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11:00 AM
looks like weird pattern matching
 
patern matching on steriods
 
it looks like a weird switch with bool pred(obj) as cases or sth
 
'weird'
looks like most forms of pattern matching that I've seen
 
@Rapptz most forms of pattern matching (I've seen) are statically typed.
 
this doesn't imply it's dynamic
 
11:02 AM
either dynamic or it automatically unwraps the Either<Long, String>
 
> Aniket Deshmukh has invited you to join Room for Aniket Deshmukh and Cicada. See your invitations.
welp
 
@AlexM. ugh
 
user1804599
@AlexM. which programming language is that?
 
@rightfold Kotlin
 
@LightningRacisinObrit Did your present arrive yet
 
11:04 AM
TIL emoji slang is now a thing.
 
user1804599
 
Can you guys like not get comments, I'm answering to, deleted? kthxbye
 
> Statically typed programming language
for the JVM, Android and the browser
 
> and the browser
 
user1804599
TypeScript also has type unions.
 
user1804599
11:05 AM
Crystal as well.
 
@AndyProwl But not as cute
 
user1804599
They're different from Either in that there's no wrapper.
 
user1804599
So the only operations you can perform on them are the ones that are available on both types.
 
I can see something like this working lol
when (enemy.fightingStyle) {
   is Melee -> adoptFightingStyle(magic)
   is Ranged -> adoptFightingStyle(melee)
   is Magic -> adoptFightingStyle(ranged)
   else -> adoptFightingStyle(melee)
}
I like it
 
Alex is hooked on Kotlin :)
 
user1804599
11:07 AM
They're like, unions discriminated by the vptr.
 
that one just looks like a basic switch
 
All forms of discriminations are bad
 
user1804599
The EU is a discriminated union.
 
@Cicada Unless they are directed towards LRiO
 
@AlexM. Why "Unknown", doesn't it have to be a string at this point?
 
11:07 AM
Or Bartek
Or telkitty
 
@Cicada Are there specific forms of discrimination that are worse?
 
@AlexM. this looks just like switch
 
@fredoverflow dunno, I took it off their site
 
@Jefffrey warned you
@Columbo uh
 
@Columbo An instance of positive discrimination!
 
11:08 AM
Anyway, I think Kotlin does a really good job of being a "Java with the warts removed".
 
user1804599
All this reminds me.
 
@Cicada #notallunions
 
user1804599
I should implement pattern matching in Mill.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Dude this is not my categorization scheme! I just made it up!
 
@BartekBanachewicz judging by their example I guess in mine Melee and the others should be subclasses of FightingStyle
because is compares types
 
11:09 AM
oh right
 
Just like a basic switch! :)
 
wipe that smirk!
 
user1804599
Can't switch on type equality.
 
@LucDanton Discrimination against me
 
@AlexM. amazing, so it's a dynamic_cast and a switch?
 
user1804599
11:09 AM
You need switch (true) and then case x instanceof T.
 
lol switch true
 
@Cicada How dare you discriminate forms of discrimination?
 
user1804599
Switching on type equality only works in the absence of subtyping, which Kotlin lacks.
 
@BartekBanachewicz typeid.
 
@Rapptz or that yeah
 
user1804599
11:10 AM
@fredoverflow Mill has no else if. You use switch true instead.
 
doesn't work though
 
which is Almost Static Typing (tm)
 
have to do hash_code
 
@LucDanton You can't discriminate against discrimination, cf Gödel
 
@Rapptz .~= C++ =~.
 
11:11 AM
@BartekBanachewicz Why do you have to hate all languages that aren't Haskell?
 
@fredoverflow I don't.
 
user1804599
Because they're not Haskell.
 
Dunno why you'd get that idea
 
anyway I like their pattern matching
seems cool
would use/10
 
11:11 AM
I still don't get it.
 
Name three languages that you like except Haskell.
 
@fredoverflow Lua, Prolog and Brainfuck
 
lmao
 
lol
 
fair enough
 
user1804599
11:12 AM
APL, Go and Perl.
 
Haskell98, Haskell2010 and Haskell'!
 
Rust, Go-lang and Nim :^)
 
@Rapptz Does Kotlin have pattern matching yet? Awesome.
 
Concurrent Haskell, Polyphonic Haskell, Quantum Haskell
 
Xeo
C++, C#, Python
 
user1804599
11:12 AM
Mill, Nok and Styx.
 
Template Haskell!
 
@Cicada Quantum Haskell has a different name IIRC
 
D, Big D, Bigger D
 
Of course nobody likes Safe Haskell.
 
C, C++, C/C++
3
 
11:13 AM
@LucDanton :'(
 
user1804599
C/C++ = ++
 
Welp, "Bigger O" notation sounds fun
 
@rightfold You are bad at math
 
> Just like with if, each branch can be a block, and its value is the value of the last expression in the block.
it's more like expression matching
if that's what this is
 
11:14 AM
@Rapptz That's not pattern matching. Pattern matching destructs values, like case (a, b) gives you access to the elements of a tuple in Scala.
 
pretty sure they have an example doing that
or I misread it
 
I dunno about pattern matching it really looks like just a list of predicates one after the other, with their execution stopping when one returns true
 
By the way: this concept of pattern matching was first invented by Rust, a novel, high performance systems programming language for the Web.
 
like
 
11:14 AM
Pattern matching is definitely on the list of TODOs for Kotlin, and the language evolves very fast.
 
oh nah
 
@Rapptz I don't see it
 
that was a 0 and a 1
 
@rightfold C/C++ = 1/++ = --
So this is bad
 
How long do you guys keep nightly builds and their reports around for?
 
11:15 AM
C/C++ is clearly 67/68
 
0,1 means 0 or 1
 
it looks like you could just replace every case of when with bool myStuff(obj) { return obj is String } for example
 
user1804599
 
@LightningRacisinObrit until the next morning
 
@BartekBanachewicz NOT IN GERMANY!!!!
 
11:15 AM
for the case is String
 
user1804599
 
Languages are not the problem. Libraries are.
 
@AlexM. Seen another way, if is a special case of cond.
 
@Rapptz really no archives at all?
 
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|                                      +-------------------------+  |
|                                      |                         |  |
|    SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT              |   WRITING CODE          |  |
|                                      |                         |  |
|                                      |                         |  |
|                                      +-------------------------+  |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
shit
 
11:17 AM
@Jefffrey You can use all Java libraries from Kotlin.
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey Use Nok, where almost everything is a library feature!
 
ffs fucking chat hiding part of my message
 
@BartekBanachewicz True. Your point?
 
there we go
 
@BartekBanachewicz Thank god
 
11:18 AM
@BartekBanachewicz lol "see full text" actually makes it smaller
 
@Jefffrey lol
 
Mar 23 '14 at 22:55, by Cat Plus Plus
Because chat is very well coded
 
@BartekBanachewicz Can't we all live in peace? Why are people always debatin' and shit
 
> Note: Deque can be a deque, a back_extended_deque or a back_extended_deque
welp
 
@Columbo like, what's your opinion about that
 
user1804599
11:19 AM
I don't see why if shouldn't be a function.
 
@BartekBanachewicz About what
 
user1804599
Why'd it be special?
 
Life?
 
> Why are people always debatin' and shit
 
@rightfold It can be a function if it takes the next branch as an object, ie, if you reify the control flow
 
11:19 AM
The joke <-------- ... --------> Columbo
 
user1804599
In Smalltalk it's a method!
 
In lambda calculus also
 
:22875334 yeah see that's why
 
user1804599
In lambda calculus it's a Boolean!
 
@Jefffrey Oh it was a joke!!
LMAO
 
11:20 AM
no, it's a function
 
Men life is shit if you don't get jokes
 
Who is that funny guy that kept flagging iharob's comments?
 
"kept"?
Boost ugly? It's one of the most respected C++ libraries there is. Many things from Boost find their way into the standard (e.g. shared_ptr) such is the level of authority is has on the C++ community. The Spirit EBNF grammar parsing library is simply brilliant. — Bathsheba 19 mins ago
> The Spirit EBNF grammar parsing library is simply brilliant.
[citation-needed]
 
> The Spirit EBNF grammar parsing library is simply brilliant.
there
hth
 
11:21 AM
Booshit
 
also told you to not engage in this shit throwing contest
 
Boost-ugly = butt-ugly
 
Boost.Graph is, for example, quite hilarious
 
[sehe-needed]
 
@Columbo Please no
 
11:23 AM
@Columbo Well, it is.
 
Mentioning BGL in the Lounge is like mentioning Nazi Germany in Germany
 
@BartekBanachewicz That guy is bo[a|o]sting all over the place
 
@BartekBanachewicz it is fairly clever
makes grammar easy to define
 
@BartekBanachewicz The fuck do you care?
You'll have less to say about this when I'll start throwing pizzas at you
 
11:26 AM
( Í¡° ͜ʖ Í¡°)
 
user1804599
λλλλλλλλλλλλ
 
@Jefffrey no argument here
 
@rightfold It appears to me you like lambdas.
 
@rightfold hl3 confirmed
 
@Rapptz well don't get me wrong, I love declarative parsers
 
11:29 AM
well time to sleep
 
@sbi: I don't actually recall where and when we were going to meet today so let me know
 
@fredoverflow English, Nuxalk, and Quenya.
@Puppy lol
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes If we even did. I remember a day but not a time. In fact, ISTR that we might have explicitly deferred it because he might have been attending some evening session.
 
TIL about "up or out" rule in USA police
 
user1804599
S = U(U(U(UU)))
K = U(U(UU))
 
user1804599
11:33 AM
U is absolutely fascinating.
 
sounds like a nice way to combat Peter Principle
 
Ven
U_U
 
"Publish or perish" is a phrase coined to describe the pressure in academia in the United States to rapidly and continually publish academic work to sustain or further one's career. Frequent publication is one of the few methods at scholars' disposal to demonstrate academic talent. Successful publications bring attention to scholars and their sponsoring institutions, which can facilitate continued funding and an individual's progress through a chosen field. In popular academic perception, scholars who publish infrequently, or who focus on activities that do not result in publications, such ...
k now I leave
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't know what that is. Or "up or out".
 
Ven
do c++ developers hate std::async and std::future?
What do people seem to think of the proposed await or async keyword for c++17?
 
user1804599
11:35 AM
@Ven everyone does.
 
user1804599
use Boost.Coroutine
 
I wonder. do c++ devs hate the future..
 
Ven
@rightfold do you have anything that explains a bit more why it's broken? a paper, a blog post, anything?
(anything that's not "@rightfold doesn't like it", that is :P)
 
user1804599
Async APIs are always broken.
 
val data = ...
data?.let {
    ... // execute this block if not null
}
@fredoverflow this language is seriously cool
 
11:37 AM
I know, right?
 
user1804599
@Ven You have a different calling convetion for sync and async functions.
 
user1804599
This makes composition and genericity hard.
 
Ven
@AlexM. what is this?
Looks like some kind of kotlin
 
it's kotlin
 
@Puppy do you know what Google Search is?
 
user1804599
11:39 AM
I wish in Haskell every function returned monadic action.
 
@Rapptz I was sure this wasn't the only example.
 
Ven
alright :)
 
user1804599
That way, you had only map, not map and mapM.
 
user1804599
It would also do away with abominations like implicit laziness.
 
@AlexM. There's also a lot of YouTube videos on Kotlin in Android. That's what you wanted, right? Or was that somebody else?
 
11:42 AM
@AlexM. I think you might rewrite the frozen song lyrics with that language
 
Ven
@rightfold why "implicit" laziness? It's just "laziness"
 
@fredoverflow that was me
it's pretty unlikely for me to get anything from proposing a switch to kotlin but it doesn't matter
I'm already having fun with it
 
@BartekBanachewicz I do, but I'm busy working.
 
11:46 AM
lol
 
> But May has said there "might be an opportunity for three of us to get back together on the BBC to do Top Gear or a car show of some sort".
>
> "The BBC haven't completely closed the door on Jeremy's return," he told the Guardian.
>
> "They've not banned him or fired him, only just not renewed his contract for the moment. It's a subtle difference, but an important one."
>
> Earlier this week, Shillinglaw stressed there was no ban on Clarkson returning to the BBC, despite director general Tony Hall's decision to fire him last month, saying "a line has been crossed".
Top journalism.
 
@LightningRacisinObrit is this soap opera still continuing?
 
*person in the know points out that Clarkson was not fired*
"Yes, someone said last week that he could still come back, even though he was fired"
#derp
 
Ven
why was he fired?
 
@Ven because he slugged a producer
 
Ven
good :>
 
Wow, Chile sucks. First a volcano and now it turns out they don't even give people names.
@Ven He wasn't.
 
Ven
Wow, Eric S. Raymond is a pretty big piece of shit..
 
@Puppy not to busy to explicitely write here about your lack of knowledge. I find your attitude exemplary; everyone should be aware of his/her shortcomings. I wish everyone was as open about expressing them as you.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Pot. Kettle. Black
 
11:50 AM
@LightningRacisinObrit better not be from some 50 Shades of Grey review
 
lul
@Ven Yes
@Ven He's an arsehole
@BartekBanachewicz the fuck
 
Giant stingray 'nibbles' on diver's head, would sounds less marketing oriented if it's "Giant great white shark 'nibbles' on diver's head" instead
 
So this is the volcano.
You can sorta see why the Greeks thought the gods lived up a mountain.
inb4 there were no Greeks in Chile
 
no that's Mordor
2
 
Xeo
11:53 AM
@LightningRacisinObrit The pictures are amazing
 
@LightningRacisinObrit lel
> App has the backing of Kanye, Madonna, Rihanna, Deadmau5, Nicki Minaj and more
lol "backing"
 
I wrote some code
 
@AlexM. Nah, that's in Titan.
Doom Mons is the name of a mountain range and its eponymous peak on Titan, the largest moon of the planet Saturn. Doom Mons is the largest mountain range on Titan by volume, and its peak possibly the highest. Doom Mons was discovered by the Cassini–Huygens probe in 2005 and officially named in 2012. == Location on Titan == Doom Mons is located in the southern hemisphere of Titan, between 14-15° south and 40-41° west. It is located within the Aztlan darklands region, possibly connected to the wider Shangri-La dark region, and is adjacent to Sotra Patera, a possible cryovolcanic caldera 1.7 km deep...
 
class Character(val name: String, var health: Int) {
    fun getRekt(damage: Int) {
        health = health - damage
    }
}
 
11:55 AM
if something is backed by Rihanna, Kanye and Nicki Minaj that's the best reason to not touch it with a 3m stick
 
so like the stuff there in the class header is supposed to be a primary constructor (?)
and those two parameters are some sort of syntactic sugar for properties
name is immutable and health is mutable
nice
 
(All mountains on Titan are named after mountains in Tolkien's works)
 
@AlexM. don't see what change does it really make here
 
change to what?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Really hard to walk up there then no?
 
11:56 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes great... now we know where Dr. Doom's lair is
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes TIL
 
@AlexM. mutability of health. I mean you can pass it to a function that will modify it inplace... But why would you want that?
 
I don't think you can change it in any way if you declare it as val
like I did with name
the program didn't compile if health was val
 
@AlexM. you can create a new object with it changed most probably
 
definitely
but it stays the same throughout the lifetime of one object
 
Xeo
11:57 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Blatant favouritism!
 
hence why I'm wondering if mutability is really helpful here
it tripped me off terribly in F#
 
Infestation: Cockatoos have been eating the head of Nefertiti - bloody native animals with a sense of entitlement!
 
makes the code way more complex and convoluted imho
 
I can find a reason to make name immutable
like I did above
 
Why not make everything immutable though.
 
11:58 AM
because I want to modify the health in a function like that
 
@AlexM. can you lift Health -> Health function to an object accessor?
 
can I what
 
lift. Change its context.
 
@Xeo Seas are named after characters from Asimov's Foundation, and plains are named after planets from Herbert's Dune. There's some variety.
 
consider...
 

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