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1:00 AM
@ThePhD I linked the source, bub
 
@sehe I think I stumbled on it by accident, and then spent a while seeing how far I could mutate the example I found on SO.
IIRC, it wasn't very far
 
I discovered what ADL really was when I tried to implement generic math functions.
 
:(
 
And thought it was actually awesome.
 
How do I put a move-only type into an unordered_map?
 
1:02 AM
emplace maybe
 
^
emplace is a buttiful thing
 
Just don't use operator[].
 
error:
      call to deleted constructor of 'sometype'
      : first(__a), second(__b) { }
                    ^      ~~~
 
@Morwenn I discovered the true, debilitating, implications of ADL when I answered this gem of a question:
10
A: Getting the address of template class object leads to full instatiation of template parameters

seheAnalysis/explanation: What you are seeing is shallow instantiation, not full (see below for proof). ADL is the culprit here. Hypothesis II I'm suspecting an ADL-related thing here (classes can have static free functions (friends) declared inline. Perhaps the compiler needs to instantiate th...

 
@caps is the move constructor noexcept
 
1:03 AM
@jaggedSpire i think you mean emplace_back is a buttiful thing :)
 
@jaggedSpire right on the mark
 
@jaggedSpire It's = default
 
excerpt from the list of things i have never used: noexcept
 
@Borgleader but it's so shiny
 
Which should make it noexcept...
The only member is a std::string
Adding noexcept did not make the problem go away.
 
1:04 AM
@Morwenn It's basically how you expect overloaded operators to work, and then your jaw drops that it even works for ordinary functions (followed by, derp, of course: those operators are also functions)
 
really I haven't much used it either. MSVC 2013 didn't have it
 
@ThePhD It's basically saying if you have something like f<T>(c);, there has to be an f (that's a function template) that it can find without ADL. Then it may (for example) find and eventually invoke a different function template in the same namespace where c is defined. But, if it doesn't find a function template for f without doing the ADL, it stops parsing when it gets to the <, says you have a syntax error, and that's the end of things.
 
@jaggedSpire ive only a very vague idea of what it does (besides, us gamedevs dont have exceptions enabled anyway :P)
 
cue minor nerd rage
 
@caps SSCCE please
 
1:05 AM
@sehe Yeah, that's some kind of magic.
 
@caps likely a library implementation thing. I remember having to switch libstdc++/libc++ sometimes
 
The most impressive thing about C++ is that compilers work for some values of « work ».
 
@sehe libc++ drools
 
@Borgleader noexcerpt
 
@sehe heh
 
1:06 AM
hah!
 
throw()
 
@caps huh?
sehe@desktop:~$ dpkg --get-selections | grep libc++
libc++-dev:amd64				install
libc++-helpers					install
libc++1:amd64					install
 
@sehe Not sure libc++ is available on all the dev boxes right now, so switching to it isn't an option. Would love to use it instead of libstdc++.
I think it will be available down the line, but not yet.
 
@caps not sure I'd recommend it. You'll have to control all your dependencies (making sure they link to libc++ as well).
As it happens I don't know a distro that builds with libc++ by default
 
@sehe Ah, yeah, one more reason it will be a while before we can switch to it, if ever.
 
1:09 AM
@Borgleader you can use it to evaluate the noexcept state of a function, and also to declare a function noexcept, so in a template you can say "This function doesn't throw exceptions if this other function doesn't." noexcept is generally useful for cimplolers because it's more compile time information for optimization for them, and useful for you because it's easier to be exception safe when you have some functions that won't throw,
so you can make noexcept, strong or weak exception guaramtees in client code, making it easier to reason about, etc.
at least, that's my understanding
 
@jaggedSpire Wait, how do you write a dependent noexcept?
 
if an exception exits a function marked noexcept, std::terminate is called.
 
void a_fun() noexcept(constexpr_boolean_condition_when_it_s_noexcept)
 
@jaggedSpire Or like auto foo() noexcept {}; auto bar() noexcept(foo()) { foo() };?
 
1:13 AM
Interestingly, I seem to recall that implementations are technically non-conforming if they mark library functions noexcept when they aren't specified to be so
@caps wouldn't be valid. You'd want auto bar() noexcept(noexcept(foo())) { foo() }
 
@jaggedSpire Nice!
What if bar() calls multiple different functions?
 
outside is the conditional noexcept marker, inside is the noexcept operator evaluating the expression
 
noexcept(noexcept(foo()) && noexcept(somefunc()))?
 
@caps I believe so. the noexcept operator returns bool
 
@jaggedSpire And it's constexpr, I assume?
 
1:16 AM
that seems to be a reasonable assumption. The information it's using should be available at compile time
 
@jaggedSpire Well, how else can you use it to mark a function as constexpr at compile-time?
 
@caps that as well
@Borgleader oh god why
Hmm
I have a cheese grater
would this be good for spaetzle making
not that that is a sudden shift in topic or anything
 
@jaggedSpire it would be espaetzly good at it
 
@Borgleader slow clap
 
1:19 AM
:)
Welcome to memory lane :D rest of soundtrack
 
@Borgleader You mean espaetzly grate?!
 
@Nooble oh cheese, how did i miss that opportunity T_T
 
hehe
 
@Borgleader your pun power is being diluted
you've given too much to me
but my specific punnage is much higher than yours, so the level of pun is much less notable.
do you want it back?
 
no ty, it will regenerate over time
this makes me want to boot up my 360 and play ssx3.
 
1:24 AM
@Borgleader When I played SSX3 I'm pretty sure it was on gamecube.
Long time ago.
 
I used to play SOCOM: FTB3 on my PSP.
Story was fine, multiplayer was the funnest shit.
 
@caps oh shit, it came out on xbox O.O
woops
its even older than i remembered
i feel old now T_T
 
The multiplayer was so limited, and the community was so small (everyone knew each other).
People invented game modes.
Oh it was swell.
Then they shut down the servers. The community I was a part of for so long just died like that.
 
rip
 
@Nooble damn, I'm sorry
 
1:29 AM
Am I bad for wanting stored_enum<std::uint8_t, TheEnum>
Instead of coupling enums with their storage representation
 
But we still had the forums.
@jaggedSpire Shut down like 4 years ago. I was 12 ahahaha.
Oh man it was fuuun.
 
@AngryLettuce Nah, you don't need that to be bad ^_^
 
Ell
@AngryLettuce I think that kinda makes sense
Idk how itd work though
just declaring something of type of the enum would use a default representation?
 
We should add cpp-sort to loungesome-cpp. It's obvious. Much useful.
 
<insert something mean here>
 
1:40 AM
@Ell I just wrote one
~20 lines
This way I can have stored_enum<SomeEnum, big_endian<std::uint16_t>>
amaze
C++ is best C
 
@Morwenn :3
 
@AngryLettuce C, C++, what is the difference.
 
@AngryLettuce 0.
 
user406009
@Nooble a computer bursting in flames due to undefined behavior.
 
user406009
1:47 AM
Shoot, autocorrect is dumb.
 
@Nooble ...at least if that comma is actually a comma operator so they're evaluated from left to right. If it's just a comma between arguments to a function (so it doesn't define sequencing) it's just undefined behavior.
 
> More about Rust — Jump straight in
wow that's p homophobic
and here I thought the rust community was more "accepting" than the others
boy was I wrong
 
At least the C++ community is accepting.
 
@JerryCoffin But but C == C++.
I think.
 
@Morwenn more like they don't give a shit
 
1:50 AM
@AngryLettuce Complains about homophobia; immediately uses "boy" as an expletive.
 
@Nooble Yeah, because sequenced before and stuff.
 
user406009
There is actually a lot of drama going on in the PHP community about this sort of thing.
 
user406009
Since people want to instate a code of conduct.
 
What?
 
@Nooble Not necessarily. == doesn't define sequencing, so it could be either true or false.
 
1:52 AM
@JerryCoffin I thought there was no sequence point in this expression so the ++ was always eveluated later?
 
user406009
@Morwenn here is one of the anti-CoC essays paul-m-jones.com/archives/6214
 
@Morwenn I'm pretty sure the C++ community is very hostile if you're stupid
 
Ell
Night all
 
@Ell Night.
 
1:54 AM
nite
 
Personally, I like that what matters is competence
@Ell night
 
@Morwenn The question is "later than what?" The C++ clearly yields the value of C from before the increment--that much is true. But, it's possible the increment could then take place, and after that, C would be evaluated again to retrieve its value for the left operand of ==, so it now gets the incremented value.
 
@jaggedSpire The C++ community is indifferently hostile, isn't it?
 
@Morwenn ...thinking about it, prooobably
and I love it like that
it matches my soul
don't tell ThePhD
 
@jaggedSpire Nah, you're a pedant fucker like everyone else and you like that a strict community recognizes you as one of them.
 
1:57 AM
@Morwenn pedant fuckery is one of my many traits, yes
<3
 
type_traits
 
The only real traits are type traits.
@Nooble Ew~, screw your speed :(
 
you traitist
 
> a pedant fucker
well to each their own, I guess
 
@AngryLettuce eeey bby
 
1:59 AM
where's @Elim when you need one
 
really I'd argue with the label but if I did I'd start laughing too hard to breathe and that gets old fast
 
@Morwenn Koalas are known to be the fastest reptiles in the universe.
 
Nooble Facts
 
rep-tile
 
Noble fracts
 
2:01 AM
repeating tile? Tesselation? Illuminati?
 
@jaggedSpire All 100% true.
 
Illuminati Confrimed
 
fact: koala farts are rich in eucalyptus
 
@AngryLettuce Also kerosene.
 
2:03 AM
speaking of flammability and eucalyptus, I have posted that video of the Victorian fire tornado, right?
that isn't something I've somehow forgotten to do at every point since I joined this chat?
 
@jaggedSpire on mumble
a very long time ago
 
@Nooble oh excellent. I hoped I hadn't deprived people of that
back when Mumble was active and I was naive
and Nooble was actually 14
 
> was
mumble needs to be active again
tomorrow is Friday
 
@Nooble you can't still be 14
 
@jaggedSpire Koalas don't age beyond 14 years.
 
2:06 AM
I remember you turning 15
and then Scott saying you were still 14 in his heart
 
No you don't. It was all a dream.
Scott died in a madarating accident.
 
> Madarating
make this a meme immediately
 
user406009
I just can't wait until Friday.
 
@AngryLettuce M'dara.
 
user406009
At 4pm I will finally be free of the MCAT (and probably the premed life in general)
 
2:14 AM
@Lalaland You're a med student?!
 
user406009
A mediocre one.
 
@Lalaland Hahaha.
Alright you can be Rapptz #2.
Since he died.
 
Rapptz is a med student? Since when
nobody tells me anything
 
user406009
@Nooble and I am/was premed. I am still in college.
 
@AngryLettuce Wasn't he a doctor?
 
2:19 AM
"Tech companies should stay out of the encryption debate" -- company that gave the NSA a room in their data center https://t.co/wakWjJvwGQ
☑ rekt ☐ not rekt
ok, time for bed
tomorrow is friday~
(inb4 stupid links)
 
Fairly sure Rapptz held a doctorate too.
 
what
yes he does but how is that related to medicine
doctor != medic
are you pulling my leg
because that'd be a very good troll which I'm stealing
 
sup
 
YO RAPPTZ
ARE YOU A MEDIC
 
look it's Rapptz the 15-yo neurosurgeon
 
2:25 AM
it's complicated
 
@JerryCoffin Ahh, I see.
 
Oh! Hello, Alex
 
@Rapptz Hiiiyo.
 
I'm an oncologist.
 
@Rapptz If I were to stop breathing at your door, would you know what to do?
@Rapptz Ooooh fancy.
 
2:27 AM
yeah I guess
 
Rapptz, I'm gonna do a presentation on sol in my school.
 
I saw the ping
 
@Rapptz lol
 
@AngryLettuce ikr
official title
 
Kill all the cancer!
 
2:29 AM
why the fuck does an oncologist do C++ on their free time
also,
> oncologist
> free time
impossible
someone is lying but who
 
@AngryLettuce #toogood
 
Not all doctors work themselves into the dirt.
 
I haven't written C++ in months
 
@ThePhD wot
 
there goes all my respect for you
at least you must be a specialist in meme cancer
so there's that
 
2:31 AM
You guys have known me for so long
Why is this new
 
I knew you were in biomed
But I thought you were more on the computer side of things
 
Nah
Our computers barely updated from Windows 9x to 7 2 years ago
I'd hate to work on those
 
> Why does memmove work but memcpy doesn't produce correct results?
well... who knows :D
 
user406009
Then what brought you to this chat? ( if you don't mind me asking)
 
how dare you ask such a mortally offensive question of Our Lord And Doctor Rapptz
 
2:36 AM
Rapppppppptttzzzzzzzzzzzz.
 
Lounge is a special case of cancer I guess
Maybe he's doing a case study on us
 
maybe he's just #disgusted
 
He should kill meta.
 
are you saying meta has metastasized
 
@jaggedSpire ...and is now doing its best to kill SO (and SE in general)? Yes, exactly.
 
2:42 AM
had to eat dinner
come on you nerds
I've known programming forever
before I even went into college
 
So why biomed
Why abandon us
why
 
it's not like I was a medical worker first and then a programmer
I rolled dice to say where I wanted to go when I grow up
 
user406009
Then why get an MD and go into oncology?
 
and I got biology
I figured since biology degrees get nowhere I'd just become a programmer
but
one day I had to do an internship to satisfy some requirements
so I did an internship at a hospital
and I really liked it there
 
and then the fire nation attacked
 
2:45 AM
so I said I wanna work in a hospital
 
that moment when your planned wizard rolls a highter Wisdom score than expected
 
hospital workers are nice man
you guys always talk about how your co-workers are dumb and what not
but hell I think everyone I know is smart
 
I hope the fuck they are
 
the only annoying people I interact with are some nurses
everyone else is pretty nice
 
so you lied about the djihad part too
wow
 
2:48 AM
que
 
speaking of cancer
why is using robert = std::declval<int>; not hallal
 
what is it supposed to do
cause function aliases are not supported
 
oh right
I was only testing your skill
doc
 
lol
 
lettuce test your skill
 
2:56 AM
nerds
btw I haven't used C++ in months cause of Python
been working on this thing: github.com/Rapptz/discord.py/tree/async
 
oncolo gist, the gist that is hosted on a colocation server
amirite
 
@Rapptz Wow, not even American English :o
Sorry, I missed the Color = Colour.
 
lol yeah
that library sucks up all my free time
 
@Rapptz At least people are expecting something from your project :p
 
:<
 
3:42 AM
WHATS UP
HELLO FROM LINUX CLASS
 
@StackedCrooked archeology or forensics
@VermillionAzure When do they teach keyboard?
 
@sehe man keyboard
NO MANUAL ENTRY FOR KEYBOARD
 
So how do you do entry? Nasal?
Mad props for that. I'd not want to be seen chatting during class like that
 
MY NKSE ISSSD TOIP BIGG
no, jk polar bear
 
That's actually funny.
Assuming you misspelled dick
 
3:47 AM
IDENTIFICATION DIVISION.
PROGRAM-ID. HELLO.
PROCEDURE DIVISION.
DISPLAY 'Hello. World.'.
STOP RUN.
^ Most elegant programming language ever.
 
@StackedCrooked ?????
 
COBOL
 
> STOP RUN.
You had to tell it to stop running.
 
We're used to seeing it here. Not a day goes by or one of them weird Dutch-enabled specimen show it
> MOVE ZIG.
 
3:48 AM
> FOR GREAT JUSTICE
so um do any of you have networking experience
 
Stop it with the all-caps :)
 
b/c we're about to jump into it
any tips?
It's all in C
 
@VermillionAzure I prefer to leave the job to hardware
 
There's no "START RUN." however. How inconsistent. I should write a proposal to their committee.
 
I'd imagine Beej is a good resource
 
3:50 AM
C = despair; // checks out
C = vain; // checks out
C = good fun; // logic_error exception
C = shambles; // ok, proceed
 
Oh wait. If it executes "START RUN." then it'd already be running. How silly of me not to realize that.
 
@VermillionAzure Don't imagine. It is
 
@sehe hm
 
@StackedCrooked "START RUN" is likely a physical control (like "PRESS PLAY ON TAPE")
 
Looks like our first assignment is to write some sort of client/server with TCP
in C
 
3:51 AM
Night all
 
@sehe night
 
@StackedCrooked The elegance of crawling through the mud, combined with the fantastic utility of stiletto heels, and the blazing speed of...well, okay, I'll stop now.
 
no, by all means. It sounds like you have some things to get off your chest.
 
Snrk.
 
4:14 AM
@sehe Nah--that'd be a JCL EXEC command (or something in JCL, I'm pretty sure).
 
 
2 hours later…
5:44 AM
Oh look MSVC 2013 doesn't support sizeof(T::nonstatic_member)
bullshit
C++11 complicance my asssssssssss
 
@AngryLettuce sizeof(std::declval<T&>().nonstatic_member) as a workaround
 
Yeah that's what I do
Why the & though
 
out of habit
 
6:16 AM
@AngryLettuce Sometimes g++ doesn't properly add the & to the return value of declval.
 
@AngryLettuce upgrade to 2015 :p
 
> note: template argument deduction/substitution failed:
concepts will improve your compiler diagnostics!
much better
 
Got a quick question, networking related.
If I'm using my router, all my queries/communications go through it, so it represents me on the net. However, is the IP from which web servers receive queries the same as that that another user on my LAN will have when communicating to the same web-server?
 
Alright.
 
6:23 AM
the requires requires bit looks really unfortunate but can’t be avoided really, it doesn’t always make sense to turn it into its own concept
(it is not a typo)
 
This makes a couple things a bit more ambiguous for me though @AngryLettuce.
For one, when packets go across the net, the MAC addresses are routinely changed between jumps, whereas the IP desintation/source remain the same.
 
If so, how does my router get to change my IP?
 
It remembers it
 
So it actively swaps out my LAN address for it's WAN address?
 
6:26 AM
This is called NAT (Network Address Translation)
 
Okay, so that's where it comes in.
Thank you.
 
hopefully this makes the requires requires wart beautiful in comparison
how much can you make C++ stutter? template<template<typename> typename> requires requires { true; } …
 
Herb Stutter
 
6:54 AM
> The Company has raised $30mm to date
what the hell is a dollar millimeter
 
megamillion, obviously :p
 
the work of a confused mind
the amount of bullshit people can spew is astonishing
if only we could turn that into renewable energy
 

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