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12:00 AM
IIRC I had GCC binaries that I was supposed to use with a preexisting MinGW install, it wasn't standalone.
 
@LucDanton I'm not getting a missing header error, I'm getting the errors in my reply above where things aren't in the std namespace
 
Gah! my bad.
 
@SethCarnegie that usually means it's mixing the headers, that the ming cwchar included the clang wchar.h or something. I have no experience there though, so I don't know how to fix
 
@MooingDuck where would I have gotten the clang wchar.h?
If I have those headers lying around then I can use those
 
12:03 AM
@SethCarnegie probably came with clang, and clang automatically tried to use it
 
Xeo
@Seth, mind joining #llvm on irc.oftc.net? :)
 
@Xeo does mibbit work on that channel
 
Xeo
@SethCarnegie llvm.org/docs/#irc
If you have ChatZilla
 
@MooingDuck I doubt it, I used -nostdinc and -I to specify the include paths
 
@SethCarnegie your compiler error clearly shows that a file included by ming's cwchar did not include the stuff that cwchar expected, meaning a compiler or version mismatch somehow. (Assuming those are the first errors)
 
12:08 AM
@MooingDuck well like I said, I'm just trying to use mingw gcc 4.6.1 headers with clang and I don't know anything about what I'm doing, I just want clang to work :(
 
@SethCarnegie there's another possibility, that mingw's headers depend on specific compiler flags (or combinations therof) to have been set, that clang isn't obeying
 
@MooingDuck how would I find that out
 
@SethCarnegie I haven't the foggiest idea
 
Xeo
@Seth, just talk on the #llvm channel. :P
 
What Xeo says. Also, I'm looking at my mingw headers for hints
 
12:14 AM
I feel the need to share a very useful construct I've been using for TMP: rebind<std::tuple<int, std::allocator<int>>, std::vector>::type yields std::vector<int, std::allocator<int>>.
It's inspired from the rebind members of allocators.
which syntax is std::allocator<int>::rebind<char>::other yields std::allocator<char> IIRC.
 
@LucDanton looks awesome
 
sitting here drinking arizona canned tea, feeling like I got punched in the throat and my bottom lip ripped from my teeth, welcome to my own little slice of heaven :/
 
(Oh wait I got the order of parameters wrong, it's template first, type second.)
For instance to compute the return type of my apply for variants I use Rebind<make_variant_over, typename tuples::result_of::apply<Functor, args>::type>, i.e. it's done in terms of the apply for tuples.
Where make_variant_over<T...>::type yields variant<U...> by stripping repeats.
 
@SethCarnegie these are some wierd headers, I have no idea how they're supposed to work
 
@MooingDuck which headers
@Xeo guess I gotta try 3.0
 
12:22 AM
@sehe my baby listens and learns! I finally got the file-IO right and now it has memory :D I need to fix the way it makes sentences on the fly though, right now it says very random things
 
I need to write multithreaded C++ code and I know nothing about it. Any suggestions on where I should start?
 
@Pubby google? lol
 
@Pubby C++11 offers a lot better threading support
 
@Hoxieboy Google gives me strangers' opinions. I want some I can trust!
 
learn what it does by itself so you don't go looking for a library for something
 
12:24 AM
I thought no compilers support C++11 threading model though :(
 
@Pubby well, perhaps SO? lol #2 :)
 
Stay high-level and don't share state.
 
I like how configure checks for windows.h's usability first, then checks for its existence
checking windows.h usability... yes
checking windows.h presence... yes
 
user406009
@Pubby stackoverflow.com/a/1192114/406009 was pretty interesting.
 
user406009
Just ignore the python parts.
 
12:30 AM
Alright, I'll read that
 
boost::variant<T, Ts...> is default constructible iff T is with obvious results. I didn't keep that, doesn't seem worth it.
 
Does a program compiled for debug mode compile slower than one compiled for release mode?
 
user406009
It shouldn't make that much of a difference. I thought most of the time was spent parsing templates anyways.
 
@EthanSteinberg not parsing, generating/resolving.
@SethCarnegie Depends. Most often releas compiles slower due to optimizing (-On, n>0)
@SethCarnegie But in some cases, debug will be slower due to excessive generation of debug information (-g). These cases are noticeable by the memory usage (and often come from having too many template instantiations).
 
@sehe that's what I was thinking, I didn't know whether the optimiser or the extra debug info would be heavier
 
12:36 AM
@SethCarnegie It fully depends. And whether it completes, by the way. Some of my spirit grammars couldn't compile with full debug information, especially on MSVC
On gcc, optimization just takes longer. Debug info seems ok
 
@sehe What do you mean "it couldn't compile with full debug information"?
the templates were too much for the compiler?
 
@SethCarnegie Like I said: it would just ICE
@SethCarnegie specificly for the debug symbol limits
 
Sorry, I don't know what ICE is
 
He he, see my comment:
0
Q: Close command prompt listener

Roronoa ZoroI want to run a block of code after the user closes the command prompt window (by clicking the x at the corner) - I'm assuming there should be a way to do event listener when command prompt closes! I'm running visual studio. More info about the problem: I'm currently capturing images and storin...

 
@SethCarnegie Internal Compiler Error
@CheersandhthAlf Time for sleep?
 
12:41 AM
maybe?
 
@CheersandhthAlf horrendous question anyway
 
Did I show you guys my magical template?
template<typename T>class A { class B : public C; };
causes an ICE in vs2010 :)
 
@SethCarnegie template<class>class A{struct B:C;}; too?, try template<int>class A{struct B:C;};
 
2
Q: What XML parser should I use in C++?

Nicol BolasNote: This is intended to be a definitive, C++-FAQ-style question for this. So yes, it is a duplicate of others. I did not simply appropriate those other questions because they tended to ask for something slightly more specific. This question is more generic. I have XML documents that I need to ...

 
12:52 AM
@Feeds wut? feeds posting Q now?
 
talking to yourself? :) @sehe
 
@sehe It's because it is tagged . But shouldn't.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes That way
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Thank you for making SO a better place.
 
@sehe Yep, same thing
 
12:53 AM
Anyway, why use XML when you have JSON?
 
Or maybe it's okay. I don't know.
@EtiennedeMartel Because you're not always in control of the serialization format?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yeah, but when you are?
And most Web services use REST with JSON these days because it's not as retarded as SOAP.
 
For some reason my keyboard has remapped F5 to "Open file"
for all programs
 
@RMartinhoFernandes huh was confused there. But shouldn't - because it's xml-faq instead?
 
12:56 AM
@SethCarnegie That probably means it sends the same scan code combination as ^O
 
@sehe it just started doing that today :(
@sehe there are labels on the f keys that say New, Open etc
but I'm not hitting any extra button to use those
 
@SethCarnegie That means a modifier is likely stuck. Try toggling all modifier keys. Is it in a virtual machine?
 
@sehe no virtual machine, what are the modifier keys?
 
12:57 AM
Aha! F Lock was off
 
@DzekTrek lol?
 
There are keyboards where thte F-keys don't do Fx by default. They do those fancy New, Open, whatever things. Some have an F-lock key for that.
 
@SethCarnegie ctrl, alt, shift (both sides) and Fn on laptops
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yep, F Lock was not on :) that was the problem
 
@Hoxieboy Marvelous song that suits my current mood just fine. :)
 
12:59 AM
@sehe that happened once to me when I was trying to log on, I was like WTF VIRUS and it took me a day to realize the reason why the keys were wrong was because of that very fn key
@DzekTrek :)
(its sad when you try to type a word like pie and it comes out -5e)
 
:( Clang is no longer compiling (that is, I am compiling clang itself) correctly
llvm-config: unknown component name: bitreader
make[2]: Entering directory `/c/users/seth/desktop/build/tools/opt'
/c/users/seth/desktop/llvm-3.0.src/Makefile.rules:961: *** llvm-config --libs
 failed.  Stop.
make[2]: Leaving directory `/c/users/seth/desktop/build/tools/opt'
make[1]: *** [opt/.makeall] Error 2
make[1]: Leaving directory `/c/users/seth/desktop/build/tools'
make: *** [all] Error 1
 
Did you try compiling clang with clang?
 
@EtiennedeMartel how can I do that if I can't compile clang?
I'm on windows btw
 
@SethCarnegie Good question.
@SethCarnegie Oh, that might be the problem.
 
@EtiennedeMartel I've been working with some people to get clang to compile on windows
I got it to compile earlier (it was the bleeding edge release) but it didn't work right with the mingw 4.6.1 headers
 
1:02 AM
Really? Woa, that's one hell of a sacrifice.
 
so now I'm compiling clang 3.0 and it's not even getting compiled :(
It's because it wasn't made to handle paths with a : in them
but I don't know how to fix it
that is, the paths aren't in quotes
 
@Hoxieboy just letting you know I'm sound asleep in case you were wondering :)
 
@sehe FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUu
@DzekTrek there are no Q's in russian :(
 
@SethCarnegie Can't you just add them?
 
@MooingDuck Greetings earthling
 
@EtiennedeMartel can't find where to add them
 
@SethCarnegie May I suggest flipping the table and getting drunk?
 
@EtiennedeMartel that rarely solves compiler errors
 
Well, it is estimated that roughly 40 % of the entire SO population have some knowledge of Russian, so there is no reason why we shouldn't have. We can arrange something on that topic, if you would like. :) @Hoxieboy
 
1:07 AM
@SethCarnegie Oh, you want to solve compiler errors? My bad, then.
@DzekTrek Where did you get that information?
 
@EtiennedeMartel His ass.
2
 
@DzekTrek Well, I meant literally, there are no Q's, as in the letters in russian XD
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Damn you, not while I got beer in my mouth. I almost spitted that everywhere.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Indeed.
 
@EtiennedeMartel ... almost spat ... FTFY
 
1:09 AM
lol
 
Yeah, I still have problems with verb tenses in English.
 
Right. Αs if verb tenses in French were simple.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes C'est très simple, le futur simple.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes just because you know a complex set of rules doesn't mean you know all complex sets of rules
 
@sehe Try the "subjonctif imparfait".
 
1:10 AM
@Hoxieboy If you would like to involve more extensively in the learning Russian for IT, I would recommend you following page, habrahabr.ru . Basically all you need about IT field could be found there. :)
 
@MooingDuck I know three of those sets of rules and English is by far the one with the simplest.
 
@EtiennedeMartel "I would have been taking the train"?
 
You better be joking. <= what mood?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes still applies
 
@DzekTrek I was taking learning the language as something to do when I'm bored but if it could go somewhere, all the better lol
@ScottW oh no, its HIM
 
1:13 AM
Un pain dans le cul.
 
@ScottW (we have a bunch of frenchies in here, keep quiet and try not to alarm them, then we'll sneak out and make our escape)
 
@Hoxieboy I'm not French, I'm Canadian.
 
@EtiennedeMartel :P
 
Yeah, there's a big difference. Canadians are way worse than French.
 
@Hoxieboy Yep, Russian is very popular language on the internet, and I am sure you will find something that will be interesting for you. For example, This song is just thrilling ...
 
1:14 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes Wut.
@ScottW Quebec.
 
@EtiennedeMartel (by the way I love canadians :D)
 
@EtiennedeMartel Just something a friend of mine used to say. Canadians are both American and French. What could be worse?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Nah, only those in Quebec. The rest of Canada is basically filled Americans who like hockey and strong beer.
 
@DzekTrek I've already memorized most of the letters of the alphabet :)
 
@RMartinhoFernandes More appropriate would be French and English.
@Hoxieboy There you go, I told you it's damn easy. :)
 
1:16 AM
@DzekTrek But American is worse than English.
 
@ScottW Really? I thought it was only a New England thing in the US.
 
@DzekTrek (why the hell does my keyboard do that XD) technically they are american, because they live on north america :D
@DzekTrek just got to remember that B = V :)
 
Oh oh oh.
 
Today, I had a good justification for optimizing for space!
 
It's unusual that the Americans named their country after a continent
 
1:18 AM
@Maxpm multiple for loops
 
@Maxpm You ran out?
 
Has any other country done that?
 
@SethCarnegie australians?
 
@ScottW Here, it's the Canadiens. They're losing.
 
@Hoxieboy I'm not sure where loops come into play.
 
1:18 AM
@SethCarnegie Does a subcontinent count?
 
@Hoxieboy Yep, they are all Americans, once they move to that plate ( America the continent ). :D
 
@sehe Yes.
 
@Hoxieboy Good job. :)
 
@Hoxieboy They didn't name their country Oceania.
 
just letting you know MooingDuck is sound asleep
in case you were wondering :)
 
1:18 AM
@Maxpm "a good justification for optimizing for space!" < multiple for-loops
 
@sehe Oh, please!
 
XD
 
@Hoxieboy It doesn't count when the country takes up the whole continent
@RMartinhoFernandes no, subcontinents don't count
@ScottW that's true
 
@SethCarnegie Australia doesn't take up the whole continent, godammit!
 
@Hoxieboy Where would one want, specifically, small things in for loops?
 
1:20 AM
@sehe waitwhat? I'm just afk
 
@Maxpm I was jking just reminded me of that
 
@RMartinhoFernandes what other countries are in the continent of Australia?
 
For instance, Papua New Guinea, I think.
 
@MooingDuck I didn't plink
 
@SethCarnegie there's at least four
 
1:20 AM
New Zealand.
 
@sehe plink like this?
 
@sehe irrelevant
 
:)
 
And some small US controlled islands. :)
 
Then Australians are just as bad as the Americans
 
1:22 AM
LOL, I didn't know that Zealandia continent exists. :)
 
Wow, clang supports mips? cool
 
@Everyone you know what? F- it all, we should all be called Pangaeans due to all the continents being linked at one time
:)
 
@Hoxieboy Yes! We should abandon all differences and set up our course to invading the universe.
 
XD
@ScottW moleculeans
 
@ScottW If you actually read the article you can learn that Zealandia is a continental fragment.
 
1:23 AM
@ScottW Now I feel dirty
 
@sehe AIDS came from space
 
Of course, when I was in school there was 7 continents and 9 planets.
 
@DzekTrek We miss you pluto :(
 
Nowadays there are 763 planets identified.
It's awesome.
 
Yes :( Our tiny little stalker. @Hoxieboy
 
1:25 AM
little do we all know, the renouncing of pluto being a planet was really an attempt to rile up any aliens that were listening on to our radio chatter
 
@ScottW No such thing as a pre-big bang.
Also, no matter in the earliest known stages of the universe.
 
Just imagine how many races is there in the universe? What is the entire number of total population living in this bubble( our universe )? And how many other bubbles is there in that vast space? And then again how many other vast spaces? And ...
 
WHY D: why must you repeat me! this, THING listens to my input and repeats it, I was planning to make a learning INTELLIGENT AI but all I ended up with was a parakeet :(
@DzekTrek calm down buddy, as quoted from (I don't know some scientist) "We are fools to think that we are alone in the universe"
 
@Hoxieboy Jack Burton from the movie Big Trouble in Little China
 
@MooingDuck that's weird, I remember it being from some girl talking on the science channel :)
 
1:31 AM
 
@Hoxieboy For sure. Moreover I deem they observe us, protect and watch over us, I don't know why but I get that feeling.
 
@DzekTrek wish they cured my illnesses :P
 
@DzekTrek I figure there's probably aliens races, but wonder how many of them have evolved multicellular organisms of any sort?
 
@Hoxieboy mine too. :(
 
@MooingDuck Or intelligence. Or interstellar travel.
 
1:32 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes oh, probably none of them have interstellar travel. Universe isn't old enough yet
 
Well, they HAVE found bacteria fossils in a meteor broken off of mars
 
@Hoxieboy that we put there (corrupted samples, not scam)
 
@MooingDuck doubt it
 
Finding Earth bacteria on a rock that fell on Earth is nothing special.
 
1:34 AM
@MooingDuck If only 0.00000001% of one cellular organisms evolved to multicellular, it would be a number that is not writable at all.
 
@DzekTrek I'm not sure what you're saying there but it doesn't sound right
 
Just imagine that every planet has some kind of one cellular organisms, even comets tend to have this practice, so I deem it is pretty clear about what count are we talking here. Also, take in the account that many species ( like we do think ) do not require oxygen and hydrogen to proceed with a living, and that somewhere out there is great possibility to encounter species that run on nitrogen or some other element.
 
@DzekTrek No, comets don't have organisms on them.
Organic molecules do not count as organisms.
 
Xeo
GoingNative 6: The D Episode with Walter Bright and Andrei Alexandrescu http://dlvr.it/1DYPWy
 
Have you guys heard of the new "earth-like" planet NASA found?
 
1:36 AM
@DzekTrek no, we haven't found any cellular organisms not from Earth
 
@MooingDuck I thought you were uncontrollably asleep
 
Xeo
Might be something for @FredO
 
@Hoxieboy there's a lot
@sehe no, still at work
 
@MooingDuck nearby in terms of space travel
 
1:37 AM
^in terms of spacetravel
 
Proxima Centauri is too far in terms of space travel.
 
@MooingDuck Well, maybe because we lack knowledge and equipment for sure, but there will come times when we will be in possibility to detect them. ;)
 
@Hoxieboy "nearby" is reletavie, and in this context, meaningless (I don't understand what you mean)
 
Mainly because reaching it is unfeasible.
 
@DzekTrek we've seen no proof of cellular life (though there are implications)
@DzekTrek also, use the reply feature instead of typing my name. Your responses are confusing me
 
1:39 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes Well, for me organisms( living matter ) is anything that moves, therefore I would classify organic molecules as organisms here too.
 
@DzekTrek Organic molecules move as much as inorganic molecules move.
 
@DzekTrek we have a definition for "living" already, that makes more sense
 
@RMartinhoFernandes as of Yet
 
@DzekTrek by that definition, wind is alive
 
@MooingDuck Well, to be honest, we can't explore our own planet, not to mention exploring of this vast universe. Time will come when we will be in possibility to begin with such actions.
 
1:41 AM
@Hoxieboy Then you should have said "nearby in terms of hypothetical future space travel".
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Now I don't follow you. Organic molecules do tend to move, how would you classify them organic if they don't move, get into interaction with other molecules and so forth so on?
 
@MooingDuck 600 lightyears away
 
@DzekTrek I was merely countering your claim that comets tend to have single celled organisms. I agree that future will give us proof one way or another.
 
@DzekTrek We classify them as organic because they have carbon atoms.
 
Xeo
I'm gonna fold time forward by 8 hours now - good night. :P
 
1:41 AM
@MooingDuck Well, this would lead us to the matter of physics but I do think that everything is in some way alive. :)
 
@DzekTrek I don't think you know what an organic molecule is
@DzekTrek yeah, I'm going to stick with science here. We have a definition for that word already.
 
@DzekTrek scientists say if a planet has whats known as a "primordial soup" on its surface or in its atmosphere, it could possibly support life
 
@Hoxieboy It would be utter nonsense, 'cause I deem that every matter can form some sort of life, not just organic ones. We have that opinion cause we have never encountered any species without structure with C, O, H. But recent research showed us that they have found specie with N in it's building structure, therefore I deem that every option is there as it comes to that matter.
 
@MooingDuck robots could be described as "artificial life" life = can reproduce, evolve, use homeostasis and is built of one or more cells
 
1:46 AM
@ScottW Well, I think that they all somehow interfere, but what is causing that action I can't explain. It may be some force that repulsively holds them or moves them, but I really can't explain it.
 
@DzekTrek You should read about thermodynamics. It provides great insights.
 
@DzekTrek You're right. That force is called electromagnetism.
 
Weren't you ranting about water as a fuel some time ago, too?
 
@Hoxieboy en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life#Biology "Growth: Maintenance of a higher rate of anabolism than catabolism. A growing organism increases in size in all of its parts, rather than simply accumulating matter."
 
@LucDanton that was me
 
1:47 AM
Everyone should read about thermodynamics!
 
@LucDanton Thermodynamics is based only on observation of our life with a technology that isn't enough to edict a crucial base of what thermodynamics is.
 
N is nitrogen. It occurs in all living organisms.
 
@DzekTrek (1) I don't think you're right. There's a lot of the "organic" types that are not part of life on earth. (2) You deeming something does not convince us of it's truth.
 
@DzekTrek What model do you use to describe how ashes won't ever turn back into a wood log without introducing energy into the system?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I hope you are joking?
 
1:49 AM
@DzekTrek No, I'm not. Look up proteins.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I think Dzek was thinking of Arsenic.
@DzekTrek he's right, there's lots of nitrogen involved
 
@MooingDuck Wait, what did I miss?
 
@MooingDuck Yes, arsenic is the right element. :)
 
Arsenic's symbol is As.
 
@MooingDuck I told you I think everything on this planet is alive. (1) Well, it's just my opinion, it is not true or false, until it's proven. :) (2)
 
1:52 AM
The common organic chemistry components are carbon, hydrogen, nitrogen, oxygen, and the halogens, as well as phosphorus, silicon, and sulfur
 
@MooingDuck sulfur = creepers :D
 
Defining that everything on the planet is alive is all well and fine, but that dilutes the meaning so much that the word is now useless. So what's the point of doing that?
 
@DzekTrek I take it back. With that definition of life, there is life on other planets.
 
@LucDanton he wants to make it a useless word
 
@DzekTrek also, no amount of science will ever prove one's definition of a word.
WOO ITS GO HOME TIME
 
1:54 AM
I'm still waiting for your superior alternative to thermodynamics that better describes why combustion goes this one way and not the other.
 
@MooingDuck Yes, I think you are right. It will pass centuries until some of us prove it.
 
@LucDanton you won't get it
@DzekTrek no, I'm saying it will not ever no matter what be proven, because a definition is arbitrary and cannot be proven.
 
@LucDanton It may be defined for our observations, however I am not sure that electromagnetism is the force that keeps our universe in the place.
 
I call robots "alive" doesnt mean anything
 
@Hoxieboy Luc got stuck on a sub-rant that Dzek disbelieves all science based on observation
 
1:56 AM
@Hoxieboy I suggested remedial thermodynamics to get a new perspective on things.
 
@DzekTrek I have no idea what you're talking about. Most people don't think electrodynamics holds things in place.
 
It must be some other force, call it just my hint.
 
Or if they do, they need to go to high school
@DzekTrek we found four forces, none of which is related to thermodynamics much
 
@DzekTrek Of course not. It does so together with the two nuclear forces and gravitation.
 
@MooingDuck you can move things with it :)
 
1:57 AM
@DzekTrek There's no way this message is referring to my previous message. Please use the chat features that 'links' answers to specific messages.
 
Yes, it's basic thinking of us, WF, SF, NF and gravitation, but has it ever been proved?
that is what I call a hint.
 
Erm, the effects of those interactions have been observed. Good enough for me.
 
Also, what holds these forces? What creates them? Everything must have it's "energy"?
 
@DzekTrek no. And nobody claimed that there are no more than four forces, or that they have anything to do with electrodynamics
 
By your criteria nothing in science has been 'proven'. Again, you're using a definition of 'proof' that is so narrow as to make it useless in this context.
 
1:59 AM
@MooingDuck Leave thermodynamics behind I just replied on someones answer.
 
Maths have formal proofs, natural sciences don't.
 
Science is not about proving, it's about modelling.
 
@DzekTrek then why are we talking about the forces?
 

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