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Ell
Ell
19:05
wxwidgets doesn't like me on linux
wxwidgets doesn't like me on windows
@Ell "should be enough" is the attitude of a C programmer.
@Ell I don't like you on Windows either. Strangely, though, when I boot into Linux, I feel this attraction. Must be some Unix Voodoo.
Xeo
Xeo
@DeadMG You never boot into Linux, do you?
well
there admittedly is that
Ell
Ell
oops that linux was meant to be edited to windows
silly chat changing edits into messages
@FredOverflow I am being a c/c++ programmer at the moment. Yes, you read correctly, I said "c/c++".
19:12
@Ell Y U mix languages?
why the fuck does wxwidgets put header files in the directory with all it's libraries?
Because fuck you.
@FredOverflow I program in C and "should be enough" stuff like this isn't something I do
Why do you call C "C/C++" instead of just C?
user1182183
becaquse we do C code in M$ Visual C++
19:15
what's with the M$?
Look look, a MS hater. Everyone mock him!
you drooled too much all over your keyboard so the S key doesn't work anymore?
@GamErix [Warning - IDIOT DETECTOR] String matched - "M$"
6
@DeadMG those are micro dollars
Go back to your £inux.
19:15
@DeadCicada I would, but I just bulldozed my Vista partition, so no MS love for me ATM :)
@netcoder Or megadollars?
or million dollars
user1182183
@DeadMG ye the S key is stuck..
@netcoder Isn't mega practically the same as million?
user1182183
M stands for Mega bytheway
W, A, S, and D would be the keys that I'd wear out first.
user1182183
19:17
MB, mB would be microBytes
Ell
Ell
@FredOverflow it's the arduino language, have you seen it before? it's like C with some c++
@FredOverflow Oh well. Vista sucks anyway so you're excused for today.
user1182183
@Mysticial I still have arrows
@GamErix Millibytes actually.
@FredOverflow like Megalionaire?
user1182183
19:17
@DeadCicada forgot, true!
@Mysticial Aha, so he walked backward a lot!
@FredOverflow Only to those benighted individuals who believe "mega" means one million instead of 1048576.
user1182183
stupid me
Mi¢ro$oƒ₮?
user1182183
too much consumtion..
user1182183
19:18
@jornak cent, dollar, pounds, nothing more?
@JerryCoffin What.
@GamErix Cent, Dollar, Netherlands Antilles Guilder, Mongolian Tughrik
maybe it would just be easier to attach the wxwidgets source right into my own project
user1182183
ok so while I have you guyz attention as my strategy to start a conversation rolled over here worked:
Who does know how I put a video in powerpoint playing continously, even when changing slides?
Oh that's easy. File > Insert > Logarithm.
19:20
@GamErix: wtf
@DeadCicada "mega" really means "2 raised to the power 20". The people who insist on "a million" are simply sloppy, and rounding 2**20 to the nearest power of 10.
@JerryCoffin That's a binary mega (Mi)
@FredOverflow You kinda have to quite often. Especially when someone is charging you, you need to face forward and keep firing.
@GamErix Not without plugins.
@DeadCicada No, that's just mega. The base 10 imitation is merely a pretender to the throne. The fact that the computer illiterate of the world outnumber us should never be taken as support for the notion that they're right.
user1182183
19:23
@jornak ah, those plugins I saw cost more than 150 bucks :/ not really a good price for a one-time presentation :$
@DeadCicada You mean a Mebi-
user406009
Arg, VBA sucks.
user406009
I thought it was impossible for something to be as bad as PHP.
user406009
But I guess I was wrong.
@EthanSteinberg VBA is better than PHP as a language IMO.
19:24
@JerryCoffin Have you lost all your digits, or why are you so keen on binary powers? :)
user1182183
@EthanSteinberg tried thhe 'l33t' prgoramming language? XD
@FredOverflow No, all digits reasonably intact. Just think base 10 is a fairly useless notion as a rule.
@EthanSteinberg What kind of trouble are you having? I know my VBA fairly well due to having a client that insists on using Access
user1182183
@JerryCoffin I created my base-255 algorythm lol
user1182183
very simple method lol
Xeo
Xeo
19:26
Yay, another downvote without explanation...
user1182183
@Xeo sure I hate them too
Xeo
Xeo
I don't even hate them for the -2rep (fuck 2 rep), but they're screwing with the score of a perfectly fine answer.
Mega- (symbol M) is a prefix in the metric system denoting a factor of million (106 or ). Confirmed in 1960, it comes from the Greek μέγας, meaning great. Other common examples of usage * megapixel - 1 million pixels in a digital camera * one megatonne (of TNT) (a unit often used in measuring the explosive power of nuclear weapons) is the approximate energy released on igniting one million tonnes of TNT. * megahertz — frequency of electromagnetic radiation for radio and television broadcasting, GSM, etc. 1 MHz = 1,000,000 Hz. Exponentiation When units occur in exponentiation, such a...
Xeo
Xeo
I mean, anything wrong with this? Tell me and I'd gladly fix it. -.-
user406009
@iornak Using a dict in the language is very annoying.
user406009
19:28
The type system also seems sort of strange.
@Xeo I wouldn't mind a down-vote at the moment (it would get my score back to a multiple of 5). Somehow, as soon as I hit a multiple of 5, some moron does another utterly unjustified downvote to ruin it though.
@EthanSteinberg Elaborate.
hey is 4^logn a higher or lower big-oh notation compared to 5N ?
@Xeo You mysteriously hit 42k. :P
@DeadCicada Yes, the illiterati have devised a broken scheme. What of it?
Xeo
Xeo
19:30
Woah, wait a sec. Serial upvote. :(
@user1411893 They are both O(n), aren't they? ^ and log cancel each other out.
I thought 4^logn is O(logn)
@JerryCoffin Mega really does mean 1 million. Hence why CS invented "mebi"
@Xeo Why the sad face?
19:31
@jornak Serial votes get automatically reverted.
Oh wait, or is 4^log(n) actually constant? Where do you get these weird complexity classes from? ?
@DeadCicada No, "mega" really means 2**20, but illiterates don't understand that, hence attempting to relegate it to secondary status.
@Xeo oright
Xeo
Xeo
@jornak Cause it's going to be reversed tomorrow and screw with my rep tomorrow
19:31
@JerryCoffin No :( Mega is thousands years old
yea Fred its from homework ..got everything but not sure what 4^log(n)'s big-oh notation be
Xeo
Xeo
The robot had the same problem, he now has a big red -58rep bar in his rep log. :s
xeo: whats the not pr0n bookmark for :o
Xeo
Xeo
@user1411893 notpr0n
@DeadCicada So? If you were speaking golden-age Latin, it might make sense to use an obviously obsolete definition of "mega". In the present day, mega means 2**20, and "mebi' means "I'm an anal retentive twit."
19:33
@user1411893 Have you looked at the graph? Oh crap, the ^ doesn't work, you have to fill that in yourself.
clever. I hope no one elses uses that computer!
@JerryCoffin lol. In all fields but CS, mega means one motherfucking million. get over it.
4
So that's why we normalized mega to ALSO mean 1 million in CS and use the FUCKING MEBI prefix instead.
@DeadCicada Even in CS, mega means 1,000,000.
19:35
Yes, I was typing.
@FredOverflow Of course it's not constant- it was an n in it.
I think I meant linear, because e^log n is the same as n, right?
No. ln
Not log.
Anyway, what algorithm has 4^logn complexity? :)
Uh, yeah e^log(n) = n
19:37
e^ln(n) = n
Fred: got it...so the 4^logN is increasing at a higher rate...but isn't it still considered O(logx) complexity?
only if by log you mean natural logarithm
log is ln_10
log base 2
Why me...
@chris, 1) void return is perfectly ok. 2) The OS ALWAYS gets a value from the program. In this case, that value will be zero. — ikegami 5 mins ago
19:38
@user1411893 What graphic are you looking at? 5n is way more expensive on my computer...
@FredOverflow Obviously, for(int i = 0; i < 4^log(n); i++) { DoSomethingWithConstantOverhead(); }
4 mins ago, by FredOverflow
@user1411893 Have you looked at the graph? Oh crap, the ^ doesn't work, you have to fill that in yourself.
@user1411893 No.
Xeo
Xeo
@chris That question.... ugh.
ah nvm..got it
yup see it now thanks
Of course that doesn't prove anything, the functions could still cross for veeeeery large values of x.
@FredOverflow Very interesting
@NikiC You mean the fact that Google can plot functions? :)
@FredOverflow No, the fact that a^lnb is so slow
19:48
@DeadCicada Sorry, had to feed a baby for a bit there. But it's apropos, because feeding a baby is probably the only "field" left that isn't now really just a branch of CS. A hundred years from now, "mebi" will be long forgotten, and the notion of "mega" referring to a power of 10 (at least) as obsolete as buggy whips.
That's probably one of the worst arguments I've seen in this chat.
Dude it's OK to be wrong from time to time D:
@NikiC Hm? It's faster than O(n). The lower, the better! The graph shows cost, not speed.
@JerryCoffin Do you need someone to debug those whips for you?
@FredOverflow Yes, sure, I got that. Was just surprised that a^lnb is rising so slowly ;)
@NikiC Have you looked at 10^log x? ;) Of course 4^log x is going to rise slower.
This ^ problem is going to drive me nuts someday!
Xeo
Xeo
19:55
@FredOverflow What problem?
@FredOverflow oh, stupid me
@JerryCoffin Maybe you can get a baby-feeding robot.
I was already wondering how the f that is even possible given that 4 is greater than e
@Xeo If you paste a link that contains something like "4^x", for some reason the ^ is swallowed. You have to write "4%5ex" instead.
Xeo
Xeo
ew
19:56
But yeah, I forgot that there are people who have a base 10 logarithm, not a natural one...
I resent that, 10 is very natural, humans have 10 fingers! ;)
How do I differentiate between "resent" and, erm... "sent again"? :)
2, e, and 10 are perfectly normal logarithm bases
@FredOverflow re-sent, I would say.
I will propose resent becoming a C++ keyword with at least two meanings.
I resent your proposal.
How? I hadn't sent it in the first place!
20:00
pff, blasphemy. There is only One True Logarithm :P
@LucDanton I'm resending this resentment of resenting the resending of my resenting.
If you want to go even further.
@DeadMG I don't mind the feeding. What I want is a diaper changing robot.
I'm resending this recent resentment of resenting the resending of my recent resenting.
Xeo
Xeo
6
Q: m3ph1st0s's programming puzzle 1 (C++)

Bogdan AlexandruHello C++ programmers! This is the first of a series of C++ puzzles for you. Hope you will enjoy. So, puzzle no.1: Given the following program: #include <iostream> main() { const int a=1; const int b=2; const float c=0.5; std::cout << a/b-a*c; } Insert some code on ...

wat.
#define int float is actually undefined behavior. You are not allowed to give keywords new meaning. — FredOverflow 24 secs ago
Xeo
Xeo
20:03
Not only that, the OPs attitude in general..
"I compiled with DevC++, so return type doesn't matter to me"
Hi, like I said I used DevC++ so I didn't mind about main's return type :) — Bogdan Alexandru 23 mins ago
22
A: Print the alphabet without using each vowel

gnibblerGolfscript - 8 chars 123,97>+

WTF is golfscript?
Xeo
Xeo
A language for golfing. :/
@FredOverflow A stack-based programming language designed specifically for code golf.
lol rly?
@FredOverflow really.
20:09
@LucDanton I'm rescinding the resenting of the resending my recent resentment of resenting the resending of my recent resenting.
Hopefully this is a last resort.
@LucDanton Reportedly.
By which I don't mean that sorting was done again.
@LucDanton So you won't resort to resorting your rose art at the resort?
I think I see why non-English speakers hate learning our language.
@jornak I doubt it's the worst around. From what I've read, during the second world war, the Japanese didn't spend a lot of time worrying about their encryption protocols, simply because they thought foreigners were incapable of learning Japanese well enough to read their messages even if they did break the encryption.
That said, history does seem to indicate they were wrong (in fact, it's likely that in some cases, the spies probably decrypted and translated their messages even before the intended recipients read them).
20:36
0
A: m3ph1st0s's programming puzzle 1 (C++)

seheSo, #define a 0, Done. I saw that was posted - unsurprisingly. Surprisingly, this wasn't posted: #include <iostream> main() { const int a=1; const int b=2; const float c=0.5; std::cout<<0 || std::cout << a/b-a*c; } That should do, right?

^ if only the challenge was actually... a challenge
I solved the .NET/proxy problem (sort of)
@IDWMaster Ah. You mean the Windows 8 problem :)
Xeo
Xeo
@sehe You should add the character count of the new line.
I found out that if I logged in through the corporate proxy, did web browsing for 30 minutes, then changed my proxy settings to "no proxy" it would let me on without using the proxy.
@Xeo How so? Can't people count?
Xeo
Xeo
20:37
@sehe It's a custom on PCG
@Xeo Oh, it's golf. Meh. Added :)
@IDWMaster Things are getting better all the time
@sehe Yeah. I think my corporate network's setup really sucks
Kind if defeats the point of using a proxy
if you can bypass it that easily.
@ZyX It was an old quote :) - more of a humour thing. Googling on 'impossible' questions gives me strange joy. By the way, I'm beginning to see how you get to be the vim guru: you meddle with the implementation too :) — sehe 10 secs ago
And of course; my supervisor has no control over it (managed remotely from India or something)
Xeo
Xeo
I found out that I can bypass the filter at my job-finding-thingy by adding an s in the url - http to https :)
20:42
@Xeo It's because packet inspection cannot (practically) 'see inside' the SSL stream.
@Xeo Doesn't work if your company makes you install a certificate in the "Trusted root certificate authorities"
My company does that so they can snoop in on your SSL traffic
If you bring your own computer to work
@IDWMaster Brillant
otherwise they just provision it using group policy
Xeo
Xeo
@sehe Btw, my initial idea was puts("0");}void f(){ right after the opening brace, but that's 20 chars. :(
@Xeo I had return std::cout<<0; planned, but same deal (well, #define a 0 was the first thing that jumped to mind seconds after reading the code)
20:49
I have a brilliant idea for the VCS system I'd like to use that has all the automagical auto-pulling I want and the history-forever I need as a proper programmer in a team.
Xeo
Xeo
any VCS + cronjob?
Git, who's items are checked out into Dropbox.
It's flawless.
Xeo
Xeo
(note: auto-pulling is still a bad idea.)
Also, what's cronjob?
Xeo
Xeo
@ThePhD A timed task, basically.
"run this script every 5 minutes" and similar stuff
0
Q: Codechef Contest

PrashantI recently encountered this problem in codechef contest <http://www.codechef.com/TCSN2012/problems/TSX01> but i was unable to make it at that time & also could not check my solution as submissions are now closed(even in practice) please correct me if i am wrong & suggest a better...

NARQ
20:52
man 8 cron
man crontab
@Xeo Ah. Well, I don't want to set it up to fire at certain intervals. I want updates whenever someone pushes one. In this case, there are only 2 of us doing the developing plus an artists and others, so Dropbox will allow me to have the latest and greatest, but I can still check merge stable branches and check in code that I want to check in as I work.
Now I just need to go with like, AssemblaSVN or Bitbucket or just roll my own.
Xeo
Xeo
Seriously, just set up Git / Mercural for your colleagues and show them how to add, commit and push stuff. hg add ., hg commit -m "message", hg push (with proper .hg/hgrc setup)
Or use TortoiseHg
Or something like that
Or any VCS, just use one
Well yeah. I'll have the VCS. But all the main files will be inside of a Shared Dropbox too. Which means if people edit stuff I can compile it in directly.
I can't think of any type of workflow where that would be useful.
Xeo
Xeo
I give up.
20:58
@ThePhD it's a total bullshit
total, complete, utter, matter-of-fact bullshit
SVN is easier to configure thanks to snvserve / VisualSVN
but if you dont want to, bitbucket has free private repos
if you want to hold binaries on the server, you need a dedicated one for it. Which is way beyond you could use efficiently (because of added complexity)
21:11
I think out of the last 10 questions I looked at, 2-3 didn't use void main...
21:37
> if you people can't answer some question why don't you sit quietly instead of critcising one's effort
@Xeo ^ this guy.
Dammit... out of close votes for the day...
@Mysticial Why? What do you think needs closing?
The review queue makes you burn through them like butter.
@EtiennedeMartel linkage?
@Mysticial Yeah, I've done that a few times too -- though I find if I really concentrate on using the "edit" button anywhere there's a hope of saving it, that helps a lot.
@DeadMG The "CodeChef Contest" question that's one-boxed up the screen.
21:56
oh dearie
22:09
Hey, how hard would it be to write a dissassembler for a program that outputs perfect nasm code?
@Link I can make sense of: "Hey, how hard would it be to write a dissassembler that outputs perfect nasm code?" Not sure I can make sense of the question as you asked it though.
oops
trailing thoughts
that's what I meant
anyways, how hard would it be?
like the code hould be recompilable
Xeo
Xeo
@EtiennedeMartel wat.
@Link If you just want to be able to re-assemble to produce the same output, probably pretty trivial. The hard part with a disassembler is making it easy for a person to understand. Making it so an assembler can process it is trivial.
Actually, I just it to be reassembleable
how would I go about that?
22:28
@Link what's your use case
just general knowledge?
not any pratical use
So Words with Friends is doing a celebrity tournament for charity, I've watched some of the games between them, it seems kind of obvious they are using cheat programs.
Got to meet Jerry Coffin in Denver yesterday
Nice guy
Which one are you?
@Chimera The goofy-looking one in the hat
22:34
Yeah, ok cool.
Yeah - hair to face ratio will do.
Awesome.
Just got my Razer Naga mouse. It's pretty sweet.
@Chimera In case it wasn't obvious from the picture, after all @DeadMG's talk about Wide, I've been growing the facial hair requisite to contributing to a language design.
@JerryCoffin LOL
@Shog9 Sadly, Shog isn't so much "nice" as (apparently) easily misled! :-)
22:45
It's that gullibility that makes me perfect for a career in customer service ;-P
@Shog9 I think being able to find a positive point, even when one of said customer's is being a bit of ass probably helps.
Definitely. Sometimes, you really gotta dig for that though
@Link If you only care about the assembler being able to reassemble it, the easiest way is probably to just generate the section headers, and convert the contents of each section into a bunch of "dd" statements (i.e., don't actually disassemble at all, just convert the raw data into assembler source format).
@Shog9 Well, you're in Colorado now, and it's state with a long history of mining.
I wonder if this software really works well. Anybody ever use it or heard of it?
http://xamarin.com/
@Chimera I've seen some questions about it pop up on SO that make it sound like at least a few people are making some attempt at using it, but not enough to be sure they're being particularly successful.
22:56
Hey guys
what other tech companies other than amazon & MS have dev centers in Seattle?
@JerryCoffin Ah ok thanks.
@LuchianGrigore Boeing?
Congratulations, @MooingDuck
I didn't know he got married! :)
Wow we had that mega vs mebi discussion again?
mega is 1000, giga is million, @DeadMG
23:10
...
someone didn't study the metric system in school.
@Takarakaka You're kiloing me...
I didn't go to school. :(
Now I regret it. @cHao
Thank you, now I know kilo is 1000 pounds, mega is 1 000 000 pounds and giga is well I have no idea how much, or isn't it? :) @MartinJames
@Rapptz s/discussion/successful troll/g FTFY.
giga == 1 billion
A metric prefix or SI prefix is a unit prefix that precedes a basic unit of measure to indicate a decadic multiple or fraction of the unit. Each prefix has a unique symbol that is prepended to the unit symbol. The prefix kilo-, for example, may be added to gram to indicate multiplication by one thousand; one kilogram is equal to one thousand grams (1 kg =  g). The prefix centi-, likewise, may be added to metre to indicate division by one hundred; one centimetre is equal to one hundredth of a metre (1 cm = 0.01 m). Decimal multiplicative prefixes ha...
23:12
@cHao ...or one milliard, for those who use that.
@cHao are you absolutely sure about it?
ie: 1000 million for you twits that don't get what "billion" means.
@JerryCoffin I was trying to point it out all the time, but no one listens.
@JerryCoffin I thought that was a duck
@Takarakaka quite.
i might use it to mean 2^30 when i'm talking about computer stuff, but the general meaning == 1 billion
23:15
:) Then I have nothing to say anymore. Attorney Jeff Coffin will take questioning now.
@MartinJames Well, Millard Fillmore wasn't exactly the greatest president, nor was he particularly handsome (his official portrait always reminds me of the bad guy in "It's a Wonderful Life"), but he was a Whig, not a duck.
Aslo, 1 billion has been used for 10^12 in UK past. It seems to have settled at 10^9 now, just about everywhere.
So one milliard is 10^9 and one billion is 10^12, right? :) @MartinJames
We're off to bed - I'm mega-tired now. 'Night all.
@Takarakaka Wait. My cousin Jeff is here? Where? When did he, of all people, get a law degree?
23:20
night :)
@MartinJames G'night.
You guys are still talking about it!
Xeo
Xeo
23:54
> I filmed Part 5, "Specializations", on Tuesday! :-> [STL on Core C++]
can't wait!
Xeo
Xeo
> The compiler team is working on C++11 Core Language features right now. In Part 6, I'll show off an internal build of the compiler (driven from the command line, since IDE integration is a separate chunk of work). I'd love to say which features are being implemented, but I'm not allowed to do that yet.
ohooo
@Jerry kinda looks like your friendly old grandpa that loves to read to his nephews. No offense. :)

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