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00:01
@KeithLayne Me too.
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck And some are divorced — multiple times, even. :)
@sbi crossed my mind, but that seemed like a poor counterexample to his question at the time
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck As a programer, pointing out counterexamples should be your second nature.
@sbi It is, and I had to resist the urge. knowing the counterexamples is handy, but defeating your own points in a random conversation is less so.
People for some reason see critical thought as a negative attitude. I don't just point out the problems with your ideas to crush your spirit, I do it to help you solve them.
sbi
sbi
00:09
Ha, I swear I had been off the list of frequent users half an hour ago (must have been a first in >2years), but now that I posted two messages, the chat server seems to be ashamed of its hasty decision to disregard me, and put me back right into the middle of the list.
Whoever came up with the algorithm to populate the frequent users list must be a genius whose thought's I can't follow.
@sbi how are you?
sbi
sbi
@KeithLayne Baffled. Isn't that obvious?
@MooingDuck I am with @Keith on this. Enumerating what counts against your theories is good scientific practice.
@sbi sure, but we weren't practicing science, I was attempting to convince someone they were wrong.
That wasn't a criticism of psyduck, especially in the context of the conversation.
Lions don't do the best science anyway, so I've heard.
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck Isn't "convincing someone they were wrong" the very definition of "practicing science"?
00:12
It depends. Some people define it as "making up numbers and shit."
@MooingDuck congratulations on your upcoming wedding, by the way.
@sbi no?
@sbi could be simple malace for instance.
@sbi I usually define it as "convincing someone I am right."
(not that I was trolling, but it's a counterexample)
sbi
sbi
Yawn.
@KeithLayne Isn't that the same as convincing them they're wrong? I mean, if they wouldn't have a dissenting POV, why would you even need to convince them?
@MooingDuck Yes!
@sbi *malice (not being nice)
00:18
@sbi It's just semantics. I call it "awesome semantics."
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck Ah. Should have thought of that.
@sbi my roommate would habitually convince people they were wrong. Even if they were right. He was good at it
user1182183
@MooingDuck Some people just need to be right, even if they're wrong ;]
user1182183
(girls...)
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck Well, the fact that other things can be defined by the same phrase doesn't invalidate a claim that one thing is defined by it. ("a keyword used to create new user-defined types" => struct, class)
user1182183
00:20
stackoverflow.com/questions/11750540/… <- anybody know if it's safe to NOT align the data for use with StorageWritefile? :$
sbi
sbi
@MooingDuck You had your soon-to-be wife as a roommate? :)
sbi
sbi
@KeithLayne ??
user1182183
@sbi MooingDuck clearly said 'HE', you suggest he's in a gay marriage? xD
@sbi I'm awesome, duh.
sbi
sbi
00:21
@GamErix Shrug. What about it? I certainly see nothing objectionable about it.
@GamErix you, sir, just got trolled.
sbi
sbi
Well, it's 2:30am, and I have been baking a cake and wrapping presents until now, because tomorrow we have a birthday to celebrate. Given that I will likely be awoken around 8, I think I'd better go to bed Real Soon Now™, in order to stand a chance to make it through the day.
user1182183
@sbi My bio clock is really messed up, I sleep at day and live at night.
user1182183
in 16 days school start ;/
user1182183
damnit.
sbi
sbi
00:27
@GamErix Get yourself a bunch of kids, and you will sleep neither day nor night.
2
@sbi Which one is having the birthday?
user1182183
@sbi for kids I have enough time, though I rly want one xd, anyway, not befor I get a good job
There's never enough time for your kids. :(
sbi
sbi
@KeithLayne The one that gets 13 today.
@GamErix I love the people and culture at my job. Dislike the code though.
00:29
That seems like an awkward age for such things. I hope you have fun.
user1182183
@MooingDuck fortunately, or at least I hope, I won't be a programmer, what my goal is, is getting into the air, boeing 747 and all that stuff. Well, flying the flying brick.
sbi
sbi
@KeithLayne I don't think there's any awkwardness involved in getting the cake you wished for, a few good presents, and spending the day exactly the way you wanted to.
quick question: if you define a lambda and assign it, can/should the var be const?
@sbi Not that part, that part is great. The awkwardness comes from being 13.
auto const foo = [](){ /* I'm awesome */ };
user1182183
yep, 13is just not enough to be the little kid nor not enough to be treatend lika a more mature piece of humanity.
okay? good? bad?
sbi
sbi
00:32
@GamErix When you have a good job, you will have too little time for your kids. I had my first child while we were still studying, and it was great to have so much time. (But this was studying in Germany, where you can set your very own pace.)
user1182183
@sbi As a commercial airline pilot, you spent 3 days working, 3days at home, 3 days working, 3 days at home, 3 days working, 4 days at home, etc
user1182183
and if you're good you get to fly around the world ; d
sbi
sbi
@KeithLayne Ah, that. Well, I think he's not the most developed of his age group, so there seems to be some time left until he becomes awkward. (Although, as these things go, this forecast could change within 3 months...)
user1182183
"The Cat says that everything sucks except WikiDot, Haskell and Python", and there he left out C..
user1182183
wow 38 times read and not 1 comment xd
sbi
sbi
00:40
@GamErix Well, there's reasons you get one more day off than the rest of us. This sounds like you will always only be a weekend dad, even though you have a 3-day weekend. The everyday life of your kids, though, needs continuity 7 days/week, and that would then have to be provided by your wife. I used to have two of my kids for half the month, and when that got lowered by 2 days/month, I lost a surprisingly big amount of everyday contact with these two.
(I'm not trying to sour your career aspiration, but I think you should know the drawbacks before plunging into this.)
Well, did I mention I need to go to bed? I need to go to bed. There, I said it. Good night, folks!
user1182183
@sbi long life ahead of me, I need to figure out everything myself and I really appreciate great suggestions. Well have a good night Sbi
user1182183
;p
sbi
sbi
Yeah, everybody needs to figure that out for themselves, that's true. OTOH, I pity all those fathers that are only weekend dads and let their wife handle everything else. Those are the ones who say "I wish I had..." when they are old, and see their sons do the same.
Anyway, I am off.
heyyy
I refuse to read the code of conduct
@Steve then you will be placed on people's ignore lists, and nobody will be able to see what you say
00:51
@Steve Who are you?
i'm a nobody
Not really, no. You are able to speak, and that means you're somebody.
nopeeee
does this room encompass visual c++ too?
well, thanks for the splendid conversation guys, have a good night
Well, if you come here at night don't expect a discussion.
Try coming back in six hours or so.
01:17
@Steve good night!
Anyone has a good tip on how to implement md5??
Yeah. Find a lib that does it for you.
Seems legit enough
01:34
@Rosme better still, just don't. md5 is broken enough that it's almost always better to use something else instead.
I know. It's not really to protect, but more to validate file integrity. Or should I go with boost::crc? (Just saw it while going through boost documentation)
> *assumptions everywhere, I know nothing
If I ever answer another question on SO, I'm stealing that.
@JerryCoffin getting any sleep yet?
@EtiennedeMartel you there?
01:49
Yes.
02:01
Heya!
@EtiennedeMartel E aí, beleza?
Sorry, I only speak French and English.
Hahahaha :D
Oi in Portuguese means "Hi"
And "E aí, beleza?" means "Hey, wassup?"
Yeah, I figured.
02:05
Looks like everybody already left to bed, huh.
hell no, there is still a few of us...
I was going to ask:
can you/is it bad to/is it good to do this:
 auto const foo = [](){/*...*/};
Hmm, auto const?
Does that compile? I thought that would be more like auto foo []() const {/*...*/};
Just out of intuition, though. I haven't used lambdas yet.
auto const is fine.
@KeithLayne Sure, why not?
02:08
But I think auto const will turn the variable into constant. Is that what you want?
Meaning you'd not be able to reassign it, if it's the case that variables holding lambda expressions can be reassigned.
@EtiennedeMartel Can you explain to me what that statement would do?
(no need to, as usual, 'bvsly)
(I might mess up some terms, so when in doubt, read the Standard)

It defines a lambda expression that takes no parameters and binds nothing, and then initializes a const variable of an implementation defined type with that.
Implementation defined type? Do you mean lambda expression types are not standardized or something?
no, it's an implementation defined type. By the standard. so, yes and no.
@KeithLayne OK, but the actual type is not enforced by the standard? So, you, e.g., you really have to use "auto" when defining lambda variables?
@n2liquid You can put them in a std::function, and a lambda that binds nothing can be implicitly converted to a function pointer, but a lambda isn't required to be either.
02:14
Oh, I see.
That's a little odd...
So the "auto" isn't required to be a function pointer? Funny. Really funny. I wonder why this quirk.
so, g++-4.7 builds and runs it fine, my clang++ segfaults.
I wonder if capturing precludes constness.
@n2liquid Gives more power to implementers.
@MooingDuck I totally didn't know Lua was such a beautiful, clean language. Thanks a lot! I might as well dump JavaScript now.
(for the kinds of things I was using it; i.e. as a generic scripting language)
TIL that (at least for g++-4.7) that a const lambda can modify variables captured by reference, but not those captured by value. Makes sense.
@all: Damn, we really needed a shorthand function like this in standard library
2
A: FPS Counter in the window title GLFW

RosmeA simple way to do, and making it compatible with every numerical could be that: <sstream> template<class T> char* toChar(T t) { std::ostringstream oss; oss << t; return oss.str().c_str(); } This way, no matter if you use int, float, long or whatever else, it wil...

Only named more appropriately, of course. Like std::to_cstring() or something. And also std::to_string(). Or maybe just std::to_string() so that we could e.g. std::to_string(123.45f).c_str().
02:29
doesn't c++11 bring that?
a to_string function
@Rosme No idea. I'll check.
Tsc, damn! It's there. Yeah, I really need to teach myself C++11. At least C++ feels like a great, new, unexplored world again :D
where?
Haha yeah! But it's not really a hard function to make anyway
the trivial implementations of most of the std lib are not hard, but they're still valuable.
02:32
Yeah
The fact that it's not a template is a little strange to me.
I thought it'd be a template so it could be specialized.
Yeah, it would make sense to make a template for anything that had an overload for stream insertion.
They must've had their reasons, though. Not to mention the current state of things allows this to change later without a hassle, keeping backwards compatibility.
Same...I guess they don't want it to go like the Java implementation of to_string...all can do and goes crazy
Well, the good thing is that it's not defined on everything. I wouldn't have a problem with a template. It's not that important though, if you need to expose this for a type, you can. No need to specialize something in std to do so.
02:40
You mean I can overload the standard function? Oh, I didn't think of that..
I would've thought it was just a Bad Thing™
But in this case, it wouldn't be different from a specialization, so yeah...
You can only specialize functions in std.
@KeithLayne Huh?
That's it, I'm actually doing it. I'm making C++ Template Metaprogramming an official language on rosettacode and I'm going to solve a bunch of their tasks. of course some are a lot harder than others considering I/O constraints, but it will be fun!
@std''OrgnlDave Good luck and be sure to post the link here later! ;)
@n2liquid old returning regular?
02:47
@std''OrgnlDave No, I'm quite new here. What about you?
I'm a regular popping in to let people know which ways I'm abusing template metaprogramming
It's sort of my hobby: use the turing-completeness of C++ templates, and also make compilers angry
@std''OrgnlDave Sounds like fun (: Template metaprogramming has always been an abuse anyway.
not ALWAYS
what compiler do you use by the way?
Have you contributed to something absurd like Boost.Spirit?
TDM-GCC (basically an updated MinGW)
which GCC
version
02:50
Latest
Should be latest, at least; that was the intent of the project.
I'm not sure if it's catching up, it's been a long time I don't write C++.
brb too, gotta get food
can you tell me if this dumps core for you
struct A { int a; bool operator<(const int& inty) { return a < inty; } }; template <class A, class B> auto operator<(const A& a, const B& b) -> decltype(a<b) { return a < b; } int main(void) { A a; a.a = 1; int b = 2; if (a < b) return 4; return 0; }
02:52
(Asking you guys real quick, any ressource you can direct me too to leaern template metaprogramming? )
rosettacode in a few weeks...lol
loll, except that one
There's a book that goes over a lot of it, especially MPL.
It's getting older now, but the concepts are there.
Ok thanks
I think it's called "C++ Template Metaprogramming", forget who wrote it.
02:55
oh boy C++11 makes things so much better though! especially constexpr which made writing a compile-time bytecode interpreter a lot easier
Haven't looked enough at what does constexpr(time to go read the standard)
If it's on the list, it's a good book.
I hadn't seen that list, thanks
I've decided to relax the restrictions for I/O on template metaprogramming; the user is allowed to view output values as the SOLE THING the program can do. i.e. std::cout << some_template<5,2,r>::value;
errr
you know what I mean
03:04
@std''OrgnlDave Is that going to be part of your RosettaCode?
@n2liquid no I just want to see if it segfaults your version of GCC
@std''OrgnlDave I was talking about the "compile-time bytecode interpreter", but considering you want to use only template metaprogramming and constexpr has nothing to do with that, scratch that :P
@n2liquid also if you have time for your compiler to suffer feed it this template
I failed miserably to install TDM-GCC here a few days ago. It was missing headers and libraries from stdlib.
hmmm, constexpr has EVERYTHING to do with it, it allows you to create arrays and simple functions and more, it is great, const was not good enough const int x[4] = { 0, 0, 0, 0 }; was unusable for instance
oh.
<typename T> struct add_pointer { typedef T*type; }; template <int N, typename T> struct add_pointers : add_pointer<typename add_pointers<N-1, T>::type> {}; template <typename T> struct add_pointers<0, T> { typedef T type; }; template <int N, typename T> struct add_many_pointers : add_pointers<180,typename add_many_pointers<N-1, T>::type> {}; template <typename T> struct add_many_pointers<0, T> { typedef T type; }; int main() { add_many_pointers<180, int>::type p; }
have fun with that if you want
@RGeorgeMartinez can now come in and complain "WHY DID I EVER WRITE THAT"
03:08
@std''OrgnlDave He did? lol
he...started it.
I'll give it a try if I can install this shit before going to bed.
that second one makes a type with 32,400 *'s. most compilers 'cept the very latest choke and die. ICC took over 6 hours, MSVC you have to bring the #'s down to 80 for it to do it but it'll take about 30 mins before it dies, latest Clang actually compiles it fine in under a minute
anyhow I'm out for now ping me with the results
@Stdorgnldave yo heres some results
:-D
@std''OrgnlDave Sure, bye-bye
How many file systems do people need these days?
03:12
@IDWMaster More.
@n2liquid And they REALLY need special file systems just for SSDs?
MORE of them?
Yes, more.
ugh...VS2012 have to reboot comp
More file systems is always more gooder.
Now, really, I don't know how SSD's work, but maybe it can really give benefits.
@IDWMaster Depends. Will a new file system for SSDs reduce the chance of a SSD dying catastrophically?
03:14
Best would be to add some sort of "meta file system" instead, though, on top of which normal file systems could stay.
@Insilico Probably not.
Backups always work best!
@IDWMaster True, but backups are a last resort strategy.
@Insilico Really? In cloud computing they shouldn't be.
@IDWMaster What I meant was that if your storage devices fail so often you need to restore from a backup all the time you have bigger issues.
Of course you must always backup.
@Insilico Oh; true.
This file system is meant specifically for mobile database storage; in which client devices have SSDs, and temporarily store copies of records from the server used for offline access.
It's not meant as a server file system
03:18
@IDWMaster You don't need a special file system to do that, no?
@Insilico Apparently you do.
That seems to be something you can implement in your own program assuming you're not an idiot.
@Insilico Seems to be; but my company wants a file system for some reason.
@IDWMaster Oh, your company is developing that?
Does your company produce SSD's?
@n2liquid Yeah, they have the specs and I'm just writing the implementation, and no; we don't produce SSDs.
03:20
@IDWMaster Who wrote the specs? Themselves?
@n2liquid Yeah.
@IDWMaster ...
Something tells me this is a huge waste of time....
@IDWMaster Haven't you asked about their reasons?
@n2liquid Performance, security, and scalability.
File system must be able to synchronize data with server at file system level
and have built-in security verifications and protections that existing file systems apparently don't have
such as the ability to encrypt not just the files but the file names as well
03:22
@IDWMaster That's quite a lot of buzzwords.
basically whole drive appears to be noise
without the correct code
Apparently TrueCrypt and BitLocker aren't strong enough or something.
@IDWMaster Hmmm... I have no idea.
But it sure sounds like a waste of time.
A girl friend of mine can't eat anymore for today... so she's staring at food from Google Images. Jeez.
Anyways; back to parallel encryption implementations.....
@IDWMaster Best of luck.
@std''OrgnlDave Looks like TDM-GCC only supports 4.6.1 as of now ): I'm not sure how's the 4.7.1 port is going.
03:55
hey n2lquid
@DeadMG Hey dude, what's up?
working more on breaking SHA-2
I solved 99.42% of all state
What do you work with professionally?
technically, I don't have a job, so nothing
lol
You're studying, then?
Better no job than PHP job, I say.
03:58
just finished failing my degree
Oh... ):
A friend of mine had that problem too.
And the guy is good.
the problem is
CS and software engineering are very different disciplines
but it's very hard, at best, to find a software engineering degree instead of a CS degree
and secondly, the stuff you can learn at university is piss in an ocean compared to what you can pick up in the right places online
and especially considering they want me to pay and expend a whole bunch of my time, it's difficult to accept the need for completing another year
"the stuff you can learn at university is piss in an ocean compared to what you can pick up in the right places online" <-- This.
4
Well, I gotta go.
bb hf
@DeadMG I'll likely be online tomorrow so you can tell me your brave hash cracking history 8D
C++ya.
04:04
heh
it'll only be a cracking history if I get the last .585%
04:41
ANyone here understand what this code does?

class A {}
class X{
operator A(){return A();}
}
operator A() is a conversion operator.
cool thanks
05:05
@KeithLayne Not much sleep yet, and probably little or none tonight -- but not from a restless child keeping me awake. He's started to have a problem with an elevated Bibirubin (sp?) level, and today it got high enough they said we needed to put him back in the hospital. They have him sleeping on (essentially) a baby tanning bed, though with slightly different color balance to the bulbs (minimal UV). It's getting closer to normal, but I'm still worried enough that sleep is unlikely.
@JerryCoffin I'm sorry to hear that. Our oldest ended up in the NICU for a few days, and with no experience, we were scared to death. I hope he gets back to normal soon and can come back home!
@KeithLayne At least assuming the drop is roughly linear, he'll probably be released sometime tomorrow.
That's great news.
05:40
Anyone know what's wrong with this specialization?

http://ideone.com/d7bTQ
@Tocs You can replace T* with T.
In the args?
Everwhere.
But I only want it to match pointers so I need to have the <T*>
Wait, member functions can't be specialized.
05:45
They can outside of the class I thought?
I could be wrong.
I probably am.
I know there's some rule about specializations and members of a class
but I thought it was you can't specialize a member function of a template class
You have to specialize the whole class, or so I thought
your right at @Tocs
05:55
And you can specialize template functions of a non template class
You can't partially specialize functions of any sort
you can have an explicit specialization of functions though
I dont follow
either member functions or non-member functions
I can't do like
template <class T>
void foo ();

and

template <class T>
void foo <T*> ();

ever?
05:57
Balls
functions can be overloaded with new templates
but no partial specialization
Plans ruined
sets fire to computer
various ways to get around that
you can have a template function call a class member function
and then partially specialize the class
Yeah, gonna have to do some shenanigans
Or I guess I could static assert if T is not a pointer
probably a better error that way
partial specialization and overloading are just too similar
I'm guessing that trying to combine the two would have been very awkward
06:02
Well
and that's why it isn't allowed
in addition, you can partially specialize anyway.
Owell
It's kinda boned for simplicity anyway
Tocs: and what is it you are wanting to do?
call a templated function with specific template parameters, and specialize the function based on the template parameters?
Well I'm working on a system that uses angelscript for a scripting language,
part of the api has functions like SetArgByte and SetArgDWord etc etc. I'm using templates to call the right one based on the type of argument passed to them.

If it's not a simple type I need to pass in a pointer to it, so I'd hope to capture

in the case of T being a reference take the address, otherwise if T was a pointer pass in the pointer.
06:16
@Tocs Why not just overload?
Because i need to handle non simple types like classes
So if you pass in a object of Foo *, it needs to pass in the Foo * pointer
So I can't overload it for every type
thus the template
I'm just gonna specialize a class with a static method to get around it
right
but you can simply overload for template<typename T> void foo(T* ptr);
Well the ones that take types like int and float
wait
I see what you're saying
I'm an idiot. It's too damn late for this, I'm going to sleep.
@Tocs You didn't use T in your example.
07:13
Hi ProfX
@StackedCrooked hi are you there?
07:29
@cHao I stand corrected.
morning all
@bamboon Yes.
@Mysticial Whoa, it is at 46 already. I really should be asking more of these silly syntax questions :)
@n2liquid I don't know, there are lots of animals living in the ocean, urinating regularly.
@StackedCrooked you are using Mac + Qt right?
> If you're asking for common optimization tricks that beat the ones the compiler uses, you're not likely to find any. This is because, if any such tricks existed, all compiler writers would race to put them into their compilers and they would cease to become "tricks not used by compilers".
this
07:49
@DeadMG not a fan of the 'small focused tools that chain together' philosophy?
@FredOverflow perhaps you would prefer the analogy of 'a fart in the wind'?
@bamboon QtCreator on Mac yes.
@StackedCrooked only qtcreator or do you also use qmake?
I have a few Qt projects where I use it indirectly. The IDE takes care of the actual calls.
yeah ok. but did you get macports gcc to work with it?
07:58
well, I need your help then^^
Make sure your PATH variable is right.
I have created a toolchain which should actually explicitly select the right gcc, but it still doesn't. what did you do to make it work?
That's all I ever needed to do.
You can set the path variable in your project build settings
08:04
@thecoshman I don't know, there's lots of birds and insects in the sky...
yeah, just removed everything but the macports dir. still doesn't work. I read here on SO somewhere that it has to do with the makespecs, but if it works for you just doing that
@FredOverflow not sure if trolling ¬_¬ or genuinely this stupid
@StackedCrooked anyway thanks for your help, gtg might come back
08:33
Hello.
'sup
4
Q: Two instances of a singleton needed

DunkenI had to extend my existing code with a Class B. The existing code uses a singleton in Library. Now Class B (which itself will be available as a singleton as is Class A) needs its own library instance... I'm wondering what's the best way to extend the existing code (Class A, Library) such that I...

lololol
08:52
@jalf So I'll actually come and visit you now in august =)
@FredOverflow Use a dualton, duh.
0
Q: If Singletons are so bad, why does Scala have language support for them?

FredOverflowWhy does Scala have language support for the Singleton anti-pattern? If Scala had inherited the static keyword from Java, what legitimate use cases of the object keyword would be left?

Let's see how fast this one gets closed :)
@FredOverflow Scale has singletons as a language feature or just for statics?
object MySingleton
{
  // ...
}
@FredOverflow that makes a singleton?
08:58
yes, note the object keyword instead of class
That's like struct {} s;
Erm, no? You can instantiate s as many times as you want.
s is an object here.
I'm pretty sure.
oh right, stupid me
But not lazy instantiated.
08:59
OMG C has always had language support for Singletons!

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