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09:00
Use the rest of the interface if you need that.
@sbi Dutch time.
I.e. functor(*e) is already 'rethrow or call (possibly throwing)'. Hence more reason to have apply(functor, e) be nothrow.
And it's 13:30 nowhere at the moment. It is 13:00 and 14:00, but not 13:30.
sbi
sbi
@RadekdaknokSlupik So you have a mere 2.5hrs t prepare, minus the time needed to get there.
@RadekdaknokSlupik I learned here that there are timezones that are half an hour off.
I prepared yesterday and two days before.
sbi
sbi
09:02
Why do you change your user name every other month, BTW? I have a hard time keeping up with who you are every time you do that.
@LucDanton Ah, I didn't notice operator* would throw, which makes perfect sense.
@sbi TIL
@sbi I prefer my real name.
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@ScottW Not every team does this here.
But he is a teen. Why would that be picking on him?
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@ScottW I resent others to pick on users here. The picking has to be mine or it's inappropriate behavior.
@RMartinhoFernandes Those who are too young (or too old) do not like to be reminded about it.
09:06
wow, I asked Manager to see if our team can't get our own server to test on, rather then having to borrow of others teams all the time (yeah, I know) he asked the manager in the contract company, who asked my team mate ¬_¬
@sbi AFAICS, you don't mind it, old man.
sbi
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@RMartinhoFernandes Pout.
@thecoshman I fail to make sense of this. (But then, that might well have been your point.)
@sbi If you minded it, you wouldn't be the one reminding us of it.
> Since FORTRAN should virtually eliminate coding and debugging, (...) — from here, page 2.
lol
09:24
'Virtually' as in 'in our imagination' I suppose.
Hm, LLVM for nvidia GPUs
Hmm.
What's alignof(int&)?
Damn, it's alignof(int).
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@RMartinhoFernandes Yeah, I also saw that tweet this morning, and had to smile.
I'll have to hack it.
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@RMartinhoFernandes You want to hack FORTRAN?!
09:29
No, he wants to hack the tweet.
Oh boy.
@sbi alignof(int&).
template <typename T>
struct member { T _; };
alignof(member<int&>) // should do
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@LucDanton Uh oh. I am not sure which one would be the worse thread on our civilization.
Mmmh, should EnableIf 'clauses' (if I can call them that) put in a specific order to guarantee SFINAE? GCC complains it can't find a tuple_type nested type in a type it shouldn't inspect.
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It seems I have a knack for colorful expressions today. :) Quick, look at this, before it gets closed because meta does not put up with "Why are you beating your wife?" questions:
0
Q: Can I please be trusted to not script a bot that dumps an endless stream of spam messages into the chat?

sbiI will have been at SO for 3 years this summer. Although I have mostly stopped answering questions long ago, I still rake in the occasional piece of rep, and have thus amassed >60k, most of it in this one tag, where, in over a year of me slacking, they still haven't managed to push me off the lis...

@LucDanton I'm not understanding.
Need code.
09:35
Yellow all
@RMartinhoFernandes Trying out apply with exceptional in a unit test, and apparently the apply overload for variants doesn't SFINAE properly.
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Haha, someone upvoted my question on meta in under a minute, while it likely requires them 3mins at least to dig through the text and find the message hidden in there.
Yep, if I move the EnableIf</* ... */> = _ bit up before the typename = TupleType<Variant> stuff it SFINAEs properly.
@sbi yeah, idiotic managers.
> interrupting my (...) statement with some stupid template meta-programming bullshit.
Hey! I resent that.
@LucDanton I don't think there's an established order for this.
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09:38
@RMartinhoFernandes That's what I put it in for.
@sbi Who cares about the message - upvotes mean something different on meta! (At least that's what I hear every time someone complains about the voting patterns there)
@sbi Because not having an anti-bot script in specific instances will undoubtedly cause the arise of those who will deliberately attempt to become a trusted member at SO just so they can bring it down.
@RMartinhoFernandes It could be a limitation of GCC, too. It might be the case that the use of the nested tuple_type should trigger SFINAE by itself.
sbi
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@Neil Can I have some of what you are smoking?
Not likely, in fact near impossible, but still.. not talking about a simple annoyance but the up state of the site itself, potentially
09:39
@Neil And then what? Spamming a chat room will get you suspended soon.
(It's more complicated than strictly doing typename = TupleType<Variant> so I'm not sure.)
And then a mod comes and bans you for three years or something (happened before).
All that work to become a trusted member down the drain.
1. Spend several weeks answering questions and being helpful to get 20K rep
2. Flood the chat causing a minor inconvenience for a few hours
3. ??????
4. Profit
Eh, going to assume GCC fails to SFINAE where it should and leaving a comment to keep track of the workaround.
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@Pubby Show me how you make 20k of rep in "several weeks".
09:42
Jon once said he makes ~400 rep a day.
Jon Skeet, Reading, United Kingdom
438k 125 1936 3269
Only 50 days (~7 weeks) to 20k.
@RMartinhoFernandes why do I get the feeling that the 3 year ban was grossly out of proportion
Robots are too fast
@thecoshman It was a "temporary my ass" ban. I don't think it was undeserved.
09:43
@RMartinhoFernandes any idea what it was for?
41 mins ago, by sbi
Why do you change your user name every other month, BTW? I have a hard time keeping up with who you are every time you do that.
What I mean is, imagine scenario A, where Johnny B. Good becomes a trusted member of SO. He is a moderator, he is highly ranked, he does everything he is supposed to.
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Feb 18 at 9:21, by sbi
@Potatoswatter Well, to be fair, you will have to take into account the rep cap. I think he averages at ~300rep/day. That's 100 per day above the rep cap. (And 5 times as much as I made.)
^ So true. @RadekdaknokSlupik @daknok @daknok_t @WTP'-- @class_daknok_t please get your MPD treated?
One day, he snaps and decides he doesn't want to live anymore and abuses his newly acquired power to not be checked for being a robot, and brings down the site with a simple script.
09:45
He can "bring down the site" as much as anyone else can.
Since when does a DDOS require rep? (or any technical skill for that matter)
@RMartinhoFernandes You could post thousands of posts in a minute
@Neil The point is, you can't.
spam every open question
That gets you an automatic IP ban.
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09:46
@Neil So set the bar up to 10 messages a second over 5mins. That should be enough for anybody™, and prevents him from doing that.
@sbi If there are other checks against this kind of thing, I wouldn't have a problem whatsoever
The best you can do is annoy a few users.
If the markdown actually worked it would be less of an issue
I only seem to run into the problem when I'm trying to comment on something I onebox'd
Speak for yourself, buddy :)
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@Neil There is no problem. Really. Even if 50 users would decide right now to do this incredibly stupid security theater movie plot stunt, we'd get 50 * 7 weeks * 20k rep of incredibly useful SO content out of them until they overstep it once, are banned within 4hrs, and would have to start all over.
09:50
50 * 7 weeks? That's almost 7 years!
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sbi
50 users.
And they need to be in Jon Skeet's quality quantity league.
@sbi Then it seems like a reasonable request what you're asking.
@ScottW Don't. The answer is many
What exactly are we on about? User's DDOSing through normal use of the site?
09:54
this is very interesting so you saying people are abusing the question and answers using crawlers to find easy targets to gain reps
In fairness, JS is actually both big on quantity and on quality. I never saw him post a poor answer.
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Really, such a scenario (which is a of movie plot "quality", really) would be 1M worth of rep. We're talking a pure positive score (no downvoting) of 100k here (yeah, I know, minus rep from getting accepted, but let's not be too pedantic here). That would be a thousand Nice Answer badges. And all SO had to pay for that is to take a few flags in the chat and ban four dozen idiots. I bet they ban that many every week. Jeff would probably consider this an incredibly good deal.
@ScottW it would be interesting to see how up-voted his answers where if they where posted under a a dummy account
+!, ever thought about writing a book? I like your style. Irony mixed with the innocence of frustration. — Gamecat 1 min ago
Sounds like a challenge.
...
It's an Australian 'i+'.
09:58
it its a little insane or stands out so much the huge gab or high reps between the top and those just discovering the site .. its seems like there no way to stand out or take for every if you time is limiited
@Riley This is not really a competiton .. :)
actually, would be nice if it all answers/question that some one makes had a random chance of being 'anonymous' for something like 24 hours. Just to see how it alters peoples voting habbits
i mean not in a bad way a good way just what large numbers
@Riley Post good answers and you'll stand out.
No need to be in the list of top users for that.
Yeah i reckon if you get a few upvotes for every answer then you're on a good path.
10:01
@sbi are you just wanting to not have long messages shrunk with a 'show full text' link at the bottom?
@RMartinhoFernandes that true i agree
you what would be so helpful and just truly innovative would be bare with my spelling and type but this : tutorial chat room / have the user that with high badges and reputation set up time where members with certain amount of reputation can participate in configuring / or gothing threw step by step process
na just warming up my fingers
and each member who sign up to live tutorial/session all have to successfully accomplish it . And also integrate something similar to team viewer so members can troubleshoot and see live results and progres
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@Riley You want to rake in masses of rep? Here's a bunch of tricks:
A man decides to take a different way home one day, when he passes the mental institution. He swears he hears something, so he gets closer. To his surprise, he hears chanting. "Thirteen! Thirteen! Thirteen! Thirteen!" Ingrigued he gets closer, all the while he hears even stronger the words "Thirteen! Thirteen! Thirteen! Thirteen!"
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1) Concentrate on one or two well-trafficked tags where you can easily provide a good answer for many questions.
The wooden fence surrounding the mental institution has a hole in it, and he decides to see what the fuss is about and peers inside, when a finger pokes him in the eye. The chanting begins again, "Fourteen! Fourteen! Fourteen! Fourteen!"
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10:05
2) Refresh a tab with the questions of that tag once every 15mins, and look out for a question you can fire at right away.
3) Send a quick(!) prayer it won't be closed as a dupe.
4) Provide a simple, non-wrong answer as fast as possible. Then use your 5min grace period to improve on it.
5) Keep polishing it as long as the question has attention, incorporating every helpful comment and answer given on the questions page.
@Bart, capital 1. — Gamecat 6 mins ago
:)
well i dont want reps so to speek i want to take these questions and so speak review them discuss and excute together
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6) Be content with providing one such answer per day that brings in a lot of rep.
Does boost::irangehave any overhead checking for overflow?
@Pubby ? why do you ask. Can't you use the source?
Also, usually, the range is statically known. How can it overflow?
10:07
I dunno
Well. I dare to guess no: there is no overhead. C++ will be C++, and boost usually understands that
but that would be basically e-learning but without the requirements to pass or $ just satisfaction of helping others while toning ones skills and a more interactive profile would would become more then just a profile page
they would be able to show their expertise to more then one questionnaire and the help would be on a much bigger impact to the point
There's no way it can overflow if you're using it right (i.e. no irange(10, 4) or other such crap).
Firstly, with me it says I can retry in 1 second
Secondly, I use the SO chat userscript and I am used to ^V, Enter, Ctrl-Space
(Ctrl-Space automatically does the Retry thingy for you)
would be nice to be able to post you screen inside this chatroom .. mini screen share
10:10
@Riley Why?
do answers not support strike through?
@thecoshman Yes <strike></strike>
@sehe (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
or if i post a question i can have a link of feed to my computer so if someone i would not know can watch me or see what going on
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@sehe Oh, minutes or secs — where's the difference when you're twiddling your thumbs waiting for it to pass?
10:12
@sbi I twidlle my thumbs pretty damn quick, but not within a second
Mar 26 at 15:03, by R. Martinho Fernandes
How do you do strikeout in SO answers?
sbi
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@sehe You need to practice.
@Riley That's chatroulette for you
:)
@sbi I did practice. I practiced hitting Ctrl-Space very quickly. I find that both more useful and more satisfying
> (I know you wouldn't have guessed, but I am a bit long-winded sometimes)
LOL
(That was: <^V><Enter>LOL<Enter><Ctrl-Space>)
so if i working in Dreamweaver messing around with CSS3 Transitions and Animation . showing and helping others live mabye not on there computer but some interface where one can edit live code together
That's not how SO works.
10:19
@Riley there are plenty of services for collaborative editing of text, SO is not one of them (and IMO nor should it be)
yea but it could be more dynamic and there is not export or live like .jsfiddle.net
edit your posts man, don't just spam your mistakes
You bring in the questions, we give out the answers. It's not a helpdesk.
The point is that someone else can find the answers later by searching them.
Not to help every single user individually.
TDS
TDS
Anyone has an idea of Github for mac. I'd tried github for Mac(that cat image), GitX and git 1.7.0.1 etc.
Poor user experience with github for mac, and when I go with command line it shows me command not found.
well nice talkign to you all
10:24
@Riley Nothing personal, just the way SO is supposed to work - I guess it can be a little intimidating when we all vocally agree on that in this room. :)
hope day is productive for everybody
Thanks
lol, productive day. I'm writing Java.
@Riley erm... and?
10:27
@Riley Are you trying to pass us a sibliminal message? Blue. Square. Hmmm?
Note to self: if you don't want to close your browser, don't close your browser.
no just would be cool the could combine jsfddle and stockexhcange would be great
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@Riley You might want to put a little bit more effort into typing. My brain parser just threw a very nasty and intimidating exception at me when I tried to decode that.
@RMartinhoFernandes Caveats, known issues: some keys on some keyboards, as well as some circumstances may decrastinate the moment at which said operation on a browser occurs.
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@RMartinhoFernandes I know you are young and you need the money, but, really, if it so bad that you need to write Java for a living?
10:33
@Riley You want to ... erm... fiddle with stock exchange? No problem, you will get less rich quick :)
sbi
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@sehe No, he wants to fddle with stock exhcnange. Wahtevr thit meens.
ROFL
@RMartinhoFernandes Some of the danger keys include [Power], [Ctrl-Q], [Ctrl-Shift-W], [Alt-F4], [Ctrl-F4], [Shift-Alt-SysRq-K], [Yank-PowerCord] and possibly some others depending on hardware and software
@sbi I'm working with people I like, on a project I find interesting (well, except for the Java...). I'm happy. Ish.
@sehe No really, I closed it twice by clicking the big red button.
I think I need food.
10:37
No shit. Don't tell me you know stockexchange.com too
hhaha
that ways good
@RMartinhoFernandes oh, must try to remember that one
i gonan go on that note
@RMartinhoFernandes (a) You click things?! (b) your browser has big buttons (c) your browser has a red close button?
true
10:38
cue: gonan the barbarian (curtain down)
@sehe I said I need food. Don't censor me.
@RMartinhoFernandes It's happened plenty of times that I click on the X to close the browser only to realize that I'm not closing that, but <insert incredibly important program to keep open here> instead
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
@RMartinhoFernandes I will use my discretion to give you apply the rules with a bit of latitude this time, but don't let it happen again!
time for the obligatory @rvalue reference
@sbi And to be honest, I think I care about money less than I should.
Hi guys
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10:43
@Riley You know, I am at the flagging such messages. They make my toenails curl in disgust, which is extremely uncomfortable in my shoes.
I'm having a rather strange problem in my code, tho I'm not a specialist of behavior, thus it might be strange only to me :D
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@shookees I think I speak for everybody else when I say that we are sorry to hear that. (Hint: You say you have a problem, and all we can do about it is to we're sorry. You tell us what the problem is, and we might be able to tell you how to fix it.)
I have a custom struct pointer set as NULL at first. If I check whether it is NULL via if statement with commands inside - it crashes. Without the commands it doesn't
@sbi I request to be officially noted as not sharing that view
by saying commands inside I meant if (){ "commands inside"}
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10:47
@thecoshman Request denied.
May 9 at 15:54, by R. Martinho Fernandes
Code speaks louder than words.
@sbi well in that case...
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@shookees Post a piece of code reproducing this error at ideone.com and post a link here.
How do you like them apples?!
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@thecoshman I prefer Windows.
Haha, who flagged that?
10:49
@sbi I have no idea who would have flagged that
Note to self: Never ever deal with class loaders ever again.
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@thecoshman Oh, so it was you, huh?
Ever.
@sbi I did request in what I thought was a rather polite way. You rudely disregarded my desire to not give a fuck about shookees
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@thecoshman Ha, so you flagged me because I forgot to add a smiley to my message? Oh well, I am truly sorry for you having a job that pisses you off so badly. I still like you, though. :)
10:56
@sbi no, I flagged because I was offended by your brash generalisation that every one in this room cares about some one
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@thecoshman Yeah, I got that. Shrug. Did I mention I like you anyway? :b
@sbi I like you too :D
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Flagging love.
@RMartinhoFernandes oh no robot, you see, 'love' and 'like' are not the same. You'll understand one day, maybe
11:00
@thecoshman I don't use Facebook. How could I know?
@RMartinhoFernandes what has Facebook got to do with this?
Isn't Facebook in the 'like' business?
11:19
Hi all
I have a stupid question ;) I have class Kernel. It doesn't have empty constructor, it's constructed only with some arguments. I have a KernelFactory class (it's not usual factory pattern, abstract or static, just class that generates Kernel instances with arguments).
So instead of doing: `Kernel k = Kernel(/* smth */)`I use:`KernelFactory kf; Kernel k = kf.generate(3);` It works fine, but how to make a global instance of Kernel in such a situation?
Declare as extern KernelFactory kernel_factory;, define as KernelFactory kernel_factory; in one TU. Beware of static initialization fiasco. One alternative is a context object.
I don't need global indeed. I just need to add try-catch structure
wut
Oh sorry, misread.
11:27
@Innuendo Why would you want to make a global instance?
KernelFactory kf;
try {
  Kernel  k = kf.generate(3);
} catch ( char* mes ) {
  cout << mes;
}
// but if it was ok
// k  in code below will be not defined
// k.smth()
In that case you need to call the factory from a function, such that you can put the try-catch blocks.
And call that function at namespace scope to initialize your global.
problem is, that try {} block has own scope. If I write Kernel k; before try {} than I call constructor that doesn't exist
try { Kernel k = kf.generate(3); return k; } catch /* handle */
blocks in C++ can return a value? ;)
11:31
2 mins ago, by Luc Danton
In that case you need to call the factory from a function, such that you can put the try-catch blocks.
Ok, I've understood
Wrap this` try` in a function. If try fails, than catch handles, otherwise function returns kernel instance
If you were using C++11 instead of a throw-away function you could use a lambda expression.
it's something like closures?
ok, thank you. I'll try
So, something like this?
  Kernel k = [&]{
    try {
      return kfactory.square(2);
    } catch (char* error_message) {
      cout << error_message << endl;
    }
  }();
11:44
That will invoke undefined behaviour if an exception is thrown because it doesn't return a value.
But you'd have the same problem when using a function, so otherwise your use of a lambda expression is correct. If you're at namespace scope though you don't need [&], that's for locals.
with this argument, it should throw exception. But i don't see my message. I see terminate called after throwing an instance of 'char const*'
Try catching char const* then.
Don't throw string literals. :.
const char* : Message was shown and after undefined behaviour (Segmentation fault)
@CatPlusPlus Does C++ have standard Exception class?
11:46
Yes.
Also use Boost.Exception.
std::exception is better used as a base class though. std::runtime_error is the one that you can use in lieu of a proper exception type.
> I'm having a rather strange problem in my code -- shookees
^ made me think "Did you talk to your doctor about your ... problem?
Is it necessary to make your own Exception class based on boost::exception or std::exception?
I'm having a rather strange code in my problem
11:49
@Innuendo It's a good thing to do.
@Innuendo boost.org/community/error_handling.html is a terrific guide on how to do that - correctly
struct my_error : virtual boost::exception, virtual std::exception {}; and then attach additional info with Boost.Exception's error_info.
@CatPlusPlus, I understand, but by now, I have one situation that throws exception, that's why I throw literal
Ok, Exceptions I'll fix - it's not a problem now. my factory in lambda function is problem
throw std::runtime_error("blah");
That's the problem with namespace scope -- what do you do if construction fails?
11:52
Die a burning death with the fire of a thousand suns!
Ineed to exit program at all
Don't use globals, duh.
2
Or, maybe a bit more environment friendly, use a energy saving light oven
@CatPlusPlus, i don't mean globals that are global to the whole program. Global to the try block I mean
11:55
Eh?
Throw a tantrum instead
@Innuendo it's not necessary, if you don't want to catch it with catch (std::exception&)
Yeah, it's not necessary, it's just a bad, nonidiomatic code.
Who'd care about that, eh.
@CatPlusPlus Let's ask thecosh
meh... it's not bad. If you don't need to pass any data (or text) with exception, you don't need std::exception
11:59
It is bad.
try { real_main(); } catch (const std::exception&) {} is a nice way to do top-level exception handler.
And not lose all information in the process.

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