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10:04 PM
How can pop_front never return.
 
@StackedCrooked If it always throws an exception? :)
 
lol
Anyway shared memory isn't the way to go. Transactional or not.
 
Shared memory would be horrifying. Just imagine what would happen if you could read everybody's mind by just looking at them.
 
Ugh. I'd rather not.
@rightfold lol
 
libgomp: Thread creation failed: Resource temporarily unavailable
^FML
 
10:14 PM
You need more threads.
 
I have all the threads
 
does anyone here have any experience telling the IT department "you should know better!", and 'go fuck yourself'
 
@rightfold Why would it never return? Obviously it will return (or throw)
 
Ell
@StackedCrooked spurious sleep
 
speaking of sleep
 
10:21 PM
@Mikhail Yeah, you're fucked.
 
nwp
@Mysticial heaven
 
@Mysticial I'm just so fucking sick of the Linux stack. In principle, with a lot of work, and error checking, I can achieve he same performance as Windows but not out of the box. I think as somebody who went Windows->Linux, I've seen how much easier things are on Windows, in contrast to people who have lived in a Linux cave for all of their lives.
 
kinda sums up Linux really
if I put in 100x the effort I might approach what could be done easily on Windows
 
Also anybody using ZFS on more than 4 drives is in denial, and should buy a $100 dollar RAID card.
 
user1804599
@Puppy When the queue will never be not empty
 
user1804599
10:31 PM
Itll block
 
@Mikhail That's exactly how I feel. The people who rant the most about Windows are the ones who have never really used it.
 
Ell
I think windows users rant about Linux and Linux users rant about windows.
4
How about that?
@Puppy yes but you're a special case ;)
 
@Mikhail Newegg has 2TB drives for $60. No tax shipping to IL. I'm tempted to get 8 of them (to complete my other build), but I need to cut back on my spending.
 
That would be very tempting if I could fit it in my budget.
 
I'm also budging for a Skylake X/Purely build later this year.
And based on the info that I have about it (including a ton of info which I've been provided under NDA), this one is going to be much more tricky than my silly Ryzen build last month.
Tricky in terms of getting what I need. I certainly hope I won't run into as many stability issues.
 
10:43 PM
@Ell Nope, I'm also a Linux user, and I've built my own kernel, an have written a driver before (for a class...). When I was ignorant I ranted about Windows.
 
IOW, I'm not gonna be able to drive out to Microcenter on launch day and have something running that evening.
I give it a 90% chance that the shit I need will only be available online. And it won't be cheap.
 
^ Is there anything special about that build?
 
@Mikhail Skylake AVX512.
 
@Mysticial FYI, recently was really impressed with this RAID card. Six drives run at 800MB/s with comparably low IO saturation amazon.com/HighPoint-RocketRAID-2720SGL-8-Port-PCIe/dp/…
 
Ell
@Mikhail So you must rant about both then
 
10:48 PM
Its also RAID 6, so 5x150 is around the expected.
 
@Ell I'm primarily a Windows user at home and Linux user at work. I rant about both.
 
Ell
I'm the opposite :D
 
The main issue I have with Windows is that certain resource allocations take longer by default than Linux (malloc for example), also response times of things like notifying condition variables, by default, are worse. On the other hand I think preventing programs from fucking over the system is a good design choice.
 
I forced myself to learn Linux back in 2010-ish prior to entering grad school. That was done by porting y-cruncher to Linux. It was not fun. While it didn't help much in grad school, it certainly did at my jobs.
 
On the other hand Linux gives me bullshit about running out of resources, when the Windows configurations don't.
 
10:51 PM
A common pattern with Linux software that steps forwards come with steps backwards. Like, "Cool new version of Qt has better autocompletion. Oh but they also broke font rendering." (Which will be fixed eventually, but in this case it took over a year.)
Finally got used to gnome2. There comes unity!
Bye bye usability for a year or three.
 
Yeah, they keep fucking themselves over on the user facing side. But I've also noticed that the system internals a lot less mature, as evidence by frequent internal system resource exhaustion (threads, memory, etc), especially comparing to Windows released in the last decade.
 
Linux is not user-friendly. Windows is not tech-savvy-friendly.
 
I remember a few years back Ubuntu came with this startup disk creator utility. It's supposed to be used for making bootable usb sticks etc. But when I click on "Create bootable disk now!" nothing happens. Just nothing. No error message.
A few years later and that seems to be fixed now.
Good for them.
But by now I've learned how to do it using a command line magic incantation. (From Google of course.)
I could never remember the command so I have to Google it every time I need it. But at least it works.
 
Maybe run WINE + Rufus?
 
And as I got better at Googling my Linux user experience became more tolerable.
 
11:00 PM
The only piece of software that I can't get for Windows is KCachegrind, I think there a few other profiling tools that don't have equivalents on Windows.
 
That's one of the very few good GUI applications in the whole Linux world.
 
FYI, you can built for Windows
Obviously, it only opens valgrind files, so no Windows use...
 
At work I'm kinda forced to use Linux.
 
time to reboot
@StackedCrooked What do you do?
 
Mostly implementing a tcp stack for a network traffic generator.
So much time goes into working on the TCP code.
But also other stuff.
 
11:10 PM
I was always wondering about this: what are the theoretical advantages and disadvantages of having the network stack in the kernel? I heard that for very high workloads people move it out of the kernel...
 
Hm. Good question.
Yeah. You need to move it out of the kernel if you want really good performance. Linux barely can handle 10G and there's 100G cards on the market.
 
Ell
I find that counter intuitive
 
I also find it counter intuitive but I think its true, from previous discussion on HN
 
@Borgleader ah-hahahahaaa
 
Ell
Why isn't there a "stock" userland network stack if having it in the kernel is slower?
Then you gain other benefits of userland drivers
And also get better perf
 
11:13 PM
@sehe :)
 
Another complicating factor is that network card bonding (using 2 10G ports to get 20G) is implemented differently between vendors. When I asked people about it, they told me to go see a IT professional. Also the people I spoke to were IT professionals (similar to the bullshit you get on Server Fault)
 
@Ell Kernel is still fast enough for most people. (I.e I have a 30Mbps DSL connection at home.)
 
Ell
@StackedCrooked I suppose the effort of moving it out of the kernel isn't worth it
 
It's only worth it if you need 10G+ speeds.
 
Ell
Well speed isn't the only benefit surely
If the kernel driver crashes then it'll bring the whole system down
It also means a smaller kernel which means less surface area for bugs
 
11:22 PM
IDK, do you really trust linux user land developers? I'm more confident about code in the kernel compared to code in Qt :-)
 
@Borgleader flop
 
@Mikhail Did they mean "autistic" rather than "acoustic"?
Not sure what an "acoustic son" is...
 
@Mikhail That's one of the weirdest pictures I've seen.
 
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