« first day (2020 days earlier)      last day (3154 days later) » 

user406009
00:05
Eh, seems like a pretty specialized use case.
user406009
@caps Why not just keep hold of the old AST?
00:32
@sehe True to an extent, but I think that's tempered by a couple of things. First of all, smog levels (and such) in China have gotten to the point that there's almost certainly a fair amount of domestic pressure to clean up their act anyway. Second, part of the Paris agreement does include a fair amount of financial aid from the more developed countries to China and other developing countries to help them do the necessary cleanup (doesn't confirm any of Trump's lunacy though).
manual labour is like ... green energy :p
Maybe people in fattie countries should do more manual labours because 1) it better for the environment 2) it's better for their own health
@Telkitty People emit CO2 also--in fact, I'd guess they probably emit more CO2 per unit of work done than a typical gasoline engine, electric plant, etc. Of course, there's a lot of variation depending on diet, etc.
user406009
@Telkitty Supposedly, most weight gain is due to diet rather than lack of exercise.
A lot of the times, I chose to walk instead of driving because 1) it's healthier for me, 2) I save diesel money & 3) it's better for the environment
user406009
It's very hard to actually burn a ton of calories.
user406009
00:41
@Telkitty Time is money though. So your monetary savings might actually be losses.
@JerryCoffin but people don't emit smog, do they? :p
@Lalaland weight gain/loss is due to the equilibrium between diet and exercise
if you hike 12 hours a day for a month, there is literally no way you could gain weight during your hike the natural way
user406009
Yeah, but that's unreasonable.
user406009
Only so much time in every day.
true
user406009
@sehe Most anti-green politicians in US have now moved on from straight denial though. Now most just claim that what we do doesn't matter because of China/India/X.
00:50
3 is a good plink ratio. Don't overdo it
@Telkitty Technically, no--but neither does anything else. To get smog, you need pollutants plus some photochemical reactions. People emit many of the right pollutants though (just like cars, manufacturing, etc., do)
> fatty countries
Telkitty level nuance
What do you call a startup that doesn't need funding? A business! https://t.co/wfEHrJPI8M
user406009
Cows are supposedly responsible for ~10% of our methane emissions.
save the planets by eating burgers
user406009
Everytime you fart, you hurt the environment just a little bit.
00:55
@Lalaland We hurt it a little. You hurt it a lot. :-)
user406009
(Especially your social environment if you make smelly farts in enclosed spaces).
01:05
@Jason_A_Murdock my Qatar gently weeps
Dat pun
We all drink water in the past urine and fart is present all the times in the environment, what varies is the concentration of it around you
user406009
@Telkitty Well, and the concentration of us on the planet.
user406009
There is quite a lot of us on the planet right now.
user406009
user406009
It's always interesting to think how humanity has had such a huge impact on Earth.
01:14
also, recently I have been thinking: there were 1 billion people back in 1804, now there are 7.
(7-1) billion x 65kg = 390 billion kg
user406009
A lot of biomass.
that's a lot of weight we have converted from our environment into humans
user406009
Sorta like a virus right?
user406009
Consume, consume, consume and create more replicas.
@Lalaland Not much. A virus can't reproduce on its own--it requires help from host cells to reproduce. We reproduce ourselves.
01:21
@LucDanton non même pas
user406009
@JerryCoffin Okay, more like a cancer then.
il fut un temps, oui (y'a des années)
:noel:
on peut plus se parler je suis désolé
I'm just starting C++, but I was wondering why we needed bitshift operators in cout/cin
user406009
@AndrewL Because somewhere, someone thought that it looked cool.
01:23
>.<
user406009
And it's a lot less verbose than the alternatives.
Are you serious?
@LucDanton et pourquoi ? :hap:
user406009
@AndrewL Nah.
Lmao
01:24
@DmitriBudnikov bon plus sérieusement j’ai épluché Crossed et j’aime bien, faut que je revisite Chroma ptet mais ça prend pas aussi bien
@AndrewL We didn't (and don't) truly need them, of course. Quite a few people seem to find them useful though.
So there is no real vital use?
@Lalaland If memory serves, they were suggested by Andrew Koenig.
user406009
@AndrewL When it comes down to it, a lot of programming language features are of "no real vital use".
user406009
I mean, technically you could still program in assembly or something.
01:26
@AndrewL Iostreams could be defined in a way that didn't use them.
user406009
However, these little minor usability improvements add up to make the language better.
Trump wob 5 states today. #ShrumpForPresident :D
@Lalaland if you don’t use keywords regularly, you die
@LucDanton oui c'est un avis partagé par certains de mes amis aussi
01:26
I'm crying because Hillary swept Penn. Bern is coming though
user406009
@LucDanton Theoretically, you don't actually "need" most of them.
user406009
Like if, return, else, class, struct and const?
user406009
Useless.
user406009
A true programmer does everything by hand.
@DmitriBudnikov c’est con parce qu’on sent la progression dans les moyens et l’ambition, mais sans la ligne directrice 'cinéma + JV' pas mal originale et avec à la place l’attention portée sur des films critiqués et recritiqués (pour l’instant) on y perd beaucoup
01:30
> Visual C++ Team Blog
Constexpr: we need your input!
We’d love to hear about how you’re using constexpr
I'm not using it because your implementation of it is broken
next question
> Variadics: we need your input!
@LucDanton Maybe that's why Smalltalk pretty much died--it didn't technically have any key words (though there were a half dozen or so identifiers pre-defined that you couldn't easily redefine).
@LucDanton Je trouve Chroma tout aussi bien fait mais c'est clair que c'est moins appealing pour employer une expression à propos et francophone pour le public qui l'a fait connaître
Donc oui ils perdent une partie de leur public
C'est certain 16 7 1
user406009
Are there even any valid uses of constexpr?
to prevent MSVC users from compiling your project
@DmitriBudnikov oh c’est pas le JV qui me manque, je regarde 2-3 chaines sur le cinéma
user406009
01:33
Seems mostly pointless without stuff like reflection.
@Lalaland that’s the dumbest question I’ve read today
Trying to find a wireless rechargeable headphone that charges itself through Not-USB-C is a lot harder than I imagined.
I don’t like to make fun of questions, but it deserved that
With a mic to boot.
I think I'll just give up the search..
@LucDanton aba je sais pas alors
user406009
01:35
Actually nvm. I forget that you need it to use methods when template metaprogramming.
@ThePhD weird, usually you put the mic next to your mouth or neck
@DmitriBudnikov je re-regarderai avant de sortir un avis, histoire de tirer ça au clair
@DmitriBudnikov Snrk.
user406009
@ThePhD Wireless is really overrated.
user406009
Watching battery levels sucks.
user406009
01:37
I used to have a wireless mouse and keyboard.
user406009
And I swear it would always give out at the worst times.
has anyone tried this build system before?
haven't come across it in the past
@DmitriBudnikov quite fond of Tony’s Every Frame a Painting myself
(maybe I can give back that way)
is it also from jv.com :nerdsang:
ok, added to watchlist
:hap: :hap:
user406009
> VC++ is still a work in progress
user406009
01:45
Already seems sorta shit.
02:19
> Insanely high performance
stop it
Someone posted build2 here before
> Mitsubishi: We've been cheating on fuel tests for 25 years
looks like it’s a competition
Mi tsu, mi shi.
02:38
Ever since the Allied blockade in 1938
The real question is, why the fuck didn't the regulators catch them?
02:54
@Nooble u no it
Deflation ... Lol
what is up
I'm on a Python death march, its like a C++ death march but really, really slow
7
Also the movie March of the Penguins takes place in the month of March
@Mikhail I don't think they were ever expected to beat out something that was written for GPU. Have you tried anything with massively parallel CPU apps?
@Mysticial Well, when I used them we were trying to do (and were promised) exactly a GPU replacement. Whats a massive parallel CPU app? Maybe like a graph algorithm? Then you should use a barrel processor like the Cray Threadstorm?
Aha... false advertising. I never saw it as a GPU replacement. It looked more like a many core CPU.
Well, what kind of workload do you envision?
03:21
Compiling a really large project with thousands of modules would be interesting.
I suppose my pi program would also be interesting. But I don't think the memory usage is suitable for Knights Landing's topology.
Hmm, that sounds like an interesting application because its possible to run mpi programs, which including a mostly unmodified version of make (pmake I think). Although most of my compilation problems were solved when I switched to using Incredibuild.
I suspect there will be two problems for my Pi program on KNL. 1. The program isn't numa-aware, and KNL's 16GB MCDRAM has 4 nodes. I'm not sure how well it will perform in cache mode. 2 The program's explicit cache algorithm only works at one layer. Currently I choose it to be the LLC/memory boundary. Beneath that threshold, the algorithm trashes the cache. Above the threshold, it's efficient with memory access. The problem with KNL is that the (four) levels of cache is too much to handle.
Well, I think the more conventional approach is to wrap it in MPI. MPI implementations are good at avoiding A->A copies, so there is rarely a performance hit that can't be managed.
If I set the threshold to be 16GB (to match the size of the MCDRAM), the "trashing" that happens below the threshold is probably too much for the MCDRAM to handle. Furthermore, the size of the twiddle factor tables will be massive. (For technical reasons, I tie the twiddle factors to the size of the cache.) But if I set the threshold at the L3/MCDRAM layer, it won't utilize the MCDRAM at all and treats it like main memory. And there won't be enough bandwidth for that.
IOW, the cache algorithm needs more than one level.
Stupid Amazon !
We have not been able to confirm the billing details for your card visa ending in XX
Please contact the card issuer and have them send the information below to our secure fax line:
-- The last two digits of the payment card.
 
2 hours later…
05:22
Ven
Ven
05:59
Yo
What 's the weird user "Feeds" . it doesn even have a SO profile -_-
06:39
np.assarray
hehe
07:17
@Ell Ah, the good old "commit without add" blunder.
07:27
> Why as the message size increases the bandwidth increases?
lol
Ell
Ell
@fredoverflow yep :(
I then reset --hard after because I made some changes I didn't want
nwp
nwp
I use a bash script which does "git commit -a -m "$1" && git push --recurse-submodules=on-demand" instead of "git push" to avoid that
could probably be improved
07:45
@Ell I always do a dummy commit before I reset --hard
@DmitriBudnikov Isn't bandwidth a property of the transfer medium?
Ven
Ven
just stash :P
07:57
> “A common error is to say, ‘We didn’t handle this well,’ rather than, ‘Harry didn’t handle this well.
@fredoverflow Does Bartek know? :D
@wilx dude it's old as hell
@fredoverflow It's proportional to the message size
@BartekBanachewicz Ok ok ok. :D
avoid success at all costs remember
08:02
@BartekBanachewicz finance vOv
08:45
Why isn't there a headset that charges with Not-USB-C
Or, er.
Micro USB
Whatever it's called
It always breaks.
Ven
Ven
today's a slow day
zzzz sysadmin projects
@ThePhD um, be more careful?
today is article day
user1804599
bleh GH markdown doesn't <abbr>.
> Tip 1: learn at least one new programming language every year.
30s developer is wat
08:52
but what does it really mean to "learn" a new language
@Zoidberg when you encounter a new language do you feel you're "learning" it?
when someone gives me a toolbox, I just look what's inside. I don't try to memorize the location of every tool in it
it's good to know that you have a hammer somewhere there, so that when a nail appears you won't grab the screwdriver
@BartekBanachewicz I mean slowly, overtime.
Ven
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz there's no dichotomy
too vague
@ThePhD ditto. My phone's socket is starting to deteriorate after 3 years of heavy use.
I don't know why nobody just uses better / more stable power cables.
@ThePhD because consumer grade electronics aren't made to be used for more than 2-3 years
08:55
It's like the bain of my existence, these ones that slowly, veeery slowly, because of micro USB and stuff, just get jimmied out of place
And then you're just baaarely off from connectivity, and can't get a charge going.
@ThePhD if you want a headset that will last you a decade, buy something like sennheiser has, with the metal wires for charge
I have one that's I think 12 years old or something and works perfectly
@BartekBanachewicz I have that one, but I can't use it fore wireless talking / setup, unfortunately.
I'm trying to find basically a compact, microhpone version of that.
And all of the ones that look good end up having some rinky dinky Micro USB charger.
vOv be more careful
a USB port, even a cheap chinese one, can survive 10000 careful plugs and unplugs, or break after 1 careless one
Maybe I should just solder the micro USB cable in and never touch it again. :v
@ThePhD so much for wireless
bonus points if you actually solder in a neutrik there
09:01
I can hardly believe how fast my Lua interop implementation is, 27ms to do 1 million callbacks from Lua into a lambda that takes an integer and string parameter! 27ns per call avg.
I made sure it was really making the calls
> or that you help a younger developer by becoming their mentor (do not do this before the age of 30, though.)
pffff
@doug65536 That's damn fast.
I want to get that fast. qq
Ven
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz because you don't know enough java&xml before that age
@ThePhD I use a variadic template that walks the argument parameter pack, builds a tuple of argument values, and calls the operator() by unpacking the tuple with an integer sequence
@ThePhD is that anything like what your project's implementation does?
@ThePhD this shows the part I mentioned
09:21
@doug65536 this, in short, was what gave birth to Sol's precedessor
I think you asked about Sol's beginning once, and it was started by Rapptz indeed
But you might also want to take a look here
ah
now I see why my implementation is so much faster :)
-rw-r--r--    1 robert robert 2.3K Apr 22 14:26 20160422.csv
-rw-rw-r--    1 robert robert  10K Apr 26 17:17 20160422.csv.tar
-rw-r--r--    1 robert robert 2.8K Apr 25 14:58 20160425.csv
-rw-rw-r--    1 robert robert  10K Apr 26 17:17 20160425.csv.tar
-rw-r--r--    1 robert robert 1.2K Apr 26 14:43 20160426.csv
-rw-rw-r--    1 robert robert  10K Apr 26 17:17 20160426.csv.tar
help
We do something a bit different, I guess?
when did tar make all files 10 kB
@ThePhD not that much different. I dont use boost apply, I use argument unpack with integer sequence trick
09:30
aaaand it's snowing here
visitors are never good for performance either
09:42
@doug65536 yep
> P.S Is there a way to do this without using import statements? Trying to get a better understanding of the language.
god
@DmitriBudnikov sudo rm -rf *
@DmitriBudnikov tar has that much overhead? wow. how?
my question exactly
@doug65536 ...or our resident ieigiiieieia can't into tars...
I mean that's a possibility.
._. it's difficult to fail at tar
09:55
Is it also difficult to fail at ieigiiieieiaing?
ieieiieieieiieiei
finally fixed the water leak problem at my parent's other place (the one with 60-80 metres drive way)
TIL about ponysay
Desirable developer skills: 1 Ability to ignore new tools and technologies 2 Taste for simplicity 3 Good code deletion skills 4 Humility
surprisingly good list
user1804599
hhaha
user1804599
Today is king's day, and there's Facebook (by Facebook) celebration thing you can post by clicking a button, and it says "it's the perfect day to celebrate you're a Dutchman" and people are angry because of that.
user1804599
10:00
Because it's nationalism i.e. nazism i.e. racism.
@DmitriBudnikov tar -tvf file.tar.gz | less ... and see what files are in it. must be more than one, or all of them
@DmitriBudnikov you forgot about ia and g
@Zoidberg I think you should ignore them
user1804599
No you should ridicule them.
10:01
@Zoidberg tell me something nice you've learned about this week
what a cute couple - man & pig
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz You can match on Foo{} in Haskell even if Foo isn't a record, and it'll be equivalent to Foo/Foo _/Foo _ _/etc.
wow
I.
wow.
@Zoidberg this is pretty amazing
it's impossible to match some args first though, right? Foo a {}
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Turning a pure function into one that returns a monadic action is a PITA: github.com/purescript/purescript/pull/2057/…
user1804599
10:02
@BartekBanachewicz dunno
@BartekBanachewicz That would indeed be a blast
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Doesn't Android run on a gazillion different architectures? Or are they going to compile Swift to Dalvik?
File directly under "Very Bad Puns": twitter.com/sehetw/status/725264011164573698
Prelude> data A = A Int Int Int
Prelude> let f A{} = "test"
Prelude> let g (A x {}) = x

<interactive>:4:10: Parse error in pattern: x {}
@Zoidberg I think they meant to run it natively
Wait
Is that Haskell? Oh boy, I've been away for too long
Did it finally got records?
10:04
It's C++17
@Shoe no
8.0 still doesn't seem to be out yet
> Release candidate by mid-January 2016. Release candidate three available in early April 2016, release in mid-April 2016.
user1804599
PureScript has proper records.
Les slides de mon talk d'hier au meetup Postgresql à Nantes sont disponibles ici : https://blog.alexandre.berthaud.me/posts/2015-01-14-talk-full-text-search-postgresql.html
For us French loving Fringe
user1804599
type Person = {name :: String, age :: Int}

greet :: forall e. {name :: String | e} -> String
greet = _.name >>> ("hello " <> _)

main = log $ greet {name: "rightfold", age: 21}
While I appreciate PureScript's efforts, I think that Haskell offers the most usable platform now
Ven
Ven
10:09
@BartekBanachewicz row polymorphism + effects ftw :D
@sehe nice
I don't know where it was
Ven
Ven
(actually, I havn't done much PureScript at all)
user1804599
@Ven do more
@doug65536 We do exactly what you're doing, actually. Minus the new, since in the case of a lambda with no state, it is convertible to a function pointer, which ends up calling this, which is a more flexible / generic version of what you wrote in LuaWrap.
Ven
Ven
@Zoidberg I'm still codegolfing stuff
10:10
Albeit, we store function deleters and state in the lua VM, rather than inside of a C++ class.
Ven
Ven
> You can only counterflag messages that have been flagged
@ThePhD yes, I whipped that up quickly as proof of concept... I know the new is cheesy
Ven
Ven
u wot?
user1804599
instance hashNumber  :: Hash Number  where hash = gHash
instance hashBoolean :: Hash Boolean where hash = gHash
instance hashInt     :: Hash Int     where hash = gHash
instance hashString  :: Hash String  where hash = gHash
instance hashChar    :: Hash Char    where hash = gHash
10:11
@ThePhD what's with the variant type and std::functions ? Or a better question, what timings do you get
Variant?
> con_names is no longer total for ConDecl
@ThePhD oh maybe you are talking about something different than I thought
Ven
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz rekt
@ThePhD do 1 million calls from lua into a C++ lambda through that interop code you have, passing an int and a string, how long is that?
that will tell how same it is. it doesnt take much to disrupt compiler optimizations for this sort of thing
Ven
Ven
10:14
@Zoidberg use CPP : ^)
user1804599
No; deriving Generic is good.
user1804599
How to make mapM (\(b, e) -> (\x -> (b, x)) <$> g' e) es less ugly?
user1804599
TupleSections
user1804599
mapM (\(b, e) -> (b,) <$> g' e) es \o/
@ThePhD hey I dont know how fast your project's implementation is either. just guessing from your comments about callback perf the other day
Ven
Ven
10:25
@Zoidberg I think that's more readable than the point-free equivalent :)
@BartekBanachewicz on a site called macRumors
credibility: -0.5
Ven
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz that would be very nice
I very much prefer Swift to Java.
I prefer neither :<
I refuse to learn new language to do old tricks
I want to use old language to create new and useful things
Ven
Ven
learn cobol
10:30
did
but I love C++
...& Java ... & perl, not necessarily in that order
lol
@doug65536 ^ LuaJIT 2.0.4, Visual Studio 2015 Update 2 Compiler, Release Build, x64
Ven
Ven
@ThePhD nice c cast : ^)
I guess I have to try your code too to test how fast it is.
I forgot my computer specs.
The best thing is that that (double) cast is not needed at all :D
10:33
Probably not, but shrug.
Quick code is quick.
@ThePhD not far off... Look how simple the generated code is in my implementation, it goes straight to lua calls. it can't do much less than that
user1804599
@Ven COBOL is great.
Ven
Ven
@Zoidberg telkitty isn't
user1804599
Telshitty.
Ven
Ven
don't steal cicada's jokes
10:37
@ThePhD my timing included the entire thing, including creating the function and storing the global and everything
but still, not far off anyway (mine is tested on fast laptop with core i7 that turbo's pretty much constant 3.3 GHz
Does "debug message" have any code in it?
FOr me I just made it an empty macro
no, that is unreachable code anyway, but the compiler cant tell
== 43 is always false
I did that to try to really make sure the compiler wasnt doing any elision tricks
the volatile "gun to the head" might not have done it :)
total nanoseconds: 131711 ns
mean nanoseconds : 0.131711 ns
That's including everything
Except the print statement/
@ThePhD are you in linux?
No, Windows
So the numbers are unfortunately not directly comparable. qq
10:45
well, the only difference would be initial memory fault performance (commit on first touch)
and different calling convention. I am using g++ 5.2.1. a profiler would probably show you where time is spent
@Griwes what don't you like in Swift?
@BartekBanachewicz I don't particularly dislike it, just... don't see anything to like in it.
@Griwes It's a modern statically typed language with a focus on immutability and decent support for functional programming?
on paper Swift looks like the best thing ever
so you are saying it's basically Rust
10:48
lemme remind yourself
Rust has way more focus on handling low-level reference semantics and mutability
Swift is much more high-level
Okay, so it's a slightly higher level Rust.
Ven
Ven
it does ARC!
Does it have a Turing-complete type system? :D
@Griwes I think this difference is pretty important in practice. Different target groups, different typical use cases.
Ven
Ven
10:49
the compiler ICEs instead
@Griwes Why would that be important?
Does it have dependent types?
Ven
Ven
nope
I think there's less than a dozen PLs with deptypes nowadays
@BartekBanachewicz Because I want to be able to do arbitrary computations, also on type level, at compile time.
10:50
you can make C++ a high level language, just provide the right libraries
@ThePhD if it did I/O I would say absolutely not fair, but this is cpu bound, the OS is hardly involved
@Griwes You know about terra right?
Ven
Ven
lol
also
Why can't you just run a program instead of the compiler?
10:51
I'm not saying it's not a language for people to use; it certainly beats crap like Ruby or JS for virtually any use case. Just not something I'd want to actually use.
Instead of learning a new language every day, developers should aim at making useful stuff
Ven
Ven
@Telkitty don't be mean to rightfold
everyone can't be as productive as you are, telkitty
not everyone is as gifted..
@BartekBanachewicz Seen it, yes.
did I detect sarcasm?
Ven
Ven
???
didn't you publish apps and stuff?
10:53
yeah
Ven
Ven
so how am i being sarcastic O.o
whatever
wasn't sure, but thanks
Ven
Ven
@Griwes you'd just use C++ everywhere?
@Ven Until Vapor is usable, yes.
Well, almost.
I wouldn't use C++ as a HDL. :P
is there a C++ compiler written in haskell? I can only imagine how incomprehensible that would get
10:57
lol

« first day (2020 days earlier)      last day (3154 days later) »