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12:00
no, not really
testability is an important factor
I dunno, I don't have the experience to compare what you say with anything else
well I work on driver validation, right; We push the limits of what's possible with testing 3D applications
and it's hard.
alright, fair enough
but yeah, fuck it, I hope you'll be happy and get the job
it's not that I don't want to make games anymore :)
but again, my lack of experience can't link driver validation to gamedev
12:03
I see how buggy the games are :)
it's certainly not linked to what I've done so far (Unity)
in general all GPU vendors are closely linked to gamedev industry
because, all in all, their software is going to be the primary use case for the GPUs
@BartekBanachewicz I don't think I'll be unhappy considering it's the only thing that I do well and doesn't bore the shit out of me
I wonder if my AI prof would be fine with me presenting the assignments with another group of students
I so don't want to have to attend the exam one month later just because I didn't do two shit problems
at the start of the semester she was still in love with me, but now that I only attended 2 out of 10 labs, I think she may be a little bit disappointed
12:10
slightly offtopic, I need literature about Liquid Types. Recommend ITT
teamliquid.net
I recommend whiskey
> a system that combines Hindley-Milner type inference with Predicate Abstraction
I like beer
oh
now I understand what the article I read was about
it's... pretty god damn cool
@BenjaminGruenbaum you'd like this.
12:12
this is good too; I find it to be a nice replacement for soda if the situation allows for alcohol to be had
Bacardi Breezer, Breezer for short, is a fruit wine-based alcopop with 4.4% alcohol in Australia, 4%/5% Canada, 4.5% in Europe, but 6.6% in the United Kingdom, and 4.8% in India. It comes in a variety of fruit flavours: lemon, peach, pineapple, apple, ruby grapefruit, lime, orange, blackberry, watermelon, cranberry, coconut, raspberry, blueberry, pomegranate, strawberry, and mango, and it is also available in both chocolate and piƱa colada flavours. A number of the flavours are available in the Half Sugar range. The drink is particularly popular in India, Europe (especially the UK), Is...
@AlexM. Err... OK. After careful consideration and reflection, I think I'll stick to beer.
well I said it's a replacement for soda
but it's a bit expensive
I can buy 4l of coke with the money that would buy 300ml of breezer
yeah, but you probably don't WANT to drink 4l of breezer
true
but 4l of coke would last me two weeks
it lasts me about three days
12:16
dayum
not really
I buy the really, really cheap coke
Heay @BartekBanachewicz - what do you call those sound-level alert thingies that they have at gigs? They have lamps that indicate if the sound it too loud. I need one and I don't know what to Google for.
the stuff that's like, "1.99L of water, 0.01L of aspartame, and some carbon dioxide">
I start feeling weird after 5 glasses of coke, and sometimes my stomach starts to hurt lol
I have one or two glasses per day at most
12:17
Train cancelled of course.
Fucking trenitalia.
eh, you probably buy "real" coke that's full of shit and sugar
yeah
real coke does not contain sugar
@Martin I guess the ones that blow the siren when it is too loud are the way to go :D I found them easily by just "sound level alert/alarm"
@BartekBanachewicz OK, I'll Google some more. I found some that auto-cutoff the power to the stage, but if I tried that at the club I would end up with a cymbal shoved up......
12:21
@MartinJames angry neighbors?
@MartinJames can't you just use a compressor?
@BartekBanachewicz cute, but still crufty
@AlexM. Nah - the bar staff are complaining that some of the bands are too loud. Unlike customers who don't like the sound, they cannot escape it.
@BenjaminGruenbaum Compared to regular haskell, yes. Compared to other languages...
@BartekBanachewicz The bands often bring their own gear and it would be too much hassle asking them to link in a compressor box.
12:25
wait their own PA?
you should measure the maximum levels at the soundchecks
the band is busy enough on stage to care about the PA levels
Xeo
Xeo
ooh, I like how Transistor puts you right into the game as soon as you start it
@BartekBanachewicz Yeah, then after a few beers they turn the knob up to 11.
welp.
@Xeo $20, eh. I'll wait for some discounts
I don't like when games don't let me adjust options and take forever to go through intros and whatever
it has pretty cool art
Xeo
Xeo
12:27
@CatPlusPlus Did you finish Transistor already?
Xeo
Xeo
k
It's about as long as Bastion, you can finish it in one sitting
Took me 5h without doing side challenge stuff
If I get a box with 'too loud' lights and put it behind the bar, the staff will know that they are protected. TBH, with some bands, it would be a blessing if the box had a remote control that forced them to play ever more quietly until nobody can hear them:)
> (ignor that part plz) 1. This is normal text. 2. So is this, but now follows a code block Skip a line and indent eight spaces. That's four spaces for the list and four to trigger the code block. (ignor that part plz)
12:29
damn
why can't I copy from PDF
Bastion was better though
@AlexM. I sometimes go through five or six. Love the stuff.
@BartekBanachewicz you can
okay this paper is too hard for me :(
12:38
@Jefffrey which was the language that you had asked me to look into ?
@CatPlusPlus: I have recently finished reading The Void trilogy from Peter F. Hamilton. There is one altogether despicable character, The Cat. Your nick name reminds of her.
@Griwes What is the picture supposed to convey? That nVidia owners overclock too much and burn?
@ItachiUchiha I bet it was Haskell
user1804599
C.
@BartekBanachewicz yeah, tnxx !
13:02
drawing UML by hand is one of the greatest joys of college
just kidding, it sucks
So, um. How the heck am I supposed to join [Text] into Text?
May 15 at 16:52, by Lightness Races in Orbit
@Jefffrey You'll need to be more vague if you want us to have any hope in hell of not being able to answer your question.
It's not vague for haskellers.
@Jefffrey It's fffundamentally vague, even if Haskellers can guess at your purpose.
The idea of joining a list of strings into a single string is widely understood.
13:06
@Jefffrey Right, but you did not say that this is what you were doing. Now you have. Well, almost. Is it really [Text]? Will there only be one string in your list?
uuuh; can you just concat?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
[Text] is the type "list of Text"
@Jefffrey So, you meant, "to join a [Text] into a Text".
with Text being Data.Text, (and != String)
13:07
@Jefffrey IOW "what's the ++ for Text"?
1 min ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
Now officially in the middle of nowhere.
Hi.
user1804599
@Jefffrey mconcat
The source uses concat, is simple and made available right there on that page. It was the first Google result for haskell implode.
13:08
you can still concat [Text] tbh; there should be concat for Data.Text
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's a non portable library from 2010.
Have a nice day.
@Jefffrey What's non-portable about it?
implode :: Eq a => [[a]] -> [a] -> [a]
implode x [] = concat x
implode (x:xs) y
	|xs == [] = x
	|otherwise = (x ++ y) ++ (implode xs y)
Looks pretty "portable" to me?
user1804599
Text is an instance of Monoid, noobs. Use mconcat.
13:09
And why does it matter that it was written in 2010?
I guess the only reason it might not work is if Text doesn't have ++.
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit [a] is not Text.
Rightfold has a canonical answer anyway.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit it doesn't because a Text is not a list.
It's a fucking stupid language, anyway. Switch to PHP and use implode. Next.
:lol:
13:10
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
user1804599
Or Data.Text.concat.
2 mins ago, by ScarletAmaranth
you can still concat [Text] tbh; there should be concat for Data.Text
user1804599
If you want Python 'foo'.join, use Data.Text.intercalate "foo" ts
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
lol "intercalate"
13:12
> use php
> laugh at the naming of functions in other languages
Data.Text.reverseThePolarityOfTheNeutronFlow "foo" ts
user1804599
Fun fact: explode in PHP does not work with the empty string as delimiter.
How would you define "work" in that scenario?
user1804599
It returns FALSE instead of acting the same as str_split.
Good. It should.
user1804599
13:13
No, itā€™s horrible.
Why?
You can't explode on something that doesn't exist
user1804599
Also substr('foo', 3) returning FALSE instead of the empty string.
You should never need an array of single characters from a string and, if you do, index into the string itself.
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit The empty string occurs between every pair of characters.
Fuck. LLVM changed their triples to be incompatible with GNU's
13:15
@rightfold It also occurs within every character. And underneath. And on top of.
Now I need to handle the difference myself
Fuck GNU for messing those up in the first place.
user1804599
No, it doesnā€™t.
@rightfold Yes, it clearly does.
user1804599
Characters are atomic and strings are one-dimensional.
@rightfold Nowhere in the PHP documentation is that stated.
13:16
@LightnessRacesinOrbit "a" ++ "" ++ "b" == "a" ++ "b"
In fact, characters are often not atomic whatsoever when stored as bytes.
@BartekBanachewicz That is not valid PHP syntax.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yes, PHP documentation isn't very good.
@BartekBanachewicz No, the problem is you are thinking of some other technology, not the language you're talking about.
every programming language can be expressed mathematically
You can't make up some arbitrary requirement then, when it's pointed out that this requirement doesn't exist in the language, just blame it on documentation.
@BartekBanachewicz So? That doesn't mean you can take the mathematical expression of one language and blindly apply it to be required to another.
13:17
what rightfold was referring to was the more generic representation of a string that's fundamental to it to work
as in, he pointed out that PHP is broken.
@BartekBanachewicz Yes, I know, and he was retarded to do so, because we are talking about a specific implementation.
yes, and that specific implementation made nonsensical decisions
It's not "broken". It takes a practical approach, rather than fondling the cocks of you theoretical astrowankerists.
There is no use case for converting a string into an array of characters, when the string can already be indexed. It's almost always a programmer bug, so now it returns FALSE and spits a warning. That's a good thing.
"practical" means mostly "as one person thought would be funny'"
Shuffling a string
Strings are typically immutable, while arrays are not
Dunno about PHP
@LightnessRacesinOrbit not what? He made a good point.
Implementation detail aside, strings are immutable in very few languages
13:19
Also characters are not bytes, tyvm
@BartekBanachewicz No, not really. Stop defending your boyfriend for no reason.
binary clock in xfce is awesome. it's probably the best thing in linux I found so far
@CatPlusPlus Yes, exactly. So characters cannot be stored atomically.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit what? Immutability is a "rather" important property and a lot of programming languages have immutable strings.
Look there's no way around this. You're wrong about everything ever just get over it guys
13:20
Representation is not relevant to semantics
@BartekBanachewicz The majority [of modern languages] have mutable strings.
user1804599
I think strings are immutable in PHP.
@rightfold You're, once again, wrong.
user1804599
Thereā€™s .= but strings are always passed by value.
Please list languages with mutable strings
user1804599
C++.
C++ has immutable string literals, coming from C
user1804599
C++ has mutable strings, so it is a language with mutable strings.
okay, so it has both.
user1804599
Ruby has mutable strings too.
13:21
C++, C, PHP, JavaScript, VB, C#, Java, TPSIScript,
Not C, not Java
Not C#
If a mutation requires physical byte-wise copies then that's an implementation detail/limitation; as long as the mutation is possible then you don't have an immutable string type.
user1804599
irb(main):001:0> s = "hello"
=> "hello"
irb(main):002:0> t = s
=> "hello"
irb(main):003:0> s[0] = "q"
=> "q"
irb(main):004:0> t
=> "qello"
user1804599
:P
"Not C"? Are you out of your mind?
13:22
@LightnessRacesinOrbit every immutable object can be modified by copy
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Uh what
what you have said makes no sense whatsoever
An array of characters is a string in C and of course you can modify characters in an array of characters...
and displays the fact that you most probably don't understand immutability
13:23
C strings are mutable when converted into arrays
@LightnessRacesinOrbit but you can't modify a string literal.
@CatPlusPlus You're conflating "C strings" with "string literals". You should look into that
@BartekBanachewicz Never said you could. Why would I?
Okay, I'm going to come back when the know-it-all kids have gone home...
Enjoy being wrong and not accepting it! <3
insulting a discussion opponnent(s) is a tactic you seem to employ often these days
2
Oh look I just mutated my previous message slightly
@BartekBanachewicz It's not a "tactic" ā€” it's a pleasure
right, it's not a discussion.
13:24
No, it's not
It's you lot talking a load of crap and me taking the piss out of you and eventually getting fed up
I'm with LRiO; C char arrays are horrible but they're how you do string handling in the language
You conflate "Lounge" for "high-brow official debate venue"
I'm p sure VB has immutable strings too, but cba to check
what's with this "p" stuff?
user1804599
VB or VB.NET?
13:25
@CatPlusPlus Actually, you're right about that: VB[.NET] strings are awful and definitely immutable and I've been hit by that in the past
e.g. strcpy, strcat
@ecatmur That's... not really relevant :/ I said arrays are mutable and WOAH mutable C strings are arrays who would've thought
@ecatmur character arrays are arrays, not strings. I'd say that string literals are the closest C has to real strings.
user1804599
Doesnā€™t VB.NET use System.String which is immutable. :v
@CatPlusPlus You said strings are immutable in C :laffo:
@BartekBanachewicz String literals are static, immutable C strings. That doesn't make C strings immutable.
user1804599
13:25
I agree with Tomalak.
anyway, the original problem was that PHP employed a model that has a lot of exceptions dictated by so-called "practicality"
Yes. It's designed to be used. Not wanked over.
user1804599
Itā€™s not designed.
I think the main point is that at least I don't think that perceived practically should be something driving the language design ultimately.
13:27
Shitty systems full of idiotic design decisions are very usable yes
@rightfold yup, worked. Thanks.
Language should be consistent and not surprising with arbitrary decisions. It's only achievable by constructing models grounded by mathematical ones, and avoiding personal choices.
user1804599
Beh the fact that Data.Text.concat exists. :|
Actually JS strings are immutable too
Now, avoiding, not removing them altogether.
13:29
So from the languages you mentioned there's C with non-existent type system w/e and C++ and PHP
@CatPlusPlus krsort
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus What do those have in common?
Mutable strings
user1804599
Mutable strings?
user1804599
Not sure PHP strings are mutable. :v
user1804599
13:30
Ruby strings are mutable, too.
Actually C doesn't even have a string type, so double w/e
8
Q: Are php strings immutable?

Henrik PaulOr: Should I optimize my string-operations in PHP? I tried to ask PHP's manual about it, but I didn't get any hints to anything.

user1804599
I think with PHP strings mutability is irrelevant.
user1804599
$s .= $t is equivalent to $s = $s . $t.
user1804599
And they are passed by value, not by pointer.
13:32
damn, I wanted to add another line to my critique, but then I've realized that LRiO would just "take the piss out of me and eventually get fed up"
user1804599
Then plonk him. vOv
Ooh, Fortran has mutable strings!
<?php $s = "hi"; $s[0] = 'b'; echo $s; ?> It's mutable. It doesn't matter whether a copy is performed under the bonnet to make that happen.
We're not in a CS class. This is programming, and programming languages are abstractions over byte fiddling.
13:36
ahhhh my boiler is having three hours of working
heattttt
@LightnessRacesinOrbit <?php $s = "hi"; $t = &$s; $s[0] = 'b'; echo $t; ?>
user1804599
@ecatmur same thing.
user1804599
$t refers to the variable $s, not to the string.
I love that Origin is giving away free games to try to convince people to use it
user1804599
I want to write something in Haskell.
13:39
@rightfold huh. Wow, that's horrible. Thanks for putting me straight.
@rightfold yep
the variable is the string
PHP doesn't really expose underlying "objects" in the way that C++ does
website design is so not my speciality
Yeah your site design could use a bit of work tbh
"a bit" -> "all the"
I was trying to be nice
13:42
it's ok
it's not; it's terrible
website design is like CV writing, it's a skill I simply don't claim to possess
so pointing out that I don't possess it is merely stating a fact
Upgrade Bootstrap to 3 and you're done :v
13:44
template <bool ClaimedToPossess, bool ActuallyPossessed>
struct Skill;

struct DeadMG
{
    std::set<boost::variant<Skill<true, false>, Skill<false, false>>> all_skills;
};
nah
I think I can quite safely claim to possess at least some skills
Wow it's so boring we got to C++ jokes
You're skilled at not having skills
lol
Did you get any interviews yet?
13:46
I think that I was over-snarky to the Bloomberg-recruiter guys, since they haven't contacted me back
Can't even login to Origin because the security code mail doesn't arrive gg
I haven't applied anywhere else yet because the flipping hospital haven't contacted me about my surgery
getting to the point where I'm gonna call them and ask wtf's going on
@DeadMG When were they supposed to contact you?
13:48
Truly terrible
they actually didn't say that either, which is unhelpful
only that they would contact me in the future.
You allowed that?
@BartekBanachewicz Can be answered? Probably. Should be answered? Most likely not. — Dukeling 9 mins ago
for fucks sake.
fucking idiots
well, they said that I'd probably have it done in late may or early june
but not how much warning I'd get in advance.
trwtf is answering shitty SO questions
13:51
@CatPlusPlus s/shitty//
You're right, they're all shitty
@CatPlusPlus I had such a great answer for that
Why would you encourage that stuff by answering it?
@BartekBanachewicz :coal:
13:52
Why would you give it to them though
hello all I have to build pjsip native library
did you just remove "dickwad" from your post and then flag me?
good luck with that?
for all architectures
can any one help
as I dont know much c
nope, not a soul
13:53
Ironic racism is still stupid thing to do hth
@BartekBanachewicz Why would I flag you?
Not racism bleh
> This user has been automatically suspended for posting inappropriate content and cannot chat for 29 minutes.
Ok, maybe that's why.
I'm sleepy
What's the other word
13:54
homophonic?
Don't ping me who the fuck are you get out
5
@Bansal_Sneha: Cease.
sorry ?But I need help
Nobody cares
13:55
okay
you have mistaken us for people who offer help
Flagging so useless
OK, well, I didn't flag the Cat message. Invalidating that one
Got @Bansal_Sneha, though
> This user has been automatically suspended for posting inappropriate content and cannot chat for 59 minutes.
@Bansal_Sneha wtf you doing?
we are getting shit load of flags, stop pinging random people
13:57
Who killed Waldo
@Mr.Alien He can no longer.. speak.
Flagging is over now.
@Mr.Alien Ah just some beggar making a racket. He's gone now.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit auto block, awesome
Thank you for your patience.
@Mr.Alien Yeah, someone's gotta administer this shithole.
it will be good if stack provides blacklisting option for room owners to add users to blacklist
13:58
Because you're bad at programming hth
no
no we cannot.
user1804599
> This user has been automatically suspended for posting inappropriate content and cannot chat for 1 hour 28 minutes.
user1804599
What did I miss?
begging
he pinged everybody he could think of for help
There's always so much drama here.
13:58
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Matrix reference?
@rightfold He started pinging everybody present, with no message. Then eventually sorry ?But I need help. Even I am not okay with that level of introductory shitspasm.
@Avery \o/
user1804599
@DeadMG What an idiot.
@Maxpm shrug Most of it is just playful banter.
@Mr.Alien Ahahahahaha yeah right
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yeah, on second thought you're right.
13:59
That's what happens when you take intelligent people like me, Xeo and Robot and cram us into a small space with people like Cat, DeadMG and Bartek.
(see??)

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