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15:00
Target
As in, what's <cpu> for exactly?
Ooh.
Architecture
So this will build to an x86 computer.
win64 at the end is the host arch
@TonyTheLion I do it on purpose to piss you guys off.
15:00
Ahh
So it's <targetcpu>-<OS>-<mycpu>-<variant> ?
Oh. :c
Target and host are separate things
triples are dumb shits
obviously
15:02
the only way to know that you have what you want is to read the source code that interprets it
Target aquired! Firing! Compiling!
Also I'm not sure if this is hard rule when it comes to triplets, 32-bit versions used i686-pc-mingw32 vOv
It's mostly "whatever whoever used first"
x86_64-w64-mingw32-gcc-4.7.2-release-win64_rubenvb
^ Builds to an (x86_64 computer (32-bit?)), from a Windows 64 Computer, meant to run on a Windows 64-bit Computer?
@ThePhD No one the fuck knows. It's the one you want.
x86_64 is 64-bit
15:03
Why they no have manual for these kinds of things. ;~
Like anything related to autoconf, it's a fucking mess
0
Q: c++11 lambda expressions

LieuweToday I was doing some catch-up on c++11 (as we have not moved on yet). One of the reasons to switch as stated by a lot of people seems to be lambda expressions. I am still unsure on how they offer something new. For instance using c++11: #include <iostream> int main() { auto func ...

close votes.
No
DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO
OOooooooh
so i686 is x86
x86_64 is 64-bit
Okay, now I'm getting somewhere.
Xeo
Xeo
@CatPlusPlus Eat sushi.
15:06
iX86 are 32-bit targets
amd64 or x86_64 is 64-bit one
ia64 is Itanium and we don't speak about it
7
@Xeo It's not here yet ;(
So I think I got the two best ones then from rubenvb, then. I have i686-w64-mingw32-gcc-4.7.2-release-win32_rubenvb, which should be for building 32bit applications, and x86_64-w64-mingw32-gcc-4.7.2-release-win64_rubenvb, which should be for building 64-bit applications.
lol, Puppy nailed it
Alright, I learned something today!
LEVEL UP!
dammit cash y u no on my account yet.
maybe because i'm constantly sitting on SO instead of working
@ThePhD ...can't the x86_64 one also target 32bit?
15:09
SHUT UP YOU'RE CONFUSING ME ;~;
I kid, I hope it can. I really do.
user1182183
hey, um anyone got the problem with a laptop (acer) that all the lights (on off button, laptop status, and charging status) are blinking 1 sec on, 1 sec off, I tried looking it up on google but nothing matches my situation. the battery doesn't load and the charger is in it's place.. this happens when I move the connector of the charger a bit (turn, not pull from the laptop). reinserting the charger works, then the battery loads.. the lights return to normal.. but why does this happen?
user1182183
Maye someone has a fix before I open my laptop and permanently build the charger into this shit.
And void your warranty.
user1182183
@ThePhD it has no more warranty
user1182183
else I would've go
15:11
@CatPlusPlus s/Itanium/Itanic/ FTFY.
user1182183
It began exactly a week after the waranty period was over.
@GamErix "acer" 'nuff said.
user1182183
I just can't keep reinserting the plug, it's driving me crazy. if no one has a fix I just have to open the shit up and permanently build the charger into.
user1182183
@BartekBanachewicz ity happens on my sisters laptop too, and it's a HP
@GamErix Did I mention that laptops suck?
user1182183
15:12
and the batteries are OK.. for the living beings which actually want to know this information.
@GamErix we don't
user1182183
@BartekBanachewicz yep and I have to agree
@BartekBanachewicz I had to take my whole fucking laptop body apart, every screw, just to get to the screws to remove the screen so I could switch that out....blergh
Now that I think about it, it's pretty great that if anything happens to mine, I just have to go downstairs and I'll get a working one in an hour or less.
do you have a laptop well in your yard?
15:15
0
A: c++11 lambda expressions

DeadMGWell, for one, macros are incredibly hideous piles of crap that nobody sane would ever want to use. Seriously, if you don't already know why macros are the worst idea since trained dolphin attackers, then you need to move to C++03, let alone C++11. For two, you can't pass a macro to a proper fu...

y -3 :(
@TonyTheLion What about math did I miss?
> These licenses may not be used for commercial, nonprofit, academic, or government use.
@Mysticial we were laughing at you nothing much
@ThePhD Yup
@BartekBanachewicz Wait, what are they usable for?
15:16
@melak47 No
Xeo
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz So, only personal use?
@Xeo but do I have to commercialize it? :)
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm asking myself the same question
THe good news: Visual Studio inspects the .PDB file generated by my command line for the MinGW Executable (that actually runs)
@BartekBanachewicz Terrorism!
The bad news: it's claiming that it's invalid. =[
I'm not using MinGW.
15:18
Oh look, one sane petition on whitehouse.gov petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/…
@ThePhD maybe it expects badly mangled names, or something? :3 idk :/
I'm trying to manipulate it myself.
@R.MartinhoFernandes of course it's a fraction of votes compared to Death Star construction
@DeadMG What the heck is that question.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Dunno, I'm just curious as to why three people downvoted my quite correct answer.
15:21
No, I said that to me it looks like they give the same result and I was merely asking a question as to what the difference is. I don't quite understand why this needs to be downvoted or be compared to "trained dolphin attackers". — Lieuwe 1 min ago
Might be related.
indeed
I think he thought I was calling him the worst thing since trained dolphin attackers
What's wrong with attacking trained dolphins? You have to defend yourself sometimes, you know they can carry mines right.
lol
Ah well, fuck it.
If someone wants to Debug they can use their beloved GDB and printf.
dolphins they gonna rape you
15:25
@DeadMG I'd be offended, too. trained dolphins are no frickin sharks with frickin lazer beams attached to their frickin heads :)
lol
@LucDanton I thought it was about training people to attack dolphins.
@ThePhD noo don't give up
English sucks.
@melak47 I have to. I want to get back to doing what I actually like doing, which is: Game Development.
15:27
@ThePhD pfff
how hard can it be to...do the stuff with the pdb files...and stuff
@ThePhD Are you sure?
@R.MartinhoFernandes You troll.
Also, I like šŸŒšŸŒ.
@Lieuwe I would be really concerned for my mental health if I started seeing macros everywhere. Either that, or you read a lot of bad code. — Bartek Banachewicz 1 min ago
Besides, Visual GCC does its job: you can compile, link, and run an Executable built with either the Official MinGW distro or the rubenvb x86/x64 (it does not work with STL's MinGW distro, maybe because his isn't built to work on Windows 8, but really I'm not going to investigate / solve that problem).
15:28
@R.MartinhoFernandes big boxes? :)
are you a cat?
@ThePhD can you debug?
@melak47 Bananas, fammit.
@BartekBanachewicz No, I can't create proper .pdb files.
I can make .pdb files, but Visual Studio tells me they ain't proper.
Unrelated
@ThePhD it's fucking useless without a debugger. You could save yourself loads of time by just using vim then -.-
15:29
Real programmers debug with SoftIce over a serial cable
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's compatible with my interpretation, assuming training trained dolphin attackers.
@sehe Real people call "soft ice" water.
@BartekBanachewicz Real people don't have street cred in here
@BartekBanachewicz Snow, silly.
Vim - Or Sublime Text 2, or Code::Blocks, or Eclipse - can't take a .vcxproj you've already created on Windows and compile with the settings you specify in VS's GUI to build an executable.
15:30
@ThePhD That's relatively cool. Is it open source?
@DeadMG you deleted the more correct answer
@ThePhD Yes, it can.
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... Vim understands .vcxprojects and spits out an executable?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Which one? I'd like to have the plugin.
@ThePhD inb4 msbuild/devenv /Rebuild
@ThePhD not directly. But you can convert these files, y'know.
15:31
@ThePhD Vim works with any build system. MSBuild understands it.
:set makeprg=msbuild\ whatever\ else\ it\ takes
Why do you think vim is awesome? (Hint: because it is)
That emoticon probably means something highly specific
That's still building with cl.exe and the VC++ compiler.
@ThePhD aaaaaand?
15:32
Not with MinGW. I'd have to write my own MSBuild project for that.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hint: because msbuild is (surprisingly) a modular part to the VS suite of unhappiness
@ThePhD True
@ThePhD There are already cross-compiler build systems out there.
And many can generate VS project files.
The goal was to be able to hit F7 in Visual Studio and know for a fact that my build would be okay on a Linux distro, without having to actually go tra-la-la to my Linux VM and fire up a build.
@ThePhD Then the goal was flawed from the start.
How is that flawed? D:
With the same libraries, it'll work OH GOD NOT HER AGAIN.
@ThePhD The only way to know if it builds ok in a Linux distro is to build it in a Linux distro.
I think it's pretty much impossible to know that for a fact, unless you actually build on an actual linux distro
Xeo
Xeo
@EtiennedeMartel First thing I thought of.
Good ol' Navy.
Well yes it's impossible, but I can catch errors a hell of a lost earlier. D:
15:34
Cross-compiling between Linux and Windows isn't all that hard
But you really need to be using cross-compiler, not building for one target and hoping it will build on another as well
Also CI
These things can be automated
Yes and yes
@ThePhD it's nonsensical
If you have minimal platform glue then it might just work (TM)
15:36
(I'm like the grammar nazi of the Zelda franchise)
But it's better to build for that target and then actually run it
Well when I make the final thing, of course I'm going to build for it, but being able to spot a MinGW build every so often ensures I can at least dodge some of a bullet.
@R.MartinhoFernandes So, wait, even if x has the same binary representation as x, it might not be equal to itself? So what, floating point number comparisons are non deterministic?
They are
@EtiennedeMartel None.
15:37
It's just that NaN != NaN
@EtiennedeMartel NaNs are not equal to any value. But they are deterministically not equal.
Oh, right, forgot about that fucking NaN (bread)
:ieee754:
It's sad that I remember this number
@R.MartinhoFernandes at least until some broken compiler decides to optimize the comparison out
I believe Intel's compiler does/did that, breaking code which tests for NaN in this way
@EtiennedeMartel Just FWIW: before it was standardized, a common way to write your own isNaN was something like: bool isNaN(double d) {return !d == d; } (presumably this is the comparison @jalf is talking about).
15:42
@jalf Well, yeah, when lossage is involved anything can become non-deterministic :(
I wonder how useful it is to have a NaN that is not equal to itself.
I mean, it's a weird special case.
@EtiennedeMartel well, on one hand, do you want 4/0 == 5/0, that said, what about doing if (4/x == nan)
We should ask @StephenCanon. He's the only person I know was (is?) in the IEEE754 committee and active on SO. He has been on chat before too.
@thecoshman Both of those are positive infinity, not NaN aN (no double negative!).
@R.MartinhoFernandes touché
@EtiennedeMartel if nothing else, it's useful for detecting NaN :)
15:45
@thecoshman But sqrt(-42) and acos(42) are good examples that make the same point.
from an IEEE point of view, that is, if you can't assume a nice language with a nice standard library with a nice isNaN function
@R.MartinhoFernandes let's just pretend that is what I said :P
@R.MartinhoFernandes IMO I would want sqrt(-42) to equal sqrt(-42) as whilst I can't represent it, those numbers are equal, if we allow for i
@R.MartinhoFernandes Woah, he is/was on the committee? No wonder he destroys everyone on the floating-point questions.
@thecoshman You suck.
@Mysticial Yeah. Dunno if still, but was.
15:47
@Mysticial he destroys them because he is a canon obviosuly
@LucDanton ...
@thecoshman If you want those to compare equal use complex numbers.
@thecoshman lol
@R.MartinhoFernandes damn...
@R.MartinhoFernandes I suppose
I admit that comprehending complex number is more then you would want from simple maths library
@jalf I thought NaN, in IEEE 754, had a specific binary representation?
still...
@EtiennedeMartel it has two IIRC
15:48
@EtiennedeMartel There are many.
@thecoshman but they're not numbers. You don't "allow for i", because it's not a complex number unless you code it to be
@Mysticial He says he was, anyway: stackoverflow.com/a/1573715/179910
@thecoshman No, that is not the point. The point is that you don't want them to compare equal because they compare equal in some different domain.
@jalf yeah I can take that point
@Mysticial He is quite close to the gold badge.
15:50
@EtiennedeMartel sure, but how do you check its binary representation easily? reinterpret_casting to int and fiddling with bit patterns is expensive. But the FPU already has an equality instruction, and if you can determine NaN just by using that, then that is all nice and simple :)
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh, so it's like a fucking hive mind.
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, so I didn't RC
But even those with the same representation compare different.
And I guess the question is, should sqrt(-42) == sqrt(-43)? I can't see any reason why they should be :)
What why what
Why would that be true
15:51
@jalf Erm, that does not make a point about NaN == NaN.
@jalf well no, even with with imaginary numbers they are not the same value.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Why not? They are both NaN, so if NaN equals NaN then those two are equal
hence, it makes sense for NaN to not be equal to NaN
Why is sqrt(43) NaN
@jalf Erm. They are not both NaN.
fine, typo
15:52
@jalf Think you forgot a minus.
shut up all ;)
Also it should be a domain exception :v
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh wow, he is pretty close.
Shit guys, jalf made a mistake. I repeat: jalf made a mistake.
4
15:52
@EtiennedeMartel screw you
@thecoshman You're slow.
@CatPlusPlus I guess that is what NaN means.
fucking spell checking my own shit and look where it gets me
I don't like NaNs
Yeah, well, it's either that or leaving others to unscramble your word salad.
15:53
Maybe signalling NaN would be
Xeo
Xeo
@EtiennedeMartel Also, he's using managers.
That's two mistakes.
@EtiennedeMartel You're my hero.
@EtiennedeMartel iff t geets mi stares, eyell buttcha ti al
15:54
@Xeo I am?
I admit to using a manager class, but it wasn't a singleton!
4
Next thing we know, @jalf is a Soviet spy.
Xeo
Xeo
Oh, right, manager.
@jalf It's worse, I think.
I am surprised that wasn't starred any faster.
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: This just in: jalf has used a manager. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq] [get-out] [no-questions]
15:56
anyway, the point I was trying to make is that most NaN's are going to appear as the result of different computations, so in general, you would expect them to not be equal. The case where you do the same computation twice, and get two NaNs which you compare is kind of the special corner case, not the general one
I'd assume that's why NaN != NaN
nakes sense I guess...
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but I still want to argue fruitless against it, or with fruit if you prefer
@R.MartinhoFernandes took your time
@thecoshman I want to see maked ladies.
15:58
@thecoshman bananas
Xeo
Xeo
@EtiennedeMartel Doing it wrong, it has to be "Breaking News"
@Xeo Aren't you an owner?
Xeo
Xeo
Too lazy.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hardcore Robot Porn
2
15:59
@jalf I think there's more to it than that -- part of the concept of what a NaN is, is that not being a number means you can't/shouldn't expect most number-like this (comparisons, computations, etc.) to work at all -- they simply don't make sense for something that's not a number at all.

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