« first day (501 days earlier)      last day (4463 days later) » 

9:00 AM
@Luc registered_ptr?
 
Yeah, int and System.Int32 are the same thing. I got that mixed up before, but they are. The tricky question is "exactly how do value types, including int relate to System.Object9
 
It's a pretty useful list, I think.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Too dizzy to think properly. Needs food badly.
 
Which reminds me: foodstuff providers are now open. Time to head out and shop for fridge fillers.
 
So apparently not only did I make an remove_ptr alias but I made a factory called make_remove without giving second thoughts.
 
9:06 AM
I think you need help @Luc
oh, and is that said like 'Luke' or 'Luck'?
 
Neither really. Not that it matters, it's only a screenname.
 
I don't think English has anything that sounds like French u.
 
But I have to read it! It melts my mind a little bit more every time I see it
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Lurk?
 
@DeadMG Isn't that like "luck", or very similar?
 
9:09 AM
nah
luck is sharper than lurk
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yeah, I'm assuming that's how it's supposed to be pronounced too :)
 
(UK) IPA: /lɜːk/
(US) IPA: /lɝk/
 
"ur" and "uh" are two different sounds
 
Well, it should be somewhat similar to "you" (but not quite).
 
IPA: /ˈlʌk/ <- that's 'luck'
 
9:09 AM
no
 
"you" is a pretty distinct sound from "lurk" and "luck"
 
Exactly my point.
 
But it's an approximate of 'Luc', or so he claims.
 
English doesn't have a sound like French u.
 
9:10 AM
I don't really know what French u sounds like :P
 
is it an 'ow' sound, the sort of sound you make when you hurt your self?
 
Can you find a recording of 'lurk' (or the sound in it)? The pronunciation key didn't really help me.
@thecoshman No.
 
@thecoshman No. It's close to "you".
 
"you" is a bit of an odd word, IMO
the other English words with similar pronunciations are like "loo" and "poo" and "shoo"
 
lurk is pronounced more like 'lerk' but not like 'lair'
 
9:12 AM
@thecoshman Okay, I think I get it.
 
@DeadMG I don't mean the "ou" part of "you". I mean the whole word, "y" included.
 
perhaps look
 
well obviously the whole words aren't going to sound even remotely alike
 
oh, then surely like king Luis (if I spelt it correctly :P you had a lot of kings with that name)
 
9:13 AM
it's actually been so long, I have totally forgotten how to spell that name
 
@thecoshman That's "Louis" and reads differently (loo - ee).
 
Contrasts 'eu' (which we don't care about) with 'u'.
 
all I know is, it should be spelt lewis :D
 
@thecoshman Some are. John Lewis, for example?
 
9:15 AM
@LucDanton that's just saying 'poo' or perhaps 'pooh'
 
Nope.
 
@DeadMG A fine establishment :D
 
Not at all.
 
French has both sounds.
 
ew, maybe.
 
9:16 AM
oh yes, I here a subtle difference. Particularly when it 'duh' and 'do'
 
It was silly of me but I should have picked the video that contrasts 'ou' with 'u':
 
when is short sound whilst the other is more drawn out and softer sound
 
@LucDanton That's better!
 
Still I hear that 'eu' is problematic to some English speakers.
Btw it's similar to 'u' vs 'ue'/'ü' in German, if you're familiar with that.
 
yeah, fairly sure in English phonetics, it would be 'look'
 
9:18 AM
Fairly sure it's not.
@LucDanton Woot, I just learned some German.
 
@thecoshman The sound quality isn't great but depending on the speaker 'u' can be shifted a lot.
@RMartinhoFernandes Which just reminded that the 'u' -> 'ue' change in German is called vowel shifting.
 
french 'nu' sounds like Englsih 'new'
 
Anyway, French 'u' might sound like 'look' in some places but most of the time it won't.
 
@thecoshman You're getting it!
Food. I forgot.
 
Fuud?
 
9:22 AM
can you buy rep. ?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yay! I can do French me :P
I used to use a really good windows program for sticky notes, but can't remember what exactly it was called, any help?
 
@thecoshman doesn't win7 come with one out of the box?
 
@jalf it seems to yes, but vista ¬_¬
sticky-notes.net well that looks legit :P
zhornsoftware.co.uk/stickies I think this is it!!!
 
I always just use sticky notes for that :D
real physical ones
 
yeah, but I am only going to loose them
plus I can actually what I type, by handwriting is terrible
 
9:33 AM
well, if you can't afford to lose the information, it doesn't belong on a sticky note anyway :D
 
plus stickies lets you have them remind you, and send them to people
 
@thecoshman your typing isn't much better ;)
 
its more for handy todo lists etc
@jalf shh, I tip perfuct
 
Oh, someone mentioned.
 
do I really need to scan it and shock you :P
 
9:37 AM
@Luc, I've been thinking about this:
2 hours ago, by Luc Danton
@RMartinhoFernandes apply(f, std::move(box)) is relevant, no temporary involved.
 
What about it.
 
The box is likely to be not movable (if it uses std::mutex) but even if it is movable, moving it in apply does not make sense. But it does make sense to move values in and out of it.
 
Indeedy. Want a better convention than std::move(box)?
 
I could overload on rvalue this, but that sounds weird.
@LucDanton Exactly.
 
Well, even if the box is not moved itself, the internal object is liable to be pilfered.
apply_move(f, box);?
 
9:47 AM
Any cmd guru's here?
 
@LucDanton Hmm, that was what I had as last resort.
 
I need this script to compile all fortran files with gfortran: pastebin.com/SzxizAZb
but it's complaining with: "*_tot.f90" not expected at this time
 
You're doing FORTRAN?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes using, not doing
fucking scientific software shit
I blame my professor for the fortran (he doesn't know it either, but he uses the program)
hmm, hold on. I think I need to use a different cmd construct
 
That thing has too many percent signs for my eyes.
 
9:53 AM
There aren't even tests included with the expensive software.
"Compile with all optmizations off, then compile the fast code, run both and compare the results". WTF?
 
@rubenvb hmm?
 
@jalf that's what the docs say
Did you guys know Fortran has "Deleted Features"?
 
@rubenvb You're "using" and "fucking" it, but not "doing" it?
 
@Potatoswatter I don't want to make it too personal
We might get attached
 
9:58 AM
Ah, subtle.
 
@rubenvb You are a true professional.
 
@rubenvb C++ has those too.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes you mean export?
 
Yes. auto as a storage class specifier, too. Possibly more things in the future (auto_ptr I'm looking at you).
A quick look at wikipedia doesn't have AT in the list of removed features.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes What's AT?
 
10:00 AM
COMEFROM.
 
are those fortran code things?
 
@rubenvb You don't know COMEFROM?
COMEFROM is from INTERCAL. AT is Fortran's equivalent.
 
Is that like inserting patches as a language construct?
 
Yes, Fortran and INTERCAL share a feature.
 
wtf is INTERCAL? I'm 22. I think that was invented before I was born.
 
10:02 AM
I'm 25.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes wat ._______________________.
 
INTERCAL is the "Compiler Language With No Pronounceable Acronym".
 
@rubenvb Intercal is very old. Maybe Fortran era. It was an early parody language.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes that's some fancy AI for the eighties :P
3
 
Yeah sure cross cutting concerns, AOP and all but still, I didn't expect that.
 
10:03 AM
Hehe.
 
interesting. Now that I can compile my lib with clang, it's finding a good handful of warnings that gcc missed
some of them look serious
 
@LucDanton All-in-One Polynomial?
 
@rubenvb Yes, exactly that.
 
Aspect-Oriented Programming.
 
sheesh. Acronyms SA. FS FTW!
 
10:05 AM
@LucDanton Fortunately, that feature is not PLEASE.
 
hmm, the GUI is written in Java. There's no MinGW-w64 libgcj, guess I'll have to install the JRE. <shudders>
 
mornin’
 
@Luc is ._______________________. a smiley?
 
Yes.
 
What does it mean?
 
10:10 AM
it looks like some Japanese anime face
 
It's a long face.
 
Well wide really. Ah well.
 
In any case, it's drawing a blank.
 
Installing Java: "Three billion devices run Java". Well hell, I didn't know there were so many slow devices.
 
10:12 AM
hmm, warning: returning reference to local temporary object [-Wreturn-stack-address], that sounds bad
 
Right! It's a stumped face. The wider, the stumped-er.
 
@rubenvb Cell phones. And many cars.
 
I should fix that
 
@Potatoswatter And TV set-up boxes. Those are freakishly slow.
 
10:14 AM
@rubenvb I prefer to stick to set-top boxes from the 80's, with nice big green block characters.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes that's a frogy :D
 
@Potatoswatter In Belguim, there is no way to use a HTPC with TV tuner card: all channels except the two national channels are encrypted.
 
Hmm, if you have two class members T foo and T* bar, shouldn't you be able to do this in a member function: const T& F() { return (some_condition) ? foo : *bar;}
 
You're decades ahead of my entertainment technology. I recently got my first dedicated DVD player.
 
@Potatoswatter lol
 
10:17 AM
@jalf I think so yes, I take it is not working though
 
@jalf ?: is a quirky beast. Does it work if you return T& instead?
 
@thecoshman both gcc and clang are claiming I'm returning a reference to a temporary
 
Let's try building PuTTY from source for x64.
 
@jalf is warning you, or is it failing?
 
@thecoshman just a warning
@RMartinhoFernandes yeah, that seems to work
 
10:20 AM
@jalf and you are sure you are doing what you think you are doing
 
not sure if I actually need the const version for anything though. Seems to compile without it
 
@jalf What's the warning? The warning goes away when you remove const?
 
@thecoshman I'm sure, yes. It's a pretty simple function ;)
 
@jalf You could try to write using a helper function that returns a pointer.
 
10:20 AM
then just ignore the warning :P
 
@jalf Then there's no temporary.
Right?
 
@Potatoswatter Yeah. Well, I already had both const and nonconst overloads of it, so commenting out the const one seems to make everyone happy
oh wait, I do need the const one
 
@jalf Um, except folks who are calling from const objects.
 
We need @Johannes.
 
@Potatoswatter yeah but I wasn't sure if it was ever called on a const object :)
 
10:21 AM
You said it was between two members. There shouldn't be a temporary.
Is the return type different from the underlying type of the pointer?
 
@Potatoswatter nope
 
@jalf here's the test cases for the warning: llvm.org/svn/llvm-project/cfe/trunk/test/SemaCXX/…
 
@jalf Can't reproduce. Have a test case?
 
Might be a bug in the warning.
 
@rubenvb unlikely, since it appears in both gcc and clang
 
10:23 AM
@rubenvb In both compilers?
 
anyway, sec, will try to create a test case
 
@jalf ah, you mentioned new warnings before. nvm then.
 
If it warns that you're returning a temporary, you probably are.
 
Can't repro either.
 
I don't think you have a T and T*. You have something and another something where one can convert to the other. Then the rules for ?: kick in.
I sure hope no conversion operator is involved, that could be worse.
 
10:26 AM
@LucDanton wouldn't adding some static_casts help debug that?
 
@rubenvb Depends.
 
@LucDanton But it wouldn't compile for a T& return, would it?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yep, it wouldn't. The whole ?: expression would not be an lvalue.
 
@LucDanton No, the member variable types are exactly T and T*
And the function's return type is const T&
 
It's hard to imagine a 'bad' interaction between the ?: expression and the expected return type though.
Welp, this has the potential to be very interesting.
 
10:28 AM
gcc 4.6 says warning: returning reference to temporary [enabled by default]
clang says warning: returning reference to local temporary object [-Wreturn-stack-address]
clang built from svn sources as of two days ago
 
@LucDanton Confirmed.
 
Right. *y is int but x is const int. So I was right all along.
Type mismatch => ?: is an rvalue most of the time and a conversion is involved.
Solution: static_cast<int const&>(*y) (not tested).
 
hmm, that makes sense
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yay for C++!
 
10:31 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes Lol, recycling messages doesn't save the environment.
Mmh, somewhat unsurprisingly I think I got optional wrong. Getting segfaults when std::unique_ptr is involved.
 
Is there any way to connect to a Cisco VPN server thing using the Windows VPN stuff?
I want to not install Cisco VPN software.
 
vpn::connect()?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes lol
 
@RMartinhoFernandes No ConnectionFactory?
 
Sigh documentation is bad enough. Then the have to do it through really shitty document revision control <rage>
 
10:40 AM
I like how clang completely ignores it when you tell it to disable a warning
 
It does?
How did you disable it?
 
-Wno-delete-non-virtual-dtor
but it still prints /opt/local/include/boost/checked_delete.hpp:34:5: warning: delete called on 'boost::error_info<boost::tag_original_exception_type, const std::type_info *>' that has virtual functions but non-virtual destructor [-Wdelete-non-virtual-dtor]
 
File a bug?
 
did you do something like -Wall after that flag?
 
nope, but before it
oh wait, let me check my makefile
ok, I thought it was after the -Wall. Turns out it wasn't :)
thanks
 
10:44 AM
did it fix it?
It's still a bug IMHO.
 
Xeo
@rubenvb No, latter flags overwrite earlier flags IIRC
 
@Xeo hmm, maybe logical for -O? stuff, but hardly for -W*. Meh, the world can't be perfect
 
yeah, that fixed it
 
@rubenvb What should the behaviour of -Wfoo -Wno-foo be?
 
Undefined!
 
10:47 AM
@LucDanton Implementation defined!
lol
 
@LucDanton warning: you need to make up your fucking mind [-Wuser-is-a-dumbass]
 
-Wuser-is-a-dumbass sounds useful.
 
-Wuser-is-a-dumbass -Wno-user-is-a-dumbass?
 
@LucDanton exactly. Problematic still.
 
cool, compiles without warnings now :)
 
10:49 AM
warning: you still need to make up your fucking mind [-Wuser-is-still-a-dumbass]
 
redundancy ftw!
you could make the compiler eat (read:remove) the source files if you do that.
 
@jalf You can pass the Boost include path with -isystem so that warnings are not emitted for those headers.
 
@LucDanton Invokes NetHack!
 
@LucDanton ooh, that's handy
anyway, was only that one warning, so I just silenced that :)
 
@jalf That and any future ones you cause.
And that one is damn useful.
 
10:52 AM
It's a useful warning.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yeah, but given how often I write virtual functions, and how rarely I use delete directly, the chances of me actually writing code that violates it are pretty damn low ;)
 
unique_ptr<base> p(new derived)
 
Just grepped through my library: not a single virtual function in it :)
 
That means it's safe to activate the warning then, duh.
Do you disable all warnings once you've figured out that your codebase is bugfree?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Still assumes I'd actually write a base class with virtual functions but no virtual dtor. I don't exactly make a habit of that ;)
 
10:54 AM
Come on, you know you should enable it.
 
I researched -isystem because I wanted to get rids of those warnings.
 
@LucDanton no, I disable the ones I know I'm not going to trigger :)
 
@jalf But then you won't know if you trigger them accidentally!
 
@jalf How often do you return references to locals? Better turn that one off.
 
@LucDanton Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. But I never figure out that my codebase is bugfree.
 
10:55 AM
@LucDanton I return references all the time, and I use locals all the time. They can get mixed up. But I can't possibly trigger that other warning without typing the word virtual, which I hardly ever do
 
FTR I do use virtual inheritance, so it's not like I can grep to check how many virtual functions I have.
 
Boost.Exception?
 
@LucDanton I don't use either. :)
@RMartinhoFernandes What about it?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yes. (Which happens to include those headers that trigger warnings by the way.)
Something to do with type-erasure, which Boost.Exception uses a lot.
 
@jalf It usually involves virtual inheritance in exception hierarchies.
 
10:58 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes but does it have any classes with virtual functions and no virtual dtor? :)
 
1 min ago, by Luc Danton
FTR I do use virtual inheritance, so it's not like I can grep to check how many virtual functions I have.
 
@jalf I was just asking Luc if the virtual inheritance was due to boost.exception.
 
oh right
anyway, I don't want to silence any warnings. But I'd rather silence a warning I know is not going to occur in my code, than silence everything just based on header location. Neither is really optimal, of course, but I'd like to see the warnings that boost causes at least once
then I can decide whether to turn them off
 

« first day (501 days earlier)      last day (4463 days later) »