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2:53 AM
hopefully not, I will not purchase any electronic goods that leaks charges ...
 
@Mysticial did you buy more ram just for teh rgb factor
 
@Mikhail I actually needed more ram. The RGB is just the cherry on top.
Since I recently (January) built a new rig around the ES 7940X that my company let me keep.
Initially, I put it in my rig from last year. But the RGB on the ram was so bright that it basically blinded out rest of the build. And there's no way to dim it down.
So I moved it into my January build where all the RGB components are blindingly bright anyway.
^^ You can see the that the ram is overexposed in the picture. They are really fucking bright.
 
3:12 AM
heat + plastic doll = partially melt, sticky doll
not hot enough
y ppl !good @ physics
 
3:55 AM
@Mysticial Actually that's pretty cool, its got an almost Akira (1988) color scheme but where is the second socket?
 
@Mikhail You mean the other build?
 
(* making fun of you for using single socket pleb components)
2
 
@Mikhail Didn't my single-socket shit outperform your dual-socket before?
Because mine was overclockable and yours had shitty clocks? :)
 
@Mysticial One of those systems had like rank 10 on your Pi program benchmark owing my once impressive 256 GB of RAM
 
ITT, turn your PC into a hatchery
be the first person to hatch eggs using your quad core cpu
 
4:02 AM
Next month I'm starting with some super ovulating mice, which hopefully I'll incubate until hatching
 
@Mikhail A rank of 10 isn't very impressive when there's only like 10 people participating. :P
 
Its going to crawl out, but won't find anywheres to attach to, because surprise, you're in a glass petri dish :-)
 
It's summer, but it was a bit chilly last night. I thought about using raspberry pi as a source of warmth for the baby chicks. But I wasn't calculating anything or using the pi otherwise so I didn't end up doing it
 
@Mikhail When you say incubate, you mean you can grow mice completely outside of a body?
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix no, just for like 7 days. But the concept of a hatching blastocyst is cute.
The technical limit the artificial placenta, but there are existential challenges like there is no use for an artificial womb when you can just use a real womb. Despite the prospect of growing people in tubes pretty cool.
^ basically my career goal
 
4:12 AM
Actually using an artificial womb has many advantage
Growing people in tube is one thing but we could actually grow animals that don't have a real womb to grow in
 
Which is equally frivolous :-)
Basically its useful if you have a baby that needs to stay in longer, the current gap though is in the early formation of the placenta.
So to address that, they actually have people working on keeping embryos alive but the target application is more like keeping preterm babies alive. I don't think there is a single grant for the whole process.
 
4:35 AM
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix FYI, there is an old method to transport embryos (that almost worked) where you can move them in another animal, like using a rabbit to move goat embryos. I think it was first used in the 1930s to ship embryos across the Atlantic before air-freight was practical.
 
5:24 AM
First time I hear about that
 
 
4 hours later…
Ven
9:23 AM
Hi lounge
 
9:57 AM
@sehe I had my first recital on Saturday :-)
 
10:13 AM
@Columbo what did you play!
Did you go entirely solo, or in cooperation with other performers
 
Yeah it was solo, two Etude-Tableaux, Skriabin Prelude and Nocturne for the left hand, Skriabin Etude, Brahms Cappricios, Brahms Intermezzi, Brahms Rhapsody Nr. 2
 
@Puppy cool
 
I have one or two recordings, if you like I can pm them
 
10:29 AM
@Columbo I'm seriously impressed.
@Columbo Yesh :) What platform? Twitter?
 
jww
@milleniumbug - We isolated the problem to GCC 8 with -O2 and -fstack-protector-strong on ppc64-le. It is not related to Fedora; GCC 7 is OK; and -O3 with -fstack-protector-strong is OK. It looks like a GCC issue.
 
@jww cool
 
@sehe Sure.
 
10:47 AM
@Columbo I'll listen to the rest when I'm back. Seriously impressed already.
 
11:27 AM
Note that this only works for installed packages. — JonnyJD Oct 15 '13 at 17:08
I have a hard time not questioning the general competence of the Python ecosystem
 
took me a second, but you're not complaining about showing dependencies of randoms hit, but not showing dependencies of not-installed packages, right?
 
yeah that seems pretty dumb#
for woofington-temp I committed all the packages and set the packages.json to reference exact versions
 
@Puppy so it's a hard freeze?
 
we just had some shit at work where some noob who was warned about this did not do that and then surprise surprise, some package updates means you can't build the application any more 6 months later
@BartekBanachewicz We can always update whenever we choose to.
 
11:40 AM
sounds awfully primitive
but sure, I don't care all that much about being on the cutting edge of redux
WebGL is frozen anyway
 
the core issue is that a) NPM can't be trusted to keep all the relevant versions around, and b), package maintainers can't be trusted to properly track their compatibility and stuff
so if you don't do it this way, your project randomly breaks later on
 
sounds like NPM ecosystem needs its own Stackage
 
NPM ecosystem needs to be competent
 
heh, that too
so anyway
where do I put my code
 
haven't plugged in the canvas yet
probably gonna do that once I've finished playing KSP ;p
 
11:44 AM
lol
 
accidentally launched my 3-crew rocket with just 1 crew
so now I gotta go back and pick them up ;p
after I already had to relaunch the mission because MechJeb broke the EVA controls
third time's the charm me hopes
 
some people never learn I swear
stop making complex stuff seem easy
 
yeah it's abysmal
 
no, I think that's a fine function
the simplifications seem acceptable for, well, simple uses
 
it's only slightly less bad than rand
 
11:59 AM
@milleniumbug what about it /cc @BartekBanachewicz
 
no, it's a lot better than rand
 
^
 
<random> is a lot better
 
because a) it specifies thread-safety, and b), it specifies the quality of the randomness you get back out
 
It actually removes all the problems of rand.
 
12:00 PM
and c) you can specify your own range
 
@BartekBanachewicz It is <random>
 
@BartekBanachewicz *for more advanced use cases
 
thread-local engine is just slightly better than a global one and still not good enough
 
it's fine for most simple use cases
 
also
> The behavior is undefined if a > b.
 
12:01 PM
ok yeah, that sucks.
it should obviously throw
 
Aaah yes, that seems to be the problem! So many hours wasted on a single space. It's strange that it worked fine for all those months. I will verify it soon and accept the answer if it solved the problem. — N Jacobs 1 hour ago
 
@Puppy or "just work", like uniform_int_distribution does
 
@Puppy I think the idea is that there is a cost to the range check (my response would have been: then "optimize" by using uniform_int_distribution)
 
@sehe It costs a fuck of a lot less than random UB.
 
in fact, it being UB directly means they don't mandate it to be implemented on top of u_i_d
 
12:03 PM
and this is the simple use case thing, remember? people can always use <random> if they need more advanced use cases
 
but it states: "produced using a thread-local instance of std::uniform_int_distribution<IntType>"?
 
@sehe it does fix some of the problems rand has (well, except the predictability across compilers), but I find it questionable that the "simple" API has no migration path to the "advanced" API
 
it's dumb to UB here
 
@Puppy hehe - not the point. I was thinking about potential rationales
 
@ratchetfreak lmao, so it just adds a random UB for the lulz if it does that
 
12:04 PM
knowing how to use randint won't help you compose distributions in a useful way
 
@milleniumbug what do you mean? What would a migration path look like?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Have to admit I don't really know what the existing <random> engines do in this case, would have suggested that they also throw, but if they don't UB there's even less reason to UB here.
 
@Puppy the equation stated on cppreference seems to suggest it should work if b > a
 
@milleniumbug The whole point of randint is that if you're using it, you don't need to know how to compose distributions.
 
or a > b whichever's which
 
12:06 PM
you're complaining that one tool for one use case does not teach you how to use a completely different tool for a completely different case.
unsurprisingly, it does also not teach you how to implement your own iterators
 
I think part of the problem for usability of easy random numbers is the fact that the distribution doesn't store the generator, yet it keeps its own state
 
IOW you can't do u_i_d<> dis { 1, 6, gen }.
 
@sehe randint(min, max) -> randint(engine, min, max) -> uniform_int_distribution<> dist(min, max); auto i = dist(engine);
 
Segmentation fault is so much better than UB, Bartek calls it "Just Works"
 
12:08 PM
but at the same time you also shouldn't do auto r16 = lambda u_i_d<> { 1, 6 }();
@sehe lol ok I stand corrected
 
:)
 
why are the distributions classes instead of functions?
 
but a guaranteed segfault is still better than UB :P
@Puppy they keep state
 
what state do they need to keep?
 
@BartekBanachewicz That's not a good enough reason.
 
12:10 PM
the uniformness?
no idea
 
@Puppy not much reason except that constructing one every time (for example, to create a CDF from a list of probabilities in the case of std::discrete_distribution) may take longer time than reusing it
 
I would have thought that the engine holds all the state you need
 
like, I don't even know if using the same distribution object on multiple engines would produce uniform results
 
In fact, I remember reading that you could easily use new temporaries of the uniform distribution each invocation.
 
if it wouldn't, then that design is seriously fucked
@sehe oh, so that's new for me then
 
12:11 PM
I think it's just to hide the parameterization.
 
@milleniumbug OK, but that assumes the class design in the first place, as in, there must be some useful shit you have to do on construction, etc.
it doesn't justify it
 
And yes, it's a good question why that is, because it means that just the free functions taking the distribution parameters was equally good.
I bet it is for uniform interface with distributions that do keep mutable state.
There are many.
 
even uniform int one has reset
no idea if it does anything
 
Yeah well. .NET's IEnumerator has a Reset as well. Precious few implement it. I think it basically always throws
 
only used for some COM uses I think
 
12:14 PM
I think that Hell++ could store state in the distributions and it would make a difference between not reusing and reusing, but no one sane does that
(because PRNGs are cheap to call and have large periods, no need to "reuse" bits)
(at least, no one sane does this with uniform_int_distribution)
 
a typical gaussian distribution implementation will store state because it generates 2 gaussian distributed samples from 2 uniform distributed numbers
 
@sehe The Skriabin is too long (6 minutes), I could send it over a private YT link
 
@Columbo please do
@milleniumbug I think there are distributions that can't correctly produce the distribution without mutable state.
 
12:35 PM
@sehe With randint, I have to use uniform int distribution with the specific PRNG. If I want a custom distribution, I now can't use that "don't care, just give me what randint uses" engine with it. If I want a custom engine, but I'm fine with randint interface, I can't use it either.
randint(engine, min, max) and random_engine() providing access to that engine would provide that migration path
 
@milleniumbug I'm not sure whether the "per-thread engine of type std::default_random_engine, initialized to an unpredictable state" is available. Yes, it would be great if they made it so. Perhaps that... could be used to subvert the results though. Mmm. That's Machiavelli
@milleniumbug The randint interface is literally just using uniform_int_distribution so yes you can. It's only the engine that might not be exposed
I think it's a perfect idea that the simple interface is added. It's is a real solution to the factual problem that everyone still uses rand() (this includes me, because I don't want to pollute easy SO demos with multiple lines of <random> code vomit)
 
<random> is a bad api for quick and easy randomness
 
That
 
for example there is no way to easily have a prng engine create a seed_seq for itself from another rng
 
12:55 PM
@sehe I don't teach rand() anymore
 
Nobody does
That's not the point.
 
Ven
1:11 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Cool kids didn't like ints anymore, so we thought we could lure them in with rad ints.
 
but typod it?
 
Ven
@Puppy we're not very good at luring kids in
7
 
pedobear warning
 
2:03 PM
That's because you're using proper English
@nwp All OP's downvotes are forgiven
 
nwp
That's not quite right.
 
Give the manwoman a break
 
nwp
They probably will.
 
2:44 PM
@LucDanton Gah. Met my yak again coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/c759c4b4f1128058 - never mind about the algo (I'm just reviewing the mess I found here). It's about the newline.
And of course, the moment I got the idea to tell you about it, I remembered std::exchange :)
Just to troll, watch grandma play that with one hand :)
Thanks for sharing that though. It's really nice to see people with talents like that.
 
@sehe Well that's just unbelievably right in the feels.
 
It is. Amazing feat. It just hurts to see the wobbly fingers struggle. It's amazing that she has tone control like that.
 
@ThePhD interesting (LuaPlusPlus)
it looks like he isn't really rewriting
as he's basing on the existing impl a lot
 
@BartekBanachewicz yeah goal is upgrading the API to modern C++ and propagating various optimizations that become possible like that
for example moving strings into the lua engine when it makes sense to do so
 
3:05 PM
@ratchetfreak fun I guess
but I still like my impl better :P
 
3:18 PM
constexpr Lua parser, when? :p
 
constexpr is overrated
4
 
I agree
 
no, constrexpr everything!
even Haskell should be constexpr-ed
 
@login_not_failed there's TH which is arguably both worse and better at the same time
 
It's convenient when you need to pass the result of an integer function to a non-type template parameter
and handy for constexpr if conditions
 
3:21 PM
@Morwenn yeah and that's about it
 
but apart from that, people just like to make overkill things (like constexpr regexp parsing) :p
 
I still can't build convenient hardware descriptors in C++ during compilation so....
but that's not just the problem of constexpr of course
 
built-in regexpr, when x)
 
std::tumblr
 
3:41 PM
std::shithole
@login_not_failed constexpr all the things, but do it implicitly. IOW, just let the compiler do its job
 
@sehe it was a very bad joke, sorry
 
absolved (one strike)
 
I just remembered Jason Turner and his talks at CppCon, can't stand that much constexps
 
> CircleCI is running your tests
well hurry up
oh also @Puppy we don't have CI yet right
 
right
 
3:45 PM
I like Circle
 
I've used Travis in the past
 
old travis was meh
 
I was thinking of trying to push build output to github pages on successful builds
 
but they have heavily upgraded it
@Puppy yes
 
but I think that after I commit some of this stuff you can worry about that ;p
there, pushed
 
3:55 PM
uu
so that's my component right
how do I react to input
 
what, Canvas?
what input do you want to react to?
right now I only rendered the world's most terrible-looking button
and then you click it and then that's it ;p
 
@Puppy well I mean I have to expose the API to you
so would I do that in this component or do I need/want some middleware
 
no, I'm pretty sure it's the other way around
I will render the UI and give a shit about input in the DOM
then I fire actions that change the state
 
oh right that's the UI
 
then you just render shit on the canvas
 
3:57 PM
wait
 
the main thing I'm not sure about is how the physics stuff would work
e.g. do you need some special web worker or some shit like that
 
I can fit in a frame
I mean I could use another thread for that I guess
 
eh
 
right know I just want to get the hold of the structure
 
my current plan is to wait until just doing the physics in the reducer is too slow
;p
 
3:59 PM
good idea
I'm just wondering where you want to map the game state to the render request state
 
that would be componentDidUpdate in the Canvas
 
ok let me clone this
 
React calls that whenever the Redux state changes
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz btw, you remember the rts-like project we had started a year or two ago for a fake game jam?
 
@Ven which one
 
Ven
4:00 PM
I had my students write their own. Got some neat ones.
 
you can also take the previous state as an argument if you want to do some diffing/incremental updates/whatever
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz We only did one thing together, ever.
 
well then admittedly I don't remember
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz here's a reminder then
 
@Puppy that won't be necessary for now
@Ven oh right that
I think I mostly did lobby and game joining and that shit
and not much of actual game
 
Ven
4:01 PM
yus
hey, I had the placement working :P
 
@Puppy so how do I build
 
run ./gulp in bash, working directory is repo root
 
apparently I need this thing called node
 
yep
current version, not LTS
 
wait so is 6.11 too old?
crap
 
4:04 PM
yes
that's the IE6 of Node.js versions
2
 
that's what my pacman has -.-
 
Ven
I'm still on 0.8
updated some stuff to 8.0 to get util.promisify
 
4:31 PM
promisify?
waddafuq
 
Ven
@Puppy turn a node-like function with a cb arg to a promise
 
Jun 5 '17 at 17:38, by Mysticial
@Puppy "waddafuq" looks like an x86 instruction: Wide add aligned to float unsigned quad word.
 
 
3 hours later…
 
 
5 hours later…
11:46 PM
@Puppy wrt to my previous inquiry, idk how i got the error I was getting because i havent been able to get it since, and i actually got it to work (though I had to get rid of the ES6 module thing from the react-faux-dom example)
 
@Mikhail So AMD and Intel keep claiming that they will completely fix Spectre in their next gens. And for a while I've been doubting that's even possible. Though I think it might actually be possible.
You include the cache/branch state as part of the misprediction roll backs.
A simple (but incomplete approach) would that if a misprediction happens, you invalidate any cachelines that were pulled in during speculation.
This will fix the out-of-bounds exploit example. Though it's not a complete fix as you've still evicted something out of the cache - a state change that could still be measurable. Though now the attack is significant harder to pull off.
A complete fix would be a separate cache that buffers all speculative loads from memory and higher-level caches and commits them only once you leave speculation mode.
 

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