
what a mess lol
 
@LeviMorrison I guess nowadays it may be possible
Historically it did not make a lot of sense because many ostensibly non-mutating operations were non-const
As things like the refcount were part of the zval
 
DateTime::diff class does not take into account microseconds in some cases – #75855
 
@NikiC Yes, that would make sense.
Of course, due to C's const rules just because the zval is const doesn't mean you can't change it. Inner pointers can be messed with still.
 
7:56 PM
Browser cache busting. Whats the best method?
 
@Wes Do you have any form of PHP karma?
Website, rfc, etc?
 
Wes
only wiki karma
 
What's your username for that?
 
Wes
wesnetmo
 
Wes
8:12 PM
why? :B
had to debug something. works now. need to do the extends part...
 
Wes
sammy
@LeviMorrison what i did so far is here tho github.com/Netmosfera/SymbolaCheck
not sure if i need to flatten the symbols in the hierarchy first, or if i should do the checks in one go
 
8:31 PM
ok, guys, any game recommendations?
 
witcher 3? wolfenstein? I haven't played any steam games in a while
I need to play through witcher 3........
 
havent finished witcher 1
have already finished wolfenstein (and based on reviews - am unlikely to play the 2nd unless it's deeply dis counted)
 
Wes
ah damn i forgot i need a flag for private stuff
 
@Tiffany what I am looking for is something shallow, with looting mechanic
 
@tereško something like torchlight?
 
8:37 PM
ideally - a brain dead version of Deus Ex
 
ahhh, can't help there
sorry
 
havent played Deus Ex or just have no suggestions?
 
@tereško warframe?
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier in warframe I managed to hit the soft paywall
 
haven't played enough fot that :)
 
8:41 PM
I have played 50h+
 
IPv6 ::/128 is not recognized by INET_PTON() and INET_NTOP() – #75856
 
Why is it that Symfony\HTTPFoundation\Request::getMethod() in bootstrap.php return POST/GET depending on the type of request, but in the controllers, it returns GET regardless of the type of the request?
 
8:58 PM
it isn't
 
It's doing in my case, I am using the exact same method on both of the pages, and one returns get/post and the other returns GET
 
also, take an advice here: don't have the "if" on request method, when you are already inside a controller's method
@CoderDudeTwodee it is impossible
 
Well, it's happening to me.
 
well, it is not the same Request instance or you have actually altered it
 
@tereško Ah, like making sure it going straight to the specific function using the router based on the request type?
 
9:01 PM
yes
 
@tereško It's not the same Request instance. I am creating a new instance of Request in the controller. Probably that's where I am screwing up real hard.
 
you should not be creating a new instance there
you should be passing it as a dependency from the bootstrap
 
Like a param to my controller's function?
 
yes
 
Ah, got it. Thanks.
 
Wes
9:08 PM
nearly done \o/
 
` ['GET', '/home', ['Vitopia\Controller\Home', 'main']]` returns 404 Not found (The apache version) although it works fine with ['GET', '/'...] in FastRoute.
 
At least PHP 7.1 got a bit saner. 3v4l.org/2dUh7Z
 
Wes
i hate the standing desk :B
 
And if a route doesn't exist, it uses the 404 of the webserver not my custom 404 that I specified in the dispatcher. The custom 404 works only if I am trying to access '/' and it doesn't have a route.
What am I doing wrong?
 
@Wes it's made by people who only use macbooks for people who only use macbooks
 
Wes
9:21 PM
i don't use macbooks :B
 
@kelunik \o/
 
well, there is your problem - you need to buy a macbooks, obviously, @Wes
 
Wes
:B
 
Can anyone tell me what am I doing wrong with my router?
 
@Wes the evolution of your opinion on the standing desk :D
 
Wes
9:25 PM
my back's much better. feet hurt :(
@LeviMorrison how do i reflection a class constant to see if it's private?
seems it's not possible yet
 
Wes
<3
 
hey
 
Wes
i bet i'd find it if i tried harder :B
 
:P
This way it's much easier though :D
 
9:36 PM
Doesn't the apache 404 turn up only if my routing isn't working properly?
 
Wes
10:12 PM
> Multiple declarations found (method, property) for member foo in Example\Vendor\MyClass
 
Wes
 
`INSERT INTO table1 (field1, field2) VALUES (1, 2);`

There is also field3 that should be calculated value of inserted fields. I can calculate it with PHP and send with other values but I wonder should there be used after insert trigger or even is there some quicker way on insert action.
Maybe even not to save field3 (not to have it in table) and just calculate it when needed (on select etc)?
 
10:56 PM
wat
 
Should I store field3 at all if it is basically calculation of field1 and field2?
 
will that field be used for search?
 
Good question. Probably not.
 
then you don't need to store it separately
 
Wes
@LeviMorrison the best thing is that properties are almost always private, so it's easy to refactor them to a different name
 
11:00 PM
Like field1 is unit and field2 is price. Or field1 is quantity and field2 is price and field3 is like total. But it is child table where I have to store more values calculated with that total. In that point that total is not so important for itself.
Also, there could and should be more those rows for one parent row.
I first thought to store just components for having that needed result. And "components" are something that is inserted by user.
 
Wes
class WP_HTTP_Fsockopen extends WP_HTTP_Streams {
class WP_Http_Streams {
fucking wordpress they can't even get their own casing right
 
@tereško Anyway thanks.
This is what I was looking for. I mean to learn.
Specifically this answer. Just wondered could something like that be done without after insert trigger.
 
Wes
11:36 PM
i'm installing laravel... it's installing everything
i mean literally everything
 
Wes
11:55 PM
is a laravellian around?
why are so many symbols undefined, like use Symfony\Component\DependencyInjection\Reference;
what i did is composer create-project
 
00:00 - 16:0016:00 - 00:00

« first day (2654 days earlier)      last day (2310 days later) »