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08:00
Wea is your guys opinion about pointers?
Compared to the way they work in C#
Yes I enjoy spamming that link
I'd prefer a managed language (i.e references) for sure. Sometimes though, even in C# programmers have to use pointers.
lol, but if I can, obviously I'd avoid them.
(Also what do you mean by > compared to the way they work in C#)
(AFAIK they "work" exactly the same way)
@Jeremy, I dont have a clue. I guess its debug. But when I try running it in debug I get a popup saying Error StanfordCPPLib not initialised properly :-/
I think he means references vs pointers.
@KodeSeeker but does it link properly?
i.e without warnings.
08:05
@Jeremy : I still get 8 warnings
are they all about the pdb files?
YEs
'vcxx.pdb was not found'
xx being numbers
That shouldn't matter too much then, it just means you'll have a hard time debugging it (but you hopefully won't need too...) Can you be 100% sure that you are initilizing it properly?
@KodeSeeker why are you actually doing that stanford stuff? it's obviously crap. just get a book like accelerated C++ and learn from there. it's ten times better and you don't need any crappy additional library, which just brings hassle
Is your code directly from an example snippet?
ALso setColour("WHITE") is an API thats painful to see.
08:09
@Jeremy: Initalising?
Lol, initializing*. I have 100 different ways to spell that word.
@bamboon: Yup. Im thinking that too.
but then coding here seemed cool with the lectures
Also, I agree with what @bamboon said. setColour("WHITE") is very discouraging.
@Jeremy: of course, but what exactly do you mean by initialising?
@KodeSeeker coding is actually never cool but hard work
08:12
What I mean: Are you sure you only need to call 'initGraphics' before using the library?
sbi
sbi
@Cicada On my phone? SlideIT
@Jeremy: Yes, thats directly off a code snippet from the reader
@CodeSeeker well its an internal error AFAIK. You've resolved the linking errors as far as they need to be. Must be a problem with the distributor or maybe you don't have the required software that the library uses. Its a pretty useless error message that it gives you.
fuck thats a whole week wasted then
lol
08:16
so @bamboon and @bamboon ,what book do you guys suggest then?
Whare you looking to learn? The basics of C++ or are you looking for something specific to graphics?
I have some knowledge of working in Java and need C++ for grad school. Is there some course (like this one) or a book that makes life a little easier with examples that actually work
lol
There is a list on stackoverflow: stackoverflow.com/questions/388242/…
Nah not graphics in particular
I personally started with C++ Primer
08:19
@Jeremy,of course. but I simply dont have the time to try each one out . Any really awesome ones there that I could give a shot right away.
Ahh
Well, fyi , I do have a basic background in C++.
@KodeSeeker I would go with accelerated c++ combined with some SO reading to get known to all the C++11 features.
Learn language first, and then deal with crappy graphics libraries.
Im just looking to brush things up ,so that I dont get stuck while writing basic code in school :P
Ah excellent, excellent
@bamboon: Will surely look at that.
does accelerated c++,come with sensible examples? :D
08:21
@KodeSeeker: The error code 0xc0000417 corresponds to STATUS_INVALID_CRUNTIME_PARAMETER, which is probably not being raised by anything you've written directly. Have you tried the low tech debugging approach of sticking a printf/std::cout statement inbetween each call into the library to see which one it's crashing in?
@russwuk: nope . Im afraid I dont know how to and havent done anything of that nature before D:
yellow
@KodeSeeker it's full of examples, packaged with do-it-yourself exercises
@bamboon: Thats awesome
I think its time to kiss good old Stanfy boy -Good bye :D
lol
The graphics library looked horrible anyway
08:23
a friggin week I spent on this bullshit ffs, and all I did was setup IDE's :x
int main(){
initGraphics();
setColor("BLUE");
oops - meant to edit that, not used to this chat window
Actually it might be related to std::string construction, but if it is, then that's that debug/release confusion thing.
Because C++ sucks and C++ tools suck even more.
3
@KodeSeeker: for example

int main(){
cout << "entered main" << endl;
initGraphics();
cout << "after initGraphics()" << endl;
setColor("BLUE");
cout << "after setColor()" << endl;
Takes 30 seconds to add and quickly tells you whether it's even got to your main method
And now I have to go write a software engineering test, which is full of crap.
I so love sublime text now more than ever
@russwuk: trying out your implementation
08:26
What do you work on, Cat?
What do you mean?
It crashed even when we resolved those link errors. Well aside from linking the pdbs for the standford lib
err
stanfordCPP lib*
w\e its called...
As in "what's your job if I may ask"
Web stuff.
08:28
ahh web
C++ on the web?
That test is for stupid uni.
I do C++ on my own.
Oh so you're at uni
At uni, in job and doing my own projects.
cgi fosho
Well, job currently on hold.
08:28
Hmmm, guessed country: russia
I knew it.
Okay so you're doing C++ "for fun"?
(Does that even exist)
to get rid of the pdb warnings you just need to copy the mentioned pdb files from the build (Debug/Release) directory for StanfordLib to the directory containing the lib file that you're linking to (StanfordLib.lib)
Meh.
08:30
Most of the stuff I do is for fun.
Oh silly me you're from polen
And in part to replace crappy software with my own, brilliant one.
Okay, gotta go. L'r.
@russwuk: It only enters main . the Error to StanfordCPPLib is called right aftet initGraphics() is called
after*
Good day sir.
Whats your countries of origin?
Canada here.
08:32
India .
@KodeSeeker - and did you get it linking to a consistent version of the lib with the version you were running... i.e. did you do a release build of StanfordLib.lib and link to that instead of the one that you were previously linking to, or switch to linking to the debug CRT in your application (as per your discusion with Jeremy?)
switched to debug.
switched the whole thing to debug, I believe
@russwuk^
Just you and I disclose our location, lol.
08:35
morning all
@Jeremy, anything to save a week of lost time :D
Hi there
whats the difference between C++ and C++11 ?
Both are blue
08:37
I'm all set up for another 'brilliant' day of work
@thecoshman:Awesome
@KodeSeeker one is a language, the other a specific version of a language
Ah I see
@KodeSeeker your sarcasm detector is either crap, or brilliant
@Jeremy Origin: America. Destination: Awesome.
08:38
Nah , Id rather call it a 'noob's way of getting around' :P
lol I've only been to the states a few times.
@Jeremy The few things I've heard from Canadians about the states has never been pleasant :/
@kode you said you where Indian right, you heared of 'wipro' (the company)
@thecoshman, is that a question?
@Neil I can't say, I didn't notice a very big difference regarding culture though.
08:40
@KodeSeeker yeah :P
We basically broadcast everything you see on tv over here and sell all the products you've got over there here
@thecoshman :oh Yeah they make a whole lot of crappy stuff :P :P
lol
and that earlier, was sarcasm :P
Anyway, I'm going to head to bed. Good night guys.
@KodeSeeker LOL! by any chance, are they known for people 'double jobbing' taking two roles at once?
08:43
@Jeremy, night.
double jobbing?
k, people woke up at last
@KodeSeeker working for two companies at once
oh yeah a lot of 'em do that, I hear
@Jeremy I think people search too hard for differences. We're a lot more similar than most people care to admit for various reasons, not excluding patriotism and arrogance.
@Neil Are you from the States? ;)
08:45
I worked for startup, now I hope to do graduate school.
@KodeSeeker they contract for a few companies don't they
We're all just part of a whole. Humanity. Except for those damn Russians...
Oh yes they do
I know I said I was leaving. Before I do:
@Neil I agree 100%
@KodeSeeker you might want to remove your question unless you are still going to activley look for a solution.
@Neil being part of a whole does not preclude having significant internal differences though. :) We're all made of the same kinds of atoms too, but I'd argue there's a pretty significant difference between me and a tree :)
08:47
Yeah, I work for one of the companies that 'hire' Wipro
@Jeremy , will do
Alright, nn.
@jalf We're far more different individually than anything else
@thecoshman: Feel free to boss them around, they'll bounce back :P :P
I'm not claiming everyone is equal. Just saying that people look at differences between individuals and then try to interpret those differences as those between countries rather than individuals.
08:49
@KodeSeeker The lad I work with is actually rather good. Though it is very clear work ethics are very different in India.
@Neil sure, but if you've travelled a bit, you'll realize there are also some very real cultural differences
Is Wipro considered a good job? In terms of pay and conditions?
Very hard to remove someone's idea of this once they've got it burned in their brains, because it's easy to dodge counterexamples by claiming they're exceptions to the rule.
@thecoshman: there are good folks everywhere. As for pay and conditions' I'd say mediocre and a little above thats about it
@jalf True, but I would argue that that comes from how members of that society are raised to think
If you take an American and raise him from a baby in a Japanese culture, he'd have all the positive and negative qualities of Japanese culture rather than American culture.
08:50
@Neil Well yes. That's like saying "the reason the sun is hot is that it's got a very high temperature"
That's kind of what culture means
Yeah
Formatting
@jalf Well I was stating that to point out that differences are not genetic. If you think I'm stating the obvious, then you already get my point.
They partly are
But they're also very environmental
@Neil Yeah, but in a discussion about cultural differences, I was hoping that'd be obvious ;)
@jalf Zing
08:52
@jalf Then why mention it if it isn't a counterexample?
hai everyone...
anyone experienced with integration of opencv and qt
@Neil what do you mean? Who mentioned what, which isn't a counterexample?
@Neil perhaps I misunderstood you? Or something
@lakshmikant Yeah
08:58
@KodeSeeker: apologies for dropping the discussion, had to make a phone call. It looks like if you want to track down why it's failing you're going to need to step into the library code and take a look at the point it fails. Running it under a debugger and looking at the call stack would give you some hints. Assuming that you don't want to take the approach that a few people have suggested of trying a different book/tutorial
@jalf Why did you mention it? Lets start from there.
Good day fellow… ehm… strange people!
wb Radek
@Neil mention what? That cultural differences exist?
09:09
@sehe Schreeuw
@jalf Yes.
@russwuk: Yeah doing that
and this chat is awesome \m/
@Neil well, because cultural differences were being discussed, and you implied that they weren't significant
37 mins ago, by Jeremy
@Neil I can't say, I didn't notice a very big difference regarding culture though.
33 mins ago, by Neil
@Jeremy I think people search too hard for differences. We're a lot more similar than most people care to admit for various reasons, not excluding patriotism and arrogance.
Generalization is so bad
@Cicada +1
09:19
@Cicada generally speaking
@jalf Oh, you.
Well it's not that bad when you use it in a technical field
But when you're speaking about humans
It always ends up in conflicts
Bleh
@Cicada He's saying generalization is accurate! Side with me!
@Neil No, I'm saying there is such a thing as culture
@jalf Yes. Then I am in agreement. Culture exists.
I'm saying that citizens of the United States in general often have certain traits that citizens of other countries notice. I'm saying that it is possible to meaningfully compare "Canadians" and "Americans", as long as you keep in mind that it's a generalization, and there are going to be plenty of exceptions
sbi
sbi
09:31
I have worked and lived in the US for half a year (and traveled more). I have traveled through eastern Europe for months. I have been to northern and southern Europe for weeks of vacation. Let me put it this way: If you come to a different country/nation/area, people are different in a general way. Of course, they still eat, drink, fuck, and yell at the kids (resulting from the latter). But they do it in different ways, passed down the generations. That is called culture.
I'm saying that when people call out Americans for their patriotism or their arrogance (to take the example that started this discussion), it is not just that they encountered a single rotten apple.
@jalf So what's the point of generalizations if there are plenty of exceptions?
@Neil the point is that in general they are correct
sbi
sbi
Damn. Now I'm even beaten by a bloody penguin.
Damn. Time for the meeting. afk
Well I think this is an exceptionally arrogant point of view, so I'm going to call you synonymously Americans, since even though there are exceptions, in general it is true.
09:35
@Neil No it isn't. The vast majority of this planet's population are not americans
And what is arrogant about it?
lol! I've just noticed how @Cicada and @sbi have the same pose going on in their avatars. They have now merged in my heads :D
And I doubt most people in this chat are americans either
@Neil I think it is exceptionally arrogant to say that "any difference you might have noticed between two groups of people are due to the specific individuals you encountered, and certainly cannot be because the group as a whole has a broad culture that might differ from that of the other group
@Neil maths god damn it!
@jalf The point was to call you arrogant, actually.
If that wasn't clear, let me clarify. Fuck you.
@Neil er, why? How is what I said arrogant?
09:38
@Neil and with that, you lose the debate. Thanks for playing, better luck next time
3
And how is it "in general" true that I am American? And how are there exceptions? Unless some of my individual limbs are American, and others aren't, that makes no sense. I either have an American citizenship, or I do not
@jalf Now you're doing that to troll me, I believe.
Xeo
Xeo
Quick question: Late-specified return type couldn't recurse into its own function, right?
@Neil Says the one who just went "fuck you"
no, I am not trolling you
@jalf your gluttony and stupidity are american :D
09:41
I am trying to get you to explain to me how I am "American", generally or specifically
And how I am arrogant
@jalf I'll respond by quoting what I had just said, "@jalf The point was to call you arrogant, actually."
specifically or generaly
"If that wasn't clear, let me clarify. Fuck you."
@Neil So you're both arrogant and you have no clue how to carry out a discussion?
Want me to repeat that again for you?
09:42
@Neil no, I want you to say something other than "you are arrogant, fuck you"
I want you to tell me why I am arrogant
what about culture are you discussing?
@jalf Because the discussion is over, and you don't seem to get that.
@Neil well, yes, you ended it by saying "fuck you". But now I am opening a new one
So I have to reasonably conclude you're doing it purposefully or you don't get it, hence what I said twice over.
@Xeo do you mean something like this? ideone.com/jeAgy
09:43
You said that I am "exceptionally arrogant". I do beleive it is within my right to ask you "why?"
@jalf Because not only must I be wrong, I must be trampled upon, isn't that right? That makes you arrogant.
Xeo
Xeo
@bamboon No, more like template<class T> auto f(T v) -> decltype(f(v.foo())){...}
with another appropriate overload that finishes the recursion
Oh wait, I'm stupid
@Neil Where did I imply that you must be trampled upon?
@Neil That's ok, I was kinda forced to ignore Jalf first time I met him because I was telling a guy who was talking about Ruby here to stop writing Ruby which was apparently unacceptable for Jalf :)
09:45
@Neil (I was just trolling :))
Xeo
Xeo
GCC fails, but Clang compiles
And while the concept may be new to you, a discussion generally involves disagreement. It is not arrogant, in a discussion, to believe that the other side os wrong.
though it is arrogant to not accept that it is your side that is wrong
@jalf Jaif, in a disagreement, when one ends a conversation, so does the other.
5 mins ago, by thecoshman
what about culture are you discussing?
09:48
@Xeo arg, that is too smart for me
@Neil What are you smoking? You present an incoherent argument, and when faced with disagreement, you call everyone who disagrees "exceptionally arrogant", and when asked why, you say "fuck you". And you expect anyone to take you seriously?
@jalf You're not arrogant becuase you disagree. You're arrogant because you won't STFU.
Here's a hint: you're not in charge. You're not ruler of the universe. You do not get to say who argues and who does not. You do not get to end a discussion. You do not get to insult others and then prohibit them from replying
And in trying to do so, you certainly lose all credibility when you call others arrogant
@jalf I think I did insult you, actually. I think that's why you're acting like this.
Your behavior here is some of the worst arrogance I have encountered for years
Xeo
Xeo
09:49
Anyone with GCC 4.7+ here?
@Neil Yes, most people consider "fuck you" to be an insult, don't they?
perhaps you don't? In that case, fuck you
@jalf Now that makes you equally part of my arrogance, doesn't it?
Can you two kids just cut it out ? ...
@Xeo Me
@Neil no it does not
Xeo
Xeo
09:51
@Pubby Could you test this snippet for me?
@Neil no. I'm not insulting you, am I? And I am not trying to tell others whether they are allowed to discuss, ask questions or disagree
@thecoshman Don't encourage him please.
@ScarletAmaranth either you are implying the de-man them selves, or you mean "Cut it out"
@Neil I don't think you get to decide who should encourage who
@thecoshman Whops ^^
09:52
@jalf Says the man who thinks I'm arrogant.
@Neil From I have seen of this, you are coming across as the childish brat of this. "nah nah nah, I'm not listening"
@Neil But the other reason I am "acting like this" is that I thought it was an interesting discussion, and I would like to understand why you feel that it is "extremely arrogant" to say that people in different countries or regions have different cultures which, in general affect how they act and think
@Xeo In instantiation of ‘decltype (smart_wrap_unwrap(forward<T>(v).getPtr(), 0)) smart_wrap_unwrap(T&&, int) [with T = smart<smart<smart<std::shared_ptr<X> > > >&; decltype (smart_wrap_unwrap(forward<T>(v).getPtr(), 0)) = smart<smart<std::shared_ptr<X> > >&]’:
test.cpp:32:36: required from here
test.cpp:15:58: error: invalid initialization of reference of type ‘std::shared_ptr<X>&’ from expression of type ‘smart<smart<std::shared_ptr<X> > >’
return smart_wrap_unwrap(std::forward<T>(v).getPtr(), 0);
@Neil ... do you actually know what "arrogant" means? It is arrogant to presume that you can tell others what to do. It is hardly arrogant to say "you can't tell others what to do"
@thecoshman I don't want to talk about this anymore. You may not agree, but tough. I don't have to continue this conversation.
09:53
@jalf wait, is that what this has all been about? If the notion of cultures is arrogant or not?
@thecoshman I think so. I'm not sure, because the person who said so would rather go "fuck you" than explain if that is what he meant
@Neil fair enough, if you want to leave the conversation, leave it
so please, correct me if I am wrong
@jalf Yes it is. It's presumptuous to assume you can tell me I must continue our conversation and I can't tell people not to encourage others. It's arrogant to assume I must do what you say.
@thecoshman You're right. I'm leaving it.
@Neil When, how and where did I tell you that you "must continue our conversation" or that you "can't tell people not to encourage others?
09:54
Stupid markdown
Xeo
Xeo
@Pubby Interesting... Clang 3.1 compiles that just fine :s
@Neil but it's not arrogant for you to do the same?
When, how and where did I assume that you must do what I say?
@jalf to be fair, and this is not at you directly, people on-line do tend to have a problem letting things go.
@thecoshman oh, sure
but there are smoother ways to get people to "let things go" than saying "fuck you"
09:56
@jalf well, I'm glad we agreed on that point so quickly, cup of tea?
I think most people would probably take a "fuck you" as an invitation to not let things go
@jalf indeed
@thecoshman Yes please!
@jalf well, sadly you don't work with me here, so you are on your own; mentally, I am willing you on your way to a lovely brew
I guess I'll make some myself then

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